TFC 2022-2023 player off-season roster discussion

[jloome]

I think we get our U22 and possibly YDP before our primary window closes. There is some benefit in waiting for the Euro window to close, but making a deal in SA while their windows are still open.

Players who were hoping/expecting a Euro move but didn't get one may be more amenable to a move to MLS now.

Given that we can give them a showcase that extends for 24 games plus whatever Can champ and leagues Cup games we play before the next window is an incentive. Given what jhegson Mendez did in less appearances for Chicago last year, it could be quite tempting for the players. The opportunity to play with insigne and bernardeschi type players won't come often. I think this may have been strategic, as these adds are more like icing then cake. We have the cake, now is the time to add the icing. This is a good time to add young players who won't be expected to carry the attacking load, but to provide depth and cover, while showcasing themselves.

That's a good point. It would be great to snag a young attacker in the mold of Jhon Duran, 18/19, shit ton of speed, scores bunches of goals.

[nick.mastro]

Really exited about these signings. I do also have some concerns along with other people who posted this. How fast Can a whole new defensive line with a new goalie who never played together build chemistry ?

Does anyone know of any teams in Europe that has done this in one off season, and the results that followed?

[James17930]

Really exited about these signings. I do also have some concerns along with other people who posted this. How fast Can a whole new defensive line with a new goalie who never played together build chemistry ?

Does anyone know of any teams in Europe that has done this in one off season, and the results that followed?

As someone mentioned before, they still have a whole month of pre-season to go ... they should be fine.

[TFC/Everton]

I think we get our U22 and possibly YDP before our primary window closes. There is some benefit in waiting for the Euro window to close, but making a deal in SA while their windows are still open.

Players who were hoping/expecting a Euro move but didn't get one may be more amenable to a move to MLS now.

Given that we can give them a showcase that extends for 24 games plus whatever Can champ and leagues Cup games we play before the next window is an incentive. Given what jhegson Mendez did in less appearances for Chicago last year, it could be quite tempting for the players. The opportunity to play with insigne and bernardeschi type players won't come often. I think this may have been strategic, as these adds are more like icing then cake. We have the cake, now is the time to add the icing. This is a good time to add young players who won't be expected to carry the attacking load, but to provide depth and cover, while showcasing themselves.

This is a a really good point and also true from a club perspective. A lot of South American teams need to bring in cash from transfers to operate.

However, I am not personally as optimistic that we sign a young DP or any U22 signings during this window. I think we need to start winning before MLSE is going to approve more spending.

I would be happy if we signed 2 more MLS veterans. One in the midfield and one outside back to provide depth.

Then, we sign a young DP and 2 U22s in the summer while we transfer JMR and or Nelson out.

Even if we don't make anymore signings, I must say I feel good about where the roster is at. Can't wait for the season to start.

[MikeForbes]

As someone mentioned before, they still have a whole month of pre-season to go ... they should be fine.

Yes. The biggest question of preseason/early regular season is probably the status of Richie. Is he worth the 700-900k transfer fee (it can be spread over the length of the player's contract) and his 900+k salary? It is gonna be a huge decision from both parties based on his performance.

[ensco]

Cavalini is going to Xolos in Liga MX so strike his name off any potential signing list

Is this why that Xolos v TFC game last week was played behind closed doors? Because it was a tryout for Cavs?

[DavemTFC]

We had a largely brand new defense to start 2016 and the new guys seemed to hit it off pretty quickly. We were in the running for the supporters shield for a while until we faded down the stretch and then regained our form just in time for the playoffs. Granted the pre-2016 defensive makeover was less extreme and more MLS-heavy compared to this year but I'm not so worried about the new players gelling as I am about them living up to their pedigree or getting acclimated to a new league. Which I think by and large they'll do

[portu]

Really exited about these signings. I do also have some concerns along with other people who posted this. How fast Can a whole new defensive line with a new goalie who never played together build chemistry ?

Does anyone know of any teams in Europe that has done this in one off season, and the results that followed?

It’s kind of something that needs to be accepted. It was always going to be better to take the risk of a fresh backline, rather than make incremental changes or keep the existing players after two years of bottom tier defending.

[James17930]

Yes. The biggest question of preseason/early regular season is probably the status of Richie. Is he worth the 700-900k transfer fee (it can be spread over the length of the player's contract) and his 900+k salary? It is gonna be a huge decision from both parties based on his performance.

At this point I would say yes. He's one of (if not the) best fullbacks in the league. I think he's worth it.

Plus remember, all the clubs are getting more money because of the Apple TV deal. I have no doubt we can make it work under the cap.

[Areathrasher]

Is this why that Xolos v TFC game last week was played behind closed doors? Because it was a tryout for Cavs?

Doubt it. Liga MX pundits saying it's cos they can't score for shit

[Hala Hrvatska]

There is nobody on here who so regularly makes it about the poster not the post. OK you started it, let's go there. Who are you really? Who are you connected to, or trying to impress?

I don’t notice who the poster is mostly… but I sure notice you. This is like the 11th time you have done this to me, taken a reasonable comment than wasn’t just blind happiness for what is going on, and started throwing personal insults, making it a character defect. It just happens over and over again, and not just with me.

Most people here are just fans. You are different. You are picking fights, going out of your way to go after people who aren't otherwise engaging with you. You are some sort of vigilante hunting people who don’t tow the team line. You are damn good at this game you are playing too, agreeing with people selectively, building your credibility , you do know football too … but you use all that to just take down people who might negatively influence how the team is perceived. It's a pattern that goes on in a lot of social media. It's a damn shame it has arrived here.

I call bs, you are not just another fan, there is something else going on. You have created more reason to wonder about who you really are, and why you are here, than literally anyone else on here.

I have little doubt what is coming next from you. Whatever. I'll live. I will predict one thing you won’t do - run to a moderator.

For everyone else… My version of a public service announcement. Not looking to engage with this guy or on this topic any further. Take it or leave it.

Well said ensco. And don't worry, your posts are great, keep them coming.

[Derko]

I would like one more signing (a CM who can fill in at both the 8 and 6) in this window and that DP spot (or two u-22 spots) filled in the July window after we see how Jesus, Dio and Ayo perform at striker, how much Bradley has left in the tank and if MAK is closer to his 2019 form or his 2022 display.

The last statement is key for me, I thought it a frivolous signing based on performance last season ( I know there was injury, but when he played seemed a flop to me), I hope he can find his form, I will defer to the masses for comment. Cheers

[Derko]

MacNaughton did score that nice header off of (arguably one of the best in MLS) outside of the foot cross by Berna's in the can championship finals.

I really liked McNaughton, a no nonsense type player you know what you are getting.

[ag futbol]

I really liked McNaughton, a no nonsense type player you know what you are getting.

I like the potential of MacNaughton and could see him fighting to be an occasional starter. Could be a steal if he works out. He did make mistakes last year but I think it’s fair to say he’s trying to adapt to a new level (TBD if he can) and the overall instability of the team did him no favours.

[jloome]

I like the potential of MacNaughton and could see him fighting to be an occasional starter. Could be a steal if he works out. He did make mistakes last year but I think it’s fair to say he’s trying to adapt to a new level (TBD if he can) and the overall instability of the team did him no favours.

Statically he didn't rate that well overall in games but a lot of that seems to have been the subjectivity projected by always losing, because his individual stats across the boards were pretty good. His tackle rate was low, but commonly is for center backs when there's little foot traffic in the box. He was generally good in the air and had several monster games.

Tried to do too much late in the season, and on occasion was isolated too high up the pitch. But given that we saw him as a "can he even play at this level" guy, he did really well. Solid backup and maybe still getting better, as he seems pretty bright.

[Mr. Inbetween]

Statically he didn't rate that well overall in games but a lot of that seems to have been the subjectivity projected by always losing, because his individual stats across the boards were pretty good. His tackle rate was low, but commonly is for center backs when there's little foot traffic in the box. He was generally good in the air and had several monster games. Tried to do too much late in the season, and on occasion was isolated too high up the pitch. But given that we saw him as a "can he even play at this level" guy, he did really well. Solid backup and maybe still getting better, as he seems pretty bright.

Very fair summation of this player's current status.

[Mr. Inbetween]

FWIW, for those, as myself, somewhat concerned about asap team/player gelling, we do have our participation in The Coachella Valley Invitational this preseason to assist. Perhaps a setting that is more challenging, mindset preparatory, than just the typical series of one-off preseason friendlies?

IIUC, 4 matches...
1/ Toronto v Vancouver 08FEB23 @ 4PM
2/ Toronto v LAFC 11FEB23 @ 2PM
3/ Toronto v Portland 15FEB23 @ 5PM
4/ Toronto v LA Galaxy 18FEB @ 10:30AM

[SenorDingDong]

FWIW, for those, as myself, somewhat concerned about asap team/player gelling, we do have our participation in The Coachella Valley Invitational this preseason to assist. Perhaps a setting that is more challenging, mindset preparatory, than just the typical series of one-off preseason friendlies?

IIUC, 4 matches...
1/ Toronto v Vancouver 08FEB23 @ 4PM
2/ Toronto v LAFC 11FEB23 @ 2PM
3/ Toronto v Portland 15FEB23 @ 5PM
4/ Toronto v LA Galaxy 18FEB @ 10:30AM

Both LAFC and LA Galaxy lost one of their best players each this off season so have to imagine their level has dropped slightly.
Either way, this will be more about getting the players to gel together then anything else I feel.

[Joe Kool]

I was just going through the TFC related videos on the new Apple TV service and the Insigne 2023 media day interview was interesting talking very directly about the quality of the squad needs to get better around him and Fede. Good to see he doesn't mind calling it out versus beating around the bush. He also mentioned about not being 100% at all last season so looking forward to a 100% Insigne.

[Mr. Inbetween]

Is this why that Xolos v TFC game last week was played behind closed doors? Because it was a tryout for Cavs?

Maybe? No knowledge, but a possibility. Perhaps even a try-out for both clubs? There were Quebec rumours at the time that trialists were participating. And La Belle Province does seem to have some sort of connect to TFC on goings lately; re.: Bernier and SJ.

From French Canadian source BBN Medias...

Translation... 'Several rumors are circulating at the moment about this match behind closed doors. Toronto could have on board players who have not yet been announced to the public and this is one of the reasons which would have led to this meeting on the sly'.

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/BBNMedias/status/1617429013756010498

[MikeForbes]

Excited to see the training camp list for our February camp. Gotta think there are a couple trialists we didn't know about since none of our journos bother to try and get information on this kind of thing.

[Mr. Inbetween]

Could this footballer be a TFC candidate? Realize.... an AM; not what is needed. Supposedly has a very reasonable contract buy-out clause.

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/mlsnetwork/status/1620895201274499079

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/Mikoaj49172933/status/1621227016832917506

Translation:
'During the matches, they said that Sebastian Kowalczyk (Pogoń Szczecin) has a clause of EUR 400,000 in the contract. A footballer with great potential, especially since Praszelik has crumbled for us.'

[OgtheDim]

In terms of team player turnover, here is a lot of data

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/etmckinley/status/1091390516858638336

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/etmckinley/status/1224718116099244032

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/etmckinley/status/1370364418568110085

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/etmckinley/status/1488545758567567364

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/etmckinley/status/1621209116080234497

[Kiwi10]

In terms of team player turnover, here is a lot of data

Interesting thing that sticks out for TFC is we're either top 3 or bottom 3 for retention every year until this year which is still 5th lowest.

Big purges and then pretty strong commitment to the replacements until the next revamp.

[ensco]

^that is super interesting data.

I would be interested in something that showed what each team's avergae contract term/length was and what payroll was relative to average payroll. I bet, if you graphed it, the correlation would be there.

Thesis is that in our low turnover years, we had very little flex to do much of anything without doing what Bob did, which is set $10-20M on fire in the service of overhauling the roster.

[MikeForbes]

Bogert dropping this.

Check out this tweet at https://twitter.com/tombogert/status/1621301930327785472?s=20&t=GYXgVCutiwdSg3TSgnfPpQ

[ensco]

I remember arguing Oso might be a DP if he had a big World Cup, but I sure never thought this. How does making Oso a DP create cap benefits?

[Ultra & Proud]

I remember arguing Oso might be a DP if he had a big World Cup, but I sure never thought this. How does making Oso a DP create cap benefits?

Since he's an under $1.5M 3rd DP doesn't that equal getting 3 U22s?

Also saves the GAM used to buy down as DPs are the straight league max.

[rydermike]

I remember arguing Oso might be a DP if he had a big World Cup, but I sure never thought this. How does making Oso a DP create cap benefits?

If he's a DP he has a ~600k cap hit and we don't use any TAM on him. Otherwise we'd have to spend about $1 million TAM to buy him down below that DP threshold. With all the TAM players we have (Laryea, MB, Oso, Petrata, Johnson, Jimenez, Hedges) we might not have enough TAM and thus Oso has to be a DP for the cap to work. I speculated this a few days ago (but with using Bradley as a DP when signing Poz was floated).

Could be to sign multi U22 initiative players by having a TAM DP, but I think it might just be we spent too much TAM. I'm thinking Raoul Petratta just happened to become available and they weren't planning on a TAM left back originally and it ate up all the TAM

[leedsandTFC]

Oso being bought a DP means he's making more than MB.