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  1. #1531
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    Quote Originally Posted by rydermike View Post
    With Oso, it would all depend on the term length. I think almost everyone was pleased when we signed Bradley to a TAM deal, but now in the later years of the term, it's getting to be a cap-eating contract. Oso at max TAM, I'd be in favour of, but how many years will he want. It'd probably be okay for years 1 and 2, but would years 3,4,5 become an issue in the future is the question
    it'd become an issue in year 1 unless he magically is fit for an extra 7+ games a season.

  2. #1532
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoesphNdo View Post
    At least, unlikely with Jozy, the opportunity cost with TAM $ is alot lower than a big DP contract so I'm kind of on the fence on this myself and it wouldn't be nearly as disastrous even if it does backfire. Heart says having him play his whole career here would be special, head agrees this isn't the absolute best use of that cap space given injuries. I think it's a middling use of the space, we could do better, but we could do worse (We arguably already are with Bradley) so it's not a slam dunk that we could get an immediately better return it really all comes down to how likely we believe he is to have recurring injury problems going forward.

    Long winded way of saying if he leaves I understand, but if he stays on a high TAM deal my heart would rule my head and not be all that upset even though it likely isn't the absolute best use of those resources
    Good summary.

    A couple of people here are seriously bent by the Oso on max TAM outcome, but who exactly are we getting for equivalent dollars?

    Just to pick an example, we could try for Eryk Williamson (a player that is supposedly available). The Extratime guys think would cost $1.5-2M in GAM plus whatever you would have to pay him when his contract expires (he is on $550K now, it's going up a lot in 2024 I think). He too comes with injury risk.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  3. #1533
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Good summary.

    A couple of people here are seriously bent by the Oso on max TAM outcome, but who exactly are we getting for equivalent dollars?

    Just to pick an example, we could try for Eryk Williamson (a player that is supposedly available). The Extratime guys think would cost $1.5-2M in GAM plus whatever you would have to pay him when his contract expires (he is on $550K now, it's going up a lot in 2024 I think). He too comes with injury risk.
    offering a player who has only been fit to start 57% of games in last two seasons max tam is suicide.

    i seriously wonder if people have been paying attention the last few years when we offered players big contracts based on loyalty and it's killed us.

    and i'm a huge fan of MB, but that contract at that price should have been a year shorter.
    Last edited by leedsandTFC; 11-29-2022 at 01:17 PM.

  4. #1534
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    This is what i was trying to say with GIO's exit, there is serious benefit to being a club legend with MLSE (both Gio & Jozy messed that up). There are benefits long past your playing days... Gio went for bigger short term money in Saudi (probably a long term mistake). There is no way Osorio will make more long term money anywhere than Toronto (perhaps even short term money). The difference for Oso from (Jozy and Gio) is they left acrimoniously and it is unlikely they will be ambassadors of the club. (Agents are short term pay day thinkers)

    Oso depending on how he does this has the opportunity to be set for 10+ years. If he leaves, he must sell it I love Toronto and i will always be a Red but i had to try to see if i was capable in Europe and he can return anytime and that should be the only public reason stated.

    To be honest, that is the only reason he should be allowed to leave as well. Just my opinion.

  5. #1535
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoesphNdo View Post
    At least, unlikely with Jozy, the opportunity cost with TAM $ is alot lower than a big DP contract so I'm kind of on the fence on this myself and it wouldn't be nearly as disastrous even if it does backfire. Heart says having him play his whole career here would be special, head agrees this isn't the absolute best use of that cap space given injuries. I think it's a middling use of the space, we could do better, but we could do worse (We arguably already are with Bradley) so it's not a slam dunk that we could get an immediately better return it really all comes down to how likely we believe he is to have recurring injury problems going forward.

    Long winded way of saying if he leaves I understand, but if he stays on a high TAM deal my heart would rule my head and not be all that upset even though it likely isn't the absolute best use of those resources
    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Good summary...
    See it similarly.
    Second, great rundown of the dilemma.

  6. #1536
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary10 View Post
    Taking a hard line there Leeds!


    Last edited by Mr. Inbetween; 11-29-2022 at 01:43 PM.

  7. #1537
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  8. #1538
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    Quote Originally Posted by leedsandTFC View Post
    it'd become an issue in year 1 unless he magically is fit for an extra 7+ games a season.
    How many games did he miss cause he got concussed/jawed?

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    Quote Originally Posted by leedsandTFC View Post
    offering a player who has only been fit to start 57% of games in last two seasons max tam is suicide.

    i seriously wonder if people have been paying attention the last few years when we offered players big contracts based on loyalty and it's killed us.

    and i'm a huge fan of MB, but that contract at that price should have been a year shorter.
    I think you are making an interesting point, there is risk in giving Oso the bag, sentimality can be dangerous/costly… but I also think you are being way too certain and way too over the top.

    Injury risk isn’t a math exercise. It isn’t quite that obvious that you are right and people on the other side are blind.

    Everybody is entitled to their style I guess.
    Last edited by ensco; 11-29-2022 at 02:34 PM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  10. #1540
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I think you are making an interesting point, there is risk in giving Oso the bag, sentimality can be dangerous/costly… but I also think you are being way too certain and way too over the top.

    Injury risk isn’t a math exercise. It isn’t quite that obvious that you are right and people on the other side are blind.

    Everybody is entitled to their style I guess.
    not blind, just vision being slightly obscured by sentimentality.

    i would love to see oso play out his career here and i think MLS should carve out an extra type of money to be used to extend players that have been around for a certain number of years (club legends).

    but the rules as they are and the way oso's availability has been the past few years, it would hinder us badly.

  11. #1541
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Injury risk isn’t a math exercise. It isn’t quite that obvious that you are right and people on the other side are blind.
    I agree but like as some people have pointed out on this board in the past, injury risk doesn't start dropping once you get into your 30's. At a certain point with the limits MLS roster rules put on teams you kind of need to think pessimistically when offering deals to 30+ players.

  12. #1542
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    I agree but like as some people have pointed out on this board in the past, injury risk doesn't start dropping once you get into your 30's. At a certain point with the limits MLS roster rules put on teams you kind of need to think pessimistically when offering deals to 30+ players.
    Oh it's a real issue for Oso, and anyone his age. I was just saying that the quality guys you could get for similar total dollars, eg Williamson… well he tore his ACL last year. Whoever you might replace Oso with likely comes with injury risk too.

    If I recall correctly Vazquez, when he came here as a 30 year old, had an injury history that was pages long…
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  13. #1543
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Oh it's a real issue for Oso, and anyone his age. I was just saying that the quality guys you could get for similar total dollars, eg Williamson… well he tore his ACL last year. Whoever you might replace Oso with likely comes with injury risk too.

    If I recall correctly Vazquez, when he came here as a 30 year old, had an injury history that was pages long…
    he was also a lot better than oso tbf.

    and it was a risk, that came off. lots don't

  14. #1544
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Oh it's a real issue for Oso, and anyone his age. I was just saying that the quality guys you could get for similar total dollars, eg Williamson… well he tore his ACL last year. Whoever you might replace Oso with likely comes with injury risk too.
    You could probably get a younger player of similar quality & cost from abroad if there was some solid scouting happening. There's also the young money option.

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    I think he had a killer year and I’d be hesitant to be too quick to dismiss him as he seemed to be one of the largest factors in our ability to compete.

    But agree, might be better value out there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I think he had a killer year and I’d be hesitant to be too quick to dismiss him as he seemed to be one of the largest factors in our ability to compete.

    But agree, might be better value out there.
    Not even that, he really wants to go try a different league. If he can do it, good for him. I would like to see him go to a Euro league and get minutes. I just hope he doesn't shoot too high and end up like Richie at NF. I would hate to see him go somewhere and get buried in the reserves for a couple years.

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  18. #1548
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    ^
    If accurate then SJ is a no go/get...
    And Minnesota would have no Keepers after losing TM?



    Except, I guess their new starter...

    Last edited by Mr. Inbetween; 11-29-2022 at 06:24 PM.

  19. #1549
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    0verpayment incoming...probs 750k at least

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    Yeah, I don't buy it. Would be nice, but unless we pay out the nose for him, it makes very little sense for Minnesota. Would rather sign Sean Johnson and save the million+ GAM we would need to surrender for DSC.

  21. #1551
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    yeah, i mean it would malpractice for them not to enquire about the price/ availability of st clair.

    he's one of the best young keepers in the league, plays for the canmnt and is from ontario.

    that being said, you'd think the price would be too high (unless he requests a trade).

    minnesota do need a striker, and have a crafty spanish speaking number 10. wouldn't be shocked if they'd be interested in jiminez.

  22. #1552
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    Guessing we aren't getting a deal done with VV? We haven't heard a peep about this since last week.

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    Quote Originally Posted by reggie View Post
    0verpayment incoming...probs 750k at least
    Yup wouldn't doubt it

  24. #1554
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    Can't imagine Sean Johnson being coached by Conway - can definatley imagine St. Clair being done so & what that would mean by 2025.

  25. #1555
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    Quote Originally Posted by leedsandTFC View Post
    …that being said, you'd think the price would be too high (unless he requests a trade). minnesota do need a striker, and have a crafty spanish speaking number 10. wouldn't be shocked if they'd be interested in jiminez.
    Love JJ.
    But if that is the deal…
    Engage!

  26. #1556
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Inbetween View Post
    Love JJ.
    But if that is the deal…
    Engage!
    disclaimer: i have no inside info, just know that minnesota haven't got a decent striker, have a good number 10, and we have a striker that linked up v well with a number 10.

  27. #1557
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    Understood.
    Should have stated… if that could be the deal…
    Start the jet!

  28. #1558
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeForbes View Post
    Guessing we aren't getting a deal done with VV? We haven't heard a peep about this since last week.
    TFC's been pretty focussed on promoting the three guys on the World Cup team. Could be that they're just waiting on that to finish before announcing stuff, since that's basically where the majority of fans have their focus. No point announcing something if most aren't paying attention. Maybe after Canada's last game, they'll announce it (or when the WC is done)

  29. #1559
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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    Would be a big supporter of Cavallini and Adekugbe starting.
    I agree with this, but doubt Adekugbe will want to leave Europe. Never know of course.Hoping he does start against Morocco.

    As for Cavalini, I don't think he thrived in Vancouver's system, but I agree that he could be like an enforcer of sorts. Having a big body in the box to pick up rebounds from Insigne and Bernadesci and he'll probably bag about 10 goals this season.
    While I hope Akinola gets out of his "funk", I have more faith in Cavalini than Akinola.
    IMO, I thought Cavalini played decently against Croatia (all things considered). Had a few decent runs and passes, didn't step on any skulls (lol) and he's a local boy. If the price is right, why NOT bring him in?
    No reason MLS/MLSE can't give him some sort of sponsorship deal to make it work.

    Would be nice to have Seba come back, but short of him on a fire sale and having him as a "super sub" of sorts, I think that ship has sailed. Maybe sign him for the league minimum and 1 day contract so can finish with TFC, but I could see him pulling a Ric Flair and having multiple "retirement" matches.

    Lastly, Dayne St.Clair? - Hell yeah!
    Doesn't he fall under the generation adidas though?

  30. #1560
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    Quote Originally Posted by rydermike View Post
    TFC's been pretty focussed on promoting the three guys on the World Cup team. Could be that they're just waiting on that to finish before announcing stuff, since that's basically where the majority of fans have their focus. No point announcing something if most aren't paying attention. Maybe after Canada's last game, they'll announce it (or when the WC is done)
    Maybe.
    Still, getting a little antsy.
    Other MLS teams seem to be making ( series of ) rumoured moves/announcements; particularly DCU.
    BTW… on the TFC Ugly Holiday Season Sweater.
    Oso absent.
    Mamah present!
    Last edited by Mr. Inbetween; 11-30-2022 at 01:46 AM.

 

 

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