Bob Bradley Deathwatch Thread

[jloome]

If you want to know the exact problem with Bob, go look at those passing maps Mr. Inbetween just posted in the New England game thread; they are very telling.

New England's is very simple: run the ball up the wings, particularly the left. Collectively, Dejuan Jones just ran by Bernie, Servania and Laryea all game, as if they weren't even there.

Now look at our passing map. A million ways to go sideways. Look how many types of passes we're trying without even exiting our own end. Zero play through the middle? I'm sorry, that's not great defense, that's tactical foolishness. That's being set up and told to get it to the wings as quickly as possible, and then waiting until the wingers show deep and ARE ALSO TRAPPED IN OUR END.

It's clear; we tried absolutely ZERO diagonal movement in the center of the park and concentrated 100% of our forward movement on the wings. Our midfield passing pattern is literally a rectangle in our end of the pitch.

That's by design. That is a BAD gameplan.

If anyone thinks Coello was overwhelmed, I'll note he was our statistically best player on the day outside of Richie; he just barely saw the ball all day.

Servania or Kaye or the fullbacks got it... and immediately tried to headman it to either insigne or Bernadeschi... even when they had to come back into our half to show for it. At no point did Sapong come back far enough to show for the ball, and at no point did any of the midfielders try to penetrate the attacking third to offer the other two mids a triangle or advance man to pass to between the lines.

We were completely one-dimensional. That's largely why we were spanked. The team's actualy underlying numbers -- we still passed at an 80% clip and had 20 shots -- all showed we had plenty of possession, so we weren't played off the park. We just gave the game up tactically.

I have zero faith in the guy anymore. I know he's had winning teams, but they seem like good alchemy; he got the exact players for his system in LA. Still, even then, he had to leave for them to go all the way.

I think shit like this is why.

I don't trust his judgment in players -- I think the arguments about giving Shaffelburg a chance to start elsewhere are largely bullshit, good teams don't give up good, young depth just to give players opportunities -- and I don't think he is a good tactical coach. Within his system, he does not prep us adequately for the teams we're playing.

We were completely tactically outcoached. That's what that passing map says. No team fails to land a SINGLE diagonal pass into the offensive third unless it's by design. And it was a stupid design.

Literally, the game we'd just won, was predicated on the mids stepping up into the middle third and winning challenges high, and then advancing through the headman, Sapong. But if we have no one IN the middle third, and no one passing to them, because we're immediately going lateral to the wing no matter how deep the ball, how the fuck are we supposed to unbalance their defense?

How do you have transitional goals if the other team can just maintain their defensive positioning in transition? You can't. How do the Italians shed constant double pressure with no central outlet? They can't.

He tried to adjust what we were doing to a new opponent and in doing so, eliminated the things that had made us successful a week earlier.

[JoesphNdo]

I don’t think too many people would be unhappy if, after all the injuries, we were in the top 1/3 of the table. If we got the result last week we would have been. I said that those proposed managers, none of who I think would be a good idea, might get us out of 13th because I don’t think they’d do much more and would not be successful over time. I’d rather see how Bradley does for the first time with his roster, without many key injuries, and adequate time to play together.

Top 33% of the league with the money spent and carte blanche to rip the team apart and start fresh is not success. It may not be an abject failure, but it is definitely not an achievement to be proud of or necessarily a sign that this management team is working. Injuries wouldn't be as much of a problem if we were even semi competent in building a roster.

And the latter point is the biggest (Well one of two biggest issues) we have with Bob. It's less Bob the manager and more Bob the GM. Our roster construction has not been good at all.

[Graeme]

Hmmm...sounds like we could have used MB out there...

[jloome]

Top 33% of the league with the money spent and carte blanche to rip the team apart and start fresh is not success. It may not be an abject failure, but it is definitely not an achievement to be proud of or necessarily a sign that this management team is working. Injuries wouldn't be as much of a problem if we were even semi competent in building a roster.

And the latter point is the biggest (Well one of two biggest issues) we have with Bob. It's less Bob the manager and more Bob the GM. Our roster construction has not been good at all.

No, it's Bob the manager.

Please, if you don't want to read the long screed I understand, as the ideas get going and I post too much.

But seriously, go look at the passing maps from New England, in the New England game thread.

We lost because we were tactically inept. We passed at an 80% clip, and yet the vast majority were in a rectangle within our own end. We attempted essentially zero forward passes through the middle and zero diagonal passes through the middle.

Consequently, all they had to do was double up on the Italians repeatedly. We did nothing centrally to shift their defense. They could literally just drop into a low unit once we were across the half, with zero space created.

It was tactical ineptitude. He made a really bad call about playing solely through the wings.

[JoesphNdo]

No, it's Bob the manager.

Please, if you don't want to read the long screed I understand, as the ideas get going and I post too much.

But seriously, go look at the passing maps from New England, in the New England game thread.

We lost because we were tactically inept. We passed at an 80% clip, and yet the vast majority were in a rectangle within our own end. We attempted essentially zero forward passes through the middle and zero diagonal passes through the middle.

Consequently, all they had to do was double up on the Italians repeatedly. We did nothing centrally to shift their defense. They could literally just drop into a low unit once we were across the half, with zero space created.

It was tactical ineptitude. He made a really bad call about playing solely through the wings.

Yeah I definitely don't disagree, and wouldn't say he's been a great manager but a bad GM. I guess I'm just more willing to give some benefit of the doubt on the management side with his track record and significantly less likely to assume there's a masterplan I can't see on the GM side. But I definitely have some major concerns on the management side, too. Everything you said being one, and the issues with his son that have been discussed to death here, also.

[Oldtimer]

It's less Bob the manager and more Bob the GM. Our roster construction has not been good at all.

The problem is that Bob can construct a roster to match his style if he's 100% in control, he's done it before, however it's unrealistic to think he can have that. If Manning is hiring random Italian stars for marketing purposes, this ties his hands.

For this reason it might be best if BB goes, because while he can win if he gets a team that matches his style, he's not flexible enough to change his style to match the players that he has. Insigne doesn't match his style of play and that's going to mean years where he will be trying to work around someone who should be built around.

[jloome]

The problem is that Bob can construct a roster to meet his style if he's 100% in control, he's done it before. However it's unrealistic to think he can have that. If Manning is hiring random Italian stars for marketing purposes, this ties his hands.

For this reason it might be best if BB goes, because while he can win if he gets a team that meets his style, he's not flexible enough to change his style to match the players that he has. Insigne doesn't match his style of play and that's going to mean years where he will be trying to work around someone who should be built around.

This is, succinctly (which I should learn, but hell, I write books for a living), the entire point.

He is not a tactical coach. He has a set system, the players have to be able to do it. Within that, the adjustments he makes to try to get this group as productive as possible simply don't work and are often not the right call.

[Ultra & Proud]

It was tactical ineptitude. He made a really bad call about playing solely through the wings.

It was this plus either being too stubborn to adapt the gameplan or not even realizing that it needed to be adjusted.

Bob's post match talk about giving up an early goal and then Bruce doing a low block, did they really? They were still were rampaging down the right wing. I think they crowded their box when we had solid offensive possession because that's what everyone should do against us. You now we'll pass it around, waste our own time, and then launch in a prayer cross or let one of the Italians try for a long shot and hope for the best. That plus any Richie marauding is basically our whole offensive strategy.

[JoesphNdo]

The problem is that Bob can construct a roster to match his style if he's 100% in control, he's done it before, however it's unrealistic to think he can have that. If Manning is hiring random Italian stars for marketing purposes, this ties his hands.

For this reason it might be best if BB goes, because while he can win if he gets a team that matches his style, he's not flexible enough to change his style to match the players that he has. Insigne doesn't match his style of play and that's going to mean years where he will be trying to work around someone who should be built around.

For sure that is part of it, 100%. But he's also made glaring errors beyond the DPs. If we are, as he says, up against the cap completely with no room to move with our roster the way it is (No depth whatsoever really, no striker who'd start on any other decent MLS squad, a *very* questionable central mid field even if everyone is fit and not entirely sure what our RB situation is after this summer) then he wears that failure completely even if the DPs maybe weren't his choice

We've traded very poorly, Shaff is a big one as Jloome mentioned. I don't think he's the second coming of Messi, but what he was was a very useful, versatile player at very low cap hit. You *need* players like that on your roster, they are essential in MLS and not finding a way to make it work and convince him to stay is exactly the kind of move that doesn't seem super significant but in the context of MLS salary rules is an example of why our roster is so poorly put together

[Ultra & Proud]

I don't think our roster is as terrible as made out.

Defense is fine. Should even be okay if Richie goes and that might be for the best to allow some more $$$ to use elsewhere. Petretta is a question though.

Forwards needs a little work. Italians are fine. Back ups need work. Sappong is a decent back up for now. The bloat at the 9 position needs to be fixed and we need a real one. Doesn't have to be some huge name "let's sell us some season memberships" kind either. A Buskas or Giakoumakis type would do fine.

Midfield has good pieces. A core of MAK, Coello, & Servania is a fine base. I think we would be better without one of MB & Osorio or both. We should be looking at finding a dynamic, pacey offensive midfielder for balance.

All of which is doable but it's unfortunately based on us trimming some fat or hoping MLS loosens the cap ASAP.

[jloome]

I don't think our roster is as terrible as made out.

Defense is fine. Should even be okay if Richie goes and that might be for the best to allow some more $$$ to use elsewhere. Petretta is a question though.

Forwards needs a little work. Italians are fine. Back ups need work. Sappong is a decent back up for now. The bloat at the 9 position needs to be fixed and we need a real one. Doesn't have to be some huge name "let's sell us some season memberships" kind either. A Buskas or Giakoumakis type would do fine.

Midfield has good pieces. A core of MAK, Coello, & Servania is a fine base. I think we would be better without one of MB & Osorio or both. We should be looking at finding a dynamic, pacey offensive midfielder for balance.

All of which is doable but it's unfortunately based on us trimming some fat or hoping MLS loosens the cap ASAP.

Any number of other managers would be doing much more with what we have.

[OgtheDim]

Give the ball to the Italians working about as well against a low block as 2018 give the ball to Seba did against a low block.

Only one game - I'd like to see the same graphs for the NYC game & the Atlanta games to see if games states changed things.

It does point out the problem with having so many touches but such bad xG.

What those positional charts don't track is speed of ball movement - that is the key to Bradley / Vanney ball and we were crap at it against NER after being much better against NYC.

[Bushmancan]

I don't think our roster is as terrible as made out.

Defense is fine. Should even be okay if Richie goes and that might be for the best to allow some more $$$ to use elsewhere. Petretta is a question though.

Forwards needs a little work. Italians are fine. Back ups need work. Sappong is a decent back up for now. The bloat at the 9 position needs to be fixed and we need a real one. Doesn't have to be some huge name "let's sell us some season memberships" kind either. A Buskas or Giakoumakis type would do fine.

Midfield has good pieces. A core of MAK, Coello, & Servania is a fine base. I think we would be better without one of MB & Osorio or both. We should be looking at finding a dynamic, pacey offensive midfielder for balance.

All of which is doable but it's unfortunately based on us trimming some fat or hoping MLS loosens the cap ASAP.

I would agree, and i would add one small thing. I know we really want our #9 to be able to hold up the ball but the more i see it, we need someone with pace that can keep defences honest. This for MLS might be a unicorn but we need someone that LI and Bernie feel comfortable playing the ball to. IMHO

[SenorDingDong]

I would agree, and i would add one small thing. I know we really want our #9 to be able to hold up the ball but the more i see it, we need someone with pace that can keep defences honest. This for MLS might be a unicorn but we need someone that LI and Bernie feel comfortable playing the ball to. IMHO

Bernie and LI need to be comfortable playing the ball to anyone though. If they decide who is worthy of getting a pass this team will never win.

Insigne I feel like is better at this recently.

[Mr. Inbetween]

The problem is that Bob can construct a roster to match his style if he's 100% in control, he's done it before, however it's unrealistic to think he can have that. If Manning is hiring random Italian stars for marketing purposes, this ties his hands...

For sure that is part of it, 100%. But he's also made glaring errors beyond the DPs…

A 30? player TFC roster - 2 players (Lollo and Fede) = 28 players, accordingly, that BB should then have pragmatic selective control over. And hence, subsequently, 93% of the roster to glaringly error with! For now, I would have to agree with JN’s argument and skepticism about BB’s ability to construct/manage his section of that playground. He has had three transfer windows so far to produce (some) wins; realistically, and unless things turn around, when should the end of that runway be reached? Another one or two more windows?

[Ultra & Proud]

Any number of other managers would be doing much more with what we have.

For sure because there are teams playing much better than we are, with points and goals to show for it, with worse rosters even with our injuries in the league right now. San Jose is one of them. Houston & Vancouver are others.

I am tired of the injury excuse and the time to gel excuse. That's what months of training is for and why they get paid to be professional footballers and pro managers/coaches. Other teams seem to be able to deal with things like injuries or they are able to incorporate new players in quickly without needing months to gel.

[jloome]

What those positional charts don't track is speed of ball movement - that is the key to Bradley / Vanney ball and we were crap at it against NER after being much better against NYC.

True. And again, if you eliminate the entire middle of the field as an option, nothing moves quickly. It was a suicidal approach.

[Ultra & Proud]

True. And again, if you eliminate the entire middle of the field as an option, nothing moves quickly. It was a suicidal approach.

Let's see if that tactic continues or we adjust. And if it continues, for how long it goes until Bob admits defeat and changes it up.

[Oldtimer]

This is, succinctly (which I should learn, but hell, I write books for a living), the entire point.

He is not a tactical coach. He has a set system, the players have to be able to do it. Within that, the adjustments he makes to try to get this group as productive as possible simply don't work and are often not the right call.

That's why I was and am lukewarm with BB. While BB has won stuff, a tactical coach gives you much more possibility and IMO is the direction where teams should be moving as MLS develops.

We had a tactical coach, traded him for a failure, and then brought in someone who is more MLS past than MLS future. It may have felt a "safe bet" at the time to Manning, but we could do better.

[Ultra & Proud]

Bothers me a bit that even Olsen, who I in no way wanted at all, has Houston playing pretty well for what they have there.

I agree we should look towards getting a tactical manager with some fresh ideas in but I have no idea who we could get and I bet Manning has even less of a clue.

[jloome]

Bothers me a bit that even Olsen, who I in no way wanted at all, has Houston playing pretty well for what they have there.

I agree we should look towards getting a tactical manager with some fresh ideas in but I have no idea who we could get and I bet Manning has even less of a clue.

Bring in a guy from the lower leagues in England or Europe, but one who has won repeatedly or gotten teams promoted repeatedly. There are quite a few out there.

They'll have the knowledge of working with restricted budgets, which means they'll have required tactical adaptation to be consistently successful. (Gary Smith in Nashville, for example.)

They're easier to find than world-class guys like Tata, but the ones who win consistently eventually also get chances at higher levels, so they're not THAT easy.

Either way, the search should be underway already, even if they're optimistic about Bob.

Football teams are like famous deaths at newspapers: you need an obituary ready, written usually years before then updated, because you have to react quickly. When they aren't ready, you get situations like Leeds and Southampton, where they've each gone through three managers in one season.

[los sonadores]

I would agree, and i would add one small thing. I know we really want our #9 to be able to hold up the ball but the more i see it, we need someone with pace that can keep defences honest. This for MLS might be a unicorn but we need someone that LI and Bernie feel comfortable playing the ball to. IMHO

That would be Diomande but of course he’s been injured and barely played.

[los sonadores]

That's why I was and am lukewarm with BB. While BB has won stuff, a tactical coach gives you much more possibility and IMO is the direction where teams should be moving as MLS develops.

We had a tactical coach, traded him for a failure, and then brought in someone who is more MLS past than MLS future. It may have felt a "safe bet" at the time to Manning, but we could do better.

For all the many other reasons that have been thought of, I suspect collapsing two roles/two hires into one coach/sporting director also appealed to Manning. It probably means less for him to do in terms of both hiring and general overseeing of things TFC.

[jloome]

For all the many other reasons that have been thought of, I suspect collapsing two roles/two hires into one coach/sporting director also appealed to Manning. It probably means less for him to do in terms of both hiring and general overseeing of things TFC.

I suspect Bob demanded it, that he figures he works best when he can pick and choose his entire lineup. We can see that's the only way his system seems to work. He might have realized that, too, or at the least that he got his best results when involved in player selection.

[Ultra & Proud]

Two minutes to midnight.

Doomsday approaches.

[OgtheDim]

Two minutes to midnight.

Doomsday approaches.

Nah....this game doesn't push the needle that much.

NOW...the beat down One Soccer just did on the midfield play on the two goals & Berna's lack of responsibility? That will get noticed.

[ag futbol]

I think I can say with some confidence that if after all this time we are questioning if Bradley can field a competitive team there is no way in hell he is ever leading anyone to a MLS cup.

[Ultra & Proud]

Nah....this game doesn't push the needle that much.

NOW...the beat down One Soccer just did on the midfield play on the two goals & Berna's lack of responsibility? That will get noticed.

How about after we lose this Saturday?

[portu]

I’m wondering if it’ll take something Armas-esque for BB to get the sack.

We are squarely in fireable territory not sure what more will move the needle during the season beyond an even longer string of bullshit.

[ag futbol]

I’m wondering if it’ll take something Armas-esque for BB to get the sack.

We are squarely in fireable territory not sure what more will move the needle during the season beyond an even longer string of bullshit.

In Chris Armas’s defence, he had a fraction of the budget Bradley has.