TFC 2013 general player moves/speculation/etc.

[ag futbol]

'Than'. FB's are more valuable (harder to find) than CBs. So Ecks has a leg up on O'Dear. That being said, his injury can't have helped his chances of sticking around, and if he was a few years older, it would have REALLY hurt them.
Certainly not in MLS. Fullback is where practically everybody skimps on salary.

[Phil]

Something better happen today, even if its an announcement of an announcement tomorrow.

Lets all cross our fingers and toes....

[Ultra & Proud]

I can only imagine how crazy it would become if no announcement came out this week.

[Stouffville_RPB]

Gotta love when current management comes out and just rips previous management.

Nelsen:
"Darren's the most expensive player in the whole of the league, in terms of salary cap."
"Unfortunately for Darren it's not his fault. His contract was pretty ridiculous, in terms of MLS contracts."

Not saying the above statements aren't true as I do believe the cap hit vs on-field play ratio wasn't good but it seems as though all this regime is doing is blaming old management. I wonder what spin they will put on things when things don't work out for them.

Future Nelsen/Payne: "I can't believe management would trade that Silva kid was traded. He's really the type of this team needs. He's even gone on to earn a few USMNT caps"
Future Reporter: "Ummm, but that was you guys"
Future Nelsen/Payne: "........"

[Phil]

The funniest bit about ripping the mariner contracts....just ask Earl. After all, he played a role there didn't he?

:hide:

[Canary10]

The funniest bit about ripping the mariner contracts....just ask Earl. After all, he played a role there didn't he?

:hide:

He's the only constant among endless bad contracts. Yet he's still there.

[tfcleeds]

^He must make coffee exactly the way Payne likes it. Can't think of any other reason.

[Phil]

He's the only constant among endless bad contracts. Yet he's still there.

Well, I like this new direction of budgeting places on the team. Determining your maximum spending on each postion, then getting players and fitting them into that based on salary and ability.

Its crazy to me that this team operated as long as it did without that kind of strategy. I know Bob DeKlerk touted this idea. Blows my mind but happy to hear the current regime is doing it.

[MartinUtd]

So what if they throw Paul Mariner under the bus. We all know he's the excuse and it doesn't change anything if they say it or not.

[billyfly]

Well, I like this new direction of budgeting places on the team. Determining your maximum spending on each postion, then getting players and fitting them into that based on salary and ability.

Its crazy to me that this team operated as long as it did without that kind of strategy. I know Bob DeKlerk touted this idea. Blows my mind but happy to hear the current regime is doing it.


All leagues with a cap should if you want true parity (never happen)

[Ultra & Proud]

So what if they throw Paul Mariner under the bus. We all know he's the excuse and it doesn't change anything if they say it or not.
Yup,exactly. Mariner found O' Dea and pushed for the signing after Mellberg fell through. I have no problem with blaming the past management for their mistakes. Why not? I don't like it being dragged on as an excuse for why we're shit now but for 1/2 year removed it's expected.

[brad]

I can only imagine how crazy it would become if no announcement came out this week.

Is Rick Titus still around? :)

[Dreadlocks]

I can only imagine how crazy it would become if no announcement came out this week.

This is the concern I'm starting to get. Prior to the transfer window, all I kept hearing from Nelson and Payne is that more players are coming. The window opened and nothing happened! Then we start releasing, trading and selling players last week to clear space I assume. So now it remains to be seen who joins this week - if anyone.

I know this season is a write off but I want to see some good signings THIS window - not next.

[T-boy]

Both Payne and Nelson have said they expect announcements to be made this week, and I see no reason why that won't happen. Nelson also said that we would suffer for "1 or 2 games" when Silva left, which would also indicate announcements this week, not before the Chivas game, but in enough time for players to be available for the Red Bulls game.

[Red Skies At Night]

I have this picture in my mind of all us TFC fan(atics) sitting around our computers, phones, tablets, etc... hitting refresh, refresh, refresh... reminds me of the scene in that (terrible) movie 'Green Street Hooligans', when they're all waiting for the cup draw.

[ag futbol]

Well, I like this new direction of budgeting places on the team. Determining your maximum spending on each postion, then getting players and fitting them into that based on salary and ability.

Its crazy to me that this team operated as long as it did without that kind of strategy. I know Bob DeKlerk touted this idea. Blows my mind but happy to hear the current regime is doing it.
I find it crazy that anybody out there would want to operate without a budget. Even if you're Real Madrid, there are going to be some ways that you're limited.

Not that I'm a huge fan of the book, but I think back to reading soccernomics where they readily ripped the way clubs were managed in the past. Game was filled with managers who thought they were business savvy but were actually having the wool pulled over their eyes on a daily basis.

[Wince]

I have this picture in my mind of all us TFC fan(atics) sitting around our computers, phones, tablets, etc... hitting refresh, refresh, refresh... reminds me of the scene in that (terrible) movie 'Green Street Hooligans', when they're all waiting for the cup draw.

You've just described my productivity level at work since the window opened... I need an announcement soon so I can clear some of these projects off my desk!

[OgtheDim]

Sooo....no media call out for today.

:(

[Red I]

Sooo....no media call out for today.

:(


sigh...I was so looking forward to hardly working today, but now this... Man, i'm just going to wait until my phone gets a press release

[Super]

Sooo....no media call out for today.

:(

In this case, no news is bad news. I thought something was going to happen today.

[Wolves_On_Tour]

Do we know for sure nothing is happening today?

[T-boy]

I really wanted something to happen today to stop the Monday morning blues!

[Super]

Doubt something big is happening today. It's noon, and no press conference has been announced. Nothing announced for tomorrow either.

Leiweke, where is your big name DP?

[ArmenJBX]

O'Dea's sale may have put a stopper on some plans. More money to spend gives the club more options.

[mowe]

The team probably went straight to LA after the SKC game. So earliest we could have a press conference would be Thursday/Friday I would assume.

[TFC07]

I want something to happen before New York game. C'mon TFC FO! Get your shit together and gives us a signing or two to make our season.

[OgtheDim]

The team probably went straight to LA after the SKC game. So earliest we could have a press conference would be Thursday/Friday I would assume.

I was wondering about that. In theory, KP doesn't have to be with the team. And Nelsen doesn't have to be at the announcement.

[Haddy]

The team probably went straight to LA after the SKC game. So earliest we could have a press conference would be Thursday/Friday I would assume.

You only need a press conference for a massive name. Here's hoping other strong acquisitions come this week and join the squad asap.

[ag futbol]

Wonder if that Brazilian defender previously on trial is now in our plans?

[T-boy]

I very much doubt KP is with the team right now, so there is still the possibility that something could be announced with the team and Nelson all away.

[Yohan]

I want something to happen before New York game. C'mon TFC FO! Get your shit together and gives us a signing or two to make our season.
I'd rather see KP do due diligence before signing. He's got options. Rushing a signing now isn't going to make a difference

[Oldtimer]

Is Rick Titus still around? :)

He retired the end of 2010 at age 41.

[BuSaPuNk]

^ Yep id much rather wait if we can't get the proper peice in now. If that means we go through the window and come up empty, I'm okay with that.

We don't want to get into the same mess with overpaid pieces like we are now. Due diligence and get in the proper players at the proper salary.

[Marc"2L"]

Kind of feels like that officer telling all his men that the Channel is bogged down in heavy fog, everything is on 24 hour hold

NO JUMP TONIGHT
​as you were

[OgtheDim]

Due diligence is important.

Doing nothing now, when they have said something will get done and after two moves to popular players to clear space for cap room, would not go over well.

More importantly for this discussion, the summer window provides more opportunities to get non-MLS players then the winter one.

[Super]

True, no rush I guess. We're not making the play-offs this year anyway. But it would be great to assemble a full team that can play together in the fall, go into the off-season together, and then start the new season as a team - not having to put it together from scratch like we've done so many times before.

[ensco]

Look before you leap, but he who hesitates is lost.

I'll get my hat.

[tfcleeds]

I was wondering about that. In theory, KP doesn't have to be with the team. And Nelsen doesn't have to be at the announcement.This. Still think nothing will really be announced until Thursday at the earliest though.

[nonc]

is Alvaro Rey still on trial?

[Red I]

is Alvaro Rey still on trial?

No longer on trial

[prizby]

I'd rather see KP do due diligence before signing. He's got options. Rushing a signing now isn't going to make a difference

he's had 6 months to do his due diligence; shouldn't be moving players until he has moves lined up to fill in the holes

[Phil]

he's had 6 months to do his due diligence; shouldn't be moving players until he has moves lined up to fill in the holes

The season is a write off, this is gutting the house for the retro fit.

[wzhxvy]

I understand all the gutting, etc but the gutting as well as the build up, do not happen serially. They have had months to prepare for this, and this window is just as important as the off season. If they do not deliver now, I will have very limited confidence they could in the off season.

[bones]

The season is a write off, this is gutting the house for the retro fit.

hmmm, 98 people hitting refresh on this thread in the middle of the afternoon.... seems to be a few people looking for the "post gut" stuff ;)

[tfcleeds]

They've still identified some of the players they want to bring in - I don't see how the O'Dea transfer would change that. But I'm not really all that bothered about when it happens, so long as we see some incomings by the end of the month. It's doubtful that any new players would have featured up to the Red Bulls match anyway. Columbus however, I hope will be a different matter.

[Richard]

They've still identified some of the players they want to bring in - I don't see how the O'Dea transfer would change that. But I'm not really all that bothered about when it happens, so long as we see some incomings by the end of the month. It's doubtful that any new players would have featured up to the Red Bulls match anyway. Columbus however, I hope will be a different matter.

For all we know the O'Dea transfer fee could bring us back in the race to get Urruti.

[__wowza]

he's had 6 months to do his due diligence; shouldn't be moving players until he has moves lined up to fill in the holes


The season is a write off, this is gutting the house for the retro fit.

what phil said. i think right now he's looking at some of the ridiculous contract options people have, and would be willing to drop them for a handful of magic beans if that means he can get closer to a clean slate. i can honestly see us playing a 4-4-2 with a single winger posted wide (a la spurs in 2011)

[prizby]

The season is a write off, this is gutting the house for the retro fit.


what phil said. i think right now he's looking at some of the ridiculous contract options people have, and would be willing to drop them for a handful of magic beans if that means he can get closer to a clean slate. i can honestly see us playing a 4-4-2 with a single winger posted wide (a la spurs in 2011)

agree, but I don't know how many more Saturday's like this past Saturday I'll be able to take

plus they have been saying for I don't know how long "the signings are coming"...i am tired of this lip service

[Ultra & Proud]

i can honestly see us playing a 4-4-2 with a single winger posted wide (a la spurs in 2011)

Me too. In fact I expect to see a lot of similarities in playing style/formation to the Harry Spurs days. Except not as good and full of MLS bonerisms of course.

[Phil]

agree, but I don't know how many more Saturday's like this past Saturday I'll be able to take

plus they have been saying for I don't know how long "the signings are coming"...i am tired of this lip service

I hear you and agree. Its getting painful but I think the long term cautious approach is needed. They do need to make a statement. Hopefully tomorrow.....we will have to see.

[Ultra & Proud]

agree, but I don't know how many more Saturday's like this past Saturday I'll be able to take

plus they have been saying for I don't know how long "the signings are coming"...i am tired of this lip service
I'd rather wait (as long as it comes) and have it done right than the knee jerk signings we have become accustomed to (Iro, Graffit, Usanov, Hscanovics, Mista, etc.). I don't want to be made happy today only to be fucking miserable for a whole lot of tomorrows.

[Marc"2L"]

Was really hoping Joey would fire his coach, just to make us seem slightly less insane.
I don't know how to take John's tweet, what is imminent in this context?

A day, two, the week?
Holy crap guys, imagine a week and a half before we hear anything.

[Super]

John Molinaro ‏@JohnMolinaro (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro)13m (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/356838860623314945)
For what it's worth, I'm told by someone at #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash) that there's nothing imminent regarding announcements about new players.

[Canary10]

Was really hoping Joey would fire his coach, just to make us seem slightly less insane.
I don't know how to take John's tweet, what is imminent in this context?

A day, two, the week?
Holy crap guys, imagine a week and a half before we hear anything.

I feel sorry for my employer if that's the case.

[Milanista]

I wish Miccoli would join, he is a pure finisher and could have a Di Vaio affect...very similar type player

[Ivy]

John Molinaro ‏@JohnMolinaro (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro)13m (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/356838860623314945)
For what it's worth, I'm told by someone at #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash) that there's nothing imminent regarding announcements about new players.
Not surprising. TFC has been a much tighter ship since KP came in. I don't remember any of the Toronto journalist getting any solid info about anyone. Everything we heard came from the other side

[Red Skies At Night]

John Molinaro ‏@JohnMolinaro (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro)13m (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/356838860623314945)
For what it's worth, I'm told by someone at #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash) that there's nothing imminent regarding announcements about new players.

In regards to the acquisition of new players, I'm pretty sure that "imminent" has been used on a number of TFC related tweets and posts from journos, quoting TFC officials, over the last little while. I guess the definition of "imminent" is a fluid one.

[Milanista]

John Molinaro ‏@JohnMolinaro (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro)13m (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/356838860623314945)
For what it's worth, I'm told by someone at #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash) that there's nothing imminent regarding announcements about new players.

lol no shit...we just got rid of a ton of players, they have to sign players asap

[tfcleeds]

I wish Miccoli would join, he is a pure finisher and could have a Di Vaio affect...very similar type playerOn his way to Lecce, apparently.

[69Chevy396]

lol no shit...we just got rid of a ton of players, they have to sign players asap
Perhaps not, are there others who think that this may in fact be a house cleansing prior to announcing the sale of the team?

[Wolves_On_Tour]

Perhaps not, are there others who think that this may in fact be a house cleansing prior to announcing the sale of the team?


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA :chillpill:

[Red Skies At Night]

Perhaps not, are there others who think that this may in fact be a house cleansing prior to announcing the sale of the team?

Not me. This franchise isn't being sold anytime soon.

[Milanista]

On his way to Lecce, apparently.

yeah i was reading that or might go to australia..we have one of the largest italian communities in the world, would be nice to get a top italian or a guy who played in serie a. Kaka would be a dream, he was my fav player for a long time

[tfcleeds]

If Payne and Nelsen won't discuss transfer targets, then perhaps they should shut up about potential signings "coming in soon" as well. I don't need all this false hope, lol. Thing is, I don't know if I can stomach watching this team unless we get reinforcements in, stat.

[69Chevy396]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA :chillpill:
Ya, ya.....but when a team is sold, this is what they typically do.....and for me it is wishful thinking to see the end of mlse running, or should I say, ruining, pro soccer in the city.

[ag futbol]

what phil said. i think right now he's looking at some of the ridiculous contract options people have, and would be willing to drop them for a handful of magic beans if that means he can get closer to a clean slate. i can honestly see us playing a 4-4-2 with a single winger posted wide (a la spurs in 2011)
Think I know what you're saying, but can you draw it out? I'm picturing something where we're more attack minded down one flank and the other midfielder is pinching inside in more of a box-to-box kind of way. Feels very 4-3-3 without it explicitly being that.

Re: ownership of this team.... Let me say this: distributors have gone on content acquisition binges in the past. The last time it happened, prior to this current trend, it wasn't long before the assets were being spun off and being sent out the door in the opposite direction. The synergy they wanted between content / distribution didn't materialize. I can't help but think we'll see the same thing again. Competition for content distribution will only get more rabid and the traditional providers are probably going to find out that trying to lock down quality content is a fruitless venture because those assets are worth more when they're sold to everybody as opposed to being dedicated to one distribution channel. So this and seemingly imminent arrival of foreign carriers makes me think that Bogers will sell MLSE sooner than expected.

Not that I could see them getting rid of it immediately, but 5-6 years out it could be a different beast entirely.

[bones]

Perhaps not, are there others who think that this may in fact be a house cleansing prior to announcing the sale of the team?

don't tease us like that

[Red I]

Ya, ya.....but when a team is sold, this is what they typically do.....and for me it is wishful thinking to see the end of mlse running, or should I say, ruining, pro soccer in the city.

Hire a new coach with little experience, yes, typical move... but hire a proven MLS GM as well as as President who's biggest selling point was his ability to put LA Galaxy on the map globally, no; these are expensive moves that are not the signs of a fire sale - if staff isn't leaving a sinking ship, it means they do believe in its direction

[Milanista]

Ya, ya.....but when a team is sold, this is what they typically do.....and for me it is wishful thinking to see the end of mlse running, or should I say, ruining, pro soccer in the city.

Toronto Fc does stink, but they aren't being sold

[Ultra & Proud]

Perhaps not, are there others who think that this may in fact be a house cleansing prior to announcing the sale of the team?

Yeah, because who wants to hold on to a team who's operating costs are low and who always makes money?

Not to mention that between the owners, they own every single sports station on TV and use their teams to fuel those stations. Rogers and Bell want to own and operate every sports team they can get their hands on, especially in T.O. All a plan to eventually do something like the YES Network I bet. So no, they'll not be dumping profitable teams who help fill a viewing demographic.

[__wowza]

Think I know what you're saying, but can you draw it out? I'm picturing something where we're more attack minded down one flank and the other midfielder is pinching inside in more of a box-to-box kind of way.

Feels very 4-3-3 without it explicitly being that.

you pretty much got it bang on, it's like a 4-3-3 but you cut one of the wingers out of the picture.

instead of this 4-4-2:
http://www.footy4kids.co.uk/442.gif

you have this:
http://i.imm.io/1cxvz.jpeg

this is a really crude mock-up, but you get the gist.

[69Chevy396]

Yeah, because who wants to hold on to a team who's operating costs are low and who always makes money?

Not to mention that between the owners, they own every single sports station on TV and use their teams to fuel those stations. Rogers and Bell want to own and operate every sports team they can get their hands on, especially in T.O. All a plan to eventually do something like the YES Network I bet. So no, they'll not be dumping profitable teams who help fill a viewing demographic.
Payne is oneof the few real assets, and he may be interested as an owner himself. There is no hard proof mlse makes any money from TFC, and it may in fact be viewed as a burden (fewer bums in the sets=less beer piss sold; negligible tv audience cant be good for ad revenue). i bet they have barely broken even since 2007. If the right buyer comes along with serious $ everything is for sale.

[PopePouri]

Payne is oneof the few real assets, and he may be interested as an owner himself. There is no hard proof mlse makes any money from TFC, and it may in fact be viewed as a burden (fewer bums in the sets=less beer piss sold; negligible tv audience cant be good for ad revenue). i bet they have barely broken even since 2007. If the right buyer comes along with serious $ everything is for sale.

Actually they've been profitable since the start.

[Phil]

Payne is oneof the few real assets, and he may be interested as an owner himself. There is no hard proof mlse makes any money from TFC, and it may in fact be viewed as a burden (fewer bums in the sets=less beer piss sold; negligible tv audience cant be good for ad revenue). i bet they have barely broken even since 2007. If the right buyer comes along with serious $ everything is for sale.

I don't think Kevin has the kind of money to even attempt a buyout of a team.

Investments into the academy and given our recent ownership change coupled with a former MLS founder as CEO, I wouldn't hold out any hope of a change there. TV, seats and the sport in general offer massive expansion avenues.

[Oldtimer]

Payne is oneof the few real assets, and he may be interested as an owner himself. There is no hard proof mlse makes any money from TFC, and it may in fact be viewed as a burden (fewer bums in the sets=less beer piss sold; negligible tv audience cant be good for ad revenue). i bet they have barely broken even since 2007. If the right buyer comes along with serious $ everything is for sale.

I can see why some would wish ML$E out of the picture, however this is wishful thinking. They will never sell TFC. Their investment has gone from $10 million to $100 million, and the value will only continue to rise.

I actually don't mind ML$E running things despite their horrible track record in all sports now that Leiweke is in charge. If he runs TFC like the Lakers we'll be fine.

[Abou Sky]

Perhaps not, are there others who think that this may in fact be a house cleansing prior to announcing the sale of the team?

Usually you build a company up and then sell it, not the other way around.

If MLSE needed money maybe they would to get a cash injection, but they don't.

Only way TFC gets sold is after they win a few supporters shields and MLS cups and can demand a huge price.

[Canary10]

John Molinaro ‏@JohnMolinaro (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro)13m (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/356838860623314945)
For what it's worth, I'm told by someone at #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash) that there's nothing imminent regarding announcements about new players.

It's possible no news is good news in this case. In organizations I've been part of, the PR cone of silence starts when there is a plan to announce something. That's going to be my interpretation.

[Ultra & Proud]

It's possible no news is good news in this case. In organizations I've been part of, the PR cloak of silence starts when there is a plan to announce something. That's going to be my interpretation.
They need more stupid employees with Twitter addictions I think.

[T-boy]

It's possible no news is good news in this case. In organizations I've been part of, the PR cone of silence starts when there is a plan to announce something. That's going to be my interpretation.

TFC have clearly silenced the gossips. Nobody had any idea about Silva or O'Dea until they were actual completed moves, so I'm hoping the same will be for the new signings, and we won't know anything until a swiftly pulled together press conference.

[ensco]

If he runs TFC like the Lakers we'll be fine.

Leiweke had nothing to do with the Lakers.

[OgtheDim]

TFC have clearly silenced the gossips. Nobody had any idea about Silva or O'Dea until they were actual completed moves....

The O'Dea one was extraordinary as the players were told at lunch, with O'Dea saying goodbye before he caught a plane. You would have thought somebody travelling with the team might have noticed or said something before the lineups were put out.

[Pint]

Leiweke had nothing to do with the Lakers.

"Leiweke joined Maple Leaf Sports from Anschutz Entertainment Group, owned by Denver billionaire Phil Anschutz, which controls MLS’s Galaxy club and the Los Angeles Kings hockey team and is part-owner of the LA Lakers basketball franchise. In his 13 years with AEG, the Lakers and Galaxy each won four league titles and the Kings clinched one Stanley Cup."

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-15/former-anschutz-boss-charts-leafs-victory-parade-route.html

Not saying you are wrong but this seams to indicate that he did have some influence on the lakers.

[Yohan]

The O'Dea one was extraordinary as the players were told at lunch, with O'Dea saying goodbye before he caught a plane. You would have thought somebody travelling with the team might have noticed or said something before the lineups were put out.
no wonder they played like shit. having their captain told he's not wanted by the team hours before the game?

[Corpand]

no wonder they played like shit. having their captain told he's not wanted by the team hours before the game?

Eeeexactly, you could see there was less leadership on the field during the game too. Everyone having something else on their mind...wondering if they really are as important an asset to Nelsen as promised before...

These kinds of deals need to happen after games. It`s interesting to see how both important players were traded almost by surprise. Notice that there were no imminent moves waiting in line so that the player trades were forced through.
This is all a PR tactic. They decided who is liable to the team (brings more cons than pros) and trade em out of the blue if needed. This gives the media absolutely no head start to try and speculate why the moves were made and how the player traded feels about the whole situation.

Because we all know how the player feels in such a situation.

[v00d00daddy]

"Leiweke joined Maple Leaf Sports from Anschutz Entertainment Group, owned by Denver billionaire Phil Anschutz, which controls MLS’s Galaxy club and the Los Angeles Kings hockey team and is part-owner of the LA Lakers basketball franchise. In his 13 years with AEG, the Lakers and Galaxy each won four league titles and the Kings clinched one Stanley Cup."

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-15/former-anschutz-boss-charts-leafs-victory-parade-route.html

Not saying you are wrong but this seams to indicate that he did have some influence on the lakers.

He was also involved with the LA Kings. And lots of Kings fans say that he was TOO involved. He has a reputation of being both great and intrusive. We shall see.

[flatpicker]

Well this was an exciting day!

[Super]

I guess Forlan Day is tomorrow.

[jazzy]

agree, but I don't know how many more Saturday's like this past Saturday I'll be able to take

plus they have been saying for I don't know how long "the signings are coming"...i am tired of this lip service

the man has a point!

[reggie]

I guess Forlan Day is tomorrow.

that's a FORLAN CONCLUSION...

[Pint]

We will find out about the next signing because he will be tweeted in the starting lineup wednesday night lol then twitter will break

[moralis]

Here's a better link to Leiweke's interview:

http://washpost.bloomberg.com/Story?docId=1376-MPZOF16TTDVH01-4JP1FK7VOBAE80ALNQDKIUG97F

[Ultra & Proud]

that's a FORLAN CONCLUSION...

http://thirtymilesofcorruption.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/3213623821584399612.gif

[moralis]

It looks like TFC head scout Pat Onstad is in Houston scouting tonight's Gold Cup games between Haiti-El Salvador and Honduras-Trinidad and Tobago:

Sebastian Salazar ‏@SebiSalazarCSN (https://twitter.com/SebiSalazarCSN) 39m (https://twitter.com/SebiSalazarCSN/status/356920976669286401) #Dynamo (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Dynamo&src=hash) legend & current chief scout for #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash) Pat Onstad here in Houston intently watching Haiti vs El Salvador. Wonder who he's looking at.

https://twitter.com/SebiSalazarCSN/status/356920976669286401

I think Onstad is looking primary at El Salvadorian forward Rodolfo Zelaya and Honduras attacking midfielder Alex Lopez and other Hondurans, plus Trinidad and Tobago forward Kenwyne Jones.

[ensco]

"Leiweke joined Maple Leaf Sports from Anschutz Entertainment Group, owned by Denver billionaire Phil Anschutz, which controls MLS’s Galaxy club and the Los Angeles Kings hockey team and is part-owner of the LA Lakers basketball franchise. In his 13 years with AEG, the Lakers and Galaxy each won four league titles and the Kings clinched one Stanley Cup."

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-15/former-anschutz-boss-charts-leafs-victory-parade-route.html

Not saying you are wrong but this seams to indicate that he did have some influence on the lakers.

If you own a few hundred shares of Bell or Rogers, do you feel like you exert influence on the management of bell or Rogers?

Anschutz own a small minority interest in the Lakers, who have a controlling interest. The influence of AEG on the Lakers was zero.

They absolutely had majority ownership of, and control of, the Kings and Galaxy.

[69Chevy396]

It looks like TFC head scout Pat Onstad is in Houston scouting tonight's Gold Cup games between Haiti-El Salvador and Honduras-Trinidad and Tobago:

Sebastian Salazar ‏@SebiSalazarCSN (https://twitter.com/SebiSalazarCSN) 39m (https://twitter.com/SebiSalazarCSN/status/356920976669286401) #Dynamo (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Dynamo&src=hash) legend & current chief scout for #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash) Pat Onstad here in Houston intently watching Haiti vs El Salvador. Wonder who he's looking at.

https://twitter.com/SebiSalazarCSN/status/356920976669286401

I think Onstad is looking primary at El Salvadorian forward Rodolfo Zelaya and Honduras attacking midfielder Alex Lopez and other Hondurans, plus Trinidad and Tobago forward Kenwyne Jones.
Geez, if we are lucky they will land a back up middle aged defender.

[Ultra & Proud]

I am watching this Haiti Vs El Salvador match and I don't see much out there besides a whole lot of typical CONCACAF officiating.

[brad]

Eeeexactly, you could see there was less leadership on the field during the game too. Everyone having something else on their mind...wondering if they really are as important an asset to Nelsen as promised before...

These kinds of deals need to happen after games. It`s interesting to see how both important players were traded almost by surprise. Notice that there were no imminent moves waiting in line so that the player trades were forced through.
This is all a PR tactic. They decided who is liable to the team (brings more cons than pros) and trade em out of the blue if needed. This gives the media absolutely no head start to try and speculate why the moves were made and how the player traded feels about the whole situation.

Because we all know how the player feels in such a situation.

These kinds of deals don't get held until after games because if they player gets injured in the game the deal is easily off.

[tfcleeds]

As far as ES is concerned, I'd be very happy if Zelaya came here.

[TFC07]

Pat Onstad is just doing his job. I wouldn't put in too much stock of Onstad watching Gold Cup in Houston. I am sure every other MLS clubs have their scouts at Gold Cup tournament as well.

[69Chevy396]

Pat Onstad is just doing his job. I wouldn't put in too much stock of Onstad watching Gold Cup in Houston. I am sure every other MLS clubs have their scouts at Gold Cup tournament as well.
Except he is the guy with his head in a paper bag

[jazzy]

John Molinaro ‏@JohnMolinaro (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro)13m (https://twitter.com/JohnMolinaro/status/356838860623314945)
For what it's worth, I'm told by someone at #TFC (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TFC&src=hash) that there's nothing imminent regarding announcements about new players.

I fear , can we actually get worse and they actually think we will watch this really sub par laughing stock for the rest of the year? But everyone else in the world knows we are the pits and will try to take us to the cleaners ......I'm afraid KP is rolling the dice......and what are the snake eyes? We actually don't have a team that is strong anywhere right now. How can a few signings = a complete team? I thought we had it rock bottom.......???

[gate7]

Except he is the guy with his head in a paper bag
:lol::lol::lol: post of the day!!

[ensco]

This is one forlorn fan base.

[Alonso]

This is one forlorn fan base.


Today killed me.

Now I am starting to worry.

Jazzy is right. Now every team in the world that does their due diligence will bend us over the coffee table and have their way with us.

If we don't seal some deals soon it's better off that we wait and not get taken to the cleaners.

This means a horrible finish to the season and even worse, another 8th consecutive year of scrambling to assemble a team in preseason.

[boozilla]

The new Rock Bottom is when the team is moved.

[Corpand]

On the contrary, keep an eye on this Friday especially. And keep your fucking fingers crossed.

[jloome]

On the contrary, keep an eye on this Friday especially. And keep your fucking fingers crossed.

Oh lordie, you're just gonna get everyone a-huffin and a-hollerin' again, consarnit.

[Marc"2L"]

Oh look a carrot...

[mowe]

Oh look a carrot...

And boy do we need one. There were 100 people refreshing this thread all day yesterday.

[Marc"2L"]

And boy do we need one. There were 100 people refreshing this thread all day yesterday.

Yeah I should go to bed

[khso11]

these signings better come fast......

[DOMIN8R]

these signings better come fast...... Unfortunately, it's this type of thinking/pressure that has led to some impulsive and often lopsided contracts that we have all come to regret. Let's ask management to stop commenting on their pursuits. Period. And we'll pretend that we're mature and wise enough to accept that there are no guarantees until a contract is signed, with papers in order and approved by MLS.














Yeah, right......:toetap05:

[OgtheDim]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uoLoyg3JKRQ

[Nuvinho]

Friday is when the transfer window closes for the Brazilian league - This could end the Forlan saga.

[Ajax TFC]

Friday is when the transfer window closes for the Brazilian league - This could end the Forlan saga.
transfer windows restrict incoming transfers, but not outgoing ones.

[Ivy]

On the contrary, keep an eye on this Friday especially. And keep your fucking fingers crossed.
What do you know??!! Tell us!!

[backbeat]

Oh look a carrot...


isn't that the same carrot as last week, only slightly shrivelled?

[OgtheDim]

Yeah, it was "Monday", said one person. For sure Monday.

Now its "Friday" by another person.


I'll believe its the day when I see a press call.

[brad]

Yeah, it was "Monday", said one person. For sure Monday.

Now its "Friday" by another person.


I'll believe its the day when I see a press call.

The sudden movement of O'Dea over the weekend change the cap situation, gained us an extra international slot and changed the picture. That is apparently why Monday was pushed.

[Ultra & Proud]

Perhaps they want to do a big splash announcement with "x" amount of players, all together like the Koev & Frings one. Maybe someone they are after is playing in the Gold Cup? Hopefully for a team that lost 2-0 last night.

[Pint]

Why would it be pushed? If the announcement was imminent that should mean that the deal is practically done. We gain more flexibility and change focus? Or they want to make it a multiplayer announcement?

[Phil]

Just sit tight and wait. Its all we can do. Additional pressure or rushing something can be way more damaging. These guys know everyone is watching them for their next move.

It does suck that it will cost us another game in tomorrow night, but the season is a write off right now.

[OgtheDim]

Reasons why this could be being delayed:



O'Dea transfer okay from Garber
Finding Forlan's new wife a job
Cochrane assumed shirt maker knew how to spell Uruti
Bierne, busy on the phone congratulating Joey for not bowing to that pressure to fire his coach, forgot to book the conference room - birthday party for Nigel Reed in full swing

[Super]

Just sit tight and wait. Its all we can do. Additional pressure or rushing something can be way more damaging. These guys know everyone is watching them for their next move.

It does suck that it will cost us another game in tomorrow night, but the season is a write off right now.

I guess it doesn't matter how deep we'll be in the hole then? But one thing is for certain, the second we're considered completely out of the play-offs by the masses is the same second the stands become empty. But I guess Nelsen still walks around thinking we have a chance?

[Phil]

I guess it doesn't matter how deep we'll be in the hole then? But one thing is for certain, the second we're considered completely out of the play-offs by the masses is the same second the stands become empty. But I guess Nelsen still walks around thinking we have a chance?

The spin machine is just that and that guy has to go into work everyday and firgure out a motivation for him, the team and the fans. So I get he says the stuff he does but really....it will be an epic run and math makes it a possibility, but with the gutting of the team as it stands and the nature of the contracts I hear about, we are building for a competitive team in the future.

[tfcleeds]

On the contrary, keep an eye on this Friday especially. And keep your fucking fingers crossed.After last week, I'm not getting my hopes up. I'm going to temper my expectations and assume we're going to be playing the Red Bulls with what we have now - and maybe even Columbus as well.

[VoxPopuliCosmicum]

Reasons why this could be being delayed:



O'Dea transfer okay from Garber
Finding Forlan's new wife a job
Cochrane assumed shirt maker knew how to spell Uruti
Bierne, busy on the phone congratulating Joey for not bowing to that pressure to fire his coach, forgot to book the conference room - birthday party for Nigel Reed in full swing



^That's some prize-worthy stuff. Especially that last one.

[Super]

The spin machine is just that and that guy has to go into work everyday and firgure out a motivation for him, the team and the fans. So I get he says the stuff he does but really....it will be an epic run and math makes it a possibility, but with the gutting of the team as it stands and the nature of the contracts I hear about, we are building for a competitive team in the future.

I just wish we'd hear the same thing from KP and RN. Be honest with us. When you're talking of play-offs when we're 13 points behind, then lose 3-0 and drop a bunch of players without reinforcement, what does that say to fans? RN certainly lost credibility on that one. Now it's up to KP and Leiweke to bring in that big name DP. Failure to do that and we'll have yet another management in charge that fails to live up to promises. Empty stands ahead.

[Canary10]

Reasons why this could be being delayed:



O'Dea transfer okay from Garber
Finding Forlan's new wife a job
Cochrane assumed shirt maker knew how to spell Uruti
Bierne, busy on the phone congratulating Joey for not bowing to that pressure to fire his coach, forgot to book the conference room - birthday party for Nigel Reed in full swing



Doesn't 'Uruti' have two 'r's?

[BuSaPuNk]

Quote for the MLS article in the news thread today.

"Obviously these moves aren’t off the cuff,” Nelsen said. “Any move, whether it is Silva or anyone else, everything is planned and organized. There are no off the cuff decisions. It is all done with an idea to what will be done in the long term. Of course, we have been looking at the fullback positions as well as the attacking positions.” - Nelsen

This scares me just the fact that he says idea. If we go through this window with no major moves I would refer to this quote from Nelsen.

I know there not going to openly say who or what but he doesn't sound convincing that there is an immediate signing happening. Hope we arnt getting caught with our pants down.

This is a big back track from Nelsen a few weeks ago saying guys are coming in. 3-4 bodies were bringing in ect. We went from there coming to an idea of where were going.

[Abou Sky]

He was also involved with the LA Kings. And lots of Kings fans say that he was TOO involved. He has a reputation of being both great and intrusive. We shall see.

He brings me championships and he can be as involved as he likes IMO, heck, he can have the keys to borrow my damn car if he wants.

[OgtheDim]

Doesn't 'Uruti' have two 'r's?

That's what the shirt maker thought.

[Ultra & Proud]

I just wish we'd hear the same thing from KP and RN. Be honest with us. When you're talking of play-offs when we're 13 points behind, then lose 3-0 and drop a bunch of players without reinforcement, what does that say to fans? RN certainly lost credibility on that one. Now it's up to KP and Leiweke to bring in that big name DP. Failure to do that and we'll have yet another management in charge that fails to live up to promises. Empty stands ahead.

Or we could have kept the status quo and kept our awesome run of form going.


Not sure why it's so hard to realize that we had to clear cap room before submitting transfer requests into our league offices. The league isn't going to take our word for it that as soon as the new guys can play then we'll trade Silva and transfer O' Dea. Doesn't work like that. You have to be cap compliant before submitting contract requests. Also remember, that when we want a player we don't just sign him up. We work the preliminary deal then the league itself negotiates with the player and draws up the final contract. No matter what Payne offers it's still up to the league to accept that or try to negotiate as they see fit. Many times in this league deals take a while due to league negotiations and paperwork. You'd rather Payne come out and say "Hey, we signed Forlan!" and then have the league say that the deal is no good for MLS and then Payne ends up looking like a sucker, you know, like when the unprofessional crew last year did the same thing with Mellberg.

[billyfly]

Speaking of shirts. Forlan's was made.

What the hold up is I don't know.

I am getting nervous like everyone else.

[Canary10]

That's what the shirt maker thought.

Wonder if they got it right on the contract? His agent probably said, oops, spelled his name wrong, off to Pumas now.

[Phil]

Quote for the MLS article in the news thread today.

"Obviously these moves aren’t off the cuff,” Nelsen said. “Any move, whether it is Silva or anyone else, everything is planned and organized. There are no off the cuff decisions. It is all done with an idea to what will be done in the long term. Of course, we have been looking at the fullback positions as well as the attacking positions.” - Nelsen

This scares me just the fact that he says idea. If we go through this window with no major moves I would refer to this quote from Nelsen.

I know there not going to openly say who or what but he doesn't sound convincing that there is an immediate signing happening. Hope we arnt getting caught with our pants down.

This is a big back track from Nelsen a few weeks ago saying guys are coming in. 3-4 bodies were bringing in ect. We went from there coming to an idea of where were going.

Nelsen can only get his info from Payne. Its a two way street, he will make requests, Payne will make suggestions and they have to agree. That being said, they are doing what should have been done very early on (I sill am stunned that I am typing this) and that is budgeting each postion and madating important exceptions (DP's).

I do agree with Super, I wish Nelsen was on the same page as Payne when giving interviews or comments, but Payne is notorious at sitting behind the curtain and controlling his responses so far, where as Nelsen has to deal with the media every day and deal with the instant communication of twitter and the players all the time. Payne also has to wrestle with his new boss in Tim. Everything that I saw indicated a very high level of respect and commitment between the 3, but they really need to get on the same page as far as outward communications.

Its not a quick fix thing, but they have a way to go. I am the same as everyone here, the longer it takes the less confident I get too. Who knows what obstacles they are dealing with given the nature of MLS and how it structures contracts.

[Phil]

I will add with the word 'idea'....I read it as multiple fits into defined or identified roles.

Wether or not they pan out, well that is the million dollar question.

[v00d00daddy]

Quote for the MLS article in the news thread today.

"Obviously these moves aren’t off the cuff,” Nelsen said. “Any move, whether it is Silva or anyone else, everything is planned and organized. There are no off the cuff decisions. It is all done with an idea to what will be done in the long term. Of course, we have been looking at the fullback positions as well as the attacking positions.” - Nelsen

This scares me just the fact that he says idea. If we go through this window with no major moves I would refer to this quote from Nelsen.

I know there not going to openly say who or what but he doesn't sound convincing that there is an immediate signing happening. Hope we arnt getting caught with our pants down.

This is a big back track from Nelsen a few weeks ago saying guys are coming in. 3-4 bodies were bringing in ect. We went from there coming to an idea of where were going.

That Nelsen quote seems like complete bullshit. Every move is planned and organized? Really?

So what he's saying is that they "planned" to bring O'Dea to Kansas and then send him home hours before the game? Or was it that they "planned" to get rid of him all along so when the opportunity came they jumped....regardless of how stupid it looked.

Did they "plan" to get rid of a player for allocation money, regardless of whether he was young, domestic and a player with actual talent?

Yet they keep around Russell and Lambe and acquire Convey and sign Earnshaw for the season (or beyond)? I thought they "planned" all these moves to bring in reinforcements? Sure doesn't look like the planning went beyond this season.

I mean, what good does it do to trade Silva for allocation money when they could have saved money by NOT extending Earnshaw? Why did we extend and pay the "over the hill ex epl cast off" and trade away a younger, cheaper player?

And please...nobody feed me any lines about trying to stay competitive. That's obviously not a concern.

I'll add that I agree that it's time to be patient in terms of when the reinforcements come in. There isn't much else we can do. I just hope they're the right reinforcements and that they address ALL our needs. If we're still tinkering going in to next season I'll consider it all a failure.

They'd better hit the ground running next year, with the guys they want on the salaries they want. Whether they win or lose, they'd better have THEIR team by then.

[Ajax TFC]

Quote for the MLS article in the news thread today.

"Obviously these moves aren’t off the cuff,” Nelsen said. “Any move, whether it is Silva or anyone else, everything is planned and organized. There are no off the cuff decisions. It is all done with an idea to what will be done in the long term. Of course, we have been looking at the fullback positions as well as the attacking positions.” - Nelsen

This scares me just the fact that he says idea. If we go through this window with no major moves I would refer to this quote from Nelsen.

I know there not going to openly say who or what but he doesn't sound convincing that there is an immediate signing happening. Hope we arnt getting caught with our pants down.

This is a big back track from Nelsen a few weeks ago saying guys are coming in. 3-4 bodies were bringing in ect. We went from there coming to an idea of where were going.
wow. I'm not sure if it's possible to take a word more out of context.

[BuSaPuNk]

Nelsen can only get his info from Payne. Its a two way street, he will make requests, Payne will make suggestions and they have to agree. That being said, they are doing what should have been done very early on (I sill am stunned that I am typing this) and that is budgeting each postion and madating important exceptions (DP's).

I do agree with Super, I wish Nelsen was on the same page as Payne when giving interviews or comments, but Payne is notorious at sitting behind the curtain and controlling his responses so far, where as Nelsen has to deal with the media every day and deal with the instant communication of twitter and the players all the time. Payne also has to wrestle with his new boss in Tim. Everything that I saw indicated a very high level of respect and commitment between the 3, but they really need to get on the same page as far as outward communications.

Its not a quick fix thing, but they have a way to go. I am the same as everyone here, the longer it takes the less confident I get too. Who knows what obstacles they are dealing with given the nature of MLS and how it structures contracts.

Oh for sure and I agree with you. My post is not jumping down there throats. I'm liking what there doing in terms of our cap situation. I'm just highlighting the fact that things may not seem as organized as we think they are.

Time will tell if this is just the wrong wording or if there is something to it.

[BuSaPuNk]

wow. I'm not sure if it's possible to take a word more out of context.

Not taking it out of context just made me wary of what possibility could be happening. Releasing and trading players away for cap relief is a great plan and one I applaud. But if there is no signings that happen it becomes a point that there might not be an I really plan that can't be implemented and they are just flying off the seats of there pants. I highly doubt it but still wary.

[Phil]

That Nelsen quote seems like complete bullshit. Every move is planned and organized? Really?

So what he's saying is that they "planned" to bring O'Dea to Kansas and then send him home hours before the game? Or was it that they "planned" to get rid of him all along so when the opportunity came they jumped....regardless of how stupid it looked.

Did they "plan" to get rid of a player for allocation money, regardless of whether he was young, domestic and a player with actual talent?

Yet they keep around Russell and Lambe and acquire Convey and sign Earnshaw for the season (or beyond)? I thought they "planned" all these moves to bring in reinforcements? Sure doesn't look like the planning went beyond this season.

I mean, what good does it do to trade Silva for allocation money when they could have saved money by NOT extending Earnshaw? Why did we extend and pay the "over the hill ex epl cast off" and trade away a younger, cheaper player?

And please...nobody feed me any lines about trying to stay competitive. That's obviously not a concern.

I'll add that I agree that it's time to be patient in terms of when the reinforcements come in. There isn't much else we can do. I just hope they're the right reinforcements and that they address ALL our needs. If we're still tinkering going in to next season I'll consider it all a failure.

They'd better hit the ground running next year, with the guys they want on the salaries they want. Whether they win or lose, they'd better have THEIR team by then.

I can tell you that Darrens salary and contract was a big concern for everyone looking on that level (not sure about Earl...). If they didn't get the chance to move him like this, my guess is a buyout next year.

So was it 'planned' to ditch him half an hour before? No. Was it desired to get something for him vs a buyout? Hell yes.

As much as we all want to think everything is planned out 6 steps ahead, sometimes you make some broad agreements like - we have to get this outrageous contract out of here.... and then jump at the opportunity to not only provide relief, but also gain a transfer fee or whatever back.

The biggest thing we could all call them on is saying the team is 'competitive' and really right now its not. I will do my best (as I know you all are) to look past that and hope they do make the correct signings to ensure the team becomes more competitive in the upcoming years.

More than being tired of the revolving door for players, I am even more sick of the revolving door at management / leadership level. Adopt a philosophy and have the guts to stick to it(my message to TFC).

[DOMIN8R]

My new concern going forward is that Leiweke will decide KP and Nelly are the wrong ones at the helm. He didn't have a say in their hiring and he may have a different vision on how to address.....
TFC’s support has declined with its underperformance. Its once-loyal fan base of “Red Army” season ticket-holders has dropped to 200 from 800 in recent years, Leiweke said. (http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/2013/07/16/mlse_boss_tim_leiweke_unveils_his_vision_for_leafs _raptors_tfc.html?cta=bottom&utm_expid=6682428-0.pmAbpHPsSSS1W5v3cyeVhw.2&utm_referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thestar.com%2F)

“We had the best brand in Major League Soccer,” he said. “We’ve done a lot of damage to the brand.” (http://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/2013/07/16/mlse_boss_tim_leiweke_unveils_his_vision_for_leafs _raptors_tfc.html?cta=bottom&utm_expid=6682428-0.pmAbpHPsSSS1W5v3cyeVhw.2&utm_referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thestar.com%2F)

[pekduck]

My new concern going forward is that Leiweke will decide KP and Nelly are the wrong ones at the helm. He didn't have a say in their hiring and he may have a different vision on how to address.....

is that because



Masai Ujiri was hired to run the Raptors because, “I didn’t get along with the GM (Bryan Colangelo) … so we brought in somebody who sees the world the same way I do,” Leiweke said.

[Canary10]

The longer the delay, the longer the team is hamstrung with a lack of players. If Nelsen/Payne really believe we can go on a run that gets us back in the playoff conversation, throwing away matches like we did Saturday, and may do again tomorrow against a beatable team is not the way to do it. If it's not a DP, at least one or two of the other signings we apparently have on the go need to happen asap. Those will also be the ones that determine how we are going forward, much more than the DP one in my opinion.

[Nuvinho]

If they sign players on Friday....I highly doubt they will start on Saturday....so we are screwed for the next 2 games for sure.

[Canary10]

I can tell you that Darrens salary and contract was a big concern for everyone looking on that level (not sure about Earl...). If they didn't get the chance to move him like this, my guess is a buyout next year.

So was it 'planned' to ditch him half an hour before? No. Was it desired to get something for him vs a buyout? Hell yes.

As much as we all want to think everything is planned out 6 steps ahead, sometimes you make some broad agreements like - we have to get this outrageous contract out of here.... and then jump at the opportunity to not only provide relief, but also gain a transfer fee or whatever back.

The biggest thing we could all call them on is saying the team is 'competitive' and really right now its not. I will do my best (as I know you all are) to look past that and hope they do make the correct signings to ensure the team becomes more competitive in the upcoming years.

More than being tired of the revolving door for players, I am even more sick of the revolving door at management / leadership level. Adopt a philosophy and have the guts to stick to it(my message to TFC).

This is really the key thing on this move. They save salary, yeah, but getting a transfer fee for him is way more important. Even a $1 million transfer fee, fairly small potatoes in European football, would be huge in MLS terms. There's no way they could pass up on that, planned or not.

[Canary10]

If they sign players on Friday....I highly doubt they will start on Saturday....so we are screwed for the next 2 games for sure.

Yeah, so we're essentially giving away 9 points without much of a fight. The team right now looks about as bad (in terms of pure numbers and in quality) as that one Mariner had last year for one game that had like 3 subs on the bench.

[OgtheDim]

I would take this team with Earnshaw Laba and Caldwell in it over Ecks as CB, Dunfield and the Weedman.

[ag futbol]

I'm sure I'll get roundly roasted for this but... the season is shot. It's pretty much what we expected going in, and sure enough it has happened. I expected us to pick up a few extra points along the road to the bottom of the table, but we are here in the same place none the less.

I'm not going to concern myself much with how we do in these next few games. I expect us sign a few people before this window is over and hit *something* that looks like a less futile run of form before the end of the season. Next year, I expect us to be 100% ready to go, no excuses, no bullshit, no cute quotes about "being in every game". Pretty much just like it was with Aron Winter, season two will be put up or shut up time. And I have no problem with that whosoever.

[Super]

Or we could have kept the status quo and kept our awesome run of form going.


Not sure why it's so hard to realize that we had to clear cap room before submitting transfer requests into our league offices. The league isn't going to take our word for it that as soon as the new guys can play then we'll trade Silva and transfer O' Dea. Doesn't work like that. You have to be cap compliant before submitting contract requests. Also remember, that when we want a player we don't just sign him up. We work the preliminary deal then the league itself negotiates with the player and draws up the final contract. No matter what Payne offers it's still up to the league to accept that or try to negotiate as they see fit. Many times in this league deals take a while due to league negotiations and paperwork. You'd rather Payne come out and say "Hey, we signed Forlan!" and then have the league say that the deal is no good for MLS and then Payne ends up looking like a sucker, you know, like when the unprofessional crew last year did the same thing with Mellberg.

I'm on board - I think KP and RN are right for this club, and I do believe that we're in for much better things to come. However, most people who frequent the TFC games do not take the time to understand why things are happening the way that they are. To them it's just more defeats, more players in and out. So you and I will continue to go to the games, but we'll still hear people around town talk negatively around town, saying that KP promised this and that. RN isn't helping matters by talking about the play-offs a week before the complete collapse (did he honestly believe that, or was he just feeding us BS?). Credibility lost with the casuals, and they make up for the majority of the stadium. So that's why I'm saying to expect empty stands in the remaining games of the season.

[ag futbol]

This is really the key thing on this move. They save salary, yeah, but getting a transfer fee for him is way more important. Even a $1 million transfer fee, fairly small potatoes in European football, would be huge in MLS terms. There's no way they could pass up on that, planned or not.
If we get any sort of fee they should erect a statue of kevin payne in front of BMO field. We are basically getting a 150-200k performance out of a 450k player. It probably is for salary cap purposes the worst contract in the entire league.

Simply having him off the books is a huge win. A transfer fee would just be incredibly lucky.

[Canary10]

I'm sure I'll get roundly roasted for this but... the season is shot. It's pretty much what we expected going in, and sure enough it has happened. I expected us to pick up a few extra points along the road to the bottom of the table, but we are here in the same place none the less.

I'm not going to concern myself much with how we do in these next few games. I expect us sign a few people before this window is over and hit *something* that looks like a less futile run of form before the end of the season. Next year, I expect us to be 100% ready to go, no excuses, no bullshit, no cute quotes about "being in every game". Pretty much just like it was with Aron Winter, season two will be put up or shut up time. And I have no problem with that whosoever.

Is there no way that we can better sequence these things so we're not dropping players without replacements in the midst of 3 games in a week? I know some things, like O'Dea, come up as a surprise, but fuck. We get caught out on these things all the time.

[ag futbol]

Is there no way that we can better sequence these things so we're not dropping players without replacements in the midst of 3 games in a week? I know some things, like O'Dea, come up as a surprise, but fuck. We get caught out on these things all the time.
Timing has not been great in some cases and they've certainly shot themselves in the foot a few times. Take the Silva transfer for example. I don't know who would be responsible for getting that message out there but somebody should have egg on their face. It's Tuesday, they know the media is at practice and they know that something is imminent. They hung their own players out to dry, which is a morale killer.

Now that being said, I really see a lot of this as the team simply needing to make moves when they come up. The second O'dea has something on paper I would not put him on the field and jeopardize that move. Nor would I with Silva or anyone else.

Really, if they had just stuck to their original message about this being a tough year, they'd be fine right now. I don't understand why anybody is mentioning playoffs for any reason. I guess the message from above is that enough seasons have been thrown away already and ticket sales are hurting, so don't tell anyone you're writing off the year.

[Ultra & Proud]

Is there no way that we can better sequence these things so we're not dropping players without replacements in the midst of 3 games in a week? I know some things, like O'Dea, come up as a surprise, but fuck. We get caught out on these things all the time.
Thing is you delay these moves until this week is done to potentially win or draw 3 matches, two of which are against teams that we'd be in tough with even with everyone still here and then what if whomever we may have already submitted papers for or at least made offers to and the players go elsewhere due to what they will see as an unprofessional delay?

Let's say we did that and we did about as well as can be expected and lost to KC, won at Chivas, and drew against NYRB. That gives us 4 extra points that mean dick all when we aren't making the playoffs and then much like in the past, we fucked the future for a few points now and would end up settling for the usual scrubs we get here and then we'd have to dump and replace them next year. And the cycle continues. For all the patience talk earlier in the season, it sure went out the window after Silva got moved and nothing happened within the first few days of the window being open.

[Initial B]

I'm honestly wondering if there is a back-room power struggle between Lieweke and Payne. It seems that the vision for TFC was clearer before TW was appointed by the MLSE bigwigs. I would think that the board has confidence in KP since they asked for him from MLS, but who knows what kind of egos are involved here.

Perhaps we're looking at the beginning of the end for this cycle?

[Phil]

I'm honestly wondering if there is a back-room power struggle between Lieweke and Payne. It seems that the vision for TFC was clearer before TW was appointed by the MLSE bigwigs. I would think that the board has confidence in KP since they asked for him from MLS, but who knows what kind of egos are involved here.

Perhaps we're looking at the beginning of the end for this cycle?

I didn't get the impression that there was a struggle at all from the way they all talked and interacted together. Tim is different though, that much is clear. Kevin seemed very comfortable interacting with him, moreso than most of the others I saw him with.

That being siad you never really know. If things get really bad, I would expect leaks. They seemed very unified on their targets and persuit and had all the clearance given by those they need it from.

[OgtheDim]

Lieweke has said numerous times that he likes Payne, admires what he has done in the league, and considers him somebody he can work with.
The same was not said of Colangelo.
One example of how Lieweke knows Payne would be that I'm pretty sure before Arena was hired that Lieweke would have had a talk with Payne.

Payne knows who is the big boss. But Lieweke also knows who has to do what job to get it all done. Although Lieweke is all for the big splash, KP has never been completely against that.

[tfcleeds]

^Only thing is, Leiweke seems hell-bent on a major DP on a similar level to Beckham/Henry at all costs. I don't think that was ever necessarily a part of Payne's thinking when he first came in.

[Phil]

^Only thing is, Leiweke seems hell-bent on a major DP on a similar level to Beckham/Henry at all costs. I don't think that was ever necessarily a part of Payne's thinking when he first came in.

The model still supports a big name, and this is where the compromise comes in. Big name DP or little name, the hit is the same (depending on age). It means you still have to be careful of overspending on other positions and that there needs to be a heavy emphisis on academy talent advancing to fill the holes. What name you put in at DP is semantecs, its the philosophy in play and how those roles are supported that is key.

[barticusz]

I'm likely missing some extra detail in this but based on the salaries that were provided earlier this year.. here is the situation.. Note that Caldwell's salary is not known and is excluded, and Bloom's contract isn't included either but he'd likely be around the Richter dollar amount. In general there is roughly 1M in cap space available for the team.. + allocation? If that is how it works.










Base Salary

Guarunteed Salary



















1
TOR
Koevermans
Danny
F
$
335,000.00
$
1,663,323.33

1,250,000.00



2
TOR
O'Dea
Darren
D
$
350,000.00
$
456,250.00





3
TOR
Eckersley
Richard
D
$
210,000.00
$
310,000.00





4
TOR
Laba
Matias
M
$
200,000.00
$
200,000.00





5
TOR
Califf
Danny
D
$
165,000.00
$
165,000.00





6
TOR
Frei
Stefan
GK
$
145,000.00
$
200,000.00





7
TOR
Earnshaw
Robert
F
$
138,000.00
$
155,150.00





8
TOR
Braun
Justin
F
$
112,200.00
$
114,700.00





9
TOR
Russell
Darel
M
$
99,999.96
$
109,874.96





10
TOR
Hall
Jeremy
D
$
80,000.00
$
90,000.00





11
TOR
Silva
Luis
M
$
70,400.00
$
105,400.00





12
TOR
Lambe
Reggie
M
$
67,500.00
$
70,000.00





13
TOR
Morgan
Ashtone
D
$
60,000.00
$
72,000.00





14
TOR
Wiedeman
Andrew
F
$
55,000.00
$
65,000.00





15
TOR
Henry
Doneil
D
$
50,000.00
$
62,083.33





16
TOR
Emory
Logan
D
$
48,400.00
$
48,400.00





17
TOR
Agbossoumonde
Gale
D
$
46,500.00
$
53,166.67





18
TOR
Bekker
Kyle
M
$
46,500.00
$
67,750.00





19
TOR
Bendik
Joe
GK
$
46,500.00
$
46,500.00





20
TOR
Osorio
Jonathan
M
$
46,500.00
$
46,500.00





21
TOR
Roberts
Quillan
GK
$
46,500.00
$
46,500.00





22
TOR
Welshman
Emery
F
$
46,500.00
$
46,500.00





23
TOR
Richter
Ryan
F
$
35,125.00
$
35,125.00





















Before Summer Moves


2,372,499.96


< Salary Cap on First 20 players




After Summer Moves


1,915,224.96

[KGH]

I'm likely missing some extra detail in this but based on the salaries that were provided earlier this year.. here is the situation.. Note that Caldwell's salary is not known and is excluded, and Bloom's contract isn't included either but he'd likely be around the Richter dollar amount. In general there is roughly 1M in cap space available for the team.. + allocation? If that is how it works.










Base Salary

Guarunteed Salary



















1
TOR
Koevermans
Danny
F
$
335,000.00
$
1,663,323.33

1,250,000.00



2
TOR
O'Dea
Darren
D
$
350,000.00
$
456,250.00





3
TOR
Eckersley
Richard
D
$
210,000.00
$
310,000.00





4
TOR
Laba
Matias
M
$
200,000.00
$
200,000.00





5
TOR
Califf
Danny
D
$
165,000.00
$
165,000.00





6
TOR
Frei
Stefan
GK
$
145,000.00
$
200,000.00





7
TOR
Earnshaw
Robert
F
$
138,000.00
$
155,150.00





8
TOR
Braun
Justin
F
$
112,200.00
$
114,700.00





9
TOR
Russell
Darel
M
$
99,999.96
$
109,874.96





10
TOR
Hall
Jeremy
D
$
80,000.00
$
90,000.00





11
TOR
Silva
Luis
M
$
70,400.00
$
105,400.00





12
TOR
Lambe
Reggie
M
$
67,500.00
$
70,000.00





13
TOR
Morgan
Ashtone
D
$
60,000.00
$
72,000.00





14
TOR
Wiedeman
Andrew
F
$
55,000.00
$
65,000.00





15
TOR
Henry
Doneil
D
$
50,000.00
$
62,083.33





16
TOR
Emory
Logan
D
$
48,400.00
$
48,400.00





17
TOR
Agbossoumonde
Gale
D
$
46,500.00
$
53,166.67





18
TOR
Bekker
Kyle
M
$
46,500.00
$
67,750.00





19
TOR
Bendik
Joe
GK
$
46,500.00
$
46,500.00





20
TOR
Osorio
Jonathan
M
$
46,500.00
$
46,500.00





21
TOR
Roberts
Quillan
GK
$
46,500.00
$
46,500.00





22
TOR
Welshman
Emery
F
$
46,500.00
$
46,500.00





23
TOR
Richter
Ryan
F
$
35,125.00
$
35,125.00





















Before Summer Moves


2,372,499.96


< Salary Cap on First 20 players




After Summer Moves


1,915,224.96










Don't forget our 2 KC players

Convey Bobby M $ 200,000.00 $ 215,000.00
Thomas Michael M $ 57,750.00 $ 60,713.21

[barticusz]

I knew I was missing something very evident!

[TFC07]

Convery makes $200K? WOW!

[19Barrett19]

Wtf where are the new players I'm getting impatient

[Marc"2L"]

We can probably all leave this thread for the day now....

:(

[Ivy]

I doubt TFC is paying 200k for Convey...

[69Chevy396]

Wtf where are the new players I'm getting impatient
The other guys are getting them, you know, good MLS teams which have good management. I just find it both predictable and amusing that whomever mlse hires each season or two to run TFC the same shit happens. Only in Toronto are pro sports fans mocked if they dont embrace these new guys and humble themselves in complete acquiescence. MLSE is the problem, it makes no difference who they hire cause that manager will be a yes man in the same mold as a cabinet minister in Harpers govt. Dale Lastman probably has more decision making authority than Payne or Lewicke, and he is a dimwit.

[NolbertoS]

All these constant delays and no press conferences. Is Forlan and Urutti trying to squeeze as much from MLSE?? If there are no announcements this week, I'm thinking the Forlan deal fell apart, due to financial and accomodation constraints. As much as the season is a wash, don't want the players thinking they got nothing left to play for other then pride

[khso11]

Unfortunately, it's this type of thinking/pressure that has led to some impulsive and often lopsided contracts that we have all come to regret. Let's ask management to stop commenting on their pursuits. Period. And we'll pretend that we're mature and wise enough to accept that there are no guarantees until a contract is signed, with papers in order and approved by MLS.














Yeah, right......:toetap05:

k, maybe all these false hope have got up to my head. Ok, so everyone lets be patient!!!!

[Phil]

I doubt TFC is paying 200k for Convey...

Good point, sometimes on player dumps the original club shoulders part of the contract just to get the player the opportunity to play.

[Ivy]

Good point, sometimes on player dumps the original club shoulders part of the contract just to get the player the opportunity to play.
If Convey was rotting on the bench is KC, surely that draft pick is more valuable to them the he. It makes more sense for them to eat a portion of the salary and get a draft pick, than pay his entire salary and get jack.

[tfcleeds]

Just funny how last week there was so much scuttlebutt about new player signings being 'imminent', and yet, we saw the outgoing of two key players in the starting XI out of the blue, with nary a clue that either was about to happen.

[barticusz]

billyfly, I'm just wondering what your connection is to TFC? You had mentioned these imminent signings and press conferences but sadly nothing has come of them. I don't doubt you, just curious is all. I'd rather have some slimmer of hope than nothing at all.

[ManUtd4ever]

Just funny how last week there was so much scuttlebutt about new player signings being 'imminent', and yet, we saw the outgoing of two key players in the starting XI out of the blue, with nary a clue that either was about to happen.

I agree. I'm inclined to give Payne the benefit of the doubt based on his track record, but the silence is somewhat disconcerting following the dpartures of two key players.

[Ivy]

I agree. I'm inclined to give Payne the benefit of the doubt based on his track record, but the silence is somewhat disconcerting following the dpartures of two key players.
Departures that you heard nothing about... So the silence is not unusual.

[Ivy]

There's no pleasing most people here eh? Lol when TFC talks and deals fall through, everybody is telling them to stfu. Now that they're not saying anything, everyone is begging for them to talk... Sheesh...

[Haddy]

There's no pleasing most people here eh? Lol when TFC talks and deals fall through, everybody is telling them to stfu. Now that they're not saying anything, everyone is begging for them to talk... Sheesh...

Nailed it. :flare:

[Super]

Talking TFC on TSN: http://www.tsn.ca/Toronto/listen/

[Red I]

I doubt TFC is paying 200k for Convey...

Probably a pro-rated cap-hit for this year, but that is his estimated salary for a whole year.

[tfcleeds]

There's no pleasing most people here eh? Lol when TFC talks and deals fall through, everybody is telling them to stfu. Now that they're not saying anything, everyone is begging for them to talk... Sheesh...I wish they'd just be consistent. Better for them not to give any hints of anything - if there are still hurdles to clear, as likely is the case in some of these deals, then don't say they're "imminent"! (or whatever phrase Nelsen or Payne may have used to suggest they were close). Just like don't say at the beginning of the season that this is a rebuilding year, and we're focusing on playoffs for 2014, then a couple months later, "oh, we're still in with a shot at the playoffs". The mixed messages are just maddening! (even though we all know here playoffs aren't happening, despite what Payne or Nelsen may say).

[OgtheDim]

Denial

Anger

Depression

Bargaining

Acceptance


I think as far as next Saturday's game is concerned I skipped bargaining.

[VoxPopuliCosmicum]

The other guys are getting them, you know, good MLS teams which have good management. I just find it both predictable and amusing that whomever mlse hires each season or two to run TFC the same shit happens. Only in Toronto are pro sports fans mocked if they dont embrace these new guys and humble themselves in complete acquiescence. MLSE is the problem, it makes no difference who they hire cause that manager will be a yes man in the same mold as a cabinet minister in Harpers govt. Dale Lastman probably has more decision making authority than Payne or Lewicke, and he is a dimwit.

OT, but Dale's actually pretty smart. Blaine's the dimwit. Not sure about the relative IQs of their half-brother, Kim, below or his brother Todd, nor am I sure that Lastman doesn't have another few dozen illegitimate kids running around.

http://contests.eyeweekly.com/eye/issue/issue_12.07.00/funny/photos/twin-b.gif

[stevep]

I'm on board - I think KP and RN are right for this club, and I do believe that we're in for much better things to come. However, most people who frequent the TFC games do not take the time to understand why things are happening the way that they are. To them it's just more defeats, more players in and out. So you and I will continue to go to the games, but we'll still hear people around town talk negatively around town, saying that KP promised this and that. RN isn't helping matters by talking about the play-offs a week before the complete collapse (did he honestly believe that, or was he just feeding us BS?). Credibility lost with the casuals, and they make up for the majority of the stadium. So that's why I'm saying to expect empty stands in the remaining games of the season.


The stadium will be packed when the 4 new guys arrive, if not i'll be there and i'll get the tickets cheap off of kijiji

[Marc"2L"]

So if anything happens Friday when do they announce a presser? The day after a potential loss to the other most dysfunctional team in the league?

Day of, hours before the game?
In 10 minutes?
ANYTHING!? Please?

[Super]

I guess it doesn't really matter WHEN during this transfer window we get our reinforcements. They'll be too late to help rescue us from yet another bottom of the table situation. I was hoping we'd see new players last week, but now we're 16 points out of the play-offs - so maybe it's to our advantage to wait a bit and time the contracts when they're the cheapest before the window closes. That's probably what they're doing. Who knows anymore.

[69Chevy396]

OT, but Dale's actually pretty smart. Blaine's the dimwit. Not sure about the relative IQs of their half-brother, Kim, below or his brother Todd, nor am I sure that Lastman doesn't have another few dozen illegitimate kids running around.

http://contests.eyeweekly.com/eye/issue/issue_12.07.00/funny/photos/twin-b.gif
That is pretty funny. Perhaps Blaine, the one stuck with the dollar store o/a a furniture retailer is pressuring lawyer Dale to write into every TFC contract a clause stipulating one or two family members have to shlep freezers for a year without pay.

[Ivy]

Don't be surprised if these signings show up at the last week of the window. TFC is looking for players from eveywhere around the world, and will look for the best possible deals now that they have some money.

[69Chevy396]

Don't be surprised if these signings show up at the last week of the window. TFC is looking for players from eveywhere around the world, and will look for the best possible deals now that they have some money.
This kills me. The good MLS organizations manage to recruit better players than we do, every year, notwithstanding money issues. If Forlan doesn't sign it won't be because mlse lacks money, it will be his response to spending a few minutes researching this teams pathetic record; has anybody here considered this as the principal reason few decent players come here? I am not trying to be the ever negative schmuck in the room, but I am having trouble finding one solid reason for not burning my scarves.

[T-boy]

This kills me. The good MLS organizations manage to recruit better players than we do, every year, notwithstanding money issues. If Forlan doesn't sign it won't be because mlse lacks money, it will be his response to spending a few minutes researching this teams pathetic record; has anybody here considered this as the principal reason few decent players come here? I am not trying to be the ever negative schmuck in the room, but I am having trouble finding one solid reason for not burning my scarves.

I don't buy that the teams bad record has anything to do with players coming here or not. There are plenty of world class players who have gone to bad teams, or bottom of the table teams. Sometimes its just a new challenge, sometimes its that you will be guaranteed playing time, or that you will be a giant fish in a small pond and a need to be idolised by new people. There are many many different reasons to come to a club other than results or reputation.

[backbeat]

This kills me. The good MLS organizations manage to recruit better players than we do, every year, notwithstanding money issues. If Forlan doesn't sign it won't be because mlse lacks money, it will be his response to spending a few minutes researching this teams pathetic record; has anybody here considered this as the principal reason few decent players come here? I am not trying to be the ever negative schmuck in the room, but I am having trouble finding one solid reason for not burning my scarves.


i understand being frustrated, i don't understand burning scarves.

TFC is my team - management, players, coaches etc. will come and go.

[Ivy]

This kills me. The good MLS organizations manage to recruit better players than we do, every year, notwithstanding money issues. If Forlan doesn't sign it won't be because mlse lacks money, it will be his response to spending a few minutes researching this teams pathetic record; has anybody here considered this as the principal reason few decent players come here? I am not trying to be the ever negative schmuck in the room, but I am having trouble finding one solid reason for not burning my scarves.
exactly. The same reason why decent coaches don't want to come here.
150 players in 6.5 years? I'm not a math professor or anything, but that's too f-ing much. Players, like supporters, want stability.

[Ivy]

I don't buy that the teams bad record has anything to do with players coming here or not. There are plenty of world class players who have gone to bad teams, or bottom of the table teams. Sometimes its just a new challenge, sometimes its that you will be guaranteed playing time, or that you will be a giant fish in a small pond and a need to be idolised by new people. There are many many different reasons to come to a club other than results or reputation.
I agree with you, but I don't think Chevy was making a reference to results.

[Ivy]

i understand being frustrated, i don't understand burning scarves.

TFC is my team - management, players, coaches etc. will come and go.
Lol I'm sure he didn't mean that literally.

[Haddy]

Folks, the window has been open a week. Put the pitchforks and torches down for a moment. The window still has a few weeks left. You'll get your reinforcements. I'm just not sure if you'll like them lol.

Remember, we were warned about no playoffs when they slashed ticket prices. No matter what is written in the media, keep your expectations super low for the remainder of this season....and anything else is just a bonus. It's like going to a really bad movie!

[Ultra & Proud]

This kills me. The good MLS organizations manage to recruit better players than we do, every year, notwithstanding money issues. If Forlan doesn't sign it won't be because mlse lacks money, it will be his response to spending a few minutes researching this teams pathetic record; has anybody here considered this as the principal reason few decent players come here? I am not trying to be the ever negative schmuck in the room, but I am having trouble finding one solid reason for not burning my scarves.
But it's mostly because our FO, prior to now,tried to appease the fanbase by giving them what they wanted regardless of fit, need, or cost. Since most of the fans want to win now, you got attempts at that but it just didn't work and went against the concept of building a team. Then you tear it down and rebuild it as nauseum and here we are. Finally someone is in charge with a plan that doesn't give a shit if the forums are filled with rage over us not announcing any signings within the first 6 days of the window being open.

[barticusz]

Instasuccess - This app should be made for the Toronto sport fan. This is what everyone craves and even though logic dictates that it will take time to see a plan through, the Toronto sport fan says yes lets follow that for 1 month.. and then.. Why is our team not winning games... ?!@?#!#!#!#?!?

Our team is crap, but we've got a new management group which will hopefully be given the ability to see their plan through. The only other person who had such foresight was Winter but he was quickly canned because of the impulsiveness that is Toronto.

[Ajax TFC]

I am having trouble finding one solid reason for not burning my scarves.
Don't know if any of these are valid for you, but:
- they're worth money
- they can keep you warm in the winter
- they could keep someone else warm in the winter
- fumes are probably toxic
- bad for the environment















g:D

[69Chevy396]

But it's mostly because our FO, prior to now,tried to appease the fanbase by giving them what they wanted regardless of fit, need, or cost. Since most of the fans want to win now, you got attempts at that but it just didn't work and went against the concept of building a team. Then you tear it down and rebuild it as nauseum and here we are. Finally someone is in charge with a plan that doesn't give a shit if the forums are filled with rage over us not announcing any signings within the first 6 days of the window being open.
I hope you are correct. By my reckoning, in order to be competitive we need;
- one star quality striker
- two creative attacking midfielders
- two reliable defenders

If they somehow manage to pull this off the team will be able to compete for a playoff position. That is still a far cry from being a contender.

[69Chevy396]

Don't know if any of these are valid for you, but:
- they're worth money
- they can keep you warm in the winter
- they could keep someone else warm in the winter
- fumes are probably toxic
- bad for the environment















g:DWell then, perhaps I will tie them together and climb out of my madhouse window.

[Stouffville_RPB]

Folks, the window has been open a week. Put the pitchforks and torches down for a moment. The window still has a few weeks left. You'll get your reinforcements. I'm just not sure if you'll like them lol.

Remember, we were warned about no playoffs when they slashed ticket prices. No matter what is written in the media, keep your expectations super low for the remainder of this season....and anything else is just a bonus. It's like going to a really bad movie!

Sharknado was 1000 times more entertaining than this season

[Stouffville_RPB]

But it's mostly because our FO, prior to now,tried to appease the fanbase by giving them what they wanted regardless of fit, need, or cost. Since most of the fans want to win now, you got attempts at that but it just didn't work and went against the concept of building a team. Then you tear it down and rebuild it as nauseum and here we are. Finally someone is in charge with a plan that doesn't give a shit if the forums are filled with rage over us not announcing any signings within the first 6 days of the window being open.

I was much more patient in the first 5 years than I have been. Maybe I'm the minority here but I was patient for the Mojo/Carver build, the Preki squad, and the Dutch Initiative. I find all the talk from FO to be patient and this I for the long haul or about this season being a write off a bit like a book I've read before.

My patience is gone, I don't want to hear about how you are looking at players, call me when they're signed. Right now all I've seen is players getting shown the door. Maybe its my fault for sticking with the clubs "vision" while the majority just wanted change. THIS is the window that you will get your marquee DP, not in our off-season while most stars are playing. Don't go into the off-season with half a team. All the main pieces better be brought in during this window.

Arm up Leiweke!

[moralis]

More roster changes and marquee signing expected soon by Toronto FC

http://www.tsn.ca/soccer/mls/story/?id=427864

[OgtheDim]

A CP article. Reads like Neil Davidson. I like his stuff. Confirms that O'Dea was an out of the blue request on the weekend.

[NolbertoS]

So Ecks and Frei are next. I'd rather keep Frei then Ecks TBH. Ecks may start looking at selling his home unless he can convince Payne and Lieweke that he'll take a massive paycut. I hope this is the last time TFC blows up the team. Payne and Lieweke must be wondering how TFC are not better than the Impact and Caps in there longer history.

[Richard]

I find it ridiculous Justin Braun is getting 112k.

[Phil]

I find it ridiculous that Russell is over 100k

[prizby]

I find it ridiculous Justin Braun is getting 112k.

don't think braun is that bad of a contract; scoring a goal every other 90 minutes; not bad

[Ajax TFC]

I'm glad Nelsen/Payne have the balls to make the hard decisions and get rid of players that are holding us back financially.

I think Braun will probably be gone next season if he doesn't agree to a serious pay cut. I think we brought him in because we didn't have any strikers on the roster at the time (apart from Koev)

[Ultra & Proud]

I find it ridiculous that Russell is over 100k
Totally agree even though he seems an upgrade in the middle over Hall, who at $80K is also approaching the ridiculous level.

[Ultra & Proud]

And is it possible what Nelsen implied that O' Dea's $450K wasn't the true number as a chunk was paid down with allocation?

If so, then Mariner is totally fucking ripped. Have another rummy.

[ryan]

And is it possible what Nelsen implied that O' Dea's $450K wasn't the true number as a chunk was paid down with allocation?

If so, then Mariner is totally fucking ripped. Have another rummy.

You mean this?


The MLS salary cap cost of a DP -- Ronaldo's current salary at Real Madrid is a reported $19 million a year -- and young DP is a combined $568,750, suggesting O'Dea's actual salary was even more than advertised.

That's madness!

[jazzy]

After last week, I'm not getting my hopes up. I'm going to temper my expectations and assume we're going to be playing the Red Bulls with what we have now - and maybe even Columbus as well.

if we get beaten and are totally impotent, KP could permanently damage the core, whatever that is these days.....I feel we've failed to instill a winning attitude (again) , which we were led to believe was key to the future . And KP is treading on dangerously thin ground. No way these players can instill fear in anyone. unfortunately,
,

[Ajax TFC]

if we get beaten and are totally impotent, KP could permanently damage the core, whatever that is these days.....I feel we've failed to instill a winning attitude (again) , which we were led to believe was key to the future . And KP is treading on dangerously thin ground. No way these players can instill fear in anyone. unfortunately,
,
We've been impotent all season. The team was shit the way it was and with no breathing room. Not doing anything would have been worse if you're worried about mentality.

[billyfly]

billyfly, I'm just wondering what your connection is to TFC? You had mentioned these imminent signings and press conferences but sadly nothing has come of them. I don't doubt you, just curious is all. I'd rather have some slimmer of hope than nothing at all.

Everything has gone quiet after being told that the major signing would play Wed.

[Phil]

And is it possible what Nelsen implied that O' Dea's $450K wasn't the true number as a chunk was paid down with allocation?

If so, then Mariner is totally fucking ripped. Have another rummy.

The use of allocation can be restrictive, and one of those restrictions is on new contracts. Entirely possible that it was applied in this way.

[PopePouri]

That's madness!

Madness?!!

This is Toronto!!

[Ultra & Proud]

if we get beaten and are totally impotent, KP could permanently damage the core, whatever that is these days.....I feel we've failed to instill a winning attitude (again) , which we were led to believe was key to the future . And KP is treading on dangerously thin ground. No way these players can instill fear in anyone. unfortunately,
,
You're making Silva & O' Dea seem like world beaters. It's not like they were carrying the team while they were here with their one goal and couple assists combined. Pretty sure other teams weren't thinking up strategies to shut them down. In fact we looked just fine (drawing or losing late fine - our 'fine') when Silva was coming off the bench. The biggest problem with either being gone is that Richter will still be starting. We play the way we have been, which we didn't do Saturday, and we'll be more or less the same as we were with Silva & O' Dea (play tight, limit opponent's chances, and have trouble scoring). Until we get some legit attacking options, which we haven't had yet, we will be what we have been so far.

[Ultra & Proud]

Almost a half season gone in an admitted rebuilding year and we're saying the winning attitude of the team is being permanently damaged? Are you familiar with the term rebuild? Don't you think our players know what it means and entails?

[Ivy]

Madness?!!

This is Toronto!!
Lmao thank you.

[jazzy]

You're making Silva & O' Dea seem like world beaters. It's not like they were carrying the team while they were here with their one goal and couple assists combined. Pretty sure other teams weren't thinking up strategies to shut them down. In fact we looked just fine (drawing or losing late fine - our 'fine') when Silva was coming off the bench. The biggest problem with either being gone is that Richter will still be starting. We play the way we have been, which we didn't do Saturday, and we'll be more or less the same as we were with Silva & O' Dea (play tight, limit opponent's chances, and have trouble scoring). Until we get some legit attacking options, which we haven't had yet, we will be what we have been so far.

true enough , just feeling the young guys are going to get lost in this total 2nd string team....it's scary who starts and ridiculous who comes off the bench....we can't score and D leaks.....we have serious lack of bodies....where does the spark come from?...Osorio is one of the few who will never give up.....Laba as well...but goals?...it would be a travesty if NY really piles it on. Columbus as well is a good team

[Ultra & Proud]

true enough , just feeling the young guys are going to get lost in this total 2nd string team....it's scary who starts and ridiculous who comes off the bench....we can't score and D leaks.....we have serious lack of bodies....where does the spark come from?...Osorio is one of the few who will never give up.....Laba as well...but goals?...it would be a travesty if NY really piles it on. Columbus as well is a good team
I just can't call it a second string team when only two players are out and I consider Osorio > Silva and Eck = O' Dea.

Not that any of the four would be of much help in regards to us scoring (well maybe Osorio).

[69Chevy396]

Almost a half season gone in an admitted rebuilding year and we're saying the winning attitude of the team is being permanently damaged? Are you familiar with the term rebuild? Don't you think our players know what it means and entails?
I tend to agree with you much of the time, but would you please refrain from using the term "rebuild". This club never stopped building, like erecting a house on quicksand, they keep changing, adding, subtracting all the time. Saying they are rebuilding implies they had something worthwhile at some point in their recent past. You forget this team has never been good.

[Ultra & Proud]

I tend to agree with you much of the time, but would you please refrain from using the term "rebuild". This club never stopped building, like erecting a house on quicksand, they keep changing, adding, subtracting all the time. Saying they are rebuilding implies they had something worthwhile at some point in their recent past. You forget this team has never been good.
And yet finally they are tearing down some of those pieces on the sinking house and everyone is complaining. You guys should watch Extreme Makeover : Home Edition. Our team is a lot like them shacks these families are stuck living in and the first thing the Makeover team does on the show is demo the house right to the foundation and then rebuild the fucker. That is finally happening here and not all hodgepodge and BS ridden like it was in Winter's summer window or as mind blowingly fucked up as it was in Mariner's.

[gate7]

I'm honestly wondering if there is a back-room power struggle between Lieweke and Payne. It seems that the vision for TFC was clearer before TW was appointed by the MLSE bigwigs. I would think that the board has confidence in KP since they asked for him from MLS, but who knows what kind of egos are involved here.

Perhaps we're looking at the beginning of the end for this cycle?

you are on to something my friend......too many chiefs yet again. we all know how that plays out.

[Ultra & Proud]

All this being said, if no help comes we'll walk out of these next 3 matches with a total max of 4 points if we play a team wide A+ game for 270+ minutes but most likely 2 points tops with 1 point not being out of the question.

And if we still had Silva & O' Dea I would say the exact same thing.

[69Chevy396]

And yet finally they are tearing down some of those pieces on the sinking house and everyone is complaining. You guys should watch Extreme Makeover : Home Edition. Our team is a lot like them shacks these families are stuck living in and the first thing the Makeover team does on the show is demo the house right to the foundation and then rebuild the fucker. That is finally happening here and not all hodgepodge and BS ridden like it was in Winter's summer window or as mind blowingly fucked up as it was in Mariner's.
I don't know about you, but last time I checked a lot of players have been leaving alright, and they have been replaced by, well, nobody. I will reserve my judgement of Payne after, and not before, he signs the five or six players this team lacks.

[Corpand]

Everything has gone quiet after being told that the major signing would play Wed.

Believe me, quiet is good. I heard nothing about starters for tomorrow's game but O'Dea leaving really got things to move along with two players. There should be activity come Friday, but if it's announced this week or beginning of next is a different story. I don't know how the club will reveal.

I firmly believe in what our backroom staff is doing. I remember signings like DeGuz or Gerba. Very clutch, very little thinking done for those moves. I believe the biggest difference of our club now is that they are willing to take calculated risks. I feel there is a longer term plan in place. I just hope Leiweke does not interfere too much with the "rebuild" (fuck I hate that term...) by chasing the easy buck and sacrificing future team integrity for short term reward.

[Phil]

Totally agree even though he seems an upgrade in the middle over Hall, who at $80K is also approaching the ridiculous level.

Hall doesn't count, GA ;) same as Wiedeman.

[gate7]

im sure KP and Co. mean well..but the real issue is that a lot of players might not want to play here.

[Ultra & Proud]

Hall doesn't count, GA ;) same as Wiedeman.
Pretty sure both aren't anymore. That's why we could renegotiate them to lesser contracts.

Hall was GA from 2009 and Wiedeman 2010. Done I believe. They both count on our cap.

[Ultra & Proud]

I don't know about you, but last time I checked a lot of players have been leaving alright, and they have been replaced by, well, nobody. I will reserve my judgement of Payne after, and not before, he signs the five or six players this team lacks.
I don't count expired loanees who never panned out or CBs who were 5th and 6th on the depth chart. We picked up a mid and a defender that will cover their bench spots. Only Silva & O' Dea I count and both moves just happened. But I agree, Payne & Co. can't really be judged until this window ends.

[Phil]

Pretty sure both aren't anymore. That's why we could renegotiate them to lesser contracts.

Hall was GA from 2009 and Wiedeman 2010. Done I believe. They both count on our cap.

well done, I just gathered off of an old interview.

[Ultra & Proud]

well done, I just gathered off of an old interview.
That's really $140K+ that we could probably use differently. Especially when hearing the value for dollars line so frequently these days.

[CBTFC]

So I noticed that in the latest Canadian Press/Sportsnet article they say "A major signing is likely imminent".

Should I (or anyone else) give much weight to that statement?

[backbeat]

So I noticed that in the latest Canadian Press/Sportsnet article they say "A major signing is likely imminent".

Should I (or anyone else) give much weight to that statement?


that line is gonna be the death of me....

[Haddy]

So I noticed that in the latest Canadian Press/Sportsnet article they say "A major signing is likely imminent".

Should I (or anyone else) give much weight to that statement?

Meh. It's like saying, 'a signing might happen and it might not'. Good way for a writer to excite the reader but play it safe.

But based on recent moves, and the fact that we're in a transfer window.....it's still probably the most obvious statement of the year.

[CBTFC]

that line is gonna be the death of me....

Same here. Anyone know who exactly writes the Canadian Press releases? Seeing as the same article always gets picked up by SN/TSN/CBC, etc.

[tfcleeds]

So I noticed that in the latest Canadian Press/Sportsnet article they say "A major signing is likely imminent".

Should I (or anyone else) give much weight to that statement?

In a word, no. At least, I'm not. Not until the press conference is announced, or I see the players actually suiting up for TFC. I fell for that 'imminent' stuff last week.

[CBTFC]

In a word, no. At least, I'm not. Not until the press conference is announced, or I see the players actually suiting up for TFC. I fell for that 'imminent' stuff last week.

Ah, so it's sort of like getting mixed signals from the smokin' hot girl at the office, giving you a glimmer of hope that you may just get a piece of that. But not until you're actually watching her undress at the foot of your bed, it's all just speculation.

[Pint]

Safe to say that nothing will happen today... Maybe tomorrow or Friday but today will be a no news day.

[pdogg]

Meh. It's like saying, 'a signing might happen and it might not'. Good way for a writer to excite the reader but play it safe.

But based on recent moves, and the fact that we're in a transfer window.....it's still probably the most obvious statement of the year.

Makes me think of the teasers on the news.

"Are Toronto FC on the verge of signing new players? The answer might surprise you - stay tuned!"

[ensco]

Ah, so it's sort of like getting mixed signals from the smokin' hot girl at the office, giving you a glimmer of hope that you may just get a piece of that. But not until you're actually watching her undress at the foot of your bed, it's all just speculation.

There are no signals from the girl in this story. Some big shot is telling you that. But you don't know. (Actually there are if the girl is Leiweke. But if the girl is Forlan, you've got nothing.)

Every media report on this so far has the same source: TFC. I am afraid their motives for talking so much about this are not necessarily aligned with "the truth".

Leiweke's interview two days ago made his game plan clear - it's razzle dazzle time in TO. Parade route for the Leafs! Tank for Wiggins! Make the business worth $2billion more than it is today! Talk big! Go big!

Regardless of whether you agree with that, it is a fact that there is absolutely nobody who can speak objectively to the difference between what TFC wants, vs the reality of what the likelihood of this signing (or these signings) actually is. TFC sure isn't going to do that, and may well not know anyway.

When you see a story with a second source, wake me up.

[tfcleeds]

Ah, so it's sort of like getting mixed signals from the smokin' hot girl at the office, giving you a glimmer of hope that you may just get a piece of that. But not until you're actually watching her undress at the foot of your bed, it's all just speculation.

Nice analogy. ;)

[Haddy]

Article from The Star about Leiweke's bullish approach to all three teams. His short-term focus is TFC. Last couple lines of the quote will increase your inpatience ;)

http://www.thestar.com/sports/2013/07/17/mlse_boss_tim_leiweke_already_planning_the_parade_ route_kelly.html?cta=bottom&utm_expid=6682428-0.pmAbpHPsSSS1W5v3cyeVhw.2&utm_referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thestar.com%2F



“We can fix (TFC) quicker than the other two because it’s more free-wheeling. In the NHL, there’s no Stanley Cup that does not come from the draft. You cannot free-agent your way to a Stanley Cup.“MLS is a little different. Much of that roster has to be made up of trades.”

Speaking more generally about the moribund soccer team, Leiweke is ruthless in his assessment of its first seven years.

“We disrespected the fans by not giving the kind of players that teams like New York and L.A. are signing. The fans act like New York and L.A. We acted like . . . well, I’m going to piss somebody off here . . . ” — he almost names the city that pales next to his new home, before thinking better of it — “ . . . like a small-market team.

“We changed the entire league’s opinion of the viability of soccer in North America. And then we blew it because we chickened out. When we could take the big dives, we always found the ‘B’ player. We found guys that we thought, ‘Well, he’s not David Beckham, but he’s awful good.’ No, he’s not. Why not get the ‘A’ guy?”

Off the record, Leiweke names two “A” guys the team is currently pursuing. Both are massively expensive, major international stars.

[Phil]

^^^ that is exactly what he was on about at the RSL game. One of the names starts with F.

hahaha

[Joe Kool]

^^^ They can pursue all they want. Problem is getting anyone to sign for a bottom feeder in MLS like us. They would have to be doing it only for the money and not because they really want to come to Toronto. Whatever....I just want to see us score more than the other team more often....that would be nice for a change. However they want to get that done.

[TOBOR !]

Article from The Star about Leiweke's bullish approach to all three teams. His short-term focus is TFC. Last couple lines of the quote will increase your inpatience ;)

http://www.thestar.com/sports/2013/07/17/mlse_boss_tim_leiweke_already_planning_the_parade_ route_kelly.html?cta=bottom&utm_expid=6682428-0.pmAbpHPsSSS1W5v3cyeVhw.2&utm_referrer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thestar.com%2F

I seem to recall that the Star ran a news story about a mayor of a certain North American city, doing something illegal, captured on video, watched by reputable media members. After much hullabaloo the video never turned up and we're now back to the status quo... but I'm sure this is different.

Hmmm... grains of salt... salty...

[Oldtimer]

I'm glad Nelsen/Payne have the balls to make the hard decisions and get rid of players that are holding us back financially.


I told you guys that this would happen at the start of the season. Only a few believed me. Everyone else thought a few tweaks was all they would do.

I don't know why everyone's so shocked that the "Worst Team in the World" needed to change the roster. I'm also quite surprised that people who have watched cap-restricted sports for years have apparently never before seen the phenomenon of clearing the decks to make cap room before bringing in new blood, even though it happens all the time in all sports. I guess everyone here is just off the boat and has never seen this before. :D

I'm also surprised that people expect a team that was at the bottom the previous year to miraculously turn around before the new blood is brought in.

I said at the start of the season that the same team wouldn't be around start of 2014, that we hadn't seen Payne's team yet. We still haven't, so how come the drama about burning scarves, dropping tickets, etc.? Payne knows how to build a winner, and with ML$E he has truckloads of cash to do it with. Make me even more surprised if we don't have a solid team in another year.

[Ultra & Proud]

I told you guys that this would happen at the start of the season. Only a few believed me. Everyone else thought a few tweaks was all they would do.

I don't know why everyone's so shocked that the "Worst Team in the World" needed to change the roster. I'm also quite surprised that people who have watched cap-restricted sports for years have apparently never before seen the phenomenon of clearing the decks to make cap room before bringing in new blood, even though it happens all the time in all sports. I guess everyone here is just of the boat and has never seen this before. :D

I'm also surprised that people expect a team that was at the bottom the previous year to miraculously turn around before the new blood is brought in.

I said at the start of the season that the same team wouldn't be around start of 2014, that we hadn't seen Payne's team yet. We still haven't, so how come the drama about burning scarves, dropping tickets, etc.? Payne knows how to build a winner, and with ML$E he has truckloads of cash to do it with. Make me even more surprised if we don't have a solid team in another year.
This post should just be stickied at the top or something.