TFC 2013 general player moves/speculation/etc.

[ag futbol]

never! he's a critical piece for the team's future.
Assets can be traded for assets though. Garbage will be shipped for likewise.

If Chivas wants to overpay, ring the register. He's good, but not untouchable.

[Abou Sky]

www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2316846/Jermaine-Pennant-wanted-Toronto-Vancouver.html

Jermaine Pennant to TFC?

Is Pennant the 1.5-2 year player Payne spoke of?

We need a good winger.

I just wish players saw TFC as a place to work their ass off to make a statement.

Bostock and Ephraim should be KILLING it on the pitch, Bostock at least is sitting there fucking the dog.

[Canary10]

I like Silva, but I think he's one of the players that won't go to the well for you do everything to win. It's funny that so many people talk about our defensive problems late in games being in part about inability to hold possession in the midfield. When he's playing in the central midfield, he's a big part of that. Possession in the attacking half comes from him. We're really not getting that from him. There's a reason he's being tried out in so many places on the pitch and why we are floating the idea of a DP attacking midfielder. And at 24 or 25, his development is pretty much done. I know he's only a second year player, but he at his age you should have high expectations - he's not a build for the future piece, he is a should be delivering now piece. Again I like him, but I think he's one who needs to take Payne's comments yesterday as a wake-up call.

[brad]

www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2316846/Jermaine-Pennant-wanted-Toronto-Vancouver.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2316846/Jermaine-Pennant-wanted-Toronto-Vancouver.html)

Jermaine Pennant to TFC?

Is Pennant the 1.5-2 year player Payne spoke of?

We need a good winger.

I just wish players saw TFC as a place to work their ass off to make a statement.

Bostock and Ephraim should be KILLING it on the pitch, Bostock at least is sitting there fucking the dog.

I think we need to become a comparative team before the first starts to happen. I don't mean champions, but not perenial bottom feeders. Lack of competition for spots hurts here as well.

In regards to the latter - this is always a risk with a player like Bostock for a couple of reasons. One, there is a risk that the past hype has gone to his head and he feels he is above TFC/MLS (a la Stevanovic. No clue if Bostock suffers here - I'm talking generally). Two, he has bags of ability but has not been able to stick at a higher level. Attitude plays as much a part as ability (more some say) to being successful at a high level, and maybe we are now seeing the reason he hasn't stuck at that level.

[nonc]

Jackson is on the outs with Norwich and probably destined for Championship at best. Not sure if there would be mutual interest but considering TFC is perpetually trawling the English football league for whatever we can find, weirder things have happened.

[OgtheDim]

I think we already had this discussion about Pennant when that article came out. There is reason to believe he wouldn't get entry into the US. That looked like an article fed to a paper by an agent.

[Canary10]

I'm going to make a brash prediction: Silva will be traded.

[Ultra & Proud]

My predictions; Califf traded for an international roster spot. At least one of our loanees having their deals terminated.

[Ajax TFC]

I get the feeling from Payne's interview that we might try to trade Koev. This makes me sad because I would hate to see him wear another MLS team's jersey. For one, he didn't really have a lot to say about him other than that he can find the net. I also got the impression that they were looking to bring in two DPs this summer, which won't be possible with Koevermans already taking a spot.

[Yohan]

I get the feeling from Payne's interview that we might try to trade Koev. This makes me sad because I would hate to see him wear another MLS team's jersey. For one, he didn't really have a lot to say about him other than that he can find the net. I also got the impression that they were looking to bring in two DPs this summer, which won't be possible with Koevermans already taking a spot.
Koev is a hard sell in MLS, no matter how good his record is.

35 yr old striker coming off a major injury and not match fit? And a DP plus int spot? Not many teams will take a chance.
He'd be better shopped around after this season when he has proven himself that he can still do the job, but then, his contract would be expired anyways

[Canary10]

"My predictions; Califf traded for an international roster spot. At least one of our loanees having their deals terminated."

^ I can see that. Safer than my prediction though :)

Silva doesn't play well as an attack minded midfielder in a 4-4-2. He's been tried as a holding mid in the system, as the number 10 and now as a wide midfielder. I just don't think he fits the system. He's a very good player, and valuable, but he needs a 4-2-3-1 or something where he can play offensively and not have the same level of defensive responsibility. I think he'll be traded while he still has value. Osorio in my mind has the potential to be a better player and is younger. And with Payne discussing the possibility of a DP attacking mid, I think Silva will end up going. The fact that he's been tried in so many places tells me a lot.

[Ajax TFC]

And I want Avila back. He would be a good domestic winger/AM and he's better than any winger we have right now, and better AM than Silva. I say we dump Ephraim or Bostock and trade the international spot to Chivas for Avila. Then Chivas can use that spot to bring in a Mexican from the big Chivas on loan to take his place. They get an other mexican, we get a good, cheap winger: that's a win - win trade right there

[Red I]

I'm going to make a brash prediction: Silva will be traded.

Huge mistake, imo. Great salary against the cap, has been a sort of super sub (like Osorio) when he comes on late - i could see his role being diminished, but considering he's not a salary hit like some other underperforming players, why move him - any asset Toronto gets will not be better than the intangibles Silva brings, i guarantee you - not many can play in the middle well, he is one of those that can. Plus, i really think the guy is solid if he had the right players around him - no one on the wings attacks, or works as hard as this guy, and that is the problem - if this team was better going forward, we would not be looking to move this kid at all - so why get rid of one of the few players that actually attacks?

[Yohan]

Silva doesn't play well as an attack minded midfielder in a 4-4-2. He's been tried as a holding mid in the system, as the number 10 and now as a wide midfielder. I just don't think he fits the system. He's a very good player, and valuable, but he needs a 4-2-3-1 or something where he can play offensively and not have the same level of defensive responsibility. I think he'll be traded while he still has value. Osorio in my mind has the potential to be a better player and is younger. And with Payne discussing the possibility of a DP attacking mid, I think Silva will end up going. The fact that he's been tried in so many places tells me a lot.
I still think Silva can work in a 4-4-2, but you're right. Silva is a pure AM/SS and doesn't do well when he has to do a lot of defending. He may still work out in a 4-3-1-2 or 4-4-2 diamond, but it looks like Nelsen wants wingers. Personally thought he did well in second striker role, especially last year paired with Hassli and to lesser extent Earnshaw, but ya. He doesn't quite fit the the 2 way CM Nelsen wants.

Which is too bad since he's been good for TFC, whenever he doesn't have to play a big defensive role. And may still work out if Laba turns out to be a stud DM who can cover a lot of ground a la Alonso to shield the back 4 and Silva doesn't have to track back so often. The thing is, Silva is like the only really creative playmaker for TFC right now that's somewhat proven. Maybe Osorio will pan out, and Bekker too. But that's looking a year or two down the road, and if Silva is not part of the future with TFC, I'd rather trade him now than later. I'd be very sad if Silva does get traded though. You don't get too many pure playmakers like him from MLS, at his salary.

[Yohan]

And I want Avila back. He would be a good domestic winger/AM and he's better than any winger we have right now, and better AM than Silva. I say we dump Ephraim or Bostock and trade the international spot to Chivas for Avila. Then Chivas can use that spot to bring in a Mexican from the big Chivas on loan to take his place. They get an other mexican, we get a good, cheap winger: that's a win - win trade right there
Avila is not a better AM than Silva. I'd put my left nut on the line with this statement.

[Canary10]

I don't want to see him go either, I'm just putting myself in the minds of the coaches and that's what I see happening. Just a wild guess.

[Red I]

Avila is not a better AM than Silva. I'd put my left nut on the line with this statement.

I second that... Hell, I'll double-down!! #2nutsonthetable

[Lucky Strike]

http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2013/05/reds-waive-bennett-morgan

Bennett and T. Morgan waived. Unsurprising, really.

[mowe]

Reds waive Bennett and Morgan (http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2013/05/reds-waive-bennett-morgan)

Expected, they were signed just to fill out the bare bones roster at the beginning of the year. Frees up two roster spots and one international spot.

[Ajax TFC]

Koev is a hard sell in MLS, no matter how good his record is.

35 yr old striker coming off a major injury and not match fit? And a DP plus int spot? Not many teams will take a chance.
He'd be better shopped around after this season when he has proven himself that he can still do the job, but then, his contract would be expired anyways
He's a proven goal scorer in the last year of his contract. If he makes his return at the end of this month, and becomes a regular in june/july and proves he's over his injury, he could become a very attractive option to any team looking to make a push for the cup. If we're just looking to offload him to get his DP spot, he would be a cheap, low risk high reward striker for any team with ambitions this year.

And if someone hires PM between now and then, we could get a first round pick for him :rolleyes:


Silva doesn't play well as an attack minded midfielder in a 4-4-2. He's been tried as a holding mid in the system, as the number 10 and now as a wide midfielder. I just don't think he fits the system. He's a very good player, and valuable, but he needs a 4-2-3-1 or something where he can play offensively and not have the same level of defensive responsibility. I think he'll be traded while he still has value. Osorio in my mind has the potential to be a better player and is younger. And with Payne discussing the possibility of a DP attacking mid, I think Silva will end up going. The fact that he's been tried in so many places tells me a lot.
I think Silva played really well at the top of the midfield diamond. But he doesn't really fit any other role than that whether in a 4-4-2, or another formation. He didn't look great in a 4-2-3-1 either when we played it last year. He's one of those players who's good but doesn't really have a position.

[jabbronies]

I'm going to make a brash prediction: Silva will be traded.

This would be a really dumb thing to do considering we are trying to get more creative in the midfield.

Guys who should be out before Silva:
Callif
O'Dea
Eckersley
Hall
Lamb
Emory
Bostock
Agbossoumonde
Quliian Roberts

[notthesun]

Too bad about T. Morgan and Bennett, hope Morgan in particular can fashion a career for himself somewhere.

That gives us one international slot back and I expect Payne to trade for at least one more before Saturday.

[Ultra & Proud]

Avila is not better than Silva and I will be the first to say that Silva is massively overrated by a lot of supporters. But he is young, showed promise, and can develop.

Avila has accomplished next to nothing (6 goals and 13 assists) for 3 teams over 7 seasons and often looked like a floater.

[jloome]

Avila is not a better AM than Silva. I'd put my left nut on the line with this statement.

I think moving Silva would be absolutely insane, unless we got back two or three major pieces with staying power. He's the best player on our team, consistently. His defence has actually improved this year, and he's working harder. If he were used properly and given some confidence to run with the ball more (I fear Winter might have drummed this out of him early, as he rarely does, but is very good with it) he'd create more.

[Yohan]

Not bummed about Bennett, but I thought Taylor Morgan had promise. 6'5" striker who has pace is rare. Too bad he couldn't find a loan, which gives TFC options whether to keep him or not at the end of the season.

[OgtheDim]

Shows how much we need a farm team.

[Yohan]

I think moving Silva would be absolutely insane, unless we got back two or three major pieces with staying power. He's the best player on our team, consistently. His defence has actually improved this year, and he's working harder. If he were used properly and given some confidence to run with the ball more (I fear Winter might have drummed this out of him early, as he rarely does, but is very good with it) he'd create more.
If Earnshaw buried couple of great chances Silva created for him, I highly doubt anyone would want Silva traded right now. (and everything would be honky dory in TFC land)

[TFC07]

Silva will only be traded if he's going to be replace by DP AM. Silva is an asset that we can trade to get a really good player in return. You're not going to get an all-star or above average MLS player by trading our garbage players. It's not going to work! There's no denying that Silva is a good player, but however, his upside is limited given his age and he got value in the league.

[Ajax TFC]

Avila is not a better AM than Silva. I'd put my left nut on the line with this statement.
depends on what you want from your AM. I expect all midfielders to do their part in the midfield battle for possession. I also expect an AM to be able to distribute not only to the strikers, but also be able to spread play to open wingers and fullbacks. Silva doesn't do those things. What he does is combine with and feed the strikers. He's good at that, but in my mind he's a withdrawn forward, not a midfielder.

Avila is fast, can spread play accurately, finds space in midfield, and off the ball he pressures to get it back. We currently have very few players who can pressure properly. He also pivots quickly, which is really helpfull in distributing effectively and escaping pressure

BTW I like Silva as well when he's used properly, and wouldn't want to see him traded

[Thomas]

What you say makes sense to me. I like him, but he needs to listen to the wake up call too


I like Silva, but I think he's one of the players that won't go to the well for you do everything to win. It's funny that so many people talk about our defensive problems late in games being in part about inability to hold possession in the midfield. When he's playing in the central midfield, he's a big part of that. Possession in the attacking half comes from him. We're really not getting that from him. There's a reason he's being tried out in so many places on the pitch and why we are floating the idea of a DP attacking midfielder. And at 24 or 25, his development is pretty much done. I know he's only a second year player, but he at his age you should have high expectations - he's not a build for the future piece, he is a should be delivering now piece. Again I like him, but I think he's one who needs to take Payne's comments yesterday as a wake-up call.

[Canary10]

I think moving Silva would be absolutely insane, unless we got back two or three major pieces with staying power. He's the best player on our team, consistently. His defence has actually improved this year, and he's working harder. If he were used properly and given some confidence to run with the ball more (I fear Winter might have drummed this out of him early, as he rarely does, but is very good with it) he'd create more.

I agree. I think it'll also only happen with a signing of another central midfielder who can better fit a 4-4-2.

[Ajax TFC]

Avila is not better than Silva and I will be the first to say that Silva is massively overrated by a lot of supporters. But he is young, showed promise, and can develop.

Avila has accomplished next to nothing (6 goals and 13 assists) for 3 teams over 7 seasons and often looked like a floater.
You do realize that Silva is only one year younger than Avila right? And I hope you're not judging Avila's abilities purely on his G/A stats.

[Abou Sky]

I second that... Hell, I'll double-down!! #2nutsonthetable

I like my nuts, but ya, I agree...

[Auzzy]

Shows how much we need a farm team.

Agreed! You can't blame TFC for releasing these guys given their roster restrictions, but there's so much wasted potential. Also thinking of earlier signings from the Academy, who got almost no playing time, so it's impossible for them to improve or even to gauge their potential -- and then they got unceremoniously dumped after wasting a couple of years that others spent in university.

[Ultra & Proud]

You do realize that Silva is only one year younger than Avila right? And I hope you're not judging Avila's abilities purely on his G/A stats.

Yes, but Avila has many more years of MLS experience than Silva and should be further along in his development with 6 full season Vs. 1 season of pro-experience.

And no, I don't judge him strictly on his goals and assists although for an attacking mid I would like to think that these things should matter. What I judge him on is being a floater and disappearing in matches. I also judge him for not defending and I can't be alone on these points as he's been left out of line-ups for a slew of managers up until this season in Chivas.

[Ajax TFC]

Yes, but Avila has many more years of MLS experience than Silva and should be further along in his development with 6 full season Vs. 1 season of pro-experience.
And those extra seasons that Avila was in MLS, Silva was wasting in NCAA. I don't see how that should be a slight against Avila. And unless you're counting PDL teams he's been on, he's only had four previous seasons at a professional level.


What I judge him on is being a floater and disappearing in matches. You also have to consider that as an AM he often had a shit support cast behind him, but I never found that he disappeared that often.
I also judge him for not defending If running back to your own box is your definition of defending, than sure he doesn't defend. But an AM isn't supposed to do that. An AM is supposed to close down space in midfield, which he did more effectively than most. Also his defending can't be that bad since he's been played as a wingback at Chivas.

and I can't be alone on these points as he's been left out of line-ups for a slew of managers up until this season in Chivas.
Four managers is a slew? At Dallas he was a supersub on a squad that had a LOT of good attacking players. Under Winter he was a regular, and Mariner dropped him for poor performances (even though everyone could see that he was playing well) in favour of Andrew fucking Wiedeman which most would take as a sign of Mariner's incompetence rather than of Avila's weaknesses. And as you said he's now a starter for Chivas.

All of which is irrelevant since we NEED wide players, and he's easily way better as a wide player than all the wide players we currently have AND he makes less AND he's domestic.

[Ultra & Proud]

All of which is irrelevant since we NEED wide players, and he's easily way better as a wide player than all the wide players we currently have AND he makes less AND he's domestic.

We do need wide players but at $125K I would hope we could do better than Avila. And Bostock makes less. If he cared he could be better but he doesn't.

Also he had a good supporting cast in Dallas and I question calling anyone super anything when they manage 3 goals and 7 assists in 63 matches. I know you don't like the G/A stats but I would like to think that attacking players should have some type of offensive stats to make them worthy of any 'super' superlative.

And you missed my point with Avila being in MLS longer despite their age difference. Since Silva was 'wasting' his time in NCAA I would expect his development to be behind someone like Avila who had many more years of pro-experience. It isn't that way however as Silva had a better 2012 on a shit team with no supporting cast than any year Avila had (on better squads) and in fact, Silva almost equaled Avila's career numbers in the single season (disaster) that was 2012. Thusly, it could be easily stated that in his 7th season, we're seeing near the max potential of Avila whereas I see Silva improving over the next few years (and at this stage he is already the better player).

[Ajax TFC]

We do need wide players but at $125K I would hope we could do better than Avila. And Bostock makes less. If he cared he could be better but he doesn't. Avila makes 100k this year which is $0.04 more than Bostock. Ephraim on the other hand is 180k. BTW an average on the cap salary is 140k, so he's got a below average salary.


Also he had a good supporting cast in Dallas and I question calling anyone super anything when they manage 3 goals and 7 assists in 63 matches. I know you don't like the G/A stats but I would like to think that attacking players should have some type of offensive stats to make them worthy of any 'super' superlative.
I didn't say he had a bad supporting cast at Dallas. He had a bad supporting cast at TFC which is why he would supposedly disappear. Any AM will disappear if they don't get the ball. At Dallas he didn't start a lot because there was lots of really good attackers. When we got him the general consensus of the FCD fans was that he was a really talented player who didn't get a chance because there were a lot of other really good players.



And you missed my point with Avila being in MLS longer despite their age difference. Since Silva was 'wasting' his time in NCAA I would expect his development to be behind someone like Avila who had many more years of pro-experience. It isn't that way however as Silva had a better 2012 on a shit team with no supporting cast than any year Avila had (on better squads) and in fact, Silva almost equaled Avila's career numbers in the single season (disaster) that was 2012. Thusly, it could be easily stated that in his 7th season, we're seeing near the max potential of Avila whereas I see Silva improving over the next few years (and at this stage he is already the better player).
Silva and Avila's 2012s aren't really comparable since Silva played as a striker and Avila as a winger before the idiot in shorts decided he had to teach his 'son' a lesson and bench him for Wiedeman. Also I'm still confused where you're getting this seventh season number from. He joined FCD in 2008. 2013 - 2008 = 5 seasons, not seven.

Besides, I'm not in favour of getting rid of Silva anyway. I just think that Avila could fill a serious need that Silva doesn't. And I think we could get him for as little as an international spot since it seems that Chivas values Mexicans more than anything and an international spot would allow them to sign another one

[Ultra & Proud]

Also I'm still confused where you're getting this seventh season number from. He joined FCD in 2008. 2013 - 2008 = 5 seasons, not seven.

You're right. It's 6 seasons. I was reading the stats where they split his year at Dalls and TFC into two 'seasons'. Regardless, if you want to talk about bringing back former players who could fill a need then Soolsma would be the one because he is a far better wide player than what Avila is.

[Ajax TFC]

You're right. It's 6 seasons. I was reading the stats where they split his year at Dalls and TFC into two 'seasons'. Regardless, if you want to talk about bringing back former players who could fill a need then Soolsma would be the one because he is a far better wide player than what Avila is.
Avila is most likely much more attainable than Soolsma.

[Red Skies At Night]

Neither Avila nor Soolsma would want to come back here. They've moved on... and so should we.

[Ivy]

All I know is that I'm happy we still have Silva. After the Houston incident, I was sure all 3 of them would be gone.

[Ultra & Proud]

Of course none of the mentioned players would come back here. Why would they and I still say that we could do better, for less money, if we did our due diligence and didn't do any of our typical rush buys.

[ag futbol]

Avila makes 100k this year which is $0.04 more than Bostock. Ephraim on the other hand is 180k. BTW an average on the cap salary is 140k, so he's got a below average salary.
Personally I'm not interested in any of these guys. And I have to say the bit about Bostock someone made a little while back rings true: where's the effort?

Sorry to say it but lot of these guys coming from Europe are just not hungry. If everyone had Richard Eckersley's drive to play or Robert Earnshaw's all-in effort pressing that'd be great... but unfortately a few of them stink of a sense of entitlement, all while getting handed their jocks every week.

[khso11]

Assets can be traded for assets though. Garbage will be shipped for likewise.

If Chivas wants to overpay, ring the register. He's good, but not untouchable.

sure, if they're willing to paid him a "laba transfer fee", and pay him DP money, otherwise I don't see that happening.

[khso11]

I think 'heart' comes in there.

I don't feel like he is giving his all here. In Chivas he would.

I think it's more because of the team's record, which really brings down the morale, if there are better players around him, and a winning team, he's going to be brilliant!

[Nuvinho]

So Chivas just traded a 1st pick and $$$$ for Gabe Farfan.

Hopefully somehow we can get that 1st round pick from Philly.

[notthesun]

So Chivas just traded a 1st pick and $$$$ for Gabe Farfan.

Hopefully somehow we can get that 1st round pick from Philly.

Danny Califf back to Philly for that sounds pretty good...

Not that I would make that trade if I were Philly. We'd need to throw in a kicker of some sort.

[TFC07]

f
So Chivas just traded a 1st pick and $$$$ for Gabe Farfan.

Hopefully somehow we can get that 1st round pick from Philly.

Wow, just wow. Just imagine what TFC could get from Chivas for Silva.

[Ajax TFC]

Personally I'm not interested in any of these guys. And I have to say the bit about Bostock someone made a little while back rings true: where's the effort?

Sorry to say it but lot of these guys coming from Europe are just not hungry.
Exactly my feeling as well. Our problem is that we have so few quality domestic players. There's Silva, and then there's some okay squad players but no one who stands out. Bekker and Osorio might after they have more time to settle in to the league. My thinking is that instead of using the international spots to constantly trial more unknown qualities from Europe who IF they manage to be decent, we likely would have to overpay to get, we trade the international spot to a team that's obsessed with foreign players like Chivas in exchange for a domestic player who we know is good, like Avila. Then in a year or two we get the spot back and still have the player. When you consider that we're using three spots on Bostock, Ephraim, and Lambe, unless we plan on bringing in three good, almost guaranteed to be good internationals this summer, it could be worth trading one of the spots for a solid domestic. And the only team I can think of that is likely to make a stupid trade like that is Chivas.

Edit: well it looks like my point about Chivas being stupid enough was just proven.

[DoubleUp]

Now these sickos are talking about trading silva.:facepalm:

[Ivy]

BREAKING NEWS: Toronto FC officially announces Luis Silva being traded to the Montreal Impact. In return, Toronto FC will receive a first round draft pick and an undisclosed amount of allocation funds.

A message along those lines will make me hire 16-18 hitmen to take care of this entire organization. :o

[Ajax TFC]

f

Wow, just wow. Just imagine what TFC could get from Chivas for Silva.
I don't think Chivas even has any assets left that are worth Silva unless they want to permanently trade us their first round selections. Plus I'd like to see us actually hold onto a talented player for once. I'm sure if Chivas has anything of value left, they can be tricked into trading it for a lot less than our best domestic player

[starter]

Silva is easily the most exciting player on the roster we have had for the last 2 years. I rather see us building around him, than trade him to fit some transient system we would be trying.

[TFC07]

I don't think Chivas even has any assets left that are worth Silva unless they want to permanently trade us their first round selections. Plus I'd like to see us actually hold onto a talented player for once. I'm sure if Chivas has anything of value left, they can be tricked into trading it for a lot less than our best domestic player

The only way I see Silva being traded is if TFC signs DP AM. Chivas obviously doesn't have anything TFC wants, but however, I could see other teams offering quality players to fill our needs (wide players, a striker, LB). We got a lot of holes to fill in this roster and signing a DP AM (Payne kind of hinted this might happen in summer time) means Silva will become expendable (to be honest, there's no player on TFC is untouchable) and an asset to make a big trade.

[Yohan]

The only way I see Silva being traded is if TFC signs DP AM. Chivas obviously doesn't have anything TFC wants, but however, I could see other teams offering quality players to fill our needs (wide players, a striker, LB). We got a lot of holes to fill in this roster and signing a DP AM (Payne kind of hinted this might happen in summer time) means Silva will become expendable (to be honest, there's no player on TFC is untouchable) and an asset to make a big trade.
Silva is not expendable. You want depth. What if this DP AM gets a long term injury? There is no one else on TFC roster that can play AM like Silva. (Bostock probably could, but he's not proven in MLS)

[TFC07]

Silva is not expendable. You want depth. What if this DP AM gets a long term injury? There is no one else on TFC roster that can play AM like Silva. (Bostock probably could, but he's not proven in MLS)

There's going to be a lot of players (hopefully quality players) coming in summer window which will result in a lot of current players leaving (waived, end of their loans and possible trades). So it's hard to answer your question (we could possibly be getting players who can play AM at times as well).

[Yohan]

There's going to be a lot of players (hopefully quality players) coming in summer window which will result in a lot of current players leaving (waived, end of their loans and possible trades). So it's hard to answer your question (we could possibly be getting players who can play AM at times as well).
you'd be hard to find a player like Silva who is a domestic, cost 75k in cap hit and is already familiar with TFC and MLS. He's probably most bang for buck player on TFC right now.

anyone else TFC gets in summer in AM is likely an international, has higher cap hit than Silva and don't know MLS and likely won't be effective right away.

[OgtheDim]

Sooooooooooo....................what other team could do with Califf?

Philly?

DC?

[Yohan]

Sooooooooooo....................what other team could do with Califf?

Philly?

DC?
Vancouver... montreal if Nesta is out even longer. Colorado and its injury bug. Portland could use some depth too

[Morlesio14]

Vancouver... montreal if Nesta is out even longer. Colorado and its injury bug. Portland could use some depth too

Could we get any quality in return? If so, who?

[Yohan]

Could we get any quality in return? If so, who?
At this moment, Califf's value is pretty low. He's not a starter for a crappy TFC team. Has 150k cap hit, plus 33 yrs old.

If Califf is on the market, other GMs would assume it is a salary dump move on TFC's part. You might get small allocation or a 2nd rd/supplemental draft pick. Maybe a depth player

[mcolvy]

At this moment, Califf's value is pretty low. He's not a starter for a crappy TFC team. Has 150k cap hit, plus 33 yrs old.

If Califf is on the market, other GMs would assume it is a salary dump move on TFC's part. You might get small allocation or a 2nd rd/supplemental draft pick. Maybe a depth player

Your speaking like your an industry expert. Califf has alot going for him. Hes the type of guy a portland type team could use to just add into their solid mix.

Again with Silva. Like guys. I know because of everyone elses lack of creativity on the team makes what he does seem special but it really isnt.. TFC does lack that, but we can and will find others. Silva makes 2-3 slick balls a game and then does nothing else but struggle to keep up with Nellys system. Hes not slow, its just hes got no agility. No acceleration. He cant change direction. Hes clever enough to make up for that offensively by keeping defenders honest. But tracking his man, cutting off passing lanes and pressuring the ball he looks like hes out of his league. Payne talks about wanting athletic players and Silva isnt one of them.

Hes been played at 3 different positions the past few weeks. Means he doesnt have a spot and they are evaluating if they can find a spot for him (cause he is on a cap friendly salary). Chivas will overpayy for his heritage. Hes from Cali and would favor the move (after his rookie deal is up or by some point he WILL end up there guaranteed.)

I want jose Correa. Cheap young. Latin...(shoot we dont really have the flexbility to bring in another international..... wait with two new dps..... assuming they will be international (cough the 1.5-2 year guy could be Hercules). We are screwed international wise.

[TFC07]

you'd be hard to find a player like Silva who is a domestic, cost 75k in cap hit and is already familiar with TFC and MLS. He's probably most bang for buck player on TFC right now.

anyone else TFC gets in summer in AM is likely an international, has higher cap hit than Silva and don't know MLS and likely won't be effective right away.

Maybe so, but however, Silva himself hasn't played well recently and isn't exactly a superstar. He's 24 years old and there isn't much more upside left in his game to improve compare to someone like Bostock (Assuming he stays in Toronto and actually makes more an effort in the defensive end).

Right now, Silva value is high enough to get you a good piece to help you in other area while you sign a better AM (DP level) who most likely make a bigger impact than Silva ever could make in a game.

As for depth, you can fill with cheap young players with upside. Bostock could be that guy or it could be someone else who's capable of playing AM to fill in case of injury. Not every international player is going to be a starter. So it isn't a big issue as some people make it out to be.

[jloome]

At this moment, Califf's value is pretty low. He's not a starter for a crappy TFC team. Has 150k cap hit, plus 33 yrs old.

If Califf is on the market, other GMs would assume it is a salary dump move on TFC's part. You might get small allocation or a 2nd rd/supplemental draft pick. Maybe a depth player

Might get a depth winger out of it if we're lucky. But you're right, probably a draft pick and allocation.

[notthesun]

But tracking his man, cutting off passing lanes and pressuring the ball he looks like hes out of his league.

Probably because he's played AM his whole career so he hasn't had to do much of that. Because of weaknesses elsewhere in the squad we haven't been able to deploy him as a straight up CAM very much. It would be incredibly foolish to trade him because he doesn't fit into this makeshift team rather than wait until we can form a solid roster and thus afford the luxury of playing him in a more advanced role.

edit: saying a 24 year old has no upside is ridiculous. Not every player peaks at 25, much less 23 year old rookies. Give me a break.

[Richard]

He is our best American player, lets not start trading our only blue chip asset that has any value to other teams in the league.

Avila to me has no substance, seems to float in and out of games, nowhere near as good like Silva who can produce with more consistensy.

[Canary10]

you'd be hard to find a player like Silva who is a domestic, cost 75k in cap hit and is already familiar with TFC and MLS. He's probably most bang for buck player on TFC right now.

anyone else TFC gets in summer in AM is likely an international, has higher cap hit than Silva and don't know MLS and likely won't be effective right away.

I think Osorio can play the same role just fine, particularly if he's a sub to a DP attacking midfielder.

[Canary10]

Probably because he's played AM his whole career so he hasn't had to do much of that. Because of weaknesses elsewhere in the squad we haven't been able to deploy him as a straight up CAM very much. It would be incredibly foolish to trade him because he doesn't fit into this makeshift team rather than wait until we can form a solid roster and thus afford the luxury of playing him in a more advanced role.

edit: saying a 24 year old has no upside is ridiculous. Not every player peaks at 25, much less 23 year old rookies. Give me a break.

Nelsen doesn't even like playing with a straight up central attacking midfielder. That's why Silva doesn't have a real place on this team. Everyone knows he's too good to sit on the bench, so he's been tried all over the place. But I don't think he fits Nelsen's system. Which is why I made the prediction he'd be traded. Look, if Silva was the answer, Payne would not be floating around the idea of a DP central midfielder.

[OgtheDim]

I don't think we are yet seeing Nelsen's true preferred system. I think he's playing a system to go with who and what we have.

E.g. He's not tied to 2 forwards.

[Ultra & Proud]

I really think the best we could get for Califf is an international spot, allocation, or maybe a second round draft pick at best. I can't see us getting a player unless it's someone who has really fallen out of favor at his current club or has an ass-ugly guaranteed contract. Or Payne is a magician. Whichever.

[ProfessorDamage]

The only way I see Silva being traded is if TFC signs DP AM.


http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01358/frank_lampard_1358363c.jpg

[Red I]

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01358/frank_lampard_1358363c.jpg

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/116/253/i_have_the_weirdest_boner_right_now_344.jpg

[Ultra & Proud]

Although Tim Lieweke had some connections with Lampard going from his LA days I doubt it would be him. I read all those interviews with Lieweke saying he wanted to talk to Payne about getting a big time DP in to 'grow the brand' like he did with LA into a worldwide (ie. Asian) marketable franchise and although Lampard is a fairly big player, he isn't the guy to sell a few million $$$ worth of jerseys. Won't happen soon but I expect in a few years someone of a massive caliber to do just that. :hide:



http://www.topnews.in/files/Wayne_Rooney_05.jpg

[mdc 77]

Wish it was Lampard, but no chance. Frank is resigning before the weekend with Chelsea.

[ProfessorDamage]

Wish it was Lampard, but no chance. Frank is resigning before the weekend with Chelsea.

I know - he wants a new deal because Mourinho is coming back to the Bridge. Wishful thinking on my part, believe me.

[notthesun]

Nelsen doesn't even like playing with a straight up central attacking midfielder. That's why Silva doesn't have a real place on this team. Everyone knows he's too good to sit on the bench, so he's been tried all over the place. But I don't think he fits Nelsen's system. Which is why I made the prediction he'd be traded. Look, if Silva was the answer, Payne would not be floating around the idea of a DP central midfielder.

He doesn't like it, or he doesn't think he can do it effectively with the players he has?

Besides, we played 4-4-1-1 for the first 4 games of the year. Silva would be a perfect CF. He would have played there if he wasn't injured I bet.

The DP central midfielder was only described as "creative". He would be the playmaking CM to partner Laba as the defensive CM, with Silva playing off the ST. No issue there.

[OgtheDim]

I'm thinking the older DP is going to be somebody playing currently in Spain, and I'm thinking that's where the creative part will come from.

Look at 29 - 33 year old non Defensive Middies at Barca or Real. It would cost us a mint for Iniesta so I'm thinking not him. Although he would be by a mile the best player EVER in this league.

The younger DP I think is going to be a forward, from somewhere else.

[ag futbol]

^ my bet would be that it's not Real or Barca. I don't see anyone on either squad that is old enough to come or doesn't have other better options if told to leave.

I'd look at Valencia, Malga, etc.. For someone who is talented but just a little older where a MLS squad would pay more than a European side would.

Joaquín of Malga ticks a lot of those boxes IMO. It would be incredibly pricy but do-able. Also heard he is on a free this summer (if memory serves). It's similar to that other guy from Spain who was linked with Seattle earlier this year.

[ensco]

Joaquín of Malga ticks a lot of those boxes IMO. It would be incredibly pricy but do-able. Also heard he is on a free this summer (if memory serves). It's similar to that other guy from Spain who was linked with Seattle earlier this year.

Verdu at Espanyol.

Neither of those guys are coming. They would cost millions, but don't put fans in the seats. They are the kinds of players that wind up at teams like Schalke, Lyon, Fulham, Fiorentina.

[ArmenJBX]

Oh man, I'd love Joaquin at Toronto FC. Perfect, fast winger.

[Haddy]

I'm thinking the older DP is going to be somebody playing currently in Spain, and I'm thinking that's where the creative part will come from.

Look at 29 - 33 year old non Defensive Middies at Barca or Real. It would cost us a mint for Iniesta so I'm thinking not him. Although he would be by a mile the best player EVER in this league.

The younger DP I think is going to be a forward, from somewhere else.

Kaka?

Been to BMO before so he's had a tour. Career not exactly budding anymore. He said previously MLS would be an option....one day.

It's a stretch but you mentioned Spain and he's the first name that comes to mind.

Half-joking here, but Toronto's Portuguese-speaking community would almost instantly fix any drop in ticket sales.

[TFC07]

I personally would be shocked if TFC land a "big name" DP this year. Maybe next year or couple of years we might see a major superstar signing. But then again, you never know especially now that Leiweke is running MLSE.

[OgtheDim]

I personally would be shocked if TFC land a "big name" DP this year. Maybe next year or couple of years we might see a major superstar signing. But then again, you never know especially now that Leiweke is running MLSE.

:)

That's why I threw it out as speculation.


Leiweke looking to make a splash.

Payne already indicated value can be had in Spain with players leaving the top teams, and among South American based players who used to go home.

And with the discussion of "the best player in this league" I'm thinking a player who has played at the top level of Europe.

[Ultra & Proud]

See guys like Kaka and Joaquin are good and definitely would help us on the pitch and in the stands but going by his comments I think Lieweke is looking bigger than that. The Beckham thing was what it was but they won a few trophies, filled stadiums even on international tours, and became the only MLS team people in foreign countries can name if asked. I think Lieweke is beyond our old thinkings of filling the stadium being job #1. I think Liweke's main agenda with TFC will be making the club a known commodity in world football, to sell millions of jerseys worldwide, and get our TV viewership up and thusly our revenue from advertising up as well. Guys like Kaka and Joaquin are great players but they don't have that kind of rock star clout and that is what I expect Lieweke to want. I guess it may all depend on whether Payne wants that or if he can be coerced into obliging.

[billyfly]

Now that there is all this effort to close out matches with these new players, in TFC fashion, we'll never have the lead to defend in the first place.

[Ultra & Proud]

Now that there is all this effort to close out matches with these new players, in TFC fashion, we'll never have the lead to defend in the first place.
We will beat the Crew this weekend. For sure.

[Haddy]

Guys like Kaka and Joaquin are great players but they don't have that kind of rock star clout and that is what I expect Lieweke to want. I guess it may all depend on whether Payne wants that or if he can be coerced into obliging.

Anything is possible. The Phil Jackson to the Raps thing won't go away for the same reason - Leiweke.

L.A. was a bit of a different beast, though. The whole club played well, with and without Beckham. If the world did tune in to watch, they saw a team win. If a real "megastar" comes here in some grand plan, the rest of the squad better not be human pylons.

In the meantime, who else can we scalp from QPR?

[Ultra & Proud]

Anything is possible. The Phil Jackson to the Raps thing won't go away for the same reason - Leiweke.

L.A. was a bit of a different beast, though. The whole club played well, with and without Beckham. If the world did tune in to watch, they saw a team win. If a real "megastar" comes here in some grand plan, the rest of the squad better not be human pylons.

In the meantime, who else can we scalp from QPR?

But right before they got Becky they were just standard MLS shite. They weren't even good in his first season. Having that name and brand power brought in the rest of the team.

[Manager87]

From a very secured source-TFC is arfter KAKA

[ag futbol]

But right before they got Becky they were just standard MLS shite. They weren't even good in his first season. Having that name and brand power brought in the rest of the team.
That's somewhat accurate, but not completely. They were the first team in the league to be profitable, most consistent attendance wise, and by many other ways ahead of the rest of the pack. Obviously Beckham gave thema huge push, but you never would of had success like that in the wrong market. It was a perfect storm. There isn't a player on earth who would gather that much media attention if signed currently. Every major media outlet in the united states had it as their top story and they were hounding the guy from the second he touched down in the airport. They were running with that as live coverage the second it happened. They couldn't create the effect with Messi or Ronaldo or anyone, because they don't transcend sport the way Beckham does. It would be big news, but it would fall far short of beckham attention wise.

To add to that prior to MLS Beckham wasn't exactly a hot commodity either. He was considered every bit as much of a wash-out as Kaka is currently, if not worse. Completely disagree that the Brazilian isn't in the global brand ambassador mold. He has 10M followers on twitter (more than any other footballer at the time he hit the mark) and he provides updates in three different language. Has a loyal fanbase with somewhat of a religious tilt, it ticks all kinds of boxes marketers would like to see. Obviously not Beckham, but from the perspective of a signing that looks to gather attention? It's top drawer.

[Morlesio14]

From a very secured source-TFC is arfter KAKA

Sure

[Auzzy]

But right before they got Becky they were just standard MLS shite. They weren't even good in his first season. Having that name and brand power brought in the rest of the team.

After a year of mostly fiasco with Beckham, they also got Bruce Arena in 2008. Probably helped that team succeed as much as anything else -- plus success, big players, and a known successful coach makes it easier to pull in other big players. I think Nelsen could do OK overall with TFC, but having him as a rookie coach, with a super-duper star player, would be kind of funny. (A big star could easily be bigger than/overshadow Payne as well.)



From a very secured source-TFC is arfter KAKA

Hmm, interesting, we shall see. Kaka has over 15 million followers on Twitter by the way.

[flatpicker]

Hmm, interesting, we shall see. Kaka has over 15 million followers on Twitter by the way.

That means TFC could sell 15 million jerseys!

win win

[Richard]

I could care less about a superstar at the moment. I just want a solid core group of players who can grow together for the next few years. The second we make this type of signing the expectations will become playoffs/championships or bust. I fear if they do this to soon we could see another TFC disaster in the making, we need the key pieces in place first. I would like the team to be at least average before TFC dives into this type of signing.

[Oldtimer]

From a very secured source-TFC is arfter KAKA

Since you are not giving the source, and you have not built up "insider" credibility yet, there is no reason for us to give this any more weight than speculation. Sorry if you turn out to be the real deal, but there is a lot of water under the bridge for these supposed big name transfers over the years.

That discussing speculation, I would theoretically like Kaka if he's still fit, both for skill and for character.

[TFC07]

Manager87 might be trolling us, but I hope he isn't though. Getting Kaka will be amazing and a lot of soccer fans in the city will come out just watch him play.

[valeo]

Manager87 might be trolling us, but I hope he isn't though. Getting Kaka will be amazing and a lot of soccer fans in the city will come out just watch him play.

He is obviously trolling.

You guys should sign up Harry Kewell.

[DoubleUp]

This team cannot appreciate the brilliance of Kaka.

and Nelsen coaching Kaka is a joke on every level of football.

[ensco]

I am after Angelina Jolie.

Well, I was, until I met my wife.

[Marc"2L"]

I am after Angelina Jolie.
Well, I was, until I met my wife.

I just don't get it.

Anyway, Kaka? Why Kaka? There's a bigger Portuguese community in Toronto then straight up Brazilian, no?

Then again, too many years left on that contract, or you know, a billion Euros.

[valeo]

This team cannot appreciate the brilliance of Kaka.

and Nelsen coaching Kaka is a joke on every level of football.

Why? I very much doubt Kaka needs a whole lot of coaching.

[jabbronies]

Neither Avila nor Soolsma would want to come back here. They've moved on... and so should we.

Amen

[PopePouri]

Payne seems to be hinting strongly at Kaka though. Saying that he'll be "the best player in MLS", looking at a "DP quality" midfielder, looking at "South American players playing in Europe".

[Haddy]

I just don't get it.

Anyway, Kaka? Why Kaka? There's a bigger Portuguese community in Toronto then straight up Brazilian, no?

Then again, too many years left on that contract, or you know, a billion Euros.

Agreed. The Portuguese community is much bigger than the Brazilian side here in Toronto. But I've also noted over the years that there is a ton of cross-over because of the common language and history.

Sorry to throw out Kaka's name today and get everyone excited. It just sorta makes sense based on extremely limited info.

Btw, I bet I'm Manager87's source :facepalm:

[Manager87]

My source us someone within TFC

[OgtheDim]

Hmm....maybe we could get some Brazilian drums and whistles and samba and...and.....


oh what am I thinking, we'll probably get Charlie Adams.

[ag futbol]

My source us someone within TFC
Looks like a case of a Freudian typo

[Morlesio14]

Hmm....maybe we could get some Brazilian drums and whistles and samba and...and.....


oh what am I thinking, we'll probably get Charlie Adams.

I wouldn't mind that.

[Derko]

Hmm....maybe we could get some Brazilian drums and whistles and samba and...and.....


oh what am I thinking, we'll probably get Charlie Adams.

Oye! Charlie Adams not that bad, I'll sick my dear old Dad on ya, g:D

[DoubleUp]

Why? I very much doubt Kaka needs a whole lot of coaching.
Exactly my point!. Maybe we can bring him in as player-Manager.:rolleyes:

[Greatest Ripoff]

Agreed. The Portuguese community is much bigger than the Brazilian side here in Toronto.

Well that is till Portugal gets knocked out of the World Cup and Brazil is still playing.

[jloome]

He is obviously trolling.

You guys should sign up Harry Kewell.

As a DP? You must be kidding.

[gate7]

Tfc already has "kaka"....:piggy:

[Voodooman]

Tfc already has "kaka"....:piggy:

Alright I laughed...

[Ivy]

My source us someone within TFC
My source (a security guard at BMO field) said that your source (Paul Mariner's bartender) is wrong. Sorry brah...

[Oldtimer]

^OK guys, go easy on him, Manager87 just doesn't have a track record yet. We have had insider information before. We've also had people troll us. Let's just wait and see how it pans out.

[Canary10]

He doesn't like it, or he doesn't think he can do it effectively with the players he has?

Besides, we played 4-4-1-1 for the first 4 games of the year. Silva would be a perfect CF. He would have played there if he wasn't injured I bet.

The DP central midfielder was only described as "creative". He would be the playmaking CM to partner Laba as the defensive CM, with Silva playing off the ST. No issue there.

They've played 4-4-1-1 with Silva in the hole, but haven't done it consistently. Tells me Nelsen isn't satisfied with him there. In a way, you are proving my point. If he doesn't feel he has the central attacking midfielder to play a formation using that position, then they are likely looking past Silva.

Good point about the DP central mid being described as "creative." There's a difference between a creative midfielder and an attacking midfielder.

[nonc]

Maybe so, but however, Silva himself hasn't played well recently and isn't exactly a superstar. He's 24 years old and there isn't much more upside left in his game to improve compare to someone like Bostock (Assuming he stays in Toronto and actually makes more an effort in the defensive end).

Right now, Silva value is high enough to get you a good piece to help you in other area while you sign a better AM (DP level) who most likely make a bigger impact than Silva ever could make in a game.

As for depth, you can fill with cheap young players with upside. Bostock could be that guy or it could be someone else who's capable of playing AM to fill in case of injury. Not every international player is going to be a starter. So it isn't a big issue as some people make it out to be.

You and this other guy are kidding yourselves regarding Silva. TFC's entire history is a repetitive story of bad players, temporary players, bad squads, why remove a rare success story are you sadistic? Bostock is more effective than Ephraim but still a dime a dozen, international, and would be grossly overpaid on an actual TFC contract. Silva is TFC's only adequate connection beyond Hall and Laba, he was putting balls on a plate in Colorado but his teammates suck. He's got little to work with, not to mention Nelsen's still figuring out his own system on all areas of the field. Why do you think Silva got invited to train with a Bundesliga club. He's cheap and domestic and good...yeah keep talking this is hilarious.

One AM is not enough for an entire damn squad, TFC needs Silva and this possible DP AM. His versatility is a bonus. If TFC had more average players like Silva they might field and average MLS team before hell freezes over.

[jloome]

They've played 4-4-1-1 with Silva in the hole, but haven't done it consistently. Tells me Nelsen isn't satisfied with him there. In a way, you are proving my point. If he doesn't feel he has the central attacking midfielder to play a formation using that position, then they are likely looking past Silva.

Good point about the DP central mid being described as "creative." There's a difference between a creative midfielder and an attacking midfielder.

He was out injured for most of the time they were playing a flat 4-4-1.

[Yohan]

They've played 4-4-1-1 with Silva in the hole, but haven't done it consistently. Tells me Nelsen isn't satisfied with him there. In a way, you are proving my point. If he doesn't feel he has the central attacking midfielder to play a formation using that position, then they are likely looking past Silva.

Good point about the DP central mid being described as "creative." There's a difference between a creative midfielder and an attacking midfielder.

4-4-1-1 with small striker only works if there is a lot of team movement in support of attack in a ground passing based game. TFC midfield, esp wingers do not support the attack well, hence static nature of offence and why the hoofball to Earnshaw which is stupid. Silva is not the problem.

[Canary10]

Possibly. I think at times we were playing 4-4-1-1 against Colorado. I do agree we shit on the wings though and need something better there for that to work.

[brad]

^OK guys, go easy on him, Manager87 just doesn't have a track record yet. We have had insider information before. We've also had people troll us. Let's just wait and see how it pans out.

Insider info around TFC isn't exactly hard to come by. I've found a number of things that should have been highly confidential (like the status of Torsten Frings injury at one point) without even looking.

But agree - let's not jump at people posting inside info - right, wrong or otherwise.

[Initial B]

Hmmm, just looking at the Kaka possibility - he hasn't been starting every game for RM and I think they might already have his replacement waiting in the wings. If Jose Mourinho is leaving, they might be looking at a retooling of their squad to pay down some of their debt. Kaka has played in 4-2-3-1 and diamond 4-4-2s while at RM, which might be what Nelsen's preferred formations may end up being.

How would this look as a possible best-XI after the summer transfer window?

---------------Frei
-Emory-Caldwell-O'Dea-Eckersley
-----------Laba--Hall
-Brockie------Kaka--------Earnshaw
-----------Koevermans

Or this?

---------------Frei
-Emory-Caldwell-O'Dea-Eckersley
--------------Laba
-Brockie------Kaka--------Silva
---Koevermans----Earnshaw

The transfer fee and salary would probably be huge, but Bogers has deep pockets and might be able to make the money back in media revenues as TFC becomes a 'must-see' team in MLS, on par with NYRB and LAG. Perhaps a new holy trinity?

<SLAP!>

Okay, that feels much better. Back to reality now...

[Oldtimer]

Payne said two DPs. I'd prefer:




---------------Frei
-Emory-Caldwell-O'Dea-Eckersley
-----------Laba--Hall
-Brockie------Kaka--------Earnshaw
-------------Messi


OK, enough of this insane dreaming. :)

[Ultra & Proud]

Payne said two DPs. I'd prefer:

---------------Frei
-Emory-Caldwell-O'Dea-Eckersley
-----------Laba--Hall
-Brockie------Kaka--------Earnshaw
-------------Messi

OK, enough of this insane dreaming. :)


Something like this (in time, not now) wouldn't totally shock me if Lieweke and Payne are on the same page and both get what they want and the insanity can continue:

------------Bendik---------------

--Emory-Boss-O'Dea-Eckersley--

-----------Laba--Hall----------

---Osorio---Bekker---Lopez------

-------------Rooney-------------

[Detroit_TFC]

No matter who is it, most everyone will think it is a crap signing. Because that is our way.

[Ultra & Proud]

No matter who is it, most everyone will think it is a crap signing. Because that is our way.
Only if we sign an English DP, possibly even an international who played in the EPL prior to here because then it's all 1970s hoofball!!!1!!1

[Initial B]

Well, Lieweke signed Beckham from RM to LAG, so he might be using his contacts there for Kaka - kind of a Beckham Redux. I just worry whether Kaka would make everyone better, or everybody else will drag him down.

U&P, regarding your lineup, we're more likely to get Ronaldo instead of Rooney in a couple of years...

[Canary10]

We traded for Bobby Convey?

[brandrews]

http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2013/05/toronto-trades-bobby-convey

sure did

[Abou Sky]

Something like this (in time, not now) wouldn't totally shock me if Lieweke and Payne are on the same page and both get what they want and the insanity can continue:

------------Bendik---------------

--Emory-Boss-O'Dea-Eckersley--

-----------Laba--Hall----------

---Osorio---Bekker---Lopez------

-------------Rooney-------------

I have been thinking Rooney for a while but don't want to sound like an idiot.

It makes sense from a marketing standpoint with Liewike etc. Rooney is on his way out at ManU and I think that DiVaio proves that you can be a waning star in a top flight league and kill it in MLS.

I don't think this year but wouldn't be surprised if it was 2014

[Blakfish]

If Rooney came to TFC I'll eat my own fingers. No way in hell that'll happen, stop dreaming.

[pekduck]

Toronto Trades For Bobby Convey

http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2013/05/toronto-trades-bobby-convey

[Initial B]

So where would Convey fit into our formation? In KC's 4-3-3 they had him playing LW so would he play LM in our current setup? That would seem to be an upgrade over what we have there currently...

[Stryker]

200g's in cap hit. Salary dump for KC.

[TFC07]

You and this other guy are kidding yourselves regarding Silva. TFC's entire history is a repetitive story of bad players, temporary players, bad squads, why remove a rare success story are you sadistic? Bostock is more effective than Ephraim but still a dime a dozen, international, and would be grossly overpaid on an actual TFC contract. Silva is TFC's only adequate connection beyond Hall and Laba, he was putting balls on a plate in Colorado but his teammates suck. He's got little to work with, not to mention Nelsen's still figuring out his own system on all areas of the field. Why do you think Silva got invited to train with a Bundesliga club. He's cheap and domestic and good...yeah keep talking this is hilarious.

One AM is not enough for an entire damn squad, TFC needs Silva and this possible DP AM. His versatility is a bonus. If TFC had more average players like Silva they might field and average MLS team before hell freezes over.

1. Silva isn't capable playing another positions outside of AM and maybe (second) striker. So I don't know where this versatility talk is coming from.

2. Silva is a good player (bit overrated on this board though), but his upside is limited given his age. Bostock might cost us an international slot, but he got some serious upside in his game. Problem with Bostock is his work ethic and he hasn't been given opportunity to play middle of the park.

3. He got value in this league that he can land us a good player to fill other needs (wide players for an example). This is the reason why I don't mind trading Silva if we can get a better player from summer window to replace his position in the end.

[TFC07]

So where would Convey fit into our formation? In KC's 4-3-3 they had him playing LW so would he play LM in our current setup? That would seem to be an upgrade over what we have there currently...

Yes, most likely that's where he's going to play. But he's going to cost us $200K which isn't good.

[Ultra & Proud]

If Rooney came to TFC I'll eat my own fingers. No way in hell that'll happen, stop dreaming.
This is the type of thing that wouldn't surprise me with Lieweke. Rooney is a big name, will sell jerseys worldwide, will boost TV numbers, and is a player who is already heavily on the decline. Due to him starting pro football so young he is showing the burnout level of a player in his early 30's. He is nearly done competing at the top level at 27.

[ProfessorDamage]

You gotta say that the shitshow going on with our roster this far into the season is just mesmerizing. I can't look away, knowing that any hour now there might be a new exit or addition. TFC has never been boring, and it's staying true to form in 2013.

[Detroit_TFC]

Bobby Convey, I've always rated him. I'm a bit concerned about his fitness though, currently injured and has only played 3 games this season.

[brad]

I have been thinking Rooney for a while but don't want to sound like an idiot.

It makes sense from a marketing standpoint with Liewike etc. Rooney is on his way out at ManU and I think that DiVaio proves that you can be a waning star in a top flight league and kill it in MLS.

I don't think this year but wouldn't be surprised if it was 2014

Rooney still has 2 years left on his contract and United will be wanting something in the order of 30-40 million pound for him - so no way is he coming to MLS.

[ProfessorDamage]

This is the type of thing that wouldn't surprise me with Lieweke. Rooney is a big name, will sell jerseys worldwide, will boost TV numbers, and is a player who is already heavily on the decline. Due to him starting pro football so young he is showing the burnout level of a player in his early 30's. He is nearly done competing at the top level at 27.

Whaaaaa? He had 12 goals in the best league in the world this year, is the 13th leading goal scorer of EPL ahead of guys like Carlos Tevez, Sergio Aguero, Lukas Podolski, Daniel Sturridge and Juan Mata. And while he's 13th, there are five guys tied for spot ahead of him with 14 goals.

You're saying he's "nearly done competing at the top level?"

[brad]

This is the type of thing that wouldn't surprise me with Lieweke. Rooney is a big name, will sell jerseys worldwide, will boost TV numbers, and is a player who is already heavily on the decline. Due to him starting pro football so young he is showing the burnout level of a player in his early 30's. He is nearly done competing at the top level at 27.

I think he would be a disaster in the MLS. A fit, committed Rooney could arguably be the best player the league has ever seen (based on his all around ability + his physical presence), but a large part of why he is on the outs with United is because is he more interested in boozing it up (and smoking) than he is with playing professional football. If you can't motivate yourself in an environment like that - I can't imagine what sort of a disaster he'd be here.

[brad]

Whaaaaa? He had 12 goals in the best league in the world this year, is the 13th leading goal scorer of EPL ahead of guys like Carlos Tevez, Sergio Aguero, Lukas Podolski, Daniel Sturridge and Juan Mata. And while he's 13th, there are five guys tied for spot ahead of him with 14 goals.

You're saying he's "nearly done competing at the top level?"

He's not looking after himself - his attitude is gone.

[brad]

Bobby Convey, I've always rated him. I'm a bit concerned about his fitness though, currently injured and has only played 3 games this season.

I haven't paid attention to him much recently - but I agree - I used to be really impressed with him

[Abou Sky]

If Rooney came to TFC I'll eat my own fingers. No way in hell that'll happen, stop dreaming.

I'm not 'dreaming' I have no love for Shrek, C. Ronaldo would be my wet dream.

[ProfessorDamage]

He's not looking after himself - his attitude is gone.

Wow, too bad Moyes got the top job at United. With talent-evaluation skills and baseless, broad pronouncements like that, you'd have been a game changer.

In all seriousness, though, the guy's still one of the top strikers in the world. We might bring him here one day, but not before he's thirty-something and REALLY over the hill. Then his value will be lifting the profile of the league here in North America, rather than adding any sort of hugely meaningful contribution.

[Abou Sky]

This is the type of thing that wouldn't surprise me with Lieweke. Rooney is a big name, will sell jerseys worldwide, will boost TV numbers, and is a player who is already heavily on the decline. Due to him starting pro football so young he is showing the burnout level of a player in his early 30's. He is nearly done competing at the top level at 27.

That said, coming to Toronto may reinvigorate him, ManU has ManU fans, here he would have Shrek fans and scoring a goal per game will lift just about anyone's spirits.

[T-boy]

Can we get back to reality please? Rooney, Ronaldo, heck even Pele will NOT be coming to TFC in the anytime near future!

[brad]

Wow, too bad Moyes got the top job at United. With talent-evaluation skills and baseless, broad pronouncements like that, you'd have been a game changer.

No need to get personal. But what makes you think my accusation is baseless? It's based on pretty reliable information coming out of Manchester and no big secret to those that follow United. Anyway, I'm done on this topic, as this is a thread about moves that are happening and could potentially happen - and this is not one of them.

[Canary10]

It would be absolute career suicide for Rooney to come to MLS. What T-Boy said!!

[MartinUtd]

With Lampard signing on at Chelsea for another year I wonder if Kaka will be an LAG target.

Either way the only DP's we're going to sign from Europe will be those who are out of contract. We're not paying for Rooney's transfer nor are we making a move for CR7. I bet we end up with Nicklas Bendtner.

[Blakfish]

James Beattie kinda fits the bill...

[Detroit_TFC]

This is pure extrapolation but LAG/Leiweke had (still has, who knows?) close relationship with Tottenham. Any players from from Spurs on the way out/seem like a likely target?

[Ultra & Proud]

I imagine more moves like this (Convey) will be coming as after June we'll have some holes in our roster.

[Canary10]

This is pure extrapolation but LAG/Leiweke had (still has, who knows?) close relationship with Tottenham. Any players from from Spurs on the way out/seem like a likely target?

If anyone says Bale I will slap you silly.

[Oldtimer]

With talent-evaluation skills and baseless, broad pronouncements like that, you'd have been a game changer.


Please don't personally attack anyone. Just deal with the argument, not the person.

YOUR FRIENDLY MODERATOR TEAM.

[Canary10]

This is pure extrapolation but LAG/Leiweke had (still has, who knows?) close relationship with Tottenham. Any players from from Spurs on the way out/seem like a likely target?

Although I actually think Ade would be very good in MLS. Plus I'd like to see him get the fuck out of Spurs.

[Red I]

This is pure extrapolation but LAG/Leiweke had (still has, who knows?) close relationship with Tottenham. Any players from from Spurs on the way out/seem like a likely target?

Iago Falque would be a good loan target for Toronto for this year; would get that creative midfielder the team is lacking, but would probably be a short term thing - I'm pretty sure Spurs are still trying to dump Bentley, but he hasn't done much since he played for Blackburn

[T-boy]

James Beattie kinda fits the bill...

World breaking news: TFC sign star from Accrington Stanley!

[T-boy]

Bobby Convey, I've always rated him. I'm a bit concerned about his fitness though, currently injured and has only played 3 games this season.

Is this a fact, or are you just assuming he's injured as he hasn't played the last few games?

[Yohan]

Is this a fact, or are you just assuming he's injured as he hasn't played the last few games?
Convey is known to be a bit of nurse chaser...

[OgtheDim]

This is pure extrapolation but LAG/Leiweke had (still has, who knows?) close relationship with Tottenham. Any players from from Spurs on the way out/seem like a likely target?


6 Degrees of Seperation


Modric?


Yeah, I know, dreaming.

[Ultra & Proud]

Is this a fact, or are you just assuming he's injured as he hasn't played the last few games?

KC supporters seem to say he is an injury problem but from 2011 earlier he seemed okay. Seemed great in 2010. For a supplemental pick we can't complain especially before seeing him play. Would have to be an upgrade on Lambe at least and good cover for when Ephraim is returned from loan.

[Detroit_TFC]

Is this a fact, or are you just assuming he's injured as he hasn't played the last few games?

He's listed as out on the MLS injury report - L achilles strain

[ProfessorDamage]

6 Degrees of Seperation


Modric?


Yeah, I know, dreaming.

As in Luka Modric, the Real Madrid mid who used to play for Tottenham?

That's more than 6 degrees. More like a "Huge Stretch of Separation."

Then again, Real played TFC at BMO in that great friendly, so "Ronaldo to TFC" isn't an impossible headline... :)

[Ultra & Proud]

He's listed as out on the MLS injury report - L achilles strain

So I assume he is out for this weekend?

[Haddy]

I imagine more moves like this (Convey) will be coming as after June we'll have some holes in our roster.

Agreed. But hopefully not all of them have lived in Payne's basement :o

Anyone have an idea if he starts? Who does he replace on the depth chart...and who leaves if it's needed?

[Ultra & Proud]

Agreed. But hopefully not all of them have lived in Payne's basement :o

Seeing as DC is in the dumps now they may have some players who could use a change in scenery and I do not mean DeRo.

[T-boy]

He's listed as out on the MLS injury report - L achilles strain

Ok. I wonder if he will "suddenly" be fit now he's coming to a near team? Sometimes that's all it takes for an unhappy player to suddenly be fit and healthy. Let's hope!

[Ultra & Proud]

Ok. I wonder if he will "suddenly" be fit now he's coming to a near team? Sometimes that's all it takes for an unhappy player to suddenly be fit and healthy. Let's hope!
Well that'd say something about his attitude that some of his former teams supporters say was not great.

[Detroit_TFC]

^ Hope so. It would be frustrating if we had to wait 3 wks to see what he can add to things.

[Morlesio14]

Convey can anchor our LM position

[ag futbol]

Well that is till Portugal gets knocked out of the World Cup and Brazil is still playing.
Ahah!

That was definitely a thing previously, but it's lessened more recently. Portugal has a team in their own right that they can focus on while brazilians have a small but rapidly growing population or their own in the GTA as of late. The funny part being most of the brazilians don't give a rats ass about Portugal on any level.

[nonc]

1. Silva isn't capable playing another positions outside of AM and maybe (second) striker. So I don't know where this versatility talk is coming from.

2. Silva is a good player (bit overrated on this board though), but his upside is limited given his age. Bostock might cost us an international slot, but he got some serious upside in his game. Problem with Bostock is his work ethic and he hasn't been given opportunity to play middle of the park.

3. He got value in this league that he can land us a good player to fill other needs (wide players for an example). This is the reason why I don't mind trading Silva if we can get a better player from summer window to replace his position in the end.

Mariner used Silva as a striker for a number of games last year and he scored goals. So, you're wrong.

You're also way too hung up on his age, the simple factual probability is that as a relatively new professional he will keep getting better. Suggesting he's already hit his potential wall is silly and borderline slander. Yet you give the benefit of the doubt to Bostock, a guy who's probably been training professionally for over 5 years, playing professionally longer than Silva, yet has less of a career to show for it.

Please continue, I'll get my popcorn.

[nonc]

Payne is holding up his end of the bargain Nelsen's gotta get this sorted.

[Pint]

@KurtLarSUN: Nelsen on Bobby Convey: "We will be losing Hogan Ephraim very soon" (Courtesy: http://t.co/PowDeIZeWZ) #TFC #TorontoFC

[Abou Sky]

Seeing as DC is in the dumps now they may have some players who could use a change in scenery and I do not mean DeRo.

Pontius is freaking amazing!

[notthesun]

Pontius is freaking amazing!

Hasn't he been awful this year?

He's usually pretty good, I wouldn't say "freaking amazing" though. Above average MLSer.

[Ajax TFC]

3. He got value in this league that he can land us a good player to fill other needs (wide players for an example). This is the reason why I don't mind trading Silva if we can get a better player from summer window to replace his position in the end.
I'm not so sure about this. Sure WE value him, and many overvalue him, but how do other teams value him? I don't think they would give us anything substantial for him. Certainly nothing close to his actual value.

[Greatest Ripoff]

Toronto FC ‏@torontofc (https://twitter.com/torontofc)
#TFClive (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFClive&src=hash) Training Update: Brazilian centre back Gleison Pinto dos Santos, who goes by Santos, is currently on trial with the Reds.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gleison_Santos

[Ultra & Proud]

I am at a loss as to why we are still trying to get more defenders in. Nelsen's affection for the defenders is getting as bad as Winter's love of the DM.

[OgtheDim]

The % of trialists that go on to play a game with us is real low.

[Oldtimer]

I am at a loss as to why we are still trying to get more defenders in. Nelsen's affection for the defenders is getting as bad as Winter's love of the DM.

You're saying that TFC doesn't need better defense?

[Yohan]

Nelsen, about to bust out the infamous 8-1-1 formation. only way to stop late game goals

[Ultra & Proud]

You're saying that TFC doesn't need better defense?
In comparison to what we've had in the past, it's better. At this point of a season we are around our best GA and GD in our history. Minus the Montreal match all our loses, including road matches, were 1 goal losses. With any possession and/or decent attack, we convert some of those to draws or wins. Many people have said it and they are right that our midfield is the biggest problem. Nothing goes through there. No possession, no build up, and little attack. You can stack the back with very best defenders going and if you absorb endless minutes of solid pressure because you can't pressure the opponents defense then when that teams feels they need to they will pile defenders forward to press, as we are no threat, and that endless pressure will lead to our defenders overworking themselves, getting tired, and eventually making mistakes. That's our 90th minute complex right there and one of the reasons Earnshaw has his goals. No team respects us going forward so our best opportunities are on the quick counter when Earnshaw cherry picks.

[T-boy]

I'm in two minds about this defense thing. I'm always of the opinion that football is about outscoring the opponent - not out-defending them! TFC haven't lost a league game more than one goal this season. You can look at that in two ways - either the defense is letting in 1 too many goals, OR the team aren't scoring enough goals.

There has been a lot of mention of conceding late goals, but this wouldn't be an issue of TFC were actually creating AND scoring more goals. You simply can't continue to go 1 goal in the lead into the end of a game and always hope to never concede. That puts way too much pressure on your defenders.

So equally if the defense needs to improve, so does the TFC attack. As they say, the best form of defense IS attack. Even the best defense in the world would eventually crumble if they were being constantly bombarded with waves of attack. Nelson needs to find a way of creating more goal opportunities, and the strikers need to start putting those chances away with more regularity.

I'm not saying that defense doesn't need to improve, but the midfield creativity, and goalscoring, is definitely an issue as well.

[Yohan]

Diego Forlan apparently would love to play in MLS. Kevin Payne said he's chasing an AM. (Forlan now plays more of an AM role instead of striker)

http://www.oem.com.mx/esto/notas/n2985236.htm

[nonc]

Diego Forlan apparently would love to play in MLS. Kevin Payne said he's chasing an AM. (Forlan now plays more of an AM role instead of striker)

http://www.oem.com.mx/esto/notas/n2985236.htm

That would be cool! I was requesting Forlan just before Winter came. A 1.5 year could work.

[Derko]

I'm in two minds about this defense thing. I'm always of the opinion that football is about outscoring the opponent - not out-defending them! TFC haven't lost a league game more than one goal this season. You can look at that in two ways - either the defense is letting in 1 too many goals, OR the team aren't scoring enough goals.

There has been a lot of mention of conceding late goals, but this wouldn't be an issue of TFC were actually creating AND scoring more goals. You simply can't continue to go 1 goal in the lead into the end of a game and always hope to never concede. That puts way too much pressure on your defenders.

So equally if the defense needs to improve, so does the TFC attack. As they say, the best form of defense IS attack. Even the best defense in the world would eventually crumble if they were being constantly bombarded with waves of attack. Nelson needs to find a way of creating more goal opportunities, and the strikers need to start putting those chances away with more regularity.

I'm not saying that defense doesn't need to improve, but the midfield creativity, and goalscoring, is definitely an issue as well.

My thoughts also, and not just lumping the the ball up the pitch and hoping for the best, dribbling and passing the ball up field,scoring more than the opposition is called winning, no

[Derko]

Diego Forlan apparently would love to play in MLS. Kevin Payne said he's chasing an AM. (Forlan now plays more of an AM role instead of striker)

http://www.oem.com.mx/esto/notas/n2985236.htm

That would be very exciting.

[ManUtd4ever]

Diego Forlan apparently would love to play in MLS. Kevin Payne said he's chasing an AM. (Forlan now plays more of an AM role instead of striker)

http://www.oem.com.mx/esto/notas/n2985236.htm

Don't tease us...

[TOBOR !]

I'm in two minds about this defense thing. I'm always of the opinion that football is about outscoring the opponent - not out-defending them! TFC haven't lost a league game more than one goal this season. You can look at that in two ways - either the defense is letting in 1 too many goals, OR the team aren't scoring enough goals.

There has been a lot of mention of conceding late goals, but this wouldn't be an issue of TFC were actually creating AND scoring more goals. You simply can't continue to go 1 goal in the lead into the end of a game and always hope to never concede. That puts way too much pressure on your defenders.

So equally if the defense needs to improve, so does the TFC attack. As they say, the best form of defense IS attack. Even the best defense in the world would eventually crumble if they were being constantly bombarded with waves of attack. Nelson needs to find a way of creating more goal opportunities, and the strikers need to start putting those chances away with more regularity.

I'm not saying that defense doesn't need to improve, but the midfield creativity, and goalscoring, is definitely an issue as well.

I think you're right and wrong here.

While we need to create more scoring opportunities (and do a better job of converting those that we do), we still need to address the propensity for giving up late goals.

Whether it's a lack of focus in the waning moments, a matter of fitness, or (as I suspect) tactics, it needs to be addressed.

[Ultra & Proud]

Whether it's a lack of focus in the waning moments, a matter of fitness, or (as I suspect) tactics, it needs to be addressed.
I believe it's a combination of all three.

[Detroit_TFC]

Forlan might still have enough to be a big deal in MLS. His stock is falling rapidly though.

[mowe]

Kurtis Larson ‏@KurtLarSUN (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN) 2m (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/335436024517902336) Nelsen: We'll add names people know of this season. "Prominent players" #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash)

Here's hoping Nelson means a big name DP.

[sashavukelich]

TFC just tweeted.

#TFClive (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFClive&src=hash) Training Update: Brazilian centre back Gleison Pinto dos Santos, who goes by Santos, is currently on trial with the Reds.

[notthesun]

Since there seemed to be some doubt about this before, Larson again reiterated (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/335433852212367361) Earnshaw's loan is due to end July 1st.

[Red CB Toronto]

Since there seemed to be some doubt about this before, Larson again reiterated (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/335433852212367361) Earnshaw's loan is due to end July 1st.

it is not a loan, he just initally signed a short term contract with the Reds. Come July 1 the two parties will have to come together on a new agreement or move on.

[Derko]

I believe it's a combination of all three.

You be right, the biggest is the mental breakdown, panic, just try and lump it up field, with the opposition pressing real hard.

[Oldtimer]

TFC just tweeted.

#TFClive (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFClive&src=hash) Training Update: Brazilian centre back Gleison Pinto dos Santos, who goes by Santos, is currently on trial with the Reds.



Interesting. Brazilians are not noted for their defense, but who knows?

[Globetrotter]

Diego Forlan apparently would love to play in MLS. Kevin Payne said he's chasing an AM. (Forlan now plays more of an AM role instead of striker)

http://www.oem.com.mx/esto/notas/n2985236.htm


He would love to play in THE UNITED STATES. Toronto, as of today, is in Canada.

[West220Side]

Go in for Kenwyne Jones I hear he's not to happy with his teammates today :)

[Oldtimer]

He would love to play in THE UNITED STATES. Toronto, as of today, is in Canada.

Don't see it as significant. Most people outside of North America lump us in with the Americans, and besides, if you play in MLS, you will be spending almost half your time in the United States. A lot of players talk about coming to Toronto as coming to America.

It drives us Canadians nuts, but it's reality... and in fact our cultures are closer than most. Take away the U.S. guns and our free healthcare, and we start to look a lot alike.

[billyfly]

He would love to play in THE UNITED STATES. Toronto, as of today, is in Canada.

Many SA's and Europeans call Canada Norte Americanos.

[VoxPopuliCosmicum]

Don't see it as significant. Most people outside of North America lump us in with the Americans, and besides, if you play in MLS, you will be spending almost half your time in the United States. A lot of players talk about coming to Toronto as coming to America.

It drives us Canadians nuts, but it's reality... and in fact our cultures are closer than most. Take away the U.S. guns and our free healthcare, and we start to look a lot alike.

Before last night, you could have added "mayors that smoke crack" to the list of things that differentiate us from the US.

[Abou Sky]

Don't see it as significant. Most people outside of North America lump us in with the Americans, and besides, if you play in MLS, you will be spending almost half your time in the United States. A lot of players talk about coming to Toronto as coming to America.

It drives us Canadians nuts, but it's reality... and in fact our cultures are closer than most. Take away the U.S. guns and our free healthcare, and we start to look a lot alike.

It's funny because I met someone and asked if they were German, they answered 'No, Austrian' they were not impressed when I said 'well, same thing anyway right?' :p

[notthesun]

it is not a loan, he just initally signed a short term contract with the Reds. Come July 1 the two parties will have to come together on a new agreement or move on.

Nope, loan (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/335481128871936001). The confusion is because it was initially misreported as a short term deal, but later clarified to be indeed be a loan.

[Benficachop20]

great, going after another cb. Surely we need more cb's and not fix our biggest problem which is the midfield

[Ultra & Proud]

great, going after another cb. Surely we need more cb's and not fix our biggest problem which is the midfield
Exactly what I said but if it is true that they have their eye on a possible big time creative MF for July then this is fine. A waste probably but fine. If our post-July midfield consists of Laba, new AM guy they talk of, Hall, and Convey or even Osorio then I am good with that.

[Derko]

He would love to play in THE UNITED STATES. Toronto, as of today, is in Canada.

Yes, but a lot of South and Central Americans refer to TFC as playing in United States,lol

[Red CB Toronto]

Nope, loan (https://twitter.com/KurtLarSUN/status/335481128871936001). The confusion is because it was initially misreported as a short term deal, but later clarified to be indeed be a loan.

It was a short term deal as of July 1 he is out of contract.

[ag futbol]

Many SA's and Europeans call Canada Norte Americanos.
Yep, it's also sometimes broadly referred to as "America" as well.

[notthesun]

It was a short term deal as of July 1 he is out of contract.

... Did you read the tweet I linked? I know his contract ends July 1st. But his contract is with Cardiff, not us. He's being loaned to us right now. We'll need to sign him permanently if we want to keep him.

[ag futbol]

You're saying that TFC doesn't need better defense?
I have to admit I'm interested into why he's doing this as well. I thought proportionately the backline is way ahead of the midfield and forwards in terms of it's standard of play.

I think our number one problem is that nobody respects us going forward, so our defending just leads to more defending.

[Greatest Ripoff]

What about having a look at Randy Edwini-Bonsu and Adam Straith? Both are young domestic players who are not getting their contracts renewed by their 2. Bundesliga clubs.

[notthesun]

I have to admit I'm interested into why he's doing this as well. I thought proportionately the backline is way ahead of the midfield and forwards in terms of it's standard of play.

I think our number one problem is that nobody respects us going forward, so our defending just leads to more defending.

CB is also the position that benefits most from chemistry and familiarity. I'd rather we identify who we want as our starting CBs going forward and tough it out with them. The more they play together the better they'll get. I don't know if O'Dea and Boss are those CBs for Payne, but I know they aren't Caldwell and Santos.

I don't mind immediate help but there are other areas I think are more deserving and would be less harmed hiring mercenaries of sorts.

[Ajax TFC]

It's funny because I met someone and asked if they were German, they answered 'No, Austrian' they were not impressed when I said 'well, same thing anyway right?' :p
Try telling Nelsen that you like his Aussie accent. Kiwis hate it when people think they're Australian.



And TFC does play in the United states. It's where we play the vast majority of our away games

[spe18]

... Did you read the tweet I linked? I know his contract ends July 1st. But his contract is with Cardiff, not us. He's being loaned to us right now. We'll need to sign him permanently if we want to keep him.

FWIW, his Wikipedia profile says:

"On 28 February 2013, Earnshaw confirmed he had left Cardiff City to join Canadian club Toronto FC"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Earnshaw

[notthesun]

FWIW, his Wikipedia profile says:

"On 28 February 2013, Earnshaw confirmed he had left Cardiff City to join Canadian club Toronto FC"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Earnshaw

For the last time, Earnshaw himself said his contract with Cardiff is up July 1st. It's a loan, end of story.

[Oldtimer]

FWIW, his Wikipedia profile says:

"On 28 February 2013, Earnshaw confirmed he had left Cardiff City to join Canadian club Toronto FC"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Earnshaw

Wikipedia is not a source that is infallible as anyone can edit it.

[Ultra & Proud]

What about having a look at Randy Edwini-Bonsu and Adam Straith? Both are young domestic players who are not getting their contracts renewed by their 2. Bundesliga clubs.
Before we even suggest doing stuff like this again just ask yourself, "If this player was from England would I want him?". If the answer is no then he isn't worth getting.

[spe18]

For the last time, Earnshaw himself said his contract with Cardiff is up July 1st. It's a loan, end of story.

Do you have a link or video clip of him saying it?

I've looked at some more articles, and I do not see the term "loan" be used. From Toronto FC site:

http://www.torontofc.ca/news/2013/03/reds-welcome-robert-earnshaw

"Toronto FC announced Friday the club has signed Welsh International striker Robert Earnshaw."

and:

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11095/8530348/?

"I leave with a heavy heart from Cardiff city. I hope we created memories and I tried to give everything I had when I played. I will remember the journey that we went through."

By the sounds of that quote, it certainly doesn't sound like he'll ever play for Cardiff City again

[ag futbol]

I'd take Bonsu at the right price, couldn't comment on straith. Have to expect both these guys are staying in Europe though.

[nonc]

Bonsu could be intriguing but I wouldn't say Straith is MLS bench quality. The Academy should have some precedent to fill out the squad instead of euro rejects, it carries financial incentive as well.


For the last time, Earnshaw himself said his contract with Cardiff is up July 1st. It's a loan, end of story.

Earnshaw is not on loan, he is on a TFC deal in which TFC has an option to extend. Payne has said this in early season interviews. He left Cardiff on a free transfer, so if there was contract time remaining we just assumed that salary or re-negotiated the terms.

[Greatest Ripoff]

Before we even suggest doing stuff like this again just ask yourself, "If this player was from England would I want him?". If the answer is no then he isn't worth getting.

What does this even mean? What does being from England have to do with looking at young domestic players? I would like less overpaid british/irish players on this team.

And this team is bringing in a 31 year old central defender from the second division in England so why not look at a 22 year old central defender from the second division in Germany who wont take up an international spot?

[Ultra & Proud]

What does this even mean? What does being from England have to do with looking at young domestic players? I would like less overpaid british/irish players on this team.

And this team is bringing in a 31 year old central defender from the second division in England so why not look at a 22 year old central defender from the second division in Germany who wont take up an international spot?
What it means is that we shouldn't get caught up in overpaying for Euro based Canucks. Ask yourself if they were a different nationality (I picked England because it seems to be the country that gets the most hate here) because if this player's best quality is his nationality then we should look elsewhere. And for domestics I'd look to Americans because they can be had for cheaper. No more "home town discounts" like we had with DeGuz and Gerba. Canadians always seem to expect more money to play at home. Bernier excepted.

[ag futbol]

And for domestics I'd look to Americans because they can be had for cheaper. No more "home town discounts" like we had with DeGuz and Gerba. Canadians always seem to expect more money to play at home. Bernier excepted.
It has little to do with them being Canadian and more to do with who was negotiating the contracts. All the way down the list, who wasn't overpaid? EVERYBODY was getting too much when Mo Johnston was the guy in charge. Under Winter / Mariner we still overpaid, but just a few guys as opposed to a lot of them.


As for the English thing, I'll take talent from anywhere but you have to acknowledge that it's the most expensive market in world football. Combine that with the work restrictions that are in place that have a greater impact at the lower levels and it makes it a less than perfect place for a MLS team to search for talent. If something great shows up that's fine, but otherwise no point of swimming against the tide.

[Abou Sky]

What it means is that we shouldn't get caught up in overpaying for Euro based Canucks. Ask yourself if they were a different nationality (I picked England because it seems to be the country that gets the most hate here) because if this player's best quality is his nationality then we should look elsewhere. And for domestics I'd look to Americans because they can be had for cheaper. No more "home town discounts" like we had with DeGuz and Gerba. Canadians always seem to expect more money to play at home. Bernier excepted.

Canadians SHOULD be cheaper, they can't play in the US as domestics so all else being equal they should come at a discount.

[T-boy]

I'm definitely looking for a win here. I don't expect too much from the new players, as always it will take a few games for them to fit into the team and the league. BUT, I am looking for a 'reaction' from the current players. The players that have been here all season need to play to keep their team place, otherwise these new players will be moving them out. Players like Lambe, Bostock (if he plays), Richter, Henry all have to play well otherwise their long term place will be in doubt. Earnshaw also needds to start putting away goals, otherwise Brockie and Koev's will soon be on his heels for fist team place.

[Abou Sky]

I'm definitely looking for a win here. I don't expect too much from the new players, as always it will take a few games for them to fit into the team and the league. BUT, I am looking for a 'reaction' from the current players. The players that have been here all season need to play to keep their team place, otherwise these new players will be moving them out. Players like Lambe, Bostock (if he plays), Richter, Henry all have to play well otherwise their long term place will be in doubt. Earnshaw also needds to start putting away goals, otherwise Brockie and Koev's will soon be on his heels for fist team place.

I don't know if Richter can do much more. I get a feeling he is a 'late bloomer' but he seems to have the heart, mind and body to be a super player, we just need to polish him off.

This goes back to the Graham Zusi thing, Richter could be a real difference maker if we let him. I also think he reacts well to pressure as he seems to step up when needed.

[T-boy]

Agreed Richter has all the traits to be a good full back in the MLS. He, along with a few others, just need to concentrate a bit more. There is nothing like competition for your place in the start 11 to make you concentrate that bit more, so that's what we are looking for today from some of the "old" players.

[Greatest Ripoff]

What it means is that we shouldn't get caught up in overpaying for Euro based Canucks. Ask yourself if they were a different nationality (I picked England because it seems to be the country that gets the most hate here) because if this player's best quality is his nationality then we should look elsewhere. And for domestics I'd look to Americans because they can be had for cheaper. No more "home town discounts" like we had with DeGuz and Gerba. Canadians always seem to expect more money to play at home. Bernier excepted.


Do you really thing Straith and REB would be demanding high wages? Are Toronto not already over paying for their British/Irish players? As pointed out, this team overpays for almost everyone. I don't think we should be dismissing players because they have played in Europe.

[Greatest Ripoff]

Ask yourself if they were a different nationality (I picked England because it seems to be the country that gets the most hate here) because if this player's best quality is his nationality then we should look elsewhere

Ok so would this club sign a 22 year old defender who is no longer wanted by his second division club if he was English? The answer is yes, and they would pay him $390,000.

[[NBF]]

Ok so would this club sign a 22 year old defender who is no longer wanted by his second division club if he was English? The answer is yes, and they would pay him $390,000.

Darren O'Dea, is very much on par with the centre backs in MLS. I would say he is worth what he's making, but only if its the most that he's going to be paid for the remainder of his contract.

Matias Laba, IMO, is only worth what they paid for him if Sam Cronin is worth the same amount. He seems to be no better than Sam Cronin. Maybe that has to do with the role he's asked to play by the current manager.

[Soccerpro]

I don't understand how TFC expects to get better without quality wide players. They don't have a single MLS quality winger (let alone an above average wide player). How do they stretch the field? How do they expect to attack? How are they going to retain possession?

Ill believe that KP and Ryan Nelson know what they're doing when they get rid of Lambe and every other pretend winger they have and bring in some real quality on the wings.

[jazzy]

I don't understand how TFC expects to get better without quality wide players. They don't have a single MLS quality winger (let alone an above average wide player). How do they stretch the field? How do they expect to attack? How are they going to retain possession?

Ill believe that KP and Ryan Nelson know what they're doing when they get rid of Lambe and every other pretend winger they have and bring in some real quality on the wings.

exactly...think (hope) what I saw in reserves will be next line-up...Koevermans/Earnshaw up front and Brockie on the right wing (he scored) Earnshaw wasn't playing in the reserves....and Santos at CBbeside Caldwell.

[Stryker]

IMO this is how we should look this summer along with what we need.


-------------Bendik----------------
Ecks----Boss----Caldwell----O'Dea
--------------Laba-----------------
TBA-------------------------Convey
---------------TBA-----------------
--------Koev---------Earnie--------

Bench/rotational players: Henry, Richter, Frei, Hall, Lambe, Silva, Osorio

The rest should be traded or released.

[Abou Sky]

O'Dea is still young, he did look good at LB but I think Ecks looked better at LB

I would prefer:

-------------Bendik----------------
Richter----O'Dea----Caldwell----Ecks
--------------Laba-----------------
TBA(Oso until?)--------------Convey
---------------TBA(Silva or Oso until?)
--------Koev---------Earnie--------

[burlington Red]

Do you really thing Straith and REB would be demanding high wages? Are Toronto not already over paying for their British/Irish players? As pointed out, this team overpays for almost everyone. I don't think we should be dismissing players because they have played in Europe.

Add South American to overpaid players also

[Stryker]

^^ Ecks is much better on the right. ODea is better at LB then any other player on the team if today was indicitive of how he plays there. Boss and Caldwell are both tall which makes defending crosses easier for CBs and can be brought forward on set pieces. They're also both comfortable with the ball at thier feet and can make a good first pass. I saw Caldwell make some very smart runs today.

[burlington Red]

did we play a back 3 today with two wing backs. At certain times it looked that way, we had ODEA left, Henry Centre and Caldwell LEFT.

[nonc]

The only person who has killed off more games this year than Morgan is Earnshaw, fluky early season goals be damned. Hot/cold Silva and Brockie should be on the field before him. Very lazy player, can't take a pass or hold the ball up, constantly offside, never passes anywhere near the box resulting in turnovers. Average pace at best. He's tried multiple bicycle kicks and volleys from ridiculous angles when he could've maintained possession and set up a better opportunity for himself or a teammate. Made one good play today with the long cross but you'll never see that situation again. DeVos is a total sellout for the guy; criticizes Henry throughout, including for the goal (had a decent game) and says things like 'Earnshaw needs more chances and support from his teammates' after games and games of missed chances and greed from him by the boatload. League 1 player in career twilight with Premier League ego.

[burlington Red]

The only person who has killed off more games this year than Morgan is Earnshaw, fluky early season goals be damned. Hot/cold Silva and Brockie should be on the field before him. Very lazy player, can't take a pass or hold the ball up, constantly offside, never passes anywhere near the box resulting in turnovers. Average pace at best. He's tried multiple bicycle kicks and volleys from ridiculous angles when he could've maintained possession and set up a better opportunity for himself or a teammate. Made one good play today with the long cross but you'll never see that situation again. DeVos is a total sellout for the guy; criticizes Henry throughout, including for the goal (had a decent game) and says things like 'Earnshaw needs more chances and support from his teammates' after games and games of missed chances and greed from him by the boatload. League 1 player in career twilight with Premier League ego.

seriously bud, never read as much as shite as this in yrs.
Earnshaw created the chance today where we missed an absolute sitter. He has been played up front in many games on his own with Bendick launching high balls to him, not his game. He needs to play off a decent target man, of which Braun is nOt, Let's see him play some games with Danny K.
What is your opinion on Laba?

[nonc]

Earnshaw created the chance today where we missed an absolute sitter.

Like I said, first play like that from him all season and probably the last because it was an unusual circumstance. Everything else was crap, again. If you want to disregard his whole game for one good play be my guest. Now I understand why you don't rate Laba at all...

[burlington Red]

Like I said, first play like that from him all season and probably the last because it was an unusual circumstance. Everything else was crap, again. If you want to disregard his whole game for one good play be my guest. Now I understand why you don't rate Laba at all...

he's a goalscorer, a fox in the box, not a target man as we have been playing him. He should not be the player making that cross today, he should have been on the end of it, he has had to play a game that is alien to him due to our lack of wingers. Not saying he is world class, but he's a decent finisher, judge him on that not on his build up play, not his strength and never has been. You obviously don't rate him, who do you suggest we play up front.
BTW no mention of Braun, who played as bad a performace as I have seen from TFC player in long time, missed a sitter and caused 1st goal

[Jack]

Neither Laba nor Earnshaw is to be blamed for our loss yesterday. Sure, Earnshaw missed a couple of chances, but Higuain probably has two goals on other days, so that's balanced out. We have more pressingissues than either of those two players. And O'Dea has played fullback before, so I'm not surprised he was solid over there. We play hoofball to a tiny striker and expect him to perform? Braun should not play. Convey, when he gets some more time, will be an upgrade. Our midfield still needs help most of all.

[BuSaPuNk]

Not surprised by the result at all. We need to stop playing hoofball. It's not working. Braun doesn't have the skill to hold the ball up and usually it's only Earnshaw up to all alone. Small man that can't play the arial game. We need to keep the ball on the deck and use our wings more.

I know we lack quality on the wings but we seem to try and go up the middle of the pitch way too often. And if that's are usual plan of attack it's easy on the other teams back line to be prepared and not worry about the wings.

[Yohan]

Post on right thread people! :p