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  1. #151
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    So Manning and Curtis are so flooded with calls about the management position that they have to take their phones off the hook... and they hire Ali’s NYRB buddy. Not surprising, Ali.

    I will say I feel pretty underwhelmed at the announcement, especially given all the hype (I should’ve expected the “Ali-hype”), but I’m not here to crap on the guy; we have to support our coach until he gives us reason to believe otherwise. That being said, how do all the people calling for “Vanney out” feel now? Not too good for the most part, I bet.

  2. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavemTFC View Post
    Wait when/where did he say this? Not surprised, I just haven't heard about it said explicitly before
    Jozy got permission to train at home during the pandemic break last year and came to camp completely out of shape (like usual). Anyone else would have been shamed and reprimanded. Jozy's laziness was brushed under the rug.

  3. #153
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    The official team review video of the 2016 season made a big joke of the fact that Jozy and Seba together both ignored Vanney's explicit instructions and ran their own corner set piece on the goal right before halftime against Montreal in the ECF second leg. There was a podcast about it afterwards (don’t remember who) where one of the reporters said it was an open secret that those two disregarded most of that kind of instruction. It was all “of course they do, they are Seba and Jozy” but I remember thinking, that is only charming if you win, that could be trouble someday.. like I said, this is a tribute to Vanney that it didn’t become trouble. Mostly.

    It was also common knowledge that Seba trained entirely according to his own regimen (and of course had his own trainer, who became Jozy's trainer, who was canned when Seba left, which led to a Jozy dustup)...Piatti and Pozo running their own PK stunt last year is another example.

    These types of players that come from big success elsewhere, they are really not going to listen to a Greg Vanney or a Chris Armas. Making sure that you deliver effective management to the rest, and that the insubordination doesn’t infect others, is a tough challenge. I think Armas had trouble with this with Kaku, hope he learned something from that.
    Last edited by ensco; 01-14-2021 at 07:56 AM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I’d argue the biggest mistake we made was not giving Bez Manning’s job.
    You have an extremely strong point of view here!

  5. #155
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    Did all the trouble with Kaku start over NYRB turning down a big $$$ offer from America for him or was there something else? I can't remember.

  6. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavemTFC View Post
    I don't know why virtually everyone is assuming we're going to press now considering his legacy in NY is moving away from the press the team was specifically built for

    I don't really have anything else to add. I hope this works out but I'll be surprised if he lasts a year
    Jesse Marsch said in the interview that's the red bull way.

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikmacdo View Post
    Jesse Marsch said in the interview that's the red bull way.
    Guy wants the Leipzig job after Salzberg - he's a company man right now through & through.

  8. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Guy wants the Leipzig job after Salzberg - he's a company man right now through & through.
    But in his little interview he seemed as if he has been in contact with Armas and he said directly he would run an aggressive press. Maybe he is wrong but this more to go on that guessing based on what he messed around with in year 2 at NYRB.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    4-2-3-1

    They play a high-press, quick recovery system like RB Salzburg.

    The idea is to use speed to keep the ball in the offensive end as much as possible, then swarm coverage of the ball quickly when its lost to try and force quick turnovers.

    It's most effective against teams like us, who build from the back. It doesn't really fit our current roster.
    This is why I am fearing the possibility of a difficult transition year in 2021.

  10. #160
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    A modified press, which is what we did against some teams last year, sure -that was Armas MO near the end of his NYRB tenure.

    A gung ho go for it all press is a waste of Pozuelo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    A modified press, which is what we did against some teams last year, sure -that was Armas MO near the end of his NYRB tenure.

    A gung ho go for it all press is a waste of Pozuelo.
    Ya we don't press like the red bulls. They go balls out, like they're on cocaine.

    Our press is more methodical.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jabbronies View Post
    Ya we don't press like the red bulls. They go balls out, like they're on cocaine.

    Our press is more methodical.
    Jozy doesn't work in even the most methodical press. If TFC Armas is anything like RB Armas then there's really no place for Jozy. Akinola would be far better as the 1 up top than Loafy.

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    One of the first things Marsch said in that interview was "I don't think anyone believes in Chris more than I do" I'm not putting much stock in what he says especially since it goes against how Armas' NY actually played

    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    The official team review video of the 2016 season made a big joke of the fact that Jozy and Seba together both ignored Vanney's explicit instructions and ran their own corner set piece on the goal right before halftime against Montreal in the ECF second leg. There was a podcast about it afterwards (don’t remember who) where one of the reporters said it was an open secret that those two disregarded most of that kind of instruction. It was all “of course they do, they are Seba and Jozy” but I remember thinking, that is only charming if you win, that could be trouble someday.. like I said, this is a tribute to Vanney that it didn’t become trouble. Mostly.

    It was also common knowledge that Seba trained entirely according to his own regimen (and of course had his own trainer, who became Jozy's trainer, who was canned when Seba left, which led to a Jozy dustup)...Piatti and Pozo running their own PK stunt last year is another example.

    These types of players that come from big success elsewhere, they are really not going to listen to a Greg Vanney or a Chris Armas. Making sure that you deliver effective management to the rest, and that the insubordination doesn’t infect others, is a tough challenge. I think Armas had trouble with this with Kaku, hope he learned something from that.
    Fair, I just interpreted your previous post as Vanney may have referenced this himself

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    Jozy doesn't work in even the most methodical press. If TFC Armas is anything like RB Armas then there's really no place for Jozy. Akinola would be far better as the 1 up top than Loafy.

    ya I mean...IMO - Jozy was kind of an anchor on our ship last couple of seasons. If he doesn't change his play, I can see him being used less often - even when healthy.

    That will be the storyline for the year. Jozy vs Armas.

    All My own Opinions BTW

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    Quote Originally Posted by jabbronies View Post
    ya I mean...IMO - Jozy was kind of an anchor on our ship last couple of seasons. If he doesn't change his play, I can see him being used less often - even when healthy.

    That will be the storyline for the year. Jozy vs Armas.

    All My own Opinions BTW
    Hopefully Jozy is gone regardless of the style of play. He's a huge waste of money.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    Jozy doesn't work in even the most methodical press. If TFC Armas is anything like RB Armas then there's really no place for Jozy. Akinola would be far better as the 1 up top than Loafy.
    I agree with your point, I don't think Jozy is suited to a press. But can we not use insults like "Loafy." He's a TFC legend, we can criticize without being insulting.

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    I hate the way Jozy is treated around here. People calling him names are ingrates.

    He was overpaid last year but who cares. He's legend. Good for him. Richie was seriously underpaid, where's the reaction to that? In any case, stop acting like it's your money.

    We used the DP slot on Jozy and that made sense to most people when we did it. What choice did we have? What evidence do you really have that the team is willing or able to spend 6M a year on someone else when he is gone? You know that slot will be used next on someone a lot cheaper.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I hate the way Jozy is treated around here. People calling him names are ingrates.

    He was overpaid last year but who cares. He's legend. Good for him. Richie was seriously underpaid, where's the reaction to that? In any case, stop acting like it's your money.

    We used the DP slot on Jozy and that made sense to most people when we did it. What choice did we have? What evidence do you really have that the team is willing or able to spend 6M a year on someone else when he is gone? You know that slot will be used next on someone a lot cheaper.
    This last bit here is my biggest takeaway from the Armas process. Management is more trying to be economical than playing it safe by not sacking old guard (Vanney, Bradley, Jozy) when it may be advantageous to transition away. This club is heading into an era of NYCFC after their names left imo.

    When you consider that Jozy was never going to be replaced with another big money striker it makes a shit ton of sense that we kept him.

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    Rollins article about Armas hire:

    One of the best new stats in sports is Value Over Replacement Player, or VORP as it is commonly called.

    VORP is great because it allows you to put a value on the overall contribution of a player. Looking at multiple aspects of their game. It also allows you to compare players of different eras, as it standardizes individual statistics from year to year.

    [moderator edit:] full article here: https://24thminute.substack.com/
    Last edited by Oldtimer; 01-14-2021 at 05:30 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    Jozy doesn't work in even the most methodical press. If TFC Armas is anything like RB Armas then there's really no place for Jozy. Akinola would be far better as the 1 up top than Loafy.
    This is a bit unfair to Jozy. He played in the wide midfield after tactical adjustments during a couple of games last season and actually worked quite hard. Huffing and puffing, but worked (and did not complain)

  21. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I hate the way Jozy is treated around here. People calling him names are ingrates.

    He was overpaid last year but who cares. He's legend. Good for him. Richie was seriously underpaid, where's the reaction to that? In any case, stop acting like it's your money.

    We used the DP slot on Jozy and that made sense to most people when we did it. What choice did we have? What evidence do you really have that the team is willing or able to spend 6M a year on someone else when he is gone? You know that slot will be used next on someone a lot cheaper.
    Jozy may well surprise people this year. And I am with Ensco. Legend.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamp Berg View Post
    Rollins article about Armas hire:
    Actually a good and interesting article.
    Last edited by Oldtimer; 01-14-2021 at 05:31 PM. Reason: delete quotation

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I hate the way Jozy is treated around here. People calling him names are ingrates.

    He was overpaid last year but who cares. He's legend. Good for him. Richie was seriously underpaid, where's the reaction to that? In any case, stop acting like it's your money.

    We used the DP slot on Jozy and that made sense to most people when we did it. What choice did we have? What evidence do you really have that the team is willing or able to spend 6M a year on someone else when he is gone? You know that slot will be used next on someone a lot cheaper.
    This is brilliant and should be stickied to the top of every thread on this forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    This is a bit unfair to Jozy. He played in the wide midfield after tactical adjustments during a couple of games last season and actually worked quite hard. Huffing and puffing, but worked (and did not complain)

    This - specifically the NYRB game.

    My issue with Jozy is I don't think he can play as a lone striker and Poz can't be that striker and that means a 4-3-1-2 but Bradley can't be the DM anymore and then where do you put Osorio?

    All needs a rethink and "pressing" isn't necessarily the right answer.

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    Jozy can both be a legend (which he is) and not fit what the team needs anymore.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeForbes View Post
    Jozy can both be a legend (which he is) and not fit what the team needs anymore.
    Fair enough. But that's rather different than the trashing he is taking from some on here.

    I like what Smokecell said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    Actually a good and interesting article.
    Seriously though why is the whole article posted here. Give them link or tell people to subscribe to read.
    It's bloody free.
    At least let the guy get a few more subscribers. We have so few content creators doing good work about TFC. This is disrespectful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    This - specifically the NYRB game.

    My issue with Jozy is I don't think he can play as a lone striker and Poz can't be that striker and that means a 4-3-1-2 but Bradley can't be the DM anymore and then where do you put Osorio?

    All needs a rethink and "pressing" isn't necessarily the right answer.
    I think Bradley drops down the pecking order. He is clearly losing, more than a step now. He was just bad in the playoffs, and at the end of the season.
    This needs to become Oso and Delgado as the base of the midfield. The kids need to be pushing Bradley for that rotation spit in midfield.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    This is a bit unfair to Jozy. He played in the wide midfield after tactical adjustments during a couple of games last season and actually worked quite hard. Huffing and puffing, but worked (and did not complain)
    But at that point he was already chronically under performing. Huffing and puffing was the price of not walking the proverbial plank.

    Honestly given his body type and such, I’m not expecting him to be that sort of player. Few guys can carry that much bulk and race around the field for 90 minutes. We just need him to score.

    On the other side, I think any strategy we implement should at least be partially reflective of our roster and / or exiting training methods. Just not sure Altidore has any major part in that. Directionally, he’s leaving and will play a smaller part in our setup. Whether it’s this year, next year, or at the end of his contract in 2.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bought with blo View Post
    I think Bradley drops down the pecking order. He is clearly losing, more than a step now. He was just bad in the playoffs, and at the end of the season.
    This needs to become Oso and Delgado as the base of the midfield. The kids need to be pushing Bradley for that rotation spit in midfield.
    I’m less concerned about his pace and more concerned about his tendency to sit just off the backline and act as a single pivot.

    Other teams just shut us down immediately when he’s doing that. He needs to be able to adjust his positioning and allow the other central mid to drop deep as well. You’d have to believe he’s capable. But I also haven’t seen a lot of examples of this yet.

 

 

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