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  1. #121
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    We're in 114 and missed much of the game due to flags. Always nice to sit on a dank school bus for two hours and not be able to see the game. Went down there at halftime to have a polite word with one of the "leaders" and it fell on deaf ears.

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    So he reportedly showered and left BMO before the game was even over according to Neil Davidson.

    Let's hope this doesn't become a distraction
    Actually, Neil Davidson said, "he left before the Journos were allowed into the Change room."

    No where does he say he left before the game was over.

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by khso11 View Post
    He could've subbed Jozy instead, which was playing very poor today. I didn't see that he push down the barriers at the game, saw when I re-watched the game on PVR, ya that was unnecessary.
    I don't think you sub your target man in a situation like that, there is nobody on the bench who is going to replicate the hold up play. Altidore almost scored in the last 5 minutes too, so it isn't as if he didn't provide any threat.

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carter View Post
    Actually, Neil Davidson said, "he left before the Journos were allowed into the Change room."

    No where does he say he left before the game was over.
    Good catch - apologies all for the poor wording of the description.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    Good catch - apologies all for the poor wording of the description.
    Sure, we can safely assume he was pissed, but at the same time, we don't know why he left before interviews could happen.

    there are too many unknown factors to say for certain what happened.

    Currently people are making speculative comments, it kind of reminds me of conspiracy theorists. "The sky is falling and he's moving to China"... grab a brain, he's out and said he loves it here and he isn't going any where.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by GBV View Post
    We're in 114 and missed much of the game due to flags. Always nice to sit on a dank school bus for two hours and not be able to see the game. Went down there at halftime to have a polite word with one of the "leaders" and it fell on deaf ears.
    So you're sticking it out and waiting for change? Good luck.
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Good to see Beitashour come up to the SGs. I'm surprised at how half hearted it was by many others . Look I get people are ticked at giving up the goal but regardless of the result, you thank the fans who cheer so loud.
    It would have been nice had our Italian friend thanked the fans who have stood by him while he's been shite this season. The club needs to show balls here and come down hard on this pathetic childish behaviour. Vanney and Bradley to a lesser extent need to sort this out.

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I don't think you sub your target man in a situation like that, there is nobody on the bench who is going to replicate the hold up play. Altidore almost scored in the last 5 minutes too, so it isn't as if he didn't provide any threat.
    You have a point about target man, but Jozy was pretty off all game. His hold up play was good, but touch otherwise poor and finishing execrable. Work rate low. He should have been subbed earlier just to get some form on the pitch. And some defensive work rate.
    Last edited by MightyDM; 04-22-2017 at 10:50 AM.

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    So you're sticking it out and waiting for change? Good luck.
    Tolerable first two home games. Yesterday couldn't see 40 per cent of the field. All game long. Pathetic the guy didn't care -- jollies from flag hoisting yet a couple hundred season-ticket holders behind you can barely see the game. And he reacted like he couldn't care less.

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carter View Post
    Sure, we can safely assume he was pissed, but at the same time, we don't know why he left before interviews could happen.

    there are too many unknown factors to say for certain what happened.

    Currently people are making speculative comments, it kind of reminds me of conspiracy theorists. "The sky is falling and he's moving to China"... grab a brain, he's out and said he loves it here and he isn't going any where.
    Of course he's gonna say he loves it here...Defoe never dissed the city while he was here and he obviously wasn't a fan.
    No one reacts to a brace and a W like that if all is dandy...Def more to it than wanting to chase the hattrick. I initially thought he had injured himself and that was the reason for the sub and his anger but that obv wasn't it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GBV View Post
    Tolerable first two home games. Yesterday couldn't see 40 per cent of the field. All game long. Pathetic the guy didn't care -- jollies from flag hoisting yet a couple hundred season-ticket holders behind you can barely see the game. And he reacted like he couldn't care less.
    He doesn't. But you knew this already.
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

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    I'm with Giovinco on this. He's had a poor start to the season. You want to build his confidence. You don't do that by subbing him after he scores. Vanney made a mistake there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary10 View Post
    I'm with Giovinco on this. He's had a poor start to the season. You want to build his confidence. You don't do that by subbing him after he scores. Vanney made a mistake there.
    I think I am too. If that is the issue.

    Not sure it is though.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    A couple of thoughts:

    - Although Cheyrou's turnover started the goal against, it was at least the 2nd time in recent games that Zavaleta was ball watching, or getting pulled aside despite being the last defender in front of goal, instead of covering the only reasonable scoring threat in that situation. Accam can beat you easily with speed, but his ball control isn't that great in close. Zavaleta could have made it much more difficult for him. (And Zavaleta isn't the only defender or defensive midfielder who has been ball watching on some of the recent goals against.)

    - I wouldn't write off Cheyrou yet. He hasn't needed to rely on speed in a while. Usually he has amazing ball control and really helps to settle the game, plus putting in same great passes which keep the opposition pinned back. He was the kind of player we needed to help control the game after Vasquez went off. I bet Cheyrou will turn things around and be more careful if he gets another chance. Anyway, isn't this his last year before he goes into coaching?
    Last edited by Auzzy; 04-22-2017 at 06:33 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GBV View Post
    Tolerable first two home games. Yesterday couldn't see 40 per cent of the field. All game long. Pathetic the guy didn't care -- jollies from flag hoisting yet a couple hundred season-ticket holders behind you can barely see the game. And he reacted like he couldn't care less.
    There really isn't much to do but wander over to some other seats.
    They have every right to wave the flags in the south end.
    I agree, it's annoying at times (when play is in front of the south net),
    but they also bring terrific atmosphere as well.
    Try looking into the possibility of moving your tix over a section.

  16. #136
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    ^ Terrific atmosphere can be brought without sight-blocking flags. Or at least wave/hoist them timing-wise with respect to those behind.
    Not sure how many season tickets are opening up in 113 or 115 for all of us to move over.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I think I am too. If that is the issue.

    Not sure it is though.
    Yeah seems there is something deeper.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary10 View Post
    Yeah seems there is something deeper.
    Speculatively speaking, he may be frustrated by what he sees as poor coaching decisions. Like pulling him out during his best game. Plus he has his contract year coming up, so goals are pretty important to the guy, I imagine.

    I genuinely think Vanney is a pretty good coach, but if you're a world-class player, "pretty good" is probably "pretty frustrating" sometimes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Speculatively speaking, he may be frustrated by what he sees as poor coaching decisions. Like pulling him out during his best game. Plus he has his contract year coming up, so goals are pretty important to the guy, I imagine.

    I genuinely think Vanney is a pretty good coach, but if you're a world-class player, "pretty good" is probably "pretty frustrating" sometimes.
    Great point about the contract here, and there could be something in it. If Giovinco has thought about life after this contract, and what possibilities or options could be out there for him if he doesn't resign, then every little decision by the coach, or missed pass or chance by Giovinco himself would be magnified. If he has any aspirations of playing back in Europe, he needs numbers or he won't be paid well to make the move back to Serie A, essentially trapping him here in MLS, or China which seems undesirable. He likely feels enormous pressure to produce, and that could be making him lash out and behave in a seemingly childish manner. His time to showcase himself is running out.
    If it's not the contract, there is something. this is not normal, or healthy for the player, or team. I dont recall any player ever behaving like this before, because he is "just a competitor".

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    ^It happens literally all the time. Footballers are for the most part incredibly petty people.

    All of this armchair psychology does nothing but make a mountain out of a mole hill. Seba's a very competitive guy, we know this. I can see why in the moment he'd be frustrated. I have a hard time seeing how it's possible he'd be angry about it the morning after though. He's an adult and a professional. This will work itself out.

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    Nobody cares about "a moment".

    It's noteworthy if you think it's a pattern.

    If you don't agree that Seba has been sulking, staring, getting overly frustrated at teammates, childish, and otherwise using body language that seems different/angry, fine.

    But that's the conversation.

    I'm torn between (i) wanting to believe that it's just what comes with the territory when the MVP and the team are both off to a slow start, or (ii) the fear that it's something worse.

    I don't know.
    Last edited by ensco; 04-22-2017 at 03:11 PM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Speculatively speaking, he may be frustrated by what he sees as poor coaching decisions. Like pulling him out during his best game. Plus he has his contract year coming up, so goals are pretty important to the guy, I imagine.

    I genuinely think Vanney is a pretty good coach, but if you're a world-class player, "pretty good" is probably "pretty frustrating" sometimes.
    Few years off yet

    MLSsoccer.com: How many more years left on your contract and have there already been talks to extend your stay in Toronto?

    Giovinco: [laughing] Yes, there are still four years left [Giovinco signed a 6-year contract through the end of 2020]. And I think on my part there’s a desire to continue here and I think on their end [TFC], as well.
    http://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2016/1...d-mls-cup-2016

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    My point is is think it's definitely the former^. He's been doing that stuff since his first year. He gets angry and frustrated when things aren't going his way but looks very happy when they are. He does shit like this every season that makes people think he's pulling a Defoe. None of it has actually amounted to anything so I don't know why we keep reacting to this stuff as though this one definitely means something.

    Until we have reason to believe otherwise I don't think it should be treated as something bigger than it is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary10 View Post
    I'm with Giovinco on this. He's had a poor start to the season. You want to build his confidence. You don't do that by subbing him after he scores. Vanney made a mistake there.
    Fully agree. Seba was outstanding in every way. His getting pissed off at Vanney is a good thing. Seba doesn't care about applause (Vanney's dumb explanation), he thrives fron success....and last night was his best game in a year

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I don't think you sub your target man in a situation like that, there is nobody on the bench who is going to replicate the hold up play. Altidore almost scored in the last 5 minutes too, so it isn't as if he didn't provide any threat.
    He should've also scored the sitter from the Seba low cross, but he didn't. Jozy wasn't confident yesterday. From Jozy's injury record and winning 3-0, I'd rather sub him off.
    edit: just saw MightyDM's post earlier, like what he said.
    Last edited by khso11; 04-22-2017 at 04:15 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post

    - Although Cheyrou's turnover started the goal against, it was at least the 2nd time in recent games that Zavaleta was ball watching, or getting pulled aside despite being the last defender in front of goal, instead of covering the only reasonable scoring threat in that situation. Accam can beat you easily with speed, but his ball control isn't that great in close. Zavaleta could have made it much more difficult for him. (And Zavaleta isn't the only defender or defensive midfielder who has been ball on some of the recent goals against.)
    I think he's just used to relying on Moor doing the dirty work. I think after a few more games, he'll learn Hagglunds defensive play and adapt to it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    - I wouldn't write off Cheyrou yet. He hasn't needed to rely on speed in a while. Usually he has amazing ball control and really helps to settle the game, plus putting in same great passes which keep the opposition pinned back. He was the kind of player we needed to help control the game after Vasquez went off. I bet Cheyrou will turn things around and be more careful if he gets another chance. Anyway, isn't this his last year before he goes into coaching?
    This. He's the type of player that can use his technical skills to cover his weaknesses (eg. Pirlo). It was a rare brainfart from him yesterday, but perhaps if he gets more PT, he would gain form and chemistry with the current setup.

  27. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    If you don't agree that Seba has been sulking, staring, getting overly frustrated at teammates, childish, and otherwise using body language that seems different/angry, fine.
    He has done this occasionally, but he's done this occasionally for two years. It hasn't really amounted to anything yet, beyond a super-competitive guy getting passionate or emotional in the moment.

    I'd assume it was exacerbated by the fact that he's gotten off to a terminally slow start, by his standards, and he clearly wanted to stay in.
    “Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens

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    Quote Originally Posted by molenshtain View Post
    My point is is think it's definitely the former^. He's been doing that stuff since his first year. He gets angry and frustrated when things aren't going his way but looks very happy when they are. He does shit like this every season that makes people think he's pulling a Defoe. None of it has actually amounted to anything so I don't know why we keep reacting to this stuff as though this one definitely means something.

    Until we have reason to believe otherwise I don't think it should be treated as something bigger than it is.
    We're the physcho boyfriend/girlfriend

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    Just like every other striker finding his rythem, Gio wanted to stay out there. Bad decision by Vanney which he admitted... Gio will be back with Altidore next week.. Nothing to worry about.. If anyone played striker and u feel a rythem, then get subbed.. I dare you not to be pissed...I'm a striker, and that's just the mentality..

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