TFC 2022 player in-season roster discussion

[jloome]

Hey Bushmancan, agree and your right.
Unfortunately... I am not comfortable with what ensued.
Accordingly, I would like to take this opportunity to apologize to any of those whom may care.
I may have been the one who by way of an early morning post inadvertently ignited enough of this mishegoss.
To clarfy, I was trying to comment on and ascertain if there were also character factors that may have contributed to the Pozuelo trade decision.
My intent was in part to also frame a consideration inspired by an earlier post about the occurrence or potential for dressing room cliques.
Whether by seniority, culture, language, personality, performance, talent, etc...
I used 'LatinX', when I should have probably just used 'Spanish language'; my understanding is that Auro is versed in Spanish.
In no way, no how, should that post have eventually lead to any suggestion that the Bradleys are racist.
Com-on, really? They are not!
However, as some are suggesting, in the sense of BBradley's football thinking and play execution being very limited and thereby inflexible.
And only in that narrow way, in a period of team transition, is it discriminatory; hence, others and #PozueloOut!
Still, I get the feeling there is potential that the Bradleys each or they together can be ruthless and even vicious in support of any football agenda.
Thereby, by way of concern and comparison, I remember the respect I held for 'oldschool' Babcock.
Until it was revealed the way he treated the prized asset that was rookie Marner.

That isn’t what started it. What started it was one poster suggesting Bradley had a problem with foreigners and then claiming it was someone else who first said it, specifically in the Seattle game thread. But it was complete fiction, as there is no such comment in the Seattle game thread other than one made by that poster.

Before that it was relatively tame.

The arguments in here don’t stem from difference of opinion over the team. They stem from those of us who are here, day in and out, for years, being offended by the tone and rudeness of two or three posters, who seem unable to either a) stick to facts and opinions about the team, rather than the quality of others posts or b) to only post toxically one-sided diatribes that even he admits, reapeatedly, are over the top.

We’re all adults here. Some seem to value civility and friendliness more than others, is what it comes down to, or at best disagree with them on what that entails.

It’s very hard not to engage with someone who seems to want to just set the room on fire because they like the attention a big blaze will draw.

But that’s what a lot of this feels like.

Anyone who comes into a forum and says: “I don’t like Bob Bradley, I don’t agree with his approach, he’s doing everything wrong” is ABSOLUTELY FINE WITH ME.

Anyone who comes in to a forum and says “Bob Bradley is a clown of a human who is unqualified for his job” is divorced from fact, reality and civility.

Civility, because he insults someone personally whom he does not know;

fact, because the man has coached winning teams all over the globe and won a Supporter’s shield just three seasons ago with LA;

and reality, because it should be apparent from even the quickest review of these boards that most of the posters here are relatively calm, sensible people, and are NEVER going to jump on board the crazy train.

It’s an open forum, I guess, so people can post whatever they want. But I’m not going to engage with diatribes any more. It’s a waste of my time.

[Bushmancan]

Hey Bushmancan, agree and your right.
Unfortunately... I am not comfortable with what ensued.
Accordingly, I would like to take this opportunity to apologize to any of those whom may care.
I may have been the one who by way of an early morning post inadvertently ignited enough of this mishegoss.
To clarfy, I was trying to comment on and ascertain if there were also character factors that may have contributed to the Pozuelo trade decision.
My intent was in part to also frame a consideration inspired by an earlier post about the occurrence or potential for dressing room cliques.
Whether by seniority, culture, language, personality, performance, talent, etc...
I used 'LatinX', when I should have probably just used 'Spanish language'; my understanding is that Auro is versed in Spanish.
In no way, no how, should that post have eventually lead to any suggestion that the Bradleys are racist.
Com-on, really? They are not!
However, as some are suggesting, in the sense of BBradley's football thinking and play execution being very limited and thereby inflexible.
And only in that narrow way, in a period of team transition, is it discriminatory; hence, others and #PozueloOut!
Still, I get the feeling there is potential that the Bradleys each or they together can be ruthless and even vicious in support of any football agenda.
Thereby, by way of concern and comparison, I remember the respect I held for 'oldschool' Babcock.
Until it was revealed the way he treated the prized asset that was rookie Marner.

Thanks and all good.

[Hala Hrvatska]

Guys, any word on if Insigne is ready to go for Saturday?

[Hala Hrvatska]

Hey Bushmancan, agree and your right.
Unfortunately... I am not comfortable with what ensued.
Accordingly, I would like to take this opportunity to apologize to any of those whom may care.
I may have been the one who by way of an early morning post inadvertently ignited enough of this mishegoss.
To clarfy, I was trying to comment on and ascertain if there were also character factors that may have contributed to the Pozuelo trade decision.
My intent was in part to also frame a consideration inspired by an earlier post about the occurrence or potential for dressing room cliques.
Whether by seniority, culture, language, personality, performance, talent, etc...
I used 'LatinX', when I should have probably just used 'Spanish language'; my understanding is that Auro is versed in Spanish.
In no way, no how, should that post have eventually lead to any suggestion that the Bradleys are racist.
Com-on, really? They are not!
However, as some are suggesting, in the sense of BBradley's football thinking and play execution being very limited and thereby inflexible.
And only in that narrow way, in a period of team transition, is it discriminatory; hence, others and #PozueloOut!
Still, I get the feeling there is potential that the Bradleys each or they together can be ruthless and even vicious in support of any football agenda.
Thereby, by way of concern and comparison, I remember the respect I held for 'oldschool' Babcock.
Until it was revealed the way he treated the prized asset that was rookie Marner.

Great post brother and all is good.

Now don't get me started on the Leafs...)))

[tfcfans]

That isn’t what started it. What started it was one poster suggesting Bradley had a problem with foreigners and then claiming it was someone else who first said it, specifically in the Seattle game thread. But it was complete fiction, as there is no such comment in the Seattle game thread other than one made by that poster.

Before that it was relatively tame.

The arguments in here don’t stem from difference of opinion over the team. They stem from those of us who are here, day in and out, for years, being offended by the tone and rudeness of two or three posters, who seem unable to either a) stick to facts and opinions about the team, rather than the quality of others posts or b) to only post toxically one-sided diatribes that even he admits, reapeatedly, are over the top.

We’re all adults here. Some seem to value civility and friendliness more than others, is what it comes down to, or at best disagree with them on what that entails.

It’s very hard not to engage with someone who seems to want to just set the room on fire because they like the attention a big blaze will draw.

But that’s what a lot of this feels like.

Anyone who comes into a forum and says: “I don’t like Bob Bradley, I don’t agree with his approach, he’s doing everything wrong” is ABSOLUTELY FINE WITH ME.

Anyone who comes in to a forum and says “Bob Bradley is a clown of a human who is unqualified for his job” is divorced from fact, reality and civility.

Civility, because he insults someone personally whom he does not know;

fact, because the man has coached winning teams all over the globe and won a Supporter’s shield just three seasons ago with LA;

and reality, because it should be apparent from even the quickest review of these boards that most of the posters here are relatively calm, sensible people, and are NEVER going to jump on board the crazy train.

It’s an open forum, I guess, so people can post whatever they want. But I’m not going to engage with diatribes any more. It’s a waste of my time.

Stop trying to be logical and reasonable and rational here jloome -- that's not why people go on to message boards --- HA HA HA......I'm kidding of course and appreciate your sentiments here wholeheartedly --- let's try to keep this on track towards what we all really want which is success on the field (and hopefully some wise decision making off the field).

Do any of us really know what is going on behind the scenes? Simply put, NO, we have no first hand knowledge of the inner workings of this team -- None of us are in the locker room or the boardroom (or know the intimate details of the players personal lives other than what they choose to share on social media most of the time which is usually a carefully cultivated image) -- we are all just speculating based on hearsay and other such reports on social media and the like - let's not turn on each other here --- some of us have been here a long while (I note the May 2008 beside your name jloome - me too!) - we have seen a lot of crap with this team both on the field and off -- we have survived the "worst team in the world" era, we can survive this too.....let's remember that we are supporters, this is a supporters group, if I'm not mistaken -- that does not mean we cannot criticise or critique management and play on the field (in my opinion being a supporter does not mean blind allegiance) - but it hopefully can remain civil and decent - especially amongst ourselves who I would think would all have the same hope in mind - that this team becomes successful again, and we can all go back to arguing about things like ticket prices and access to playoff tickets....HA HA HA.....

(Side note -- who wants to bet that the push for renewals is coming sooner than ever this year, while they are spending money and not necessarily focusing on results for this season -- LOL)

[Richard]

I know but just lumped them him in as a Spanish speaker...))) and I excluded the Portuguese....though many in South American like in Argentina and Uruguay are in particular Italian dna...). Auro is Brazilian who got dumped as well....Solteldo, Salcedo, Poz, Gonzo, to name a few dumped...all one thing in common, not American or Canadian. Yet we go with kids who have no business being on the team or guys like Bono....

Someone mentioned it perfectly a few days back, the Bradleys and some of their supporters sure do like to blame the "foreigners" for our troubles....and Poz was a "foreigner". He was the LEAST of our concerns.

Fully agreed. Great mods here for sure. Not sure who they all are but I know Oldtimer is one of them and he is great.

Cheers.

Stop trolling. You are the main instigator in contributing to the toxic nonsense occurring in this thread.

[Hala Hrvatska]

Stop trying to be logical and reasonable and rational here jloome -- that's not why people go on to message boards --- HA HA HA......I'm kidding of course and appreciate your sentiments here wholeheartedly --- let's try to keep this on track towards what we all really want which is success on the field (and hopefully some wise decision making off the field).

Do any of us really know what is going on behind the scenes? Simply put, NO, we have no first hand knowledge of the inner workings of this team -- None of us are in the locker room or the boardroom (or know the intimate details of the players personal lives other than what they choose to share on social media most of the time which is usually a carefully cultivated image) -- we are all just speculating based on hearsay and other such reports on social media and the like - let's not turn on each other here --- some of us have been here a long while (I note the May 2008 beside your name jloome - me too!) - we have seen a lot of crap with this team both on the field and off -- we have survived the "worst team in the world" era, we can survive this too.....let's remember that we are supporters, this is a supporters group, if I'm not mistaken -- that does not mean we cannot criticise or critique management and play on the field (in my opinion being a supporter does not mean blind allegiance) - but it hopefully can remain civil and decent - especially amongst ourselves who I would think would all have the same hope in mind - that this team becomes successful again, and we can all go back to arguing about things like ticket prices and access to playoff tickets....HA HA HA.....

(Side note -- who wants to bet that the push for renewals is coming sooner than ever this year, while they are spending money and not necessarily focusing on results for this season -- LOL)

Well said brother. We all want the best for this team, and its to win. Nothing better than heading to BMO on a sunny Saturday and Sunday and watching us win....

My son is a die hard fan as well....have spent a tonne of money over the years on this team...even watched them away while on vacation sometimes....the wife and daughter shopping while me and my son sneak in a game....

Looking forward to Inigne no doubt...

[Bushmancan]

What we all need is a beer together, sorry couldn’t resist! Sign up as a RPB and shout and sing in 112. hahahah

[tfcfans]

What we all need is a beer together, sorry couldn’t resist! Sign up as a RPB and shout and sing in 112. hahahah

What we really need is Joes.....I really think losing Joes hurt the group a lot as it really was our "home" on so many levels....I miss you "Joe" (wherever you are! - LOL).....

[Hala Hrvatska]

What we all need is a beer together, sorry couldn’t resist! Sign up as a RPB and shout and sing in 112. hahahah

Fully agreed...lol

Can't wait for a few nice cold ones Saturday...heading there really early to try and get some pics with Insigne and my son and his buddies.

[reggie]

so no LI until at least the 23rd,playoffs are probs done at this point

cue the trolls

[Bushmancan]

Someone found this on the interweb from 2020

Check out this tweet at [URL]https://twitter.com/sportsnet/status/1291894324880379904?s=21&t=TwppjxkY5Teram4JXXJKrw[/URL]

[FootBallAZ]

[QUOTE=Yuushalinsky;1963380]The only thing I disagree with is that it is 'lazy' to get top players from a top league in the team. Manning's asset management has been nothing short of awful, but the improv works for me as long as we get a functional team and, to some extent, is cleaning up the Curtis asset management. He was supposed to fade into black so Curtis could work his capology but it turns out that Curtis was the real fraud.

Also, I don't think anyone should be making unsubstantiated statements but if it's seen as a personal attack to call someone out on bad behaviour, so be it[/QUOT


when I say lazy I mean in doing the least to get everyone to forget about mis-handling of everything.

For example, Insigne- still is a lazy signing as he was connect via an existing player agent( Seba's) this is how Insgine was on Manning's radar.

Getting Crissitto his best friend isnt an astute signing- it is to appease his prized signing - also lazy

He also floated out the CMNT player- he basically is relying on an italian fan base combined with Canada men's hype to fill the stadium.


His vision is very low level at best - If canada wasn't hosting 2026 -TFC may not have even got Insigne -.

Yes he is smart to ball everything up into a new project that will spill over to 2026's world cup.


my definition of him being lazy.

[Yuushalinsky]

Your definition of lazy is my definition of efficient but potato potahto.

[jloome]

[QUOTE=FootBallAZ;1963418]

The only thing I disagree with is that it is 'lazy' to get top players from a top league in the team. Manning's asset management has been nothing short of awful, but the improv works for me as long as we get a functional team and, to some extent, is cleaning up the Curtis asset management. He was supposed to fade into black so Curtis could work his capology but it turns out that Curtis was the real fraud.

Also, I don't think anyone should be making unsubstantiated statements but if it's seen as a personal attack to call someone out on bad behaviour, so be it[/QUOT


when I say lazy I mean in doing the least to get everyone to forget about mis-handling of everything.

For example, Insigne- still is a lazy signing as he was connect via an existing player agent( Seba's) this is how Insgine was on Manning's radar.

Getting Crissitto his best friend isnt an astute signing- it is to appease his prized signing - also lazy

He also floated out the CMNT player- he basically is relying on an italian fan base combined with Canada men's hype to fill the stadium.


His vision is very low level at best - If canada wasn't hosting 2026 -TFC may not have even got Insigne -.

Yes he is smart to ball everything up into a new project that will spill over to 2026's world cup.


my definition of him being lazy.

I suspect a lot of high-achieving people (having sort of been one at various times when I was younger) are emotionally immature, or their potential in their field is stunted by prior successes giving them a false sense of security in their own qualities and ideas.

He certainly seems to just go for the easiest answer. Fill the stands? Toronto is full of Italians and it worked with Giovinco.

The fact that the league’s makeup has changed dramatically since TAM being introduced would suggest using the model we had in 2017 is probably deeply insufficient to proper roster building, but it was the route he automatically took.

Lazy seems an apt description but I don’t think it’s necessarily the man’s makeup, just that he’s had successes in the past, is supremely self-confident and therefore misses better options and the need for more nuance. “Myopic” would probably be better.

[portu]

Lingard doesn’t fit with the team unless all of a sudden we’re doing a 4-4-2 sticking Insigne up top and playing him on the wing.

That being said this looks pretty good:

Insigne-JJ

Lingard-Oso-MAK-Berna

[Ultra & Proud]

For example, Insigne- still is a lazy signing as he was connect via an existing player agent( Seba's) this is how Insgine was on Manning's radar.

Getting Crissitto his best friend isnt an astute signing- it is to appease his prized signing - also lazy

You realize that this happens in every window in every league right? Ask Wolves about running through one specific agent for most of their signings.

As for his buddy coming. Well yeah but that happens when players go to culture shock countries, for example when Russian teams go for Brazilians. They usualy get a few to make it easier on the transition. Which is sensible moreso than lazy. Lazy is dumping money on a player and telling him to figure it out himself. Doing this is setting up employees to succeed rather than the old school throwing them to the wolves and see who survives way. Even PSG signed a couple of Neymar's pals to BS positions just so he felt good being in Paris.

As for the CMNT, sure they're looking to cash in on the WCQ success but if it's Kaye we're after then I bet Bob would have gone for him even if we finished where Honduras did in qualifying.

[Kamp Berg]

Lingard doesn’t fit with the team unless all of a sudden we’re doing a 4-4-2 sticking Insigne up top and playing him on the wing.

That being said this looks pretty good:

Insigne-JJ

Lingard-Oso-MAK-Berna

I think it’ll be a 4-3-3 from now on unless Bob is forced to adapt due to injuries or something as dire.

[Richard]

when I say lazy I mean in doing the least to get everyone to forget about mis-handling of everything.

For example, Insigne- still is a lazy signing as he was connect via an existing player agent( Seba's) this is how Insgine was on Manning's radar.

Getting Crissitto his best friend isnt an astute signing- it is to appease his prized signing - also lazy

He also floated out the CMNT player- he basically is relying on an italian fan base combined with Canada men's hype to fill the stadium.


His vision is very low level at best - If canada wasn't hosting 2026 -TFC may not have even got Insigne -.

Yes he is smart to ball everything up into a new project that will spill over to 2026's world cup.


my definition of him being lazy.

If "lazy" wins us trophies then does it matter?

I'm not enthused by Criscito but if it helps Insgine settle then its only a net positive, its not like Criscito is here long term. In negations with high profile players and agents there is always give an take, I wouldn't look too deeply into this signing.

Sometimes you need to be "lazy" to keep the team relevant in the media and city, while signings like Jiménez are generally the backbone of a winning team in MLS which looks to be handled by Bob. As long as Manning sticks to the obvious blockbuster signings it should all work out.

[Yuushalinsky]

I suspect a lot of high-achieving people (having sort of been one at various times when I was younger) are emotionally immature, or their potential in their field is stunted by prior successes giving them a false sense of security in their own qualities and ideas.

He certainly seems to just go for the easiest answer. Fill the stands? Toronto is full of Italians and it worked with Giovinco.

The fact that the league’s makeup has changed dramatically since TAM being introduced would suggest using the model we had in 2017 is probably deeply insufficient to proper roster building, but it was the route he automatically took.

Lazy seems an apt description but I don’t think it’s necessarily the man’s makeup, just that he’s had successes in the past, is supremely self-confident and therefore misses better options and the need for more nuance. “Myopic” would probably be better.

As a slacker, this is pretty much spot on. Path of least resistance, repeat what works, so on, so forth. I think myopic is very much the correct word here, but if it works for him he's not gonna change and frankly he shouldn't need to.

Key words being if it works. I also think that, again, he wasn't expecting to have to put in so much work building TFC up from the ashes again since Curtis and Armas royally fucked us, and is just on auto-pilot. The work is there... he's just not seeing the other avenues.

We also DEFINITELY fucked up the forum's code lol

[OgtheDim]

I go away for 4 hours & you all start discussing workplace theory!?!?!

Damn it people, send out the bat signal next time....that's my jam.

[Initial B]

Holy crap - I don't check for 48 hours and there's suddenly a flame war going on in this thread, with a smattering of rumored crazy signings coming. I'm getting dizzy scrolling through all these responses....

[Ultra & Proud]

I go away for 4 hours & you all start discussing workplace theory!?!?!

Damn it people, send out the bat signal next time....that's my jam.

I knew that one wouldn't slip by.

[Hala Hrvatska]

Someone found this on the interweb from 2020

Check out this tweet at [URL]https://twitter.com/sportsnet/status/1291894324880379904?s=21&t=TwppjxkY5Teram4JXXJKrw[/URL]

Is Lingard still in consideration for the England NT? Would this move hurt him if he came here if he wants any shot at England?

Bale's move to LA was to be ready for the WC and he is kind of the exception I think moving over this way.

[Oldtimer]

Someone mentioned it perfectly a few days back, the Bradleys and some of their supporters sure do like to blame the "foreigners" for our troubles....and Poz was a "foreigner". He was the LEAST of our concerns.

If you repeat it you are saying it too.

That’s a lie, and classic Trumpian disinformation “someone said (insert lie here)” Prove it - that Bob Bradley is discriminating against foreign players or fuck off these boards

MightDM, don't tell anyone to "fuck off these boards." I realize you've apologized so move on.

Dude, weren't you warned about this the other day? Everyone can post what they want here if following the mods rules. You are not the moderator here, you won't be telling ANYONE what they can or cannot post. Got it? Good.

PS I didn't make the post about foreigners...I said someone else did the other day in the Seattle thread...if you don't like it, take it up with them.

You repeated it so you are also saying that BB is racist.

You are essentially saying BB is racist. Back it up or shut up. it is a serious and ugly allegation, and saying "someone else said it, i am just repeating them' is cowardly. Just stop it.

MightyDM is correct. Hala is getting a second infraction on the board for trolling. Some of what he's posted seems designed to upset people.

[jloome]

I knew that one wouldn't slip by.

I wonder how the impulse buyers are going to feel this weekend when he can’t play. Given the calf muscle occurred before he got here, and that he was training on his own… they probably should’ve soft-sold the first appearance.

It would be nice to get a confirmation on Bernadeschi and may be one other player this week. Even Juve fans sites are reporting he’s coming now, so maybe soon on that one.

Some clarification on the Poz situation today might be a good move, too, considering it’s been out there for 18 hours already.

[OgtheDim]

I don't know if an MLS team can talk about an internal to MLS trade today - the window opens tomorrow.

[Oldtimer]

God bless mods for having to moderate this board this year.

I’ve never seen it this heated before in this thread.

Can we just take a moment to appreciate the individual(s?) moderating, especially when things are getting lengthy and way off topic.

Thanks. There's a small team of us, though I am the most active.

You think this is heated, though? The meltdown when DeRo left was epic, but that's quite a few years back now.

[jloome]

I don't know if an MLS team can talk about an internal to MLS trade today - the window opens tomorrow.

Oh! Good point! I’d totally gotten it into my head over the weekend that Monday was the 7th!

So we could have a flood of news tomorrow.

This somewhat makes up for my dog (a four month old great dane-pitbull mix who weighs 60 lbs already) dragging me down the sidewalk face first for two blocks yesterday when spooked. One separated shoulder and a quarter-centimetre of mangled finger flesh later…

I’m sure your dog would not have approved but probably couldn’t have helped laughing, especially when the puppy ran two blocks home without me, yelping and dragging the leash, like a baby giraffe on uppers.

[Hala Hrvatska]

If you repeat it you are saying it too.



MightDM, don't tell anyone to "fuck off these boards." I realize you've apologized so move on.



You repeated it so you are also saying that BB is racist.




MightyDM is correct. Hala is getting a second infraction on the board for trolling. .

So he can tell me to F off and imply I am calling BB racist when there are quite non white guys on the team which of course BB isn't a racist.

Foreigner in the context of non America or Canadian. Poz is Spanish.


But Oh well...got it..warning noted and to be safe I will ignore DM as well.

Sorry for the trouble. Cheers.