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  1. #4981
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Much as I generally agree with jloome, I mostly agree with portu on this. I just predict I am going to be less vexed about a poor start than he will.

    I don’t think there is any way to accelerate a strategic overhaul like this.

    One possible way we could all be wrong: we may have been a lot better than our record last year, and getting rid of unhappy people is always good for any locker room.
    Assuming we bring in Jiiminez, I'll bet you a beer we're in a better spot come June than we were last season.

    Our biggest problem last year wasn't our offence, meagre as it was. It was that we started every game by giving up a stupid goal in the first 20.

    Salcedo and Mavinga in the middle, O'Neill (a regular start for Seattle) as an option? We're instantly better with that.

    Soteldo had six assists from open play (four were "secondary" assists). His four goals and six assists weren't a whole lot better than Jacob Shaffelburg's three and three.

    Jozy had four goals all season.

    Lawrence hasn't actually gone anywhere yet, we're all speculating that based on one rumour a week ago.

    Auro hasn't either, but even if he does, I suspect we won't get much worse from O'Neill and the kids on that side.

    In the middle, Priso is back, and I rate him at least as useful as a DM as Delgado was as a number eight, given how his quality slid over the last two seasons.

    Pozuelo is back and fit, after an offseason with a team-supplied personal trainer.

    The only massive loss so far is Richie.

    And to top all that off, we have an actual fucking coach, not Chris Armas.

    If we started this year with...

    ------------------Westberg------------------
    O'Neil----Salcedo--------Mavinga----Lawrence
    ------------------Priso/Bradley------------------------
    ------------Osorio------Pozuelo/Bradley-------------

    --Jiminez/Achara--------------------Shaffelburg
    ------------Jiminez/Peruzza/Akinola (They're saying April but maybe earlier)

    ....that's not a whole lot less strong than last year. O'Neil is preferred centally but can do the job wide and is an excellent defender.

    Outside of Soteldo, that's not far off what we had last year at this time, except we didn't have Poz back, we weren't getting Ayo back in two months and Richie added some speed wide.

    But on paper, that's a stronger defensive unit by a FRIGGIN MILE. I think everyone's forgetting what a total bomscare the pairing of Gonzalez/Zavaleta was.

    Add in an actual coach who can teach them to play cohesively and... yeah, I think people are badly overreacting on how much we've got to work with.

    I think we might actually be better off.
    Last edited by jloome; 02-06-2022 at 12:30 AM.

  2. #4982
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    So much doom predicted. Guess last years team scorched some people’s eyes.

    Call me glass half full guy but I think back to the start last year and remember how good the kids and fresh bodies did to start the season. I don’t think this year is going to be anything different.

    Someone said there’s like 10 exits and only Salcedo brought in. Simply not true as others have pointed out. I’d even say Poz is kinda an addition as he was nowhere to be found last year. The younger guys for sure have taken a step forward and having a respected coach that isn’t going to try some convoluted system that doesn’t suit the players available will also go a long ways. They could also add someone else before the season as well.

    Let’s not forget some of the subtractions (Omar) likely make us better too.

    Regardless I’ll bet anyone a Guinness that the team is .500 after their first dozen games. Salcedo, Poz, BB and subtracting stupidity from the former bench boss is an addition that can’t be understated.

  3. #4983
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    jloome,

    A thoughtful reply to what is being discussed. Although, I do share portu's feeling of unease.

    I do not disagree with your lineup.
    Semantics... maybe I might adjust it to...

    -----------------------Westberg------------------------
    --O'Neil--------Salcedo--------Mavinga----{Lawrence}--

    -----------------------Bradley--------------------------
    --------------Priso-----------------Osorio--------------

    --Pozuelo/Jimenez/Achara------------------Shaffelburg--
    -----------------Jimenez/Peruzza/[Akinola]-------------

    Perhaps Igor comes in exchange for Auro and O'Neill moves to the left? Then a little less problematic.

    Trying to be glass half-full, understand addition by subtraction, but as they say "it's the hope that kills you".

    I previously posted in this thread 19JAN25 Pg.131 #3909...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Inbetween View Post
    This is not interim pretty... until Insigne et al. arrive. I am now resigned to the fact that what is happening this off season is a complete housecleaning… a gut and rebuild... the right side is in a bit of shambles... I believe and trust in Bob The Builder... I am expecting pragmatic decisions... Hopefully BB has a few more surprise roster additions.

    Rough calculations... we likely need 35 to 45% of available game played points to be in playoff contention until reinforcements arrive...
    others welcome to comment...

    I believe BB wants to put an entertaining product on-field but... as is... and while I believe defense wins championships...
    It seems defensive ball'in is what will give us any chance to stay in contention this season... until...
    Last edited by Mr. Inbetween; 02-06-2022 at 01:20 AM.

  4. #4984
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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    I think everyone's forgetting what a total bomscare the pairing of Gonzalez/Zavaleta was.
    Hilarious! And so true!

  5. #4985
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Inbetween View Post
    jloome,

    A thoughtful reply to what is being discussed. Although, I do share portu's feeling of unease.

    I do not disagree with your lineup.
    Semantics... maybe I might adjust it to...

    -----------------------Westberg------------------------
    --O'Neil--------Salcedo--------Mavinga----{Lawrence}--

    -----------------------Bradley--------------------------
    --------------Priso-----------------Osorio--------------

    --Pozuelo/Jimenez/Achara------------------Shaffelburg--
    -----------------Jimenez/Peruzza/[Akinola]-------------

    Perhaps Igor comes in exchange for Auro and O'Neill moves to the left? Then a little less problematic.

    Trying to be glass half-full, understand addition by subtraction, but as they say "it's the hope that kills you".

    I previously posted in this thread 19JAN25 Pg.131 #3909...
    Maybe I'm numb from last season; anyone really think we're going to be worse than that shitshow?

    I'd be happier if we had some more wide right speed -- we do need to replace Richie properly -- and that we knew what the deal with Lawrence was.

    But if Jiminez works out and we can get a few first half-season goals from Ayo/Achara/Peruzza, why would we be worse? I don't get that idea.

    It's Feb. 5. We're starting the season and month early, but we stilll have three weeks to add a body or two, and even then, we know it's going to take a month or two to coalesce around whatever Bradley's teaching. But the young players are also a year older and wiser; JMR and Nelson spent the last two months training with some of the better clubs in Europe. And we have the lock-down center back we've been after since Drew Moor left.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Assuming we bring in Jiiminez, I'll bet you a beer we're in a better spot come June than we were last season.

    Our biggest problem last year wasn't our offence, meagre as it was. It was that we started every game by giving up a stupid goal in the first 20.

    Salcedo and Mavinga in the middle, O'Neill (a regular start for Seattle) as an option? We're instantly better with that.

    Soteldo had six assists from open play (four were "secondary" assists). His four goals and six assists weren't a whole lot better than Jacob Shaffelburg's three and three.

    Jozy had four goals all season.

    Lawrence hasn't actually gone anywhere yet, we're all speculating that based on one rumour a week ago.

    Auro hasn't either, but even if he does, I suspect we won't get much worse from O'Neill and the kids on that side.

    In the middle, Priso is back, and I rate him at least as useful as a DM as Delgado was as a number eight, given how his quality slid over the last two seasons.

    Pozuelo is back and fit, after an offseason with a team-supplied personal trainer.

    The only massive loss so far is Richie.

    And to top all that off, we have an actual fucking coach, not Chris Armas.

    If we started this year with...

    ------------------Westberg------------------
    O'Neil----Salcedo--------Mavinga----Lawrence
    ------------------Priso/Bradley------------------------
    ------------Osorio------Pozuelo/Bradley-------------

    --Jiminez/Achara--------------------Shaffelburg
    ------------Jiminez/Peruzza/Akinola (They're saying April but maybe earlier)

    ....that's not a whole lot less strong than last year. O'Neil is preferred centally but can do the job wide and is an excellent defender.

    Outside of Soteldo, that's not far off what we had last year at this time, except we didn't have Poz back, we weren't getting Ayo back in two months and Richie added some speed wide.

    But on paper, that's a stronger defensive unit by a FRIGGIN MILE. I think everyone's forgetting what a total bomscare the pairing of Gonzalez/Zavaleta was.

    Add in an actual coach who can teach them to play cohesively and... yeah, I think people are badly overreacting on how much we've got to work with.

    I think we might actually be better off.
    The addition by subtraction point, re Gonzalez/Zavaleta and especially Armas, that's pretty compelling.

    I wonder if BB has an imminent U 22 deal or two lined up, if this Auro thing is true. He was a pioneer in that market at LAFC. I have been waiting for that…
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  7. #4987
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I wonder if BB has an imminent U 22 deal or two lined up, if this Auro thing is true. He was a pioneer in that market at LAFC. I have been waiting for that…
    Thie could be why Salcedo is being reported as a DP. If 3rd DP is on 1.6 we can have 3U22s. If we get another DP and buy Salcedo down, we can only have 1U22 (Akinola). I guess the club is weighing the benefits. Do we want one more really good DP or two more very good U22s.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rydermike View Post
    Thie could be why Salcedo is being reported as a DP. If 3rd DP is on 1.6 we can have 3U22s. If we get another DP and buy Salcedo down, we can only have 1U22 (Akinola). I guess the club is weighing the benefits. Do we want one more really good DP or two more very good U22s.
    *slaps head* that is it, that is why he was coy on that!
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  9. #4989
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    Good discussion, I feel the anxiousness based on 2018 & 2022 results, the difference between then and now is hopefully we have a solid re-build/reinforce plan. Portu is not wrong, there are so many new pieces and gaps in this squad that it will be a challenge to gel. There are 17 games before the summer recruits come in.

    I am optimistic that silence is not a bad thing, clearly there is stuff going on and i would prefer to hear rumors from outside than to hear 2 weeks and nothing happens. Auro is concerning because i felt defence had time to train together (this is an unneeded distraction) but I continue to believe we are far better off today than November.

    We may be playing ugly football before we play better, i hope that is not the case or at least not too long. And the FO keeps the pedal on the floor to fill the holes.

  10. #4990
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    Napoli currently playing vs. Venezia, and Insigne is on the field.

  11. #4991
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    Quote Originally Posted by spe18 View Post
    Napoli currently playing vs. Venezia, and Insigne is on the field.

    His class is obvious & his defensive work rate is unquestionable. Every defender shows Insigne to the left but they also know how to cut off his options when he goes left. My question is whether the lack of MLS defensive rigor will allow Insigne to succeed more going to his left then he does right now.

  12. #4992
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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Maybe I'm numb from last season; anyone really think we're going to be worse than that shitshow?

    I'd be happier if we had some more wide right speed -- we do need to replace Richie properly -- and that we knew what the deal with Lawrence was.

    But if Jiminez works out and we can get a few first half-season goals from Ayo/Achara/Peruzza, why would we be worse? I don't get that idea.

    It's Feb. 5. We're starting the season and month early, but we stilll have three weeks to add a body or two, and even then, we know it's going to take a month or two to coalesce around whatever Bradley's teaching. But the young players are also a year older and wiser; JMR and Nelson spent the last two months training with some of the better clubs in Europe. And we have the lock-down center back we've been after since Drew Moor left.
    Without any doubt, the Spock in me obviously agrees with you and doesn't think we will be worse than that shitshow of last season.
    However, the Ian Hunter in me gives pause with some unease.
    If you would have advocated a shitshow scenario to me at the beginning of last season... on paper... I would have likely scoffed at that notion.
    Possession with a purpose verses pressing, given MBradley's unique relationship with Armas, he obviously drank some of the first sips of that latter Kool-Aid.
    Maybe it was time for a coaching/style change. Maybe the dressing room tuned Vanney out.
    Maybe it was a situation of 'the grass is always greener on the other side' tactical approach wise.
    Maybe enough players thought they could manage the new style. Not so, and Altidore was only the first to publicly crack.
    I also get and agree with the Bradley Inc.'s command and control, team first, internal and philosophical football approach.
    To me it seems the whole back lines, defensive players are/were suspect for BBradley and at one point or another this season under movement rumour.
    Some of remaining whom still are.
    Realistically, I believe there has been enough significant action and turnover disruption to maybe effect any immediate transitional gelling of the teams playing which in turn may affect any TFC playoff ambitions for this season.
    Last edited by Mr. Inbetween; 02-06-2022 at 11:29 AM.

  13. #4993
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    I'm incredibly excited to watch this team progress. Youth will get a chance; we have a decent shot at defensive stability; might see a cameo from Seba; goals from Peruzza; JJ two - lots of fun and real potential

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    This is probably the first year in a long time that I have no idea what to expect from the team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeForbes View Post
    This is probably the first year in a long time that I have no idea what to expect from the team.
    Expect a lot of losing to start.

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    I feel like JJ/Pozuelo connection can be something the team relies on in the early stretch of the season

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    Even just having Poz fit for the start of the season is massive.

  18. #4998
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    Based on the general tone of discussion, I predict many of you will be pleasantly surprised with the team's record by the time Insigne arrives.

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    God help us but if Bono is still starting, something is terribly effed up.

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    If Seattle can me mediocre for half a season and hit the league hard post-summer signings, I don’t see why can’t do the same.

    I don’t think if you took last years team with a proper coach they’d have made playoffs (as much as Armas made it worse). Let’s wear the fact we suck for a moment and seem to be trying to work our way back up. With our resources we can rebound faster than most but I wouldn’t expect instant success.

    Having things still to fix opening day isn’t an indictment of management. Only so much that can be done in a single window and we’ve already done a lot.

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    Bono can not start any games. No discussion. He will cause us to loose points single handedly. Bob will get this team playing well, but if your keeper has a bomb scare every games it's pointless.

    Westberg needs to be starting until a proper MLS starting keeper is acquired.

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    To counter my own worry about the lack of fullbacks: that might be on purpose. Explanation/Line-up below (3-4-3).

    Backline -- If Criscito comes then you'd have three centrebacks on TAM/DP money. Criscito/Salcedo/Mavinga could be the best backline in the league, granted that Mavinga rediscovers form. Mavinga, Salcedo, O'Neil could be very decent for a time as long as none of them get brutally injured.

    Central Midfield -- A two-man central midfield would explain why Delgado left and they're not worried about a replacement. As well as why BB has been open about his desire for Poz to do more defensively, which would be necessary in a pivot. You'd have Bradley and Priso off the bench and Okello off the reserves would be excellent (you'd want at least one guy who could start on the bench).

    Wings -- This is the only gap. Shaff is a starter and would offer overlap once Insigne arrives. You could start JJ and Akinola, but JJ is a more striker now than anything else - you don't pay a transfer fee to play him out of position. JMR could push to be a starter maybe, I think we all know Nelson isn't ready and Achara is not starting quality. Regardless after the deal that fell through for the young winger from SA, they are certainly after a deal like that.

    Overall, in this scenario, you'd really only need to get a couple starting quality wingers in. I am speculating though, and BB usually plays 4 at the back.

    3-4-3 Now

    ???*, JJ, ???

    Shaffelburg, Oso, Poz, ???/JMR

    Mavinga, Salcedo, O'Neil

    Westberg**

    3-4-3 by Summer

    Insigne, Akinola/JJ, ???

    Shaffelburg, Oso, Poz, ???/JMR

    Mavinga, Criscito, Salcedo

    Westberg**

    *I use ??? to denote a spot where there isn't someone who can (should?) start on the roster
    **We need a keeper badly, but it's MLS so I guess it's not a massive priority
    Last edited by portu; 02-06-2022 at 04:56 PM.

  23. #5003
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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    To counter my own worry about the lack of fullbacks: that might be on purpose. Explanation/Line-up below (3-4-3).

    Backline -- If Criscito comes then you'd have three centrebacks on TAM/DP money. Criscito/Salcedo/Mavinga could be the best backline in the league, granted that Mavinga rediscovers form. Mavinga, Salcedo, O'Neil could be very decent for a time as long as none of them get brutally injured.

    Central Midfield -- A two-man central midfield would explain why Delgado left and they're not worried about a replacement. As well as why BB has been open about his desire for Poz to do more defensively, which would be necessary in a pivot. You'd have Bradley and Priso off the bench and Okello off the reserves would be excellent (you'd want at least one guy who could start on the bench).

    Wings -- This is the only gap. Shaff is a starter and would offer overlap once Insigne arrives. You could start JJ and Akinola, but JJ is a more striker now than anything else - you don't pay a transfer fee to play him out of position. JMR could push to be a starter maybe, I think we all know Nelson isn't ready and Achara is not starting quality. Regardless after the deal that fell through for the young winger from SA, they are certainly after a deal like that.

    Overall, in this scenario, you'd really only need to get a couple starting quality wingers in. I am speculating though, and BB usually plays 4 at the back.

    3-4-3 Now

    ???, JJ, ???

    Shaffelburg, Oso, Poz, ???/JMR

    Mavinga, Salcedo, O'Neil

    Westberg

    3-4-3 by Summer

    Insigne, Akinola/JJ, ???

    Shaffelburg, Oso, Poz, ???/JMR

    Mavinga, Criscito, Salcedo

    Westberg

    *I use ??? to denote a spot where there isn't someone who can (should?) start on the roster
    Makes a lot of sense. That Nottingham Forest game today they played a 3-4-3 very effectively, with the wide players dropping into fullback roles.

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    Did Bob ever played 3 at the back at LAFC?

    I used to follow USMNT pretty closely and I believe they were always a 4-4-2 team under BB. That became quite a talking point towards the end of his time in that gig (lack of tactical flexibility for the modern game etc). But that was all quite a long time ago now...
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Did Bob ever played 3 at the back at LAFC?

    I used to follow USMNT pretty closely and I believe they were always a 4-4-2 team under BB. That became quite a talking point towards the end of his time in that gig (lack of tactical flexibility for the modern game etc). But that was all quite a long time ago now...
    Yeah, I believe Amir looked it up and he played a 4-3-3 and a 3-5-2/3-4-3 last season. Traditionally, pre LA, he played 433 most of the time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Did Bob ever played 3 at the back at LAFC?
    I believe his favoured formation is 4-3-3. His greatest success at LAFC was with both Rossi and Vela playing as inverted wingers flanking a CF. It seemed to work. Both Rossi and Vela won Golden Boots in successive years and made MLS Best XI in successive years. Plus he won Supports Shield and reached the final of CCL. He also lined up 4-3-3 in the Champions League final against Tigres with both Rossi and Vela in their usual off-wing positions.

    The way it looks like our roster is taking shape, I could see a slight variation that looks a bit more 4-2-3-1.

    --------------Jimenez----------------
    Insigne-----Pozuelo---------Shaff
    -------Osorio-----Bradley-------------
    Criscito---Mavinga---Salcedo---NewGuy

    Frankly, this formation would really appeal to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Did Bob ever played 3 at the back at LAFC?

    I used to follow USMNT pretty closely and I believe they were always a 4-4-2 team under BB. That became quite a talking point towards the end of his time in that gig (lack of tactical flexibility for the modern game etc). But that was all quite a long time ago now...
    In that 20 minute video posted the other day “back 3” slipped into the conversation several times. Wouldn’t be entirely surprised.

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    Just to manage our expectations on Criscito a little bit, given that most have him pegged as a centre back;
    According to footballcritic.com, in his last 50 appearances he has played left back 38 times, left midfield 11 times, and centre back only once.
    So it feels like he's coming to patrol the left flank, and as a natural left foot, he can definitely run the overlap and put in the cross.
    Given where we're at, this actually seems like a nice fit for our roster.

  29. #5009
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    Jiminez and Criscito are still only rumored? Or did I miss the signing? Are they as good as signed?

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    Giovinco to Sampdoria, reported by DiMarzio and relayed by F Romano

 

 

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