Bill Manning Deathwatch

[wopchop]

The idea whould be to hire a head of the footballing side and that hire would not be by Manning but by the higher ups and it would have to be a can't miss, proven guy that has done it before like a Lagerwey. Then that guy answers to the board directly instead of answering to a boob that is either clueless or absent or in Bill's case, both.

This sounds bizarre. In theory, a GM or Football Director would be running the football operations, but to have them answer to the Board directly is very non typical of any corporate structure.

A normal executive structure would have a Football Director, CFO, Operations Manager (i.e. grounds keeping/stadium ops), Sales/Marketing Director & HR director all reporting to a President/CEO of the Club, who then sits on/reports to the Board of Directors.

[jloome]

This sounds bizarre. In theory, a GM or Football Director would be running the football operations, but to have them answer to the Board directly is very non typical of any corporate structure.

A normal executive structure would have a Football Director, CFO, Operations Manager (i.e. grounds keeping/stadium ops), Sales/Marketing Director & HR director all reporting to a President/CEO of the Club, who then sits on/reports to the Board of Directors.

Which is how it works now. He's a corporate executive. There are large swaths of the corporate executive world whose only real job is "oversight" and "the bottom line." I think as long as the latter was healthy, he didn't really worry about the former.

As I said, though, I've talked to him enough times that my sense is that he was ill-suited to the role initially, as he works mostly off trust relationships, and the American football scene -- and any large organization, let's be honest -- is rife with untrustworthy self-promoters.

My sense has always been that he was naive, not lazy or malicious, and that he sees fixing what he let happen as his entire remit now, basically.

He knows he fucked it all up, he's not happy, he's trying to fix it. I don't know if he can. People can assume it's solely self-protection if they want, but my sense is that he was genuinely humbled by it all -- and not just because he's actually said to several people "this is humbling. This is the worst moment in my professional life."

I think it would be easier for people to view him with less hostility if he came out and said some of this stuff publicly, instead of to a handful of people he already knows and gets along with. But I tend to be naïve about how neurotypical people will react to outreach.

His unwillingness to be open and engage is really hurting that effort. I'd put it down to bad advice, but beyond his relationship with Jason, I'm not sure he's taking any from staff anymore. It hasn't gone so well in the past, and there are -- to my eye -- large numbers of underqualified people at MLSE, including numerous essentially political appointments.

If he's more worried about the internal politics than the quality of information flow and collaboration, the value of staff and how they should be used, he's not going to make it. My sense unfortunately is that that is the case. He wants to fix it, but he's not being nearly aggressive enough in structural reform and renewal.

EDIT: And I did put the "resign out of priciple" question to him. His answer -- which people will take however they want based on existing opinion -- was "I'm the one who fucked this up, I'm the one who should fix it." It wasn't a line, it was very much in the context of "if I don't, I'm going to get fired anyway, so I might as well try."

EDIT2: And for a few people who've either asked or emailed me and said "Do you actually LIKE this person?!?" my answer would be yes, I do. I like Bill Manning as a person. Perhaps if they'd ever had a human conversation with him, they would too. That hasn't prevented me from telling him he's a fuck up who should have been fired.

Would it be good if he pulled it off and we were a good team again? Yes. Am I certain he can do it? Hell no. But I still like the guy personally, and if he pulls it off, I'm not going to emaiil and tell him to quit anyway for being such a fuck up in the past. Having fucked up many things in my life, including some pretty big, important things, I have a degree of empathy for his situation. Not a ton, but a degree.

[FootBallAZ]

Which is how it works now. He's a corporate executive. There are large swaths of the corporate executive world whose only real job is "oversight" and "the bottom line." I think as long as the latter was healthy, he didn't really worry about the former.

As I said, though, I've talked to him enough times that my sense is that he was ill-suited to the role initially, as he works mostly off trust relationships, and the American football scene -- and any large organization, let's be honest -- is rife with untrustworthy self-promoters.

My sense has always been that he was naive, not lazy or malicious, and that he sees fixing what he let happen as his entire remit now, basically.

He knows he fucked it all up, he's not happy, he's trying to fix it. I don't know if he can. People can assume it's solely self-protection if they want, but my sense is that he was genuinely humbled by it all -- and not just because he's actually said to several people "this is humbling. This is the worst moment in my professional life."

I think it would be easier for people to view him with less hostility if he came out and said some of this stuff publicly, instead of to a handful of people he already knows and gets along with. But I tend to be naïve about how neurotypical people will react to outreach.

His unwillingness to be open and engage is really hurting that effort. I'd put it down to bad advice, but beyond his relationship with Jason, I'm not sure he's taking any from staff anymore. It hasn't gone so well in the past, and there are -- to my eye -- large numbers of underqualified people at MLSE, including numerous essentially political appointments.

If he's more worried about the internal politics than the quality of information flow and collaboration, the value of staff and how they should be used, he's not going to make it. My sense unfortunately is that that is the case. He wants to fix it, but he's not being nearly aggressive enough in structural reform and renewal.

EDIT: And I did put the "resign out of priciple" question to him. His answer -- which people will take however they want based on existing opinion -- was "I'm the one who fucked this up, I'm the one who should fix it." It wasn't a line, it was very much in the context of "if I don't, I'm going to get fired anyway, so I might as well try."

EDIT2: And for a few people who've either asked or emailed me and said "Do you actually LIKE this person?!?" my answer would be yes, I do. I like Bill Manning as a person. Perhaps if they'd ever had a human conversation with him, they would too. That hasn't prevented me from telling him he's a fuck up who should have been fired.

Would it be good if he pulled it off and we were a good team again? Yes. Am I certain he can do it? Hell no. But I still like the guy personally, and if he pulls it off, I'm not going to emaiil and tell him to quit anyway for being such a fuck up in the past. Having fucked up many things in my life, including some pretty big, important things, I have a degree of empathy for his situation. Not a ton, but a degree.

being nice never stopped someone being fired before!
making mistakes once or twice - is understandable to feel responsible to correct the mistake and back on track- but a third time is really becoming- amusing.

who in the right mind wouldnt want to fix past mistakes, during their lowest point of their professional career? how many in this world actually get the opportunity to actually stick round - while getting paid a shit tonne.

the saddest part is the amount of politics and people appointed who may not even have any qualifications in the soccer world.


SMH


for my understanding- the supporters are off the fire bill manning wagon because of one win and the hiring of herdman?

[los sonadores]

Which is how it works now. He's a corporate executive. There are large swaths of the corporate executive world whose only real job is "oversight" and "the bottom line." I think as long as the latter was healthy, he didn't really worry about the former.

As I said, though, I've talked to him enough times that my sense is that he was ill-suited to the role initially, as he works mostly off trust relationships, and the American football scene -- and any large organization, let's be honest -- is rife with untrustworthy self-promoters.

My sense has always been that he was naive, not lazy or malicious, and that he sees fixing what he let happen as his entire remit now, basically.

He knows he fucked it all up, he's not happy, he's trying to fix it. I don't know if he can. People can assume it's solely self-protection if they want, but my sense is that he was genuinely humbled by it all -- and not just because he's actually said to several people "this is humbling. This is the worst moment in my professional life."

I think it would be easier for people to view him with less hostility if he came out and said some of this stuff publicly, instead of to a handful of people he already knows and gets along with. But I tend to be naïve about how neurotypical people will react to outreach.

His unwillingness to be open and engage is really hurting that effort. I'd put it down to bad advice, but beyond his relationship with Jason, I'm not sure he's taking any from staff anymore. It hasn't gone so well in the past, and there are -- to my eye -- large numbers of underqualified people at MLSE, including numerous essentially political appointments.

If he's more worried about the internal politics than the quality of information flow and collaboration, the value of staff and how they should be used, he's not going to make it. My sense unfortunately is that that is the case. He wants to fix it, but he's not being nearly aggressive enough in structural reform and renewal.

EDIT: And I did put the "resign out of priciple" question to him. His answer -- which people will take however they want based on existing opinion -- was "I'm the one who fucked this up, I'm the one who should fix it." It wasn't a line, it was very much in the context of "if I don't, I'm going to get fired anyway, so I might as well try."

EDIT2: And for a few people who've either asked or emailed me and said "Do you actually LIKE this person?!?" my answer would be yes, I do. I like Bill Manning as a person. Perhaps if they'd ever had a human conversation with him, they would too. That hasn't prevented me from telling him he's a fuck up who should have been fired.

Would it be good if he pulled it off and we were a good team again? Yes. Am I certain he can do it? Hell no. But I still like the guy personally, and if he pulls it off, I'm not going to emaiil and tell him to quit anyway for being such a fuck up in the past. Having fucked up many things in my life, including some pretty big, important things, I have a degree of empathy for his situation. Not a ton, but a degree.

For what it’s worth (I’ve not met him), he always seems reasonably genuine, open, and trying hard during the many press conferences I’ve seen.

Too many press conferences, of course, it would fewer if he hadn’t fucked up again and again. But I don’t imagine he’s not a good guy. Ingenuous, probably, yes.