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  1. #1561
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    Beyond the points the biggest factor that should be watched is our defensive shape and how our defense holds up.
    This.

    Defence has to be fixed.

    If it isn't, Bez and Vanney out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobo View Post
    I get where you're coming from but what influence has Vanney had on the makeup of the club that the next coach would have to undo? Aside from the fact he employed very basic 'systems' that a) he kept changing to and from, and b) he didn't implement well, most of the guys brought in during his tenure either:

    a) were not his doing: (Seba, Jozy)
    b) are relative non-issues in varying tactical setups: (Zavaleta, Perquis, Williams - defenders)
    c) don't deserve to/may not stay: (Kantari, Findley, Gomez - the last two of whom seemingly didn't even work in his own systems)

    That leaves who, Cheyrou and Delgado, an aging player with developing fitness issues and your common generic 'versatile' MLS depth?

    Judging from the year-end interviews, I'm willing to bet that there are more players who would benefit from a new coach/system than players who would suffer for it. To say that Vanney has engrained some style of play into the psyches of these players is giving the guy too much credit. Aside from his nephew, I'm pretty sure that with a proper coach, this group could quite easily forget that Vanney ever existed.

    As for waiting for the time to ship Bez out as well, my hope is that he might work better having to answer to a superior who can steer him in the right direction.
    The point is really that new tactics / systems take time to implement. Identifying players to fit a system takes time as well. Van Gaal is saying he needs 3 years at United to get where he wants to go.

    Now this is not the premier league, but I'd still agree with Ensco that an idea of a plug-and-play coach that instantly makes things better is not the case.

  3. #1563
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobo View Post
    what influence has Vanney had on the makeup of the club that the next coach would have to undo?
    It's not that. New manager always equals new players. Every manager has guys he wants, and someone has to go to make room. Often it's someone pretty good that moves on the cheap.

    We have lost a ton of good players for nothing because of regime change (Cronin and Wynne being examples that come to mind, there are many more)

    Listen, it's risk management. I doubt this'll work, and I think Vanney and Bez are gone next year. But I acknolwedge that I may be wrong, and I think it costs so much to make these changes, that there is value and waiting to see if I am "wrong".
    Last edited by ensco; 11-23-2015 at 03:53 PM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  4. #1564
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    It's not that. New manager always equals new players. Every manager has guys he wants, and someone has to go to make room. Often it's someone pretty good that moves on the cheap.

    We have lost a ton of good players for nothing because of regime change (Cronin and Wynne being examples that come to mind, there are many more)

    Listen, it's risk management. I doubt this'll work, and I think Vanney and Bez are gone next year. But I acknolwedge that I may be wrong, and I think it costs so much to make these changes, that there is value and waiting to see if I am "wrong".
    This cannot be understated. In recent years, names like Plata, Silva, Tchani, Frei, Urruti, and Laba are just a few others that come to mind, and the collective return we got was inconsequential.

  5. #1565
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    Chicago Fire hired Veljko Paunovic today as head coach. Won the U-20 WC with Serbia. Apparently they passed on Kreis.



    Starting to think Kreis might still be available next season if things do go sour with us. Sounds like Sigi is staying in Seattle, Curtin staying in Philly, Mastroeni staying in Colorado. I don't think there are any vacancies left.

  6. #1566
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    dont forget the tear that Dero went on after he left us

  7. #1567
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    Something to consider with Kreis is that he's still getting paid by NYCFC. 2 years and $2mil left on that deal.

    Now for TFC that shouldn't be a problem, other clubs definitely. He'll be available for a while IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notthesun View Post
    Chicago Fire hired Veljko Paunovic today as head coach. Won the U-20 WC with Serbia. Apparently they passed on Kreis.



    Starting to think Kreis might still be available next season if things do go sour with us. Sounds like Sigi is staying in Seattle, Curtin staying in Philly, Mastroeni staying in Colorado. I don't think there are any vacancies left.
    Quote Originally Posted by Areathrasher View Post
    Something to consider with Kreis is that he's still getting paid by NYCFC. 2 years and $2mil left on that deal.

    Now for TFC that shouldn't be a problem, other clubs definitely. He'll be available for a while IMO.
    It could even be that there is an "arrangement" with Kreis to take over should Vanney fall on his face.
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    It could even be that there is an "arrangement" with Kreis to take over should Vanney fall on his face.
    "Let me spend some time with my family while getting paid for it, get back to me next summer Bill"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    It could even be that there is an "arrangement" with Kreis to take over should Vanney fall on his face.
    I dunno. Since Kreis interviewed for the Chicago job, (sounds like there was a mutual feeling that it was not a good fit) seems he is eager to get on somewhere sooner rather than later.
    Last edited by Detroit_TFC; 11-24-2015 at 02:39 PM.

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    Or someone of Krei's ilk is still feeling out our organization. Have we really changed from the top down? Our reputation has been dragged through the mud... our own doing. He has the luxury of being paid good money to do nothing so all he has is time. Makes sense.

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    Kreis interviewing with Chicago certainly makes it very clear that he wants to get back to work as soon as possible. So that rules out any deal with us - or that he's doing a "wait and see" type of thing.

    If Vanney fails and gets fired, and Kreis is still available, then it's highly likely that we would see him come here. In terms of stability it would also be a good choice for us. I don't think many of us would object to giving Kreis a full 3 years even if he came here. He's a proven coach, so not much gamble in terms of whether or not he's able to do the job. "Clueless" is what we've had so far with most, if not all, of our coaches, and that's what I want to counter with a proven manager.

    So maybe this is all good news for us? If Vanney works out, then great! If not, then Kreis might be here right away, and great again! Win-win for us I think. The worst scenario would be that Vanney doesn't work out, Kreis is already taken, and we have to go find a coach in late May.

  13. #1573
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    I still think Kreis is going to Seattle. Lagerwey has to be the one waiting in the wings here.

    How would we compete with them? Lagerwey has to be closer to Kreis than anybody. Seattle isn't just playing the DP game, unlike us. They do a lot of things right, there's a lot to work with there. They find excellent non DP internationals, they have a good academy that produces players. They have great ownership.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  14. #1574
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    Sigi Schmid is staying at Seattle, no? He's certainly under contract.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Super View Post
    Sigi Schmid is staying at Seattle, no? He's certainly under contract.
    There were rumblings of Seattle potentially making a change, but Lagerway has publicly backed him in response: http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/s...-be-our-coach/

    For all Seattle's success Schmid has never delivered an MLS Cup Final appearance, and that's the goal for Seattle now. I think Schmid gets one more year there and if they get eliminated before the final again, that's probably it for his time there.

  16. #1576
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    I think Schmid retires after next season. Seattle is about to go into a 2 year rebuilding process with a new DP next season an 2 new DPs in 2017. Not sure he wants to go through all that again for what is likely only a championship push in 2018.

  17. #1577
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    I like Chicagos new coach Paunovic ! And he's foreign . He knows what he's getting into and has superb success with young players , winning under20's with Serbia . I'd be excited if he was our choice but ......we're going to keep muddling along .
    ALL HELL'S BROKEN LOOSEhttp://gfycat.com/SharpKindArrowana

  18. #1578
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    Think he also played here years back

  19. #1579
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ossington Mental Youth View Post
    Think he also played here years back
    CSL? Lots of Balkan dudes seem to have come through the CSL over the last few decades.

  20. #1580
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzy View Post
    I like Chicagos new coach Paunovic ! And he's foreign . He knows what he's getting into and has superb success with young players , winning under20's with Serbia . I'd be excited if he was our choice but ......we're going to keep muddling along .
    Quote Originally Posted by Ossington Mental Youth View Post
    Think he also played here years back
    Played 17 games with Philly back in 2011. That will give him some knowledge of the league so he won't be completely lost like a lot of foreign coaches are.

    Colour me completely unimpressed. My prediction is he won't last more than a year or so, maybe even less.

    He's jumped around a lot over his playing career, that's a bad sign.

    Youth NT coach has little to do with the skill-set needed to run a club, and he has zero experience running a senior side. Plus his contacts being Eastern European doesn't give a lot of potential, we all remember the side that Preki put together. My gut feeling is this guy was available, and they think he has some potential to learn how to coach a senior club side. Sound familiar? If it does you should be an uber Vanney supporter because Vanney's resume is better than this guy having actually coached youth before in two different club settings.
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

  21. #1581
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    IMO Kreis in a position to choose the team, no pressure there, since he is being paid anyway.
    <Speculation>I could imagine TFC negotiating told him to keep dearly beloved Vanney/Bez on staff, which he'd rather not do.</Speculation>
    I still hope Manning would do a mature thing, and get an experienced coach ASAP.
    Last edited by starter; 11-26-2015 at 10:02 AM.

  22. #1582
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Played 17 games with Philly back in 2011. That will give him some knowledge of the league so he won't be completely lost like a lot of foreign coaches are.

    Colour me completely unimpressed. My prediction is he won't last more than a year or so, maybe even less.

    He's jumped around a lot over his playing career, that's a bad sign.

    Youth NT coach has little to do with the skill-set needed to run a club, and he has zero experience running a senior side. Plus his contacts being Eastern European doesn't give a lot of potential, we all remember the side that Preki put together. My gut feeling is this guy was available, and they think he has some potential to learn how to coach a senior club side. Sound familiar? If it does you should be an uber Vanney supporter because Vanney's resume is better than this guy having actually coached youth before in two different club settings.
    Winning at the world cup U20 beating Beazil no less , is a bit more than anything Vanney has accomplished ever coaching . And he has experience on many European leagues won what at the World level . Vanney is ok . I guess that is what we deserve with quite few OK players .
    ALL HELL'S BROKEN LOOSEhttp://gfycat.com/SharpKindArrowana

  23. #1583
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzy View Post
    Winning at the world cup U20 beating Beazil no less , is a bit more than anything Vanney has accomplished ever coaching . And he has experience on many European leagues won what at the World level . Vanney is ok . I guess that is what we deserve with quite few OK players .
    Not bad at all at the youth level, but it's still true he never coached adults or at a club. He might turn out good, but hasn't most of our coaches been a work in progress? Replacing one less experienced coach with the same thing is not an upgrade.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Not bad at all at the youth level, but it's still true he never coached adults or at a club. He might turn out good, but hasn't most of our coaches been a work in progress? Replacing one less experienced coach with the same thing is not an upgrade.
    Ill give you that .....I'm just not sure how long of a snails pace with questionable players and decisions we can be expected to wait . He gets Gomez and basically never uses him , his main substation is defenders or mids . He has forgotten Morgan which would have forwarded the ball and crossed to Gio ......please someone realize Gio is the team and not Bradley ! That is our main problem . We actually play better without Bradley as a team . Vanney for his intelligent view of the game has been out coached many games . So be it . I'm simply so afraid we will be in the same place next year and heaven forbid we have Moore, Findley , etc, overpaid and really would not play as starters on any other team . I love exciting soccer regardless of win or lose . With all the crap we are now getting AND paying for with A$$$s , We better have something happening on the pitch this year or it very well may determine our deserved rep as a franchise . Simply the worst in MLS . I may be wrong but I need a reason to be hopefull .
    ALL HELL'S BROKEN LOOSEhttp://gfycat.com/SharpKindArrowana

  25. #1585
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    Morgan is not better then Morrow and isn't really a LM. (And why would anybody be crossing the ball to Gio?)

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Morgan is not better then Morrow and isn't really a LM. (And why would anybody be crossing the ball to Gio?)
    Morgan is so overlooked for his cost , who crosses more ? He's value ! We need to spend on the CB and work him in even playing Morrow out of position . Gio is always standing in position on the pitch being ignored ? Yes high crosses are not for Gio but crosses can drop in ones area ! Use him that's all . Get him the ball anywhere and he'll do the rest ....Who else ? The only one I see is Alitore when he can pick up his feet and move . Surely not Moore or Findley even Bradley deems himself a better scorer then Gio when he attempts . The main player I see always looking for Gio is Osario and Cheyrou !
    ALL HELL'S BROKEN LOOSEhttp://gfycat.com/SharpKindArrowana

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    vanney.jpg

    Looks like Vanney is sticking around Toronto this winter. My kid sold him skates in a Play It Again Sports yesterday.
    Toronto 'til I die although still a Leeds fan at heart...


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    Quote Originally Posted by andyc View Post
    vanney.jpg

    Looks like Vanney is sticking around Toronto this winter. My kid sold him skates in a Play It Again Sports yesterday.
    OMG, Vanney bought skates, totally means he's staying..... /end sarcasm
    Not like they don't have rinks any where else in the world...

    This post is like saying, I saw him buying groceries, he's gotta be staying...

    It's been made clear that he's staying, just depends on how long until his tactics make him fall flat on his face again.

    Mans gotta eat, man's gotta skate bud.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carter View Post
    OMG, Vanney bought skates, totally means he's staying..... /end sarcasm
    Not like they don't have rinks any where else in the world...

    This post is like saying, I saw him buying groceries, he's gotta be staying...

    It's been made clear that he's staying, just depends on how long until his tactics make him fall flat on his face again.

    Mans gotta eat, man's gotta skate bud.

    Gosh that sounds bitter. I'm wondering how people on here would take the meltdown that is happening in Dallas right now.

  30. #1590
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyc View Post
    vanney.jpg

    Looks like Vanney is sticking around Toronto this winter. My kid sold him skates in a Play It Again Sports yesterday.
    Grade A creeper pic, thank you.

 

 

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