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  1. #1741
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    Just thinking out side the box here - we seem to do OK when dipping into the Jupiter League.

    Why not a Belgian league manager seeking an adventure?

    You can't tell me there are not managers in equivalent leagues also looking for a change.

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    Quote Originally Posted by burlington Red View Post
    Benetiz just recently left Newcastle in PL to manage in China.
    I wasn't aware of that! I stand corrected. Maybe there is the odd top coach who would be interested in coming here then (not necessarily Mourinho).

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    There are lots of managers who go for the dough. Not just Benitez. But they aren’t from England, Spain or Germany.

    Giovinco's Saudi club was managed by Jorge Jesus at the time Seba went there. Jesus is a legend in Portugal, a serious world class manager who is now at Flamengo in Brazil.

    Henk ten Cate had a pretty decent Euro football resume (including Ajax and Panathinaikos) before becoming a manager in the middle east

    Ligue Un is a hotbed of this. The manager at Nantes, Christian Gourcuff, a big name in France, has cycled back and forth between Ligue Un and the Middle East multiple times. Bordeaux's manager, Paulo Sousa, was in China a couple of years ago.

    I think a google search would find 5-10 more managers with interesting Euro resumés that have cycled through the Middle East or China.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    I would give Vanney a full rebuild opportunity.

    Fire the clown Curtis who hasn't a clue on on how world soccer works.

    Edit: Where is the Curtis evaluation thread? He needs to be put under a microscope for that recent all for one video. He hasn't got a clue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    There are lots of managers who go for the dough. Not just Benitez. But they aren’t from England, Spain or Germany.

    Giovinco's Saudi club was managed by Jorge Jesus at the time Seba went there. Jesus is a legend in Portugal, a serious world class manager who is now at Flamengo in Brazil.

    Henk ten Cate had a pretty decent Euro football resume (including Ajax and Panathinaikos) before becoming a manager in the middle east

    Ligue Un is a hotbed of this. The manager at Nantes, Christian Gourcuff, a big name in France, has cycled back and forth between Ligue Un and the Middle East multiple times. Bordeaux's manager, Paulo Sousa, was in China a couple of years ago.

    I think a google search would find 5-10 more managers with interesting Euro resumés that have cycled through the Middle East or China.
    ^Ensco correct yet again.

  6. #1746
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    I would love a Portuguese manager for personal reasons. Why we haven't dipped more into Italian and Portuguese players is nuts to me.

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    Roger Schmidt is a free agent

  8. #1748
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    I would give Vanney a full rebuild opportunity.

    Fire the clown Curtis who hasn't a clue on on how world soccer works.

    Edit: Where is the Curtis evaluation thread? He needs to be put under a microscope for that recent all for one video. He hasn't got a clue.
    I sometimes wonder if Curtis is trying to pull a "Mariner" and get Vanney out so that he can put in his own guy ... he strikes me as someone I wouldn't trust at all. The kind of business person who smiles at you all the while he is planning to rip you off or get you fired.

    The Curtis evaluation thread is here. I was too harsh with Laryea in that thread, he's turned out OK. Re-signing Endoh turned out well, although an obvious move: http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/showthread.php?42375-Ali-Curtis-evaluation-thread
    Last edited by Oldtimer; 08-23-2019 at 08:32 AM.
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

  9. #1749
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    I sometimes wonder if Curtis is trying to pull a "Mariner" and get Vanney out so that he can put in his own guy ... he strikes me as someone I wouldn't trust at all. The kind of business person who smiles at you all the while he is planning to rip you off or get you fired.
    This is possible but I am starting to wonder if Curtis is just there as a more 'on the job and noticable' person of the TFC FO but in reality is just doing whatever Manning tells him to do.

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    But just to Vanney and how he is doing; there are teams right now with far worse rosters and much less continuity performing much better and far more consistently than we have been since early last season. We can talk about Curtis getting him or not getting him the right pieces for his Man City gameplan but his job is to make the best with what he has and he has failed in that regard based on our roster. Our roster isn't Cinci's or Colorado's. It's a decent roster. Arena is doing more with less at NE.

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    Jozy says for the past year and a half it hasn't been good enough and that though the players may be good enough they need to start showing it.

    Take from that what you will. Do or die for Vanney.

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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    Jozy says for the past year and a half it hasn't been good enough and that though the players may be good enough they need to start showing it.

    Take from that what you will. Do or die for Vanney.
    Yeah. It's a win, or he's gone. I don’t think it's right btw, I'd wait until year end.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Yeah. It's a win, or he's gone. I don’t think it's right btw, I'd wait until year end.
    I would rather him see out the year but if we blow this one then either way we're finished. I hated it when we fired Nelson at a similar point and brought in Vanney but in hindsight it did give him a small run to evaluate the players, the training regimens, and overall fitness of the squad. Maybe a bit of a headstart on the following season? Still will most likely be shit for the rest of this season.

  14. #1754
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    This is possible but I am starting to wonder if Curtis is just there as a more 'on the job and noticable' person of the TFC FO but in reality is just doing whatever Manning tells him to do.
    I think it is quite likely he does the background work. But thats it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    I would rather him see out the year but if we blow this one then either way we're finished. I hated it when we fired Nelson at a similar point and brought in Vanney but in hindsight it did give him a small run to evaluate the players, the training regimens, and overall fitness of the squad. Maybe a bit of a headstart on the following season? Still will most likely be shit for the rest of this season.
    Nielson was a special case of incompetence. His training methods betrayed his lack of experience and qualifications. Vanney at least understood how to prepare his team with drills and exercises from his time in the Real Salt Lake academy.

    Vanney’s method of preparation is fine, IMO. Its his attitude toward our academy players and whether his training is from the school of Tom Thibodeau that needs examination.

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    Quote Originally Posted by noimpactinmtl View Post
    Nielson was a special case of incompetence. His training methods betrayed his lack of experience and qualifications. Vanney at least understood how to prepare his team with drills and exercises from his time in the Real Salt Lake academy.

    Vanney’s method of preparation is fine, IMO. Its his attitude toward our academy players and whether his training is from the school of Tom Thibodeau that needs examination.
    I’ve never bought that front office line about Nelsen. He was the Captain of two Premier League teams and of New Zealand, which was undefeated in the World Cup. To suggest that he did not understand training or tactics - especially defensive ones - really doesn’t square with history.

    It also provides an easy out for Vanney et al around training methods. He has demonstrated tactical nous but the vast number of training injuries call someone’s training skills into question.
    Last edited by MightyDM; 08-23-2019 at 08:44 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    I would love a Portuguese manager for personal reasons. Why we haven't dipped more into Italian and Portuguese players is nuts to me.
    Ya, the one Italian we had was such a bust.

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    I don’t think playing and coaching necessarily translate I’m all cases. He was frequently out on the field with the players practicing with them playing as an extra defender. Not what a coach should be doing.

    Hasn’t done much since, I think that tells the story.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    I’ve never bought that front office line about Nelsen. He was the Captain of two Premier League teams and of New Zealand, which was undead eater in the World Cup. To suggest that he did not understand training or tactics - especially defensive ones - really doesn’t square with history.

    It also provides an easy out for Vanney st al around training methods. He has demonstrated tactical nous but the vast number of training injuries call someone’s training skills into question.
    To quote Arrigo Sacchi “I didn’t recall having to be a horse first to become a jockey”

    Just because he captained teams in the past doesn’t mean he’s qualified to coach a team. He had zero experience and zero training as a coach. Preparing a team is more than tactics. As a player, you only partook in drills. You didn’t have to organize drills or workout management.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blizzard View Post
    Ya, the one Italian we had was such a bust.
    Seriously. I get not pursuing guys for marketing purposes but we have to have some sort of sponsorship agreement with AirFrance with the amount of Francophones that have come through here. Like if we can go shopping in France then why aren't we going shopping in Portugal and Italy. The guys would probably adjust better here anyway. The one Italian we had basically still lives here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    Seriously. I get not pursuing guys for marketing purposes but we have to have some sort of sponsorship agreement with AirFrance with the amount of Francophones that have come through here. Like if we can go shopping in France then why aren't we going shopping in Portugal and Italy. The guys would probably adjust better here anyway. The one Italian we had basically still lives here.
    Note that Vanney spent 3 years as a player in Ligue 1 with Bastia (currently down in Ligue 4 due to finance issues). If the player is from the French system, chances are it’s a Vanney connection.

    Mind you, it’s not a bad thing to look at French castoffs when France have one of the best football academy system in the world.

  22. #1762
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I don’t think playing and coaching necessarily translate I’m all cases. He was frequently out on the field with the players practicing with them playing as an extra defender. Not what a coach should be doing.

    Hasn’t done much since, I think that tells the story.
    Perhaps he should not be a coach. But he had to understand modern training methods given where he came from. It’s a management smokescreen to say he didn’t. Basically, he was not Bez’s guy but they had to find some other reasons.

    My worry is that Vanney isn’t Manning’s guy. Certainly isn’t Curtis’s guy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by noimpactinmtl View Post
    To quote Arrigo Sacchi “I didn’t recall having to be a horse first to become a jockey”

    Just because he captained teams in the past doesn’t mean he’s qualified to coach a team. He had zero experience and zero training as a coach. Preparing a team is more than tactics. As a player, you only partook in drills. You didn’t have to organize drills or workout management.
    Fair enough. Hard to transition from player to coach - I did it so I know what you mean. As for Nelsen, I think he was a decent coach - very good at defensive organization - but that’s not the point. The management whispers were that he didn’t train the players properly from a physical perspective because he didn’t know modern training methods, and that has to be BS. As Captain of at least two Premier league teams and of the New Zealand Undefeated team from the World Cup, he had to have personally experienced the highest level training possible. It’s inconceivable that he could not coach that. Tactics, maybe, but training was every day. He knew it intimately and that’s the one thing he would certainly have been able to oversee.

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    Quote Originally Posted by noimpactinmtl View Post
    Note that Vanney spent 3 years as a player in Ligue 1 with Bastia (currently down in Ligue 4 due to finance issues). If the player is from the French system, chances are it’s a Vanney connection.

    Mind you, it’s not a bad thing to look at French castoffs when France have one of the best football academy system in the world.
    Certainly there are worse markets to shop in than France. However, I don't believe it would be outlandish to say we shop there (and from the USMNT) to the exclusion of other markets and that's not good practice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    Perhaps he should not be a coach. But he had to understand modern training methods given where he came from.
    His last manager was Harry Redknapp. The assumption that he had to know based on being in the EPL is just weird in my head given the amount of mangers of that era who were dinosaurs.

    Regardless, this wasn't management speak - it was obvious for all to see that Nelsen was old school "we gotta just get fit".

    E.g. the players didn't wear the sensor bras in practice or games until Vanney came.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    His last manager was Harry Redknapp. The assumption that he had to know based on being in the EPL is just weird in my head given the amount of mangers of that era who were dinosaurs.

    Regardless, this wasn't management speak - it was obvious for all to see that Nelsen was old school "we gotta just get fit".

    E.g. the players didn't wear the sensor bras in practice or games until Vanney came.
    Is there a possibility that our poor results in the second half are lack of fitness? Or are we all sold that it's lack of proper management? Either way....

  27. #1767
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    Quote Originally Posted by Areathrasher View Post
    Roger Schmidt is a free agent
    Underwhelming in the Bundesliga. However did well in Austria. Iono tbh

  28. #1768
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    This is the first time I have seriously wondered about Vanney. Sitting Pozo was a major waste of a critical resource, and nearly cost us. Vanney needing to do that is evidence of some sort of serious problem.

    We have a window here. A lot of key players are older. We need to compete for MLS Cup this year. That is MORE IMPORTANT than Vanney's need to send messages and/or exert control in the room.

    It is almost September, and two of our three most important attacking players have played something like a total of 25 minutes together.

    It is past go time. The best XI needs to go 90 minutes game in and game out now, that has been true for a few weeks. But we sit the TAM guys, then play them without Pozo? That is impossible to explain. If Gallardo can play, he needs to play with Pozo. All the time. Period.

    Winning that game last night (which we were lucky to do, whatever the stats say) was not the only thing, or even the most important thing.

    I am not thrilled by the ambition of lurching into the 6 or 7 spot by eking it out against inferior teams, and maybe stealing a round.

    How the f&$k is this team going to develop the form to go into Atlanta and beat them?
    Last edited by ensco; 08-25-2019 at 10:30 AM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    This is the first time I have seriously wondered about Vanney. Sitting Pozo was a major waste of a critical resource, and nearly cost us. Vanney needing to do that is evidence of some sort of serious problem.

    We have a window here. A lot of key players are older. We need to compete for MLS Cup this year. That is MORE IMPORTANT than Vanney's need to send messages and/or exert control in the room.

    It is almost September, and two of our three most important attacking players have played something like a total of 25 minutes together.

    It is past go time. The best XI needs to go 90 minutes game in and game out now, that has been true for a few weeks. But we sit the TAM guys, then play them without Pozo? That is impossible to explain. If Gallardo can play, he needs to play with Pozo. All the time. Period.

    Winning that game last night (which we were lucky to do, whatever the stats say) was not the only thing, or even the most important thing.

    I am not thrilled by the ambition of lurching into the 6 or 7 spot by eking it out against inferior teams, and maybe stealing a round.

    How the f&$k is this team going to develop the form to go into Atlanta and beat them?
    Pozuelo has not had an off-season since last July and will be playing for at least another month. Vanney’s biggest issue now is figuring out how to fit Benezet-Gallardo-Altidore-Pozuelo-Osorio on the same team without sacrificing balance.

    Bradley can’t singlehandedly anchor a backline anymore, he needs a secondary defensive mid or box to box.

    Vanney using Gallardo-Altidore-Benezet with overlapping fullbacks worked for the first half. Montreal looked listless until Bojan pulled a worldie out of his ass.

  30. #1770
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    Vanney said all along he was going to manage Pozuelo's minutes.

 

 

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