TFC v Roma at BMO Aug 7, 2013

[brad]

I'd expect to see a lot more friendlies as the gate revenues drop (either from discounted tickets or from lower overall sales).

That said, the more I think about it, the more I realize I don't think that matters. Even with higher ticket prices and a sold out stadium, I think these friendlies would continue. As supporters, we look at TFC as our team - but tend to forget the reality of things. MLSE are a business, and TFC are a product that MLSE sells. From that perspective, the friendly is an additional opportunity to see that product and make more money. Even if we go back to the days of a sold out stadium and high prices, would you expect a business to say "I have made enough money, and therefore I will turn down this additional opportunity to sell my product and make even more money"? Not very realistic..

It happens at all levels. Big teams get paraded around the world in the off season to make more money. It doesn't help prep them for the season any more than staying close to home. It's a pure cash grab.

[prizby]

Not exactly what you had asked. But yeah, I actually had a good chuckle when I saw your name and question on the little banner there. That's our Prizby!

i do hope you enjoyed that

going to pull out an old 2 stick from last season for tomorrow's game

Folks that are say "no real team would play a mid-season friendly" are off the mark here. Not common, but it does happen. For example -

AC Milan - 2009
Feb 1st - Serie A game against Lazio
Feb 4th - Friendly against Rangers - a number of first team players got significant minutes here.
Feb 7th - Serie A game against Reggina

They also had a couple other friendlies sandwiched in between competitive fixtures that year. I recall seeing other teams do it as well, but don't have time to look.

and when is the next time AC Milan will do this? Thats about as often as TFC should too

Remembr when Celtic and Benfica flew over to play here in Toronto during their regular seasons?

http://www.thestar.com/sports/soccer...bmo_field.html

Imagine going on such a long journey to play a firendly, that would really suck.

was that no during the international break where players were away on international duty and they had no weekend match?

I'd be all for splitting MLS season into an aperatura and a closura and have a break in between for cash grabs

Lets not forget that seasons tickets were cut in half last year.

If you were to ask clear thinking logical me about things....continue with tickets at this price and allow spectacles like friendlies go on in the heat of summer once a year, or pay an inflated price to cover not playing. Its a tough call.

Bayern Munich's cheapest season ticket is $110 for 17 Bundisliga games vs. TFC's $170 for 17 MLS games.

TFC's sponsorships more than cover the MLS salary cap.

As supporters, we look at TFC as our team - but tend to forget the reality of things. MLSE are a business, and TFC are a product that MLSE sells. From that perspective, the friendly is an additional opportunity to see that product and make more money.

see this is the wrong mentality; following the EPL way vs. the Bundisliga way is a theological mistake in my opinion

Mid season friendlies do not really raise the profile of teams. Its a short term money grab, there are always going to be fans who couldn't care less for TFC and use the game as an opportunity to spread their snob mentality.

If you want to raise the awareness and profile of the club you become affiliates, this is all behind the scenes stuff that isn't glamorous.

Does MLSE really need the money? We are not Columbus who may have to play these games to break even. Its embarrassing and makes us look poor from an outsiders perspective.

MLSE should be flexing there muscle and look to play teams over seas, no none in Italy outside Roma supporters will care who they play MLS for preseason. If you want to raise awareness you go into their barn.


Garber wants MLS to be a top flight league, does that vision include the continuance of these friendlies?

i always find it funny when they say these friendlies raise the awareness and profile of the club...I am sure Kevin Payne can list of the teams AS Roma played during their 2008 tour...(i'd be surprised if he could even think of what country they played in without having to look it up)

[Phil]

^^^ Celtic played on August the 30th and played that game on the 2nd. It was during an international break, but still I would say it proves the point that other clubs do this close to and affecting league matches. I would imagine both clubs made money for the game too. Its been going on for some time and most of the MLS clubs do it. I can't see that changing.

I do wish they would choose the timimg better though to mitigate any impact.

I dont doubt much that the sponsorships pay for the salary, but do you have the numbers because I am not aware that its publically disclosed. As a business I expect that they have more expenses than the teams salary cap and all teams like money. Show me one that doesn't.

[brad]

and when is the next time AC Milan will do this? Thats about as often as TFC should too

Every January. After the mid-season break, right before their first fixture in January (different circumstances, but it's still playing a friendly mid-season close to a competitive fixture)

see this is the wrong mentality; following the EPL way vs. the Bundisliga way is a theological mistake in my opinion

I agree completely, but it's a totally different landscape.

[HuTor]

As far as I am concerned I don't give a shit for any meaningless friendly (and all friendlies are 100% meaningless unless the only reason to play them is to test new players, new team formulas, etc), and even if this friendly is in the middle of a busy MLS week for TFC I still don't give a shit - I'm not being angry for the probability that some of our players will be tired for the next MLS game, or getting injured.

Why? Because in this season we already we have zero, zip, nada chances to get into playoffs. Those who think we still have chances for playoffs until we have mathematical chances? (And are many of those on this board)
With all the respect, all these people are either smoking something they should share with everyone, lol... or either are irreparable born dreamers, who will never stand on real ground in life, just in clouds...

And for the same reason I wouldn't care at all even if TFC would have other 2 extra friendlies like this scheduled in this regular MLS season.
I mean what the fuck of damage can these games bring to an already washed away season?

[Haddy]

^^^ Celtic played on August the 30th and played that game on the 2nd. It was during an international break, but still I would say it proves the point that other clubs do this close to and affecting league matches. I would imagine both clubs made money for the game too. Its been going on for some time and most of the MLS clubs do it. I can't see that changing.

For the record, I had a blast at the Celtic v Benfica match. I'm usually in the corner in 119, so to sit right behind the net was remarkable.

Each year I hope the Ex, or whomever, will make this an annual friendly cup at BMO. Be it before or during their domestic seasons. International break meant a few less star players - mostly on Celtic's side - but the tickets weren't astronomical. These are the kind of friendlies I'd pay for no questions asked.

.......okay, maybe not Rangers. Dirty little buggers.

[Fort York Redcoat]

Why? Because in this season we already we have zero, zip, nada chances to get into playoffs. Those who think we still have chances for playoffs until we have mathematical chances? (And are many of those on this board)
With all the respect, all these people are either smoking something they should share with everyone, lol... or either are irreparable born dreamers, who will never stand on real ground in life, just in clouds...

And for the same reason I wouldn't care at all even if TFC would have other 2 extra friendlies like this scheduled in this regular MLS season.
I mean what the fuck of damage can these games bring to an already washed away season?

For someone who's been indirectly accused of making mountains out of molehills for my POV there is a lot of hyperbole going on in here in regards to the number of people thinking this friendly will keep us out of playoffs or contention thereof.

I don't care if it means we're only 6th instead of 7th, it's a marked improvement in the standings and progress.

The number of people holding the tired North American view of

"Trophies or tank it" or in this case, "Playoffs or who cares?"

makes me ill

Enjoy your friendly. Especially if it's all you think is a worthwhile event.

I realize it's where we live and

It's just the way it is.

[Globetrotter]

Society wouldn't have progressed very far if we settled for "it's just the way it is".

Christine Sinclair would be at home scrubbing dishes and raising 8 children if many years back we settled for "it's just the way it is".

[MarkEightThree]

For the record, I had a blast at the Celtic v Benfica match. I'm usually in the corner in 119, so to sit right behind the net was remarkable.

Each year I hope the Ex, or whomever, will make this an annual friendly cup at BMO. Be it before or during their domestic seasons. International break meant a few less star players - mostly on Celtic's side - but the tickets weren't astronomical. These are the kind of friendlies I'd pay for no questions asked.

.......okay, maybe not Rangers. Dirty little buggers.

When they announced they were bringing back the CNE Cup for this match I got excited and thought it would be an annual thing at the Ex, but it was a one and done deal unfortunately. Not sure why, it was a sold-out match and getting into the Ex free with your game ticket was a great deal.

[ensco]

see this is the wrong mentality; following the EPL way vs. the Bundisliga way is a theological mistake in my opinion

Theological mistake?

The world you want doesn't exist. You're going to have to find another universe. Here's a list of in-season Bundeliga friendlies.

http://us.soccerway.com/national/ger...ub-friendlies/

[Richard]

^^^ Those friendlies are from June-July, there are no competitive fixtures as the Bundeliga season is finished. Its essentially an early training camp. Unless im missing something very obvious I don't see how this relates. Nvm. just saw you can flip through the past few months. Don't they have a winter break though? I can see them doing that to keep player match fitness up.

[prizby]

Every January. After the mid-season break, right before their first fixture in January (different circumstances, but it's still playing a friendly mid-season close to a competitive fixture)

they do it during a Christmas break (2 week break); MLS can't take a break for friendlies?

Theological mistake?

The world you want doesn't exist. You're going to have to find another universe. Here's a list of in-season Bundeliga friendlies.

http://us.soccerway.com/national/ger...ub-friendlies/

1. Those are all during the summer; not during the Bundesliga season

2. My point was how we are perceived as a customer of the club; not a 'member' of the club

^^^ Celtic played on August the 30th and played that game on the 2nd. It was during an international break, but still I would say it proves the point that other clubs do this close to and affecting league matches. I would imagine both clubs made money for the game too. Its been going on for some time and most of the MLS clubs do it. I can't see that changing.

I do wish they would choose the timimg better though to mitigate any impact.

I dont doubt much that the sponsorships pay for the salary, but do you have the numbers because I am not aware that its publically disclosed. As a business I expect that they have more expenses than the teams salary cap and all teams like money. Show me one that doesn't.

point was celtic didn't have a game 3 days later; it was more than a week later; plenty of time to recover and still stay focused on their season. They also don't have the issue of playing in a league where any team can win any day of the week.

BMO Field naming rights went for 10 years; $27 million. $2.7 million a year = almost the cap; that is just one sponsorship; wonder what the jersey rights go for; been rumoured to be close to $4 million; even if that is half of it; that is the cap + Koef's dp salary

[Phil]

^^^ They are no different than any other NA buisness and they want increased profitability. Weather that comes from tickets, sponsorships, tv - it really doesn't matter. If they were only concerned with covering salary, why not give the tickets away for free?

It speaks to your point about being as a member of the club vs a customer, but a shift in perception and business practices would be monumental. It would need a real cultral shift in NA sports. Or they can keep chasing the dollar signs like they do in the EPL, I know which one will win in this universe.

Fair enough on your points about the Celtic match but I wanted to counter balance all the claims of other clubs not doing mid season friendlies a bit. As well a trip overseas was pretty major for both teams even on an international break. Those leauges align with FIFA and its dates, our league does not. If the MLS continues on this cycle then this is the only way they will get these types of friendly games and its clear that they want them.

Anyhow, I am going to save my energy for supporting the team tomorrow vs. the internets.

[Ultra & Proud]

Seeing this as the evil ML$E raking money hand over fist is short sighted and too simple. Bottom line is that Garber wants teams to do friendlies. He insists on them and is not happy when teams do not sacrifice their schedules to raise the profile of the league. Since Lieweke is on the MLS honcho committee and agrees with this stance it should be no surprise that even more friendlies are coming. Right or wrong, Garber and the MLS honchos see these high profile friendlies as a way to grow the league by getting some TV and newspaper time in Europe and abroad. That's the big picture. The big picture isn't "Team A" is getting only 3 days rest before the next match. Their big picture is that MLS will be a real world class league in a decade or so. Besides since most teams are doing friendlies at roughly the same part of the season it's an even playing field. Most teams will be dealing with shortened weeks at some point this season and in our case, our schedule is even lessened as we bombed out of the CCL. Complaining about these friendlies is about as useful as me going outside right now to yell at the sky for raining. The rain will still fall and even though I may not see it right now, my inconveniences today will mean that plants and crops will grow and there will be food for tomorrow.

[tfcleeds]

Seeing this as the evil ML$E raking money hand over fist is short sighted and too simple. Bottom line is that Garber wants teams to do friendlies. He insists on them and is not happy when teams do not sacrifice their schedules to raise the profile of the league. Since Lieweke is on the MLS honcho committee and agrees with this stance it should be no surprise that even more friendlies are coming. Right or wrong, Garber and the MLS honchos see these high profile friendlies as a way to grow the league by getting some TV and newspaper time in Europe and abroad. That's the big picture. The big picture isn't "Team A" is getting only 3 days rest before the next match. Their big picture is that MLS will be a real world class league in a decade or so. Besides since most teams are doing friendlies at roughly the same part of the season it's an even playing field. Most teams will be dealing with shortened weeks at some point this season and in our case, our schedule is even lessened as we bombed out of the CCL. Complaining about these friendlies is about as useful as me going outside right now to yell at the sky for raining. The rain will still fall and even though I may not see it right now, my inconveniences today will mean that plants and crops will grow and there will be food for tomorrow.

This is all true, of course. But it would be easier to accept if it weren't for the fact that once again, we will almost certainly be on the outside looking in come playoff time. As someone alluded to earlier, sometimes it just really feels like the FO cares more about arranging these friendlies than it does about building a competitive team in MLS. As though somehow scheduling these matches against marquee names somehow makes up for all the crap we've consistently been served up.

[Ultra & Proud]

This is all true, of course. But it would be easier to accept if it weren't for the fact that once again, we will almost certainly be on the outside looking in come playoff time. As someone alluded to earlier, sometimes it just really feels like the FO cares more about arranging these friendlies than it does about building a competitive team in MLS. As though somehow scheduling these matches against marquee names somehow makes up for all the crap we've consistently been served up.

I can see the more concerned with friendlies than winning point since we never won but I in no way think TFC and MLSE don't want or care to win. They do. They just don't know how to go about doing it.

The main complaint around here is that it adds congestion to our schedule and we may lose matches or take on injuries because of extra meaningless match. Injuries happen and just because O'Brien went down in a friendly on our then shit turf means nothing. Frei had a worse injury on grass during training so shit happens. You live with that. Point is that all teams play them and some play more than one so it's not like TFC is the only one doing it. Also if we look at the past, LA has played more of them than anyone over the past 5 seasons and have the best record over that stretch and the most amount of silverware too.

[bones]

I can see the more concerned with friendlies than winning point since we never won but I in no way think TFC and MLSE don't want or care to win. They do. They just don't know how to go about doing it.

The main complaint around here is that it adds congestion to our schedule and we may lose matches or take on injuries because of extra meaningless match. Injuries happen and just because O'Brien went down in a friendly on our then shit turf means nothing. Frei had a worse injury on grass during training so shit happens. You live with that. Point is that all teams play them and some play more than one so it's not like TFC is the only one doing it. Also if we look at the past, LA has played more of them than anyone over the past 5 seasons and have the best record over that stretch and the most amount of silverware too.

Are you Larson in disguise???

If you think that the intensity of match play, yes even an international friendly, is in any way the same as inter squad training then you are wrong. I have played some fairly significant games in other sports and practice is ALWAYS not the same intensity level as a game. When you play meaningless games against players that are in so called higher level play leagues it motivates you even more. When you increase the intensity you GREATLY increase the risk of injury.

My point, why increase the risk of injury during the regular season. By all means, please have international friendlies, make boat loads of cash, do whatever floats your boat, but DON'T DO IT DURING THE REGULAR SEASON.

[Ultra & Proud]

You just don't get it. This is MLS. You HAVE to do the friendlies and you HAVE to do them in the summer. Garber and the MLS B.O.G insists on them. Pretty much every team does them. You live with it. You see the Liverpool one? It was 3/4 reserves and Academy kids and only them in the second half. Players who never get significant minutes. You think they can't get more out of this than these more relaxed training sessions you speak of? You think these players wouldn't want to play this match because of injury risk? I saw that Liverpool one and you could see our starters treating it like a meaningless friendly. When it was all kids and reserves you could see it was big for them. Whether it was fun for them to actually play in front of a big crowd or to test/prove themselves against stiffer competition, they clearly were into it and wanted to be there. For some of the kids, especially the ones who got cut from the Academy, that will be a big experience for them going forward. Now is it worth paying decent cash to see these players out there against Roma? Not for me but to each their own. As for future friendlies I could care less. I most likely would never go but I won't cry about them happening and wouldn't begrudge anyone who went.

[ElvistheEvilScotsman]

If Garber wants to increase the profile of the league I would suggest getting the best of MLS to take these matches on. TFC is just going to get embarrassed. If we had a great team that could be a giant killer I'd pay to see it. Right now I could give two shits about this match.

[prizby]

You just don't get it. This is MLS. You HAVE to do the friendlies and you HAVE to do them in the summer. Garber and the MLS B.O.G insists on them.

pretty simple solution; fuck off with this march to november calendar season or have an international friendly break.

[brad]

pretty simple solution; fuck off with this march to november calendar season or have an international friendly break.

A lot of rumors floating around that FIFA (with UEFA who are on board) want to move the big European leagues to playing over the summer with the season ending in the winter, and that heat of playing in summer Qatar in 2022 is going to be the big push that they will use to make it happen.

Who know what sort of legs this has, but it wouldn't surprise me with FIFA (nothing would really). Anyway, it would be interesting as it might mean the rest of the world aligns with us :-)

International friendly break makes a lot of sense. It's a pretty narrow window when the Euro clubs are looking for matches.

[nfitz]

A lot of rumors floating around that FIFA (with UEFA who are on board) want to move the big European leagues to playing over the summer with the season ending in the winter, and that heat of playing in summer Qatar in 2022 is going to be the big push that they will use to make it happen.

I've heard comments about a winter break for the 2022 World Cup itself, but until recently, FIFA was trying to push MLS and other leagues to adopt the summer break. When did the go the other way?

As for Roma itself ... I'm on the fence. On one hand, I don't have any interest in Italian football. And I don't think I even recognize a player on their team other than Bradley. I can't really complain about the pricing. $29 doesn't seem unreasonable. Perhaps it will come down to do I really want to show support for bringing a team like Roma here, given their ongoing links to racism and disinterest in dealing with their supporters. If MLS took their respect campaign seriously, they wouldn't be letting teams like this tour North America.

But then again, it will be almost my only chance to see TFC all summer, as I seem to be strategically out-of-town on the rare occasions they are here this year.

[brad]

I've heard comments about a winter break for the 2022 World Cup itself, but until recently, FIFA was trying to push MLS and other leagues to adopt the summer break. When did the go the other way?

I've just heard rumblings through the grapevine - no clue if it is legit, but there is quite a bit of chatter around this overseas. Blatter/Plantini think having the schedule over the summer (better weather) would be better overall.

[Davenport]

A good read. Just how I feel about meaningless friendlies. Never paid to see one....never will.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/b...th-real-madrid

[T-boy]

I've only ever seen one decent friendly in my life (Oxford V Aston Villa back in 1995 or 1996). Outstanding game just before the start of the premier league season. Villa players were clearly out to try and play themselves into the starting 11, Oxford players doing the same. It was no holds barred and a proper football game.

Apart from that, all friendlies I've seen are clearly just that - a friendly kick about, a glorified training or warm up session. The weird thing is, the people who hardly ever go to real football games live, they think its a proper game and all the players are putting in 100% effort. Don't get duped people, this game is nothing more than that training session. Players won't put themselves on the line, don't want to get injured, don't really care!

You wouldn't pay the same price for the Toronto Indy race on the warm up Friday compared to the actual race day - why would people pay a premium price for a friendly football game?! Looking at the prices for the Roma game, its crazy! And the prices for that Bournmouth game?! That's a joke!

[cmonyoureds]

I've only ever seen one decent friendly in my life (Oxford V Aston Villa back in 1995 or 1996). Outstanding game just before the start of the premier league season. Villa players were clearly out to try and play themselves into the starting 11, Oxford players doing the same. It was no holds barred and a proper football game.

Apart from that, all friendlies I've seen are clearly just that - a friendly kick about, a glorified training or warm up session. The weird thing is, the people who hardly ever go to real football games live, they think its a proper game and all the players are putting in 100% effort. Don't get duped people, this game is nothing more than that training session. Players won't put themselves on the line, don't want to get injured, don't really care!

You wouldn't pay the same price for the Toronto Indy race on the warm up Friday compared to the actual race day - why would people pay a premium price for a friendly football game?! Looking at the prices for the Roma game, its crazy! And the prices for that Bournmouth game?! That's a joke!

One might argue that thus far this year every team coming to BMO has had an overpriced training game on their schedule also....

[brad]

I've only ever seen one decent friendly in my life (Oxford V Aston Villa back in 1995 or 1996). Outstanding game just before the start of the premier league season. Villa players were clearly out to try and play themselves into the starting 11, Oxford players doing the same. It was no holds barred and a proper football game.

I saw a Barca - Newcastle freindly at St James park around 2000-2001. Puyol knocked Shearer out in the first couple of minutes (which made it worth the price of admission alone). They didn't let up at each other from there.

But yes, for the most part friendlies are a training match. That said, with good teams, I find it a treat to watch players of that ability in person. Don't get to see it everyday around here.

[Yagbod]

Has anyone bought tickets yet? I'm curious if you get your seasons seat or just buy from a pool.

[SamK]

Has anyone bought tickets yet? I'm curious if you get your seasons seat or just buy from a pool.

Just got mine, they'll be the regular season seats not from a pool.

[T-boy]

I think we get a set amount of time to book our own seat, then it goes into the pool. I haven't looked much though as I won't be going. The prices seemed a little high for this game though after my quick look.