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    Most likely is cepitelli coming in.

    That link wouldn't have come out of nothing.

    A 32 year old serie a CB has the ability to revolutionize our defense

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    Quote Originally Posted by leedsandTFC View Post
    Most likely is cepitelli coming in.

    That link wouldn't have come out of nothing.

    A 32 year old serie a CB has the ability to revolutionize our defense
    If he learns how to yell at Mavinga and Thompson in English fast enough.

    Also, does anyone know what kind of CB this guy is? Can he organize a defence?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yohan View Post
    If he learns how to yell at Mavinga and Thompson in English fast enough.

    Also, does anyone know what kind of CB this guy is? Can he organize a defence?
    I think he also plays some RB. So he might not be yelling at Thomson as much as replacing him short term.

    Although there was also some suggestion he’s good in the air, which screams CB.

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    I had half a thought that TFC might be in for an incentive laden deal for Aaron Long (minimal GAM up front + sell-on + GAM on resign), but he played for them last night so that probably pours water on that.

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    Belotti to Roma seems inevitable and done?
    Faint hope?
    Maybe?
    Has Fabrizio Romano even commented on this subject?
    Recently?
    Odd?
    I believe he has about Gini Wijnaldum to Roma a few times?
    I guess we shall definitively see within the next few hours or days.
    Some harsh criticism from the Torino viewpoint...


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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    In general, if the Waking the Red consensus about a player who has been with the team for a couple of years is that he is underrated...he's not.

    Bono is a serviceable MLS keeper who with the right coaching, and maybe given time with somebody looking at his eyesight, could be a decent shop stopper - he has shown no capability to learn to distribute the ball & doesn't seem to know how to marshal a backline.

    He is the epitome of a middle of the pack MLS keeper...paid upper MLS keeper wages because of 2017.

    The game has changed now with the expectation that keepers will be a part of play buildup. TFC fans expect that because we know how the world game is changing - the fact that MLS keepers by and large can't distribute the ball decently is frankly shocking.


    Watch that Chicago. now Chelsea, kid for a game & you see the difference.
    Gaga? Have watched him in the past on one of the services, thinking DAZN and of course Youtube highlights.
    The NA/Polish phenom.
    Arguably just a step behind Donnarumma in trajectory?
    His distribution still needs work.
    Though, much, much better than Bono.
    On par with Westberg?
    36 with years of experience v 18 with 1 year?
    Yeah, Gabriel Pawel "Gaga" Slonina is gonna do just fine!

  7. #4507
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    Quote Originally Posted by rydermike View Post
    No way they add two more DP slots. Those small market teams will fight it. Maybe they remove the u22 restrictions on teams with 3 DPs, but no way they have 5 DPs + TAM + U22
    Quote Originally Posted by TFC/Everton View Post
    I'm not sure I agree. MLS just signed a massive new streaming agreement with Apple +. The last TV deal gave MLS $65 million per season ($90 million split with US soccer). Now, they get $250 million per season in addition to the pending smaller deals with ESPN, Fox, Univision, TSN.

    MLS also recently signed a $270 million betting data deal with IMG Arena. https://sports.yahoo.com/mls-signs-2...105500478.html

    And the biggest prize, the current $117 million per season deal with Adidas expires in 2023. MLS is growing and so should the number of DPs.
    Coming to this late, but the way I see it, MLS is probably done with adding DPs. Garber has said in the past that the purpose of TAM was to reduce the gap in quality between the DPs and the regular players. I mean, here were the team salaries at the beginning of 2022: https://boardroom.tv/highest-mls-team-salaries-of-2022/. None of the MLS teams, even the cheap ones, are spending less than $10m USD on their rosters.

    Since DPs and other personnel rules have to be negotiated though the CBA, I could see the league implementing a Salary Floor of $10m and a Ceiling of $20m and rolling TAM into GAM (aiding transparency). The DP rules would still be in place, with their salary cap hit equal to the current 12.5% of the Cap ceiling, which would be $2.5m.(!) Half of the MLS clubs highest paid players don't even make $2.5m, so it would free up DP slots if teams really wanted to shoot for the moon. It would be a jackpot for most lower-end players as even the reserve players would see their salaries rise to the low 6-digits. It would also be a jackpot for the league as it would vault them into the top 10 leagues in the world, closing on the top 5
    Last edited by Initial B; 08-03-2022 at 10:52 AM.

  8. #4508
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    Quote Originally Posted by Initial B View Post
    Coming to this late, but the way I see it, MLS is probably done with adding DPs. Garber has said in the past that the purpose of TAM was to reduce the gap in quality between the DPs and the regular players. I mean, here were the team salaries at the beginning of 2022: https://boardroom.tv/highest-mls-team-salaries-of-2022/. None of the MLS teams, even the cheap ones, are spending less than $10m USD on their rosters.

    Since DPs and other personnel rules have to be negotiated though the CBA, I could see the league implementing a Salary Floor of $10m and a Ceiling of $20m and rolling TAM into GAM (aiding transparency). The DP rules would still be in place, with their salary cap hit equal to the current 12.5% of the Cap ceiling, which would be $2.5m.(!) Half of the MLS clubs highest paid players don't even make $2.5m, so it would free up DP slots if teams really wanted to shoot for the moon. It would be a jackpot for most lower-end players as even the reserve players would see their salaries rise to the low 6-digits. It would also be a jackpot for the league as it would vault them into the top 10 leagues in the world, closing on the top 5
    Eliminating or reducing TAM was a player negotiation point last CBA. It benefits new players coming in at the expense of current players. It's a reasonable guess that it will be gone next CBA.
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

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    Quote Originally Posted by Initial B View Post
    It would be a jackpot for most lower-end players as even the reserve players would see their salaries rise to the low 6-digits.
    This is the biggest sticking point amongst the cheapo owners. They fought for a lower floor more than they did free agency.

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    Oh, that makes the trade a little more easier to swallow, I guess, if the GAM goes until 2024.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red I View Post


    Oh, that makes the trade a little more easier to swallow, I guess, if the GAM goes until 2024.
    This is helpful. Does anyone know how long teams have to use GAM in general? I know GAM received for selling a player abroad has to be used within 4 transfer windows. I'm unclear on if GAM allocated to a team can roll over to a future year. For example, if TFC doesn't use ~500K in GAM this year, are we able to spend it next year instead?

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    Some of the board have seen this article, no doubt, but I find it interesting in retrospect. A tactical/roster look into Bradley’s last season at LAFC via advanced metrics. With lots of TFC roster speculation. “Bob Bradley, Possession, Pressing, Personnel”

    https://www.americansocceranalysis.c...-and-personnel

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    I believe tomorrow is the final day for inter-league trades and incoming (non-free agent) transfers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeForbes View Post
    I believe tomorrow is the final day for inter-league trades and incoming (non-free agent) transfers.
    It is. Been pretty quiet overall across the league leading up to this. I'd like us to do something small at least in an inter-league deal.


    Edit - I spoke too soon. All sorts of moves dropping right now. So might get busy over the next day.
    Last edited by Ultra & Proud; 08-03-2022 at 12:16 PM.

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    Just so everyone knows we’re still the worst thing to ever happen to Canadian Soccer, even while probably providing 5x the minutes to youth players VWFC or Mtl have this year.

    These takes are hilarious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red I View Post


    Oh, that makes the trade a little more easier to swallow, I guess, if the GAM goes until 2024.
    There has to be something more to this GAM we're getting. The way it is sounding is we get 225k GAM and then Nashville can opt to keep or not.

    So if Nashville wants to keep him do they pay us extra GAM? Or do they get to just keep him for free if they want. Or is this like we get 125k GAM now and if they want to keep him and the rest if they keep him? If it's all the GAM upfront and then in December they can opt to keep him or release him, that's basically a no brainer (basically Nashville can decide whether his option is picked up or not).

    Based on the press release, it sounds like it's all the GAM upfront. It's basically like this is a trade, disguised as a loan to trick fans into thinking its not a trade, since the reports sound like the latter.
    Last edited by rydermike; 08-03-2022 at 12:56 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rydermike View Post
    There has to be something more to this GAM we're getting. The way it is sounding is we get 225k GAM and then Nashville can opt to keep or not.

    So if Nashville wants to keep him do they pay us extra GAM? Or do they get to just keep him for free if they want. Or is this like we get 125k GAM now and if they want to keep him and the rest if they keep him? If it's all the GAM upfront and then in December they can opt to keep him or release him, that's basically a no brainer (basically Nashville can decide whether his option is picked up or not).

    Based on the press release, it sounds like it's all the GAM upfront. It's basically like this is a trade, disguised as a loan to trick fans into thinking its not a trade, since the reports sound like the latter.
    No, if they decide to buy him it's a different transaction.

    The GAM is largely for the international spot in order to add him now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leedsandTFC View Post
    No, if they decide to buy him it's a different transaction.

    The GAM is largely for the international spot in order to add him now.
    This is what it is. If they choose to buy him at the end of the loan then they will have to pay a transfer fee. This was only a loan fee + the international roster spot (probably $25K loan & $200K roster spot).

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    Nashville actually sold an international slot about a month ago for $175k GAM (and a 3rd round pick, but that's basically worthless). Since it was sold later in the season our international slot is maybe worth $150k GAM. So we basically got 75k GAM for half a season of Shaff. I'm curious what the buy price is. Is $400-$500k reasonable? That's around what we got for Marky. Marky is a better player now, but Shaff is on a better contract and maybe has a higher ceiling at this point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by noxx98 View Post
    Nashville actually sold an international slot about a month ago for $175k GAM (and a 3rd round pick, but that's basically worthless). Since it was sold later in the season our international slot is maybe worth $150k GAM. So we basically got 75k GAM for half a season of Shaff. I'm curious what the buy price is. Is $400-$500k reasonable? That's around what we got for Marky. Marky is a better player now, but Shaff is on a better contract and maybe has a higher ceiling at this point.
    Maybe $275K to make it $500K all in? Can't see it being much more than that.

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    When the Union loaned Carranza from Miami they announced they had an option to acquire him but didn't announce what that was at the time. Ended up being 500k GAM iirc

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post

    Just so everyone knows we’re still the worst thing to ever happen to Canadian Soccer, even while probably providing 5x the minutes to youth players VWFC or Mtl have this year.

    These takes are hilarious.
    Yeah… but he didn’t say we didn’t give them time, he said we’ve managed our youth-to-first-team pipeline badly.

    Given that we have more youth in first teams on other teams than we do our own over the last decade — and pretty regularly at that — it’s hard to argue that’s wrong, unless you can point to assets we got back that replaced them, or transfer fees received.

    We’ve had exactly one player, Ayo, stick with the first team in that decade. I guess you could argue Jay, as he has sixty plus appearances, but I don’t think he started more than a handful.

    They’re obviously trying to address it now, but again, it’s hard to argue Shaffelburg was well-developed.

    He contributed three goals and three assists as a 21 year old, and now we have no place for him because we’re wedded to one tactical look. This is a kid who went to the same school as Jack Harrison, broke Harrison’s records there, and was regarded as having at least as much of a top end.

    Harrison left NYCFC after two years, and now he’s a Prem regular at Leeds.

    But Shaff got to us and just… didn’t grow much. They played him, but tasked him with just beating a guy and crossing the ball. So that’s what he did. He’s a kid (well… he was. He’s 22 now, so that time has gone). Is that on him… or TFC? Again, if it was an occasional lack of advancement I’d say the player. But…

    In the meantime, this year, we started Kosi for three months and clearly he didn’t improve. Why the stubbornness? Why not trying Kobe Franklin there, or someone else from TFC II? Why try to shoehorn players like Shaffelburg and Thompson into positions and roles they don’t know — effectively making them start their pro career over — rather than adapting to the players you have?

    In the knowledge that, because you work for MLSE, you can just fit players to the system. Sure. I get that. But that’s entirely the opposite of developing our own youth. That’s casting them off when they’re not first-teamers right out of the gate.

    Similarly, while Jayden’s potential is massive (ball skills, speed, attacking confidence) his game is riddled with shortcomings that pretty much guaranteed he could not always be counted on in the first team. And yet where were the other youth being given a shot? Why did we give Themi Antonoglu a temporary deal this year and then not give him a shot?

    In short, why with all this youth playing time are only two (three if you count Petrasso, who is a few years of strength development from becoming a starter) youths playing:?

    The only answer is that those three have so much natural talent they’ll definitely be an asset at some point, as opposed to a gamble. But even then, based on prior results, I have to look at how they play versus other 19 year olds who are already in starting lineups, and question who is making that decision, as none of the three can read the game at MLS speed yet, and most of the time PEtrasso is the only one who looks close.

    They all have obvious technique, and both Jayden and Kosi in particular are obviously talented athletically. But their read of the game is non-existent even compared to some armchair managers. That’s really, really not a good sign. In fact, I’d say it’s a worst hindrance to development than speed or strength being lacking. Those can somewhat develop. But making smart decisions quickly? I’m not sure how much he can coach that.

    I dunno… maybe I”m wrong and we’ll get something great for that 225K while Shaff’s forever a backup, but it seems pretty clear after dozens and dozens of kids have gone through the system that the fault is at least partly in talent recognition and development, or so many of them wouldn’t still be playing somewhere else.

    There are issues with youth development right across MLS, it should be noted. I saw an interview the other day that Adrian Heath did with a Liverpool paper about Minnesota beating Everton, and he said the complacency that stems from their jobs not being challenged, particularly by relegation, makes it harder to develop players here.

    Certainly, we’ve had a fair amount of that. I think Priso has huge potential but always seemed to display more confidence and attitude than his play had earned, as if he knew just how hot shit he was. Now after starting his first two games for Colorado but being pulled at halftime in both, I notice he did not start the third or play a minute against New York. Smells like someone sending him a message.

    Maybe our biggest impediment is that the best academies in Toronto pre-existed TFC and we’re already graduating players to the PROs. When TFC came in and treated them arrogantly (as FC Edmonton did with Minor soccer, forever screwing up that relationship) they went their own way, and they have the rep for development. We don’t. So we’re not even getting the best recruits.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Areathrasher View Post
    When the Union loaned Carranza from Miami they announced they had an option to acquire him but didn't announce what that was at the time. Ended up being 500k GAM iirc
    Now I must admit, THAT was a massive mismanagement of talent. Shaff is a mismanagement of potential. But Carraza had already performed in Argentina, was already known to be a strong pressing forward even though young.

    Get him out of Miami and with a coach who knows how to use players to their most potential and… he’s one of the best pressing forwards in the league AND is scoring regularly.

    Neville… I’m not sure what to make of him yet. Certainly, he can’t get it done with disparate pieces. He needs a certain mindset of player. He managed the England women’s team about as poorly as Miami, and a year later, they’re European champions, without adding any major pieces (other than players he’d left out).

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Yeah… but he didn’t say we didn’t give them time, he said we’ve managed our youth-to-first-team pipeline badly.

    Given that we have more youth in first teams on other teams than we do our own over the last decade — and pretty regularly at that — it’s hard to argue that’s wrong, unless you can point to assets we got back that replaced them, or transfer fees received.

    We’ve had exactly one player, Ayo, stick with the first team in that decade. I guess you could argue Jay, as he has sixty plus appearances, but I don’t think he started more than a handful.

    They’re obviously trying to address it now, but again, it’s hard to argue Shaffelburg was well-developed.

    He contributed three goals and three assists as a 21 year old, and now we have no place for him because we’re wedded to one tactical look. This is a kid who went to the same school as Jack Harrison, broke Harrison’s records there, and was regarded as having at least as much of a top end.

    Harrison left NYCFC after two years, and now he’s a Prem regular at Leeds.

    But Shaff got to us and just… didn’t grow much. They played him, but tasked him with just beating a guy and crossing the ball. So that’s what he did. He’s a kid (well… he was. He’s 22 now, so that time has gone). Is that on him… or TFC? Again, if it was an occasional lack of advancement I’d say the player. But…

    In the meantime, this year, we started Kosi for three months and clearly he didn’t improve. Why the stubbornness? Why not trying Kobe Franklin there, or someone else from TFC II? Why try to shoehorn players like Shaffelburg and Thompson into positions and roles they don’t know — effectively making them start their pro career over — rather than adapting to the players you have?

    In the knowledge that, because you work for MLSE, you can just fit players to the system. Sure. I get that. But that’s entirely the opposite of developing our own youth. That’s casting them off when they’re not first-teamers right out of the gate.

    Similarly, while Jayden’s potential is massive (ball skills, speed, attacking confidence) his game is riddled with shortcomings that pretty much guaranteed he could not always be counted on in the first team. And yet where were the other youth being given a shot? Why did we give Themi Antonoglu a temporary deal this year and then not give him a shot?

    In short, why with all this youth playing time are only two (three if you count Petrasso, who is a few years of strength development from becoming a starter) youths playing:?

    The only answer is that those three have so much natural talent they’ll definitely be an asset at some point, as opposed to a gamble. But even then, based on prior results, I have to look at how they play versus other 19 year olds who are already in starting lineups, and question who is making that decision, as none of the three can read the game at MLS speed yet, and most of the time PEtrasso is the only one who looks close.

    They all have obvious technique, and both Jayden and Kosi in particular are obviously talented athletically. But their read of the game is non-existent even compared to some armchair managers. That’s really, really not a good sign. In fact, I’d say it’s a worst hindrance to development than speed or strength being lacking. Those can somewhat develop. But making smart decisions quickly? I’m not sure how much he can coach that.

    I dunno… maybe I”m wrong and we’ll get something great for that 225K while Shaff’s forever a backup, but it seems pretty clear after dozens and dozens of kids have gone through the system that the fault is at least partly in talent recognition and development, or so many of them wouldn’t still be playing somewhere else.

    There are issues with youth development right across MLS, it should be noted. I saw an interview the other day that Adrian Heath did with a Liverpool paper about Minnesota beating Everton, and he said the complacency that stems from their jobs not being challenged, particularly by relegation, makes it harder to develop players here.

    Certainly, we’ve had a fair amount of that. I think Priso has huge potential but always seemed to display more confidence and attitude than his play had earned, as if he knew just how hot shit he was. Now after starting his first two games for Colorado but being pulled at halftime in both, I notice he did not start the third or play a minute against New York. Smells like someone sending him a message.

    Maybe our biggest impediment is that the best academies in Toronto pre-existed TFC and we’re already graduating players to the PROs. When TFC came in and treated them arrogantly (as FC Edmonton did with Minor soccer, forever screwing up that relationship) they went their own way, and they have the rep for development. We don’t. So we’re not even getting the best recruits.
    I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said, more so just questioning VWFC and IMFC’s credentials on the subject and why we should take all the heat.

    Vancouver got lucky with one generational talent and otherwise has done squat. Montreal has Piette similar to us having Osorio. They’ve binned a ton of guys who arguably had the talent to play in MLS (similar to we have). They told Crepeau to take a hike and a trade rather than give him a moderate pay raise. But I don’t see knives out for them.
    Last edited by ag futbol; 08-03-2022 at 03:02 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said, more so just questioning VWFC and IMFC’s credentials on the subject.

    Vancouver got lucky with one generational talent and otherwise has done squat. Montreal has Piette similar to us having Osorio. They’ve binned a ton of guys who arguably had the talent to play in MLS (similar to we have). They told Crepeau to take a hike and a trade rather than give him a moderate pay raise. But I don’t see knives out for them.
    Oh! Oh yeah, good point. Vancouver has been worse than us, but gets a complete pass for Alphonso Davies, who frankly they barely developed. He was so talented and overgrown as a 14-year-old that Swansea City tried to sign him five years before Bayern, right out of Edmonton Minor Soccer, but obviously couldn’t get around the youth transfer restrictions.

    Most of Vancouver’s development from teh past decade is playing in the CPL. Montreal’s isn’t even that lucky. Was Piette even one of their youths? I know he spent years in Europe before going there, including a stint in La Liga.

    Part of the issue seems to be that the athletic talent recognition in the first place — and the ability to convince them to stick with soccer instead of hockey or basketball or football — is still utterly lacking in North America, particularly Canada.

    Look at the size of the average premiership player when they compete against MLS teams in friendlies. We look like we’re playing against giants, for crying out loud.

    It’s also the biggest complaint about players from the Americas going into top Euro leagues, that they’re always undersized.

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    for about a decade, we've always had this problem - only a couple of teams have ever gotten academies/youth teams right in MLS so it's not unique to us but it is still a problem nevertheless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Oh! Oh yeah, good point. Vancouver has been worse than us, but gets a complete pass for Alphonso Davies, who frankly they barely developed. He was so talented and overgrown as a 14-year-old that Swansea City tried to sign him five years before Bayern, right out of Edmonton Minor Soccer, but obviously couldn’t get around the youth transfer restrictions.

    Most of Vancouver’s development from teh past decade is playing in the CPL. Montreal’s isn’t even that lucky. Was Piette even one of their youths? I know he spent years in Europe before going there, including a stint in La Liga.

    Part of the issue seems to be that the athletic talent recognition in the first place — and the ability to convince them to stick with soccer instead of hockey or basketball or football — is still utterly lacking in North America, particularly Canada.

    Look at the size of the average premiership player when they compete against MLS teams in friendlies. We look like we’re playing against giants, for crying out loud.

    It’s also the biggest complaint about players from the Americas going into top Euro leagues, that they’re always undersized.
    I feel like I’ve gone full circle on the importance of athleticism in development. As a 5’9, slight of frame guy, I always sort of rolled my eyes at Canada Soccer historically picking out players similar to how you’d pick out a race horse. But… I have seen first hand “can’t miss talent” basically evaporate once the athleticism gets taken up a level in a more demanding league. And ironically, I now feel Canada Soccer overvalues skill at the expense of many other attributes.

    That’s not say you have to be built like a brick house to play soccer. I’d argue that’s not the case and certainly lots of countries (particularly Spain) have proved you can still be under 6 feet and play at the highest level.

    We’ve got to work on the tactical / mental aspects of being a professional more than anything else. That’s where I feel most of these youth players are fall short.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I feel like I’ve gone full circle on the importance of athleticism in development. As a 5’9, slight of frame guy, I always sort of rolled my eyes at Canada Soccer historically picking out players similar to how you’d pick out a race horse. But… I have seen first hand “can’t miss talent” basically evaporate once the athleticism gets taken up a level in a more demanding league. And ironically, I now feel Canada Soccer overvalues skill at the expense of many other attributes.

    That’s not say you have to be built like a brick house to play soccer. I’d argue that’s not the case and certainly lots of countries (particularly Spain) have proved you can still be under 6 feet and play at the highest level.

    We’ve got to work on the tactical / mental aspects of being a professional more than anything else. That’s where I feel most of these youth players are fall short.

    Have to disagree somewhat amigo. Canadian soccer is missing the technical skills development. The Canadian system looks for raw athleticism and the skill "little" guys never get a chance to develop. Same thing in the US as they have no technical midfielders that can dictate the game/pull the strings. Spain has little guys that have been ultra successful...and sorry (have to mention my beloved Croatia as its what I know), Luka Modric is what like 5"7". If he grew up in Canada, he'd be out of footie at 14 as the coaches here would deem him too small.


    Alphonso Davies is a generational talent with speed, strength etc who could walk into any national team in the world. An exception. Our Canadian academy TFC guys simply aren't good enough. Is that on the academy, Canadian soccer, both?
    Last edited by Hala Hrvatska; 08-03-2022 at 04:07 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Yeah… but he didn’t say we didn’t give them time, he said we’ve managed our youth-to-first-team pipeline badly.

    Given that we have more youth in first teams on other teams than we do our own over the last decade — and pretty regularly at that — it’s hard to argue that’s wrong, unless you can point to assets we got back that replaced them, or transfer fees received.

    We’ve had exactly one player, Ayo, stick with the first team in that decade. I guess you could argue Jay, as he has sixty plus appearances, but I don’t think he started more than a handful.

    They’re obviously trying to address it now, but again, it’s hard to argue Shaffelburg was well-developed.

    He contributed three goals and three assists as a 21 year old, and now we have no place for him because we’re wedded to one tactical look. This is a kid who went to the same school as Jack Harrison, broke Harrison’s records there, and was regarded as having at least as much of a top end.

    Harrison left NYCFC after two years, and now he’s a Prem regular at Leeds.

    But Shaff got to us and just… didn’t grow much. They played him, but tasked him with just beating a guy and crossing the ball. So that’s what he did. He’s a kid (well… he was. He’s 22 now, so that time has gone). Is that on him… or TFC? Again, if it was an occasional lack of advancement I’d say the player. But…

    In the meantime, this year, we started Kosi for three months and clearly he didn’t improve. Why the stubbornness? Why not trying Kobe Franklin there, or someone else from TFC II? Why try to shoehorn players like Shaffelburg and Thompson into positions and roles they don’t know — effectively making them start their pro career over — rather than adapting to the players you have?

    In the knowledge that, because you work for MLSE, you can just fit players to the system. Sure. I get that. But that’s entirely the opposite of developing our own youth. That’s casting them off when they’re not first-teamers right out of the gate.

    Similarly, while Jayden’s potential is massive (ball skills, speed, attacking confidence) his game is riddled with shortcomings that pretty much guaranteed he could not always be counted on in the first team. And yet where were the other youth being given a shot? Why did we give Themi Antonoglu a temporary deal this year and then not give him a shot?

    In short, why with all this youth playing time are only two (three if you count Petrasso, who is a few years of strength development from becoming a starter) youths playing:?

    The only answer is that those three have so much natural talent they’ll definitely be an asset at some point, as opposed to a gamble. But even then, based on prior results, I have to look at how they play versus other 19 year olds who are already in starting lineups, and question who is making that decision, as none of the three can read the game at MLS speed yet, and most of the time PEtrasso is the only one who looks close.

    They all have obvious technique, and both Jayden and Kosi in particular are obviously talented athletically. But their read of the game is non-existent even compared to some armchair managers. That’s really, really not a good sign. In fact, I’d say it’s a worst hindrance to development than speed or strength being lacking. Those can somewhat develop. But making smart decisions quickly? I’m not sure how much he can coach that.

    I dunno… maybe I”m wrong and we’ll get something great for that 225K while Shaff’s forever a backup, but it seems pretty clear after dozens and dozens of kids have gone through the system that the fault is at least partly in talent recognition and development, or so many of them wouldn’t still be playing somewhere else.

    There are issues with youth development right across MLS, it should be noted. I saw an interview the other day that Adrian Heath did with a Liverpool paper about Minnesota beating Everton, and he said the complacency that stems from their jobs not being challenged, particularly by relegation, makes it harder to develop players here.

    Certainly, we’ve had a fair amount of that. I think Priso has huge potential but always seemed to display more confidence and attitude than his play had earned, as if he knew just how hot shit he was. Now after starting his first two games for Colorado but being pulled at halftime in both, I notice he did not start the third or play a minute against New York. Smells like someone sending him a message.

    Maybe our biggest impediment is that the best academies in Toronto pre-existed TFC and we’re already graduating players to the PROs. When TFC came in and treated them arrogantly (as FC Edmonton did with Minor soccer, forever screwing up that relationship) they went their own way, and they have the rep for development. We don’t. So we’re not even getting the best recruits.
    I have to agree. Our pipeline is shaky, uneven and full of holes. I think the lack of talent recognition in Canada has something to do with the CSA’s long time approach to amateur football. Also, the fact that Canadians haven’t known much about football, not on a deep level.

    Small commercial enterprises can be smarter, much more nimble.
    Last edited by los sonadores; 08-03-2022 at 04:19 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said, more so just questioning VWFC and IMFC’s credentials on the subject and why we should take all the heat.

    Vancouver got lucky with one generational talent and otherwise has done squat. Montreal has Piette similar to us having Osorio. They’ve binned a ton of guys who arguably had the talent to play in MLS (similar to we have). They told Crepeau to take a hike and a trade rather than give him a moderate pay raise. But I don’t see knives out for them.
    They didn’t boot him out fwiw - he’s the one who wanted to leave, ugh this sounds like I’m defending club foot… now I’ll list the 10 reasons anyone would want to leave them: ehem

 

 

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