Insigne thread.

[los sonadores]

You are probably right; let the rumour mill begin and go into overdrive. I would not be surprised if either or both Lollo and Fede have been given permission to negotiate with another team. Ideally, it could be conditioned upon a no transfer fee (the honey) and a mutual termination of the contract- no $ owing (the catch). Given what has transpired, I would not be surprised that BB has maintained the confidence of BM and/or the MLSE Board in the matter of the revolt.

I’d been thinking before the Kaylyn Kayle news that Bob had this year and more - both if he made the playoffs and even if he didn’t, especially if there are extenuating circumstances (major injuries, for example). Barring an Italian mutiny, that is. We seem to have had the mutiny so I’m guessing now that maybe it depends on the results going forward. Which isn’t bad in the sense that it’s good to have pressure to perform. We had almost no pressure last season and that doesn’t make for winning football.

Another guess: we make the playoffs and it’ll satisfy the board but not the Italians if they are still with us. They really want to win and haven’t come to the bush league to sit near the bottom of the table.

[Mr. Inbetween]

It was well known enough to be a topic of discussion here as far back as last seasons and a clip of them celebrating doesn't mean anything compared to sourced, backed up reporting. Literally *everything* she has said on Tfc this week has been backed up in an article by the athletic, an article that has multiple sources and is from maybe one of the only credible publications left in sports. Something isn't fake news when you don't like what the message is. What she has said has been backed up at the highest level of credibility that exists for a team like Toronto fc. She is batting 1000 on us this week. I've no idea if she's generally credible, but this consistent attempt to discredit her I've seen elsewhere is...weird. It's downright weird. It's Donald trump "I don't like it therefore it's fake"-esque. She has been fully, 100% backed up with what she's said. Like her or not, she has said nothing that hasn't been sourced and printed by a very credible media outlet.

I do not remember it being a topic of discussion here as far back as last season; I do remember mentions related to a blurt about this in a segment involving MSingh from earlier this year though. Numerous clips of Lollo and Fede interacting even celebrating are relevant. A publication’s or writer’s credibility is not a proxy for reliability. I am not suggesting the message of her reporting is fortunate happenstance; it’s opportunism. I do not believe she cares if her source inference is being linked to Richie or follows the advice of Jeff Bradley who I think has slyly trolled her. Nothing she has specifically said has been backed up by that article. Words, the choices of, have meaning; they are the foundation of contract and libel law. Professionally she is a tenant of the wordsmith world. In what literary universe does ‘not get along’ mean ‘hated each other’. Even if one thinks it’s code and equates both phrases while also then accepting a personal issue existed between the two ‘before’ they even got to TFC, where is it stated in the article that that was ‘very well known in the media. That was very well known in Italy, with the national team, they did not get on’?

Agree, something isn't fake news when you don't like what the message is. However, something may be considered fake journalism if statements can and do fit within the parameters of such criteria. In my opinion her reporting is often weak in newsworthiness, investigation, featurability, opinion and analysis. I think she enjoys walking late into a theater to pour gasoline on fire while screaming to everyone it’s out of control. Example, her assertion massive corporations wanting to give all their money to CWNT that went nowhere. Some even consider her Alexi Lalas-esque. Maybe its just weird thinking it’s weird to equate calling someone out with discrediting them; a distinction with a difference. To introduce Trump into the discussion just murks the conversation.

Experience has taught me to subscribed to Knoll’s law of media accuracy. IIUC, you yourself believe some in the profession ‘aren't media, they're an extension of the party line’. Others in this Forum have even expressed concerns about TBogerts past reporting as such. These outlets/media mediums are not scholarly publications. The Athletic itself was a distressed asset just bought out last year by the NYT. Again, would it be a great leap to think journalistic standards are usually the first to be tested or suffer in such ordeals. Great reporting can be sensational. Yet, into today’s economic landscape sensationalism still baits/drives the most clicks and purchases/subscriptions. I think the fight against shortcuts or compromise is the prevailing reality that many in that profession have to deal with while trying to earn a living.

[jloome]

I do not remember it being a topic of discussion here as far back as last season; I do remember mentions related to a blurt about this in a segment involving MSingh from earlier this year though. Numerous clips of Lollo and Fede interacting even celebrating are relevant. A publication’s or writer’s credibility is not a proxy for reliability. I am not suggesting the message of her reporting is fortunate happenstance; it’s opportunism. I do not believe she cares if her source inference is being linked to Richie or follows the advice of Jeff Bradley who I think has slyly trolled her. Nothing she has specifically said has been backed up by that article. Words, the choices of, have meaning; they are the foundation of contract and libel law. Professionally she is a tenant of the wordsmith world. In what literary universe does ‘not get along’ mean ‘hated each other’. Even if one thinks it’s code and equates both phrases while also then accepting a personal issue existed between the two ‘before’ they even got to TFC, where is it stated in the article that that was ‘very well known in the media. That was very well known in Italy, with the national team, they did not get on’?

Agree, something isn't fake news when you don't like what the message is. However, something may be considered fake journalism if statements can and do fit within the parameters of such criteria. In my opinion her reporting is often weak in newsworthiness, investigation, featurability, opinion and analysis. I think she enjoys walking late into a theater to pour gasoline on fire while screaming to everyone it’s out of control. Example, her assertion massive corporations wanting to give all their money to CWNT that went nowhere. Some even consider her Alexi Lalas-esque. Maybe its just weird thinking it’s weird to equate calling someone out with discrediting them; a distinction with a difference. To introduce Trump into the discussion just murks the conversation.

Experience has taught me to subscribed to Knoll’s law of media accuracy. IIUC, you yourself believe some in the profession ‘aren't media, they're an extension of the party line’. Others in this Forum have even expressed concerns about TBogerts past reporting as such. These outlets/media mediums are not scholarly publications. The Athletic itself was a distressed asset just bought out last year by the NYT. Again, would it be a great leap to think journalistic standards are usually the first to be tested or suffer in such ordeals. Great reporting can be sensational. Yet, into today’s economic landscape sensationalism still baits/drives the most clicks and purchases/subscriptions. I think the fight against shortcuts or compromise is the prevailing reality that many in that profession have to deal with while trying to earn a living.

Yeah, just said something similar in the Bob thread, although more from a working perspective.

I think the fight against shortcuts or compromise is the prevailing reality that many in that profession have to deal with while trying to earn a living.

​ I'd add to this that a great many journalists have been hired in the years since standards began to seriously drop, which wasn't long after 9/11. So they've never had to work to tougher standards. And many of the remaining veterans were literally those who'd stay and write whatever told, just because they wanted to keep the job.

[ag futbol]

I do not remember it being a topic of discussion here as far back as last season; I do remember mentions related to a blurt about this in a segment involving MSingh from earlier this year though. Numerous clips of Lollo and Fede interacting even celebrating are relevant. A publication’s or writer’s credibility is not a proxy for reliability.

Ah yes, the sacred locker room bond. Always real, never done for the sake of public appearances, or strangely compartmentalized when there is conflict elsewhere in the relationship. What you see is what you get!

I’ve included some classic relationships in sports below in the spirit of friendship. Hooray for camaraderie!

[Mr. Inbetween]

You missed the most obvious and easy one...

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/texsaspost/status/1132132944003444736

[ag futbol]

You missed the most obvious and easy one...

There were just too many too list

[Mr. Inbetween]

^^^

Ah yes, the sacred locker room bond. Always real, never done for the sake of public appearances, or strangely compartmentalized when there is conflict elsewhere in the relationship. What you see is what you get! I’ve included some classic relationships in sports below in the spirit of friendship. Hooray for camaraderie!

Also, <EDIT: missed this at first glance, brain-fart on my part>, according to those pics selected as examples, are you implying one of the Italians had an affair with the other's wife?

[ag futbol]

^^^



Also, brain fart, according to those pics selected as examples, are you implying one of the Italians had an affair with the other's wife?

No, just that things aren’t always what they appear and people can be excessively fake or celebrate in a moment but not give up their grievances.

By all accounts, it sounded like coming in the Italians weren’t exactly close (but that’s different from being in conflict). Perhaps they are closing now finding themselves on this adventure together?

[Mr. Inbetween]

^
I do not fundamentally disagree with what you and others as well have suggested. It may also just be the opposite of what you state. The Italians grew apart after arriving. Fede may have wanted more, either salary, official recognition or exposure, given how, with his likeable personality, he sort of became the defacto face of the franchise. We all know Lollo went through a personal issue during the second half of last season, that then kind of again carried over after the beginning of this season with an injury. However, I think he may have lost a mental edge over Fede that was then compounded by the tragedy his family suffered before that occurrence. Specifically, when he took that penalty kick against NER's Petrovic which was saved. I believe after that he ceded that responsibility to Fede.

[JoesphNdo]

I do not remember it being a topic of discussion here as far back as last season; I do remember mentions related to a blurt about this in a segment involving MSingh from earlier this year though. Numerous clips of Lollo and Fede interacting even celebrating are relevant. A publication’s or writer’s credibility is not a proxy for reliability. I am not suggesting the message of her reporting is fortunate happenstance; it’s opportunism. I do not believe she cares if her source inference is being linked to Richie or follows the advice of Jeff Bradley who I think has slyly trolled her. Nothing she has specifically said has been backed up by that article. Words, the choices of, have meaning; they are the foundation of contract and libel law. Professionally she is a tenant of the wordsmith world. In what literary universe does ‘not get along’ mean ‘hated each other’. Even if one thinks it’s code and equates both phrases while also then accepting a personal issue existed between the two ‘before’ they even got to TFC, where is it stated in the article that that was ‘very well known in the media. That was very well known in Italy, with the national team, they did not get on’?

Agree, something isn't fake news when you don't like what the message is. However, something may be considered fake journalism if statements can and do fit within the parameters of such criteria. In my opinion her reporting is often weak in newsworthiness, investigation, featurability, opinion and analysis. I think she enjoys walking late into a theater to pour gasoline on fire while screaming to everyone it’s out of control. Example, her assertion massive corporations wanting to give all their money to CWNT that went nowhere. Some even consider her Alexi Lalas-esque. Maybe its just weird thinking it’s weird to equate calling someone out with discrediting them; a distinction with a difference. To introduce Trump into the discussion just murks the conversation.

Experience has taught me to subscribed to Knoll’s law of media accuracy. IIUC, you yourself believe some in the profession ‘aren't media, they're an extension of the party line’. Others in this Forum have even expressed concerns about TBogerts past reporting as such. These outlets/media mediums are not scholarly publications. The Athletic itself was a distressed asset just bought out last year by the NYT. Again, would it be a great leap to think journalistic standards are usually the first to be tested or suffer in such ordeals. Great reporting can be sensational. Yet, into today’s economic landscape sensationalism still baits/drives the most clicks and purchases/subscriptions. I think the fight against shortcuts or compromise is the prevailing reality that many in that profession have to deal with while trying to earn a living.

Honestly as I said, I can't speak to her in general. However, in this case, the main facts of what she said (you can argue on wording) was backed up by a sourced article from a credible institution, bar maybe the 'hating each other' part but, as I said, that rumour existed here for over a year so this definitely was one that existed (it may have had no merit, but the rumour existed). The other side I'm sorry, I can't agree pictures or social media posts prove anything. There's numerous examples given here so I won't go more into it, but there's many examples of people who can't stand each other appearing happy and huggy in the public eye

That doesn't make it 100% gospel, everyone has an agenda, I just think calling her national enquirer-esque and fake news for reporting of something that...is pretty much accurate, as best as we can tell, seems personal. In this case, I don't get it. Maybe some of her wording was off and sure, call her on that, but the bones of what she said was pretty much vindicated as best as anyone who isn't in the camp possible could

Nothing is a proxy for 100% reliability, but I'll take an article by known writers backed up by (they say, and I've no reason to doubt) a string of sources on both sides of the fence over random social media posts and context-less pictures. Unfortunately for us, while not 100% reliable, it's the least bad option we have (Bar jloome just calling his people and talking to them!)

My main issue is the way she's been taken to task - mostly elsewhere, btw, not you - over stating things pretty well backed up strikes me as odd given the lack of scrutiny given to things we think are news these days. Makes me wonder if there's more at play there.

[ensco]

At risk of wading into cultural stereotyping, Fede and Lorenzo come from the two very different halves of Italy.

Fede is from the wealthier north, and within that context, his home town, Carrara, is a particularly wealthy part of Italy. Insigne is from the working class south, and withing that context, one of the grittier areas (suburban Naples).

The North-South cultural divide in Italy resembles, but is bigger, I would say, than that between the US Northeast and the Deep South, just to draw a parallel we all know.

Anybody who knows anything about Italy knows that two Italians with those backgrounds are not automatically going to be reflexively friendly with each other, even if they are far from home and the only Italians in the room. My expectation would never have been that they would be instant blood brothers here. Which is fine.

[Mr. Inbetween]

^^
JoesphNdo, appreciate your reply. We have each had the opportunity to opine and rebut on this matter. You do not agree with me, I do not agree with you; that's alright, I think we can agree to disagree. Trusting we are both good to move on.