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  1. #121
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    Why wasn’t this Forge v TFC game played last year, anyways? Anybody know?
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Why wasn’t this Forge v TFC game played last year, anyways? Anybody know?
    One thing was Forge was in Central America for almost a month and half for CONCACAF League, there first match was Oct. 22 and the last December 8th.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

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    This says they camped in the Dominican only after Nov 23.

    https://www.thespec.com/sports/hamil...-honduras.html

    TFC didn’t play between November 8 and November 24. Forge didn’t play between November 3 and December 1. Seems to me this could have been sorted.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soccerpro View Post
    All the upcoming Canada games this month will be on Onesoccer....
    Ugh. Too many streaming services now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    This says they camped in the Dominican only after Nov 23.

    https://www.thespec.com/sports/hamil...-honduras.html

    TFC didn’t play between November 8 and November 24. Forge didn’t play between November 3 and December 1. Seems to me this could have been sorted.
    Maybe Vanney leaving had something to do with it. Didn’t he announce his departure on Dec.2?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    This says they camped in the Dominican only after Nov 23.

    https://www.thespec.com/sports/hamil...-honduras.html

    TFC didn’t play between November 8 and November 24. Forge didn’t play between November 3 and December 1. Seems to me this could have been sorted.
    Quarantine in and out not really possible under those circumstances to get a game in between. Game would not have been allowed in Ontario at the time so TFC wasn't coming back to Canada & Hamilton going to the US then onto other countries was not going to be allowed by the countries they were going to.

    IIRC, one of the reasons the game against Haiti was played in the Dominican was Haiti didn't like how Covid was going in Canada at the time.
    Last edited by OgtheDim; 03-07-2021 at 08:36 AM.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    This says they camped in the Dominican only after Nov 23.

    https://www.thespec.com/sports/hamil...-honduras.html

    TFC didn’t play between November 8 and November 24. Forge didn’t play between November 3 and December 1. Seems to me this could have been sorted.
    Here we go, the stayed in Central America for their first two games, on October 22 and November 3rd, returned to Hamilton, quarantined for two weeks and were allowed to return to training on the 19th of November, trained for two days in Hamilton and then flew to Dominican Republic to prepare for the game on December 1st. This is all based on reading tweets.

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  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    This says they camped in the Dominican only after Nov 23.

    https://www.thespec.com/sports/hamil...-honduras.html

    TFC didn’t play between November 8 and November 24. Forge didn’t play between November 3 and December 1. Seems to me this could have been sorted.
    We're talking about the CSA here. Even without a pandemic they're 50/50 on screwing up everything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Quarantine in and out not really possible under those circumstances to get a game in between. Game would not have been allowed in Ontario at the time so TFC wasn't coming back to Canada & Hamilton going to the US then onto other countries was not going to be allowed by the countries they were going to.

    IIRC, one of the reasons the game against Haiti was played in the Dominican was Haiti didn't like how Covid was going in Canada at the time.
    OK I get it now. Thanks.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    This says they camped in the Dominican only after Nov 23.

    https://www.thespec.com/sports/hamil...-honduras.html

    TFC didn’t play between November 8 and November 24. Forge didn’t play between November 3 and December 1. Seems to me this could have been sorted.
    They wouldn't have arrived home until November 4. Two-week quarantine would have ended on November 18 - and at that point, Hamilton hadn't trained in 2 weeks. TFC was back in the USA by then.

    I suppose they could have played on Connecticut around November 12 or so ... but I thought Hamilton was opposed to going to the USA.

    Also by November 3, all Hamilton had to do was win one of their next 2 CONCACAF League matches, and the whole thing would have been moot.

    The bigger question is how did Hamilton Forge fail to get their approval to start training? They've known since November 2020 that the game could be played no later than March 21, 2021, with CSA in November announcing the game would be played before the end of March, and there being an international break starting March 22.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nfitz View Post
    ...

    The bigger question is how did Hamilton Forge fail to get their approval to start training? They've known since November 2020 that the game could be played no later than March 21, 2021, with CSA in November announcing the game would be played before the end of March, and there being an international break starting March 22.
    They have known since the Island games they would need to get approval for training at some point. They couldn't get their ducks in a row - or wouldn't do so because it costs too much.

    Pure spec from Rollins yesterday was Forge is going to forfeit, know it, and are trying to put the blame on big bad MLS/ Toronto / MLSE.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    They have known since the Island games they would need to get approval for training at some point. They couldn't get their ducks in a row - or wouldn't do so because it costs too much.

    Pure spec from Rollins yesterday was Forge is going to forfeit, know it, and are trying to put the blame on big bad MLS/ Toronto / MLSE.
    There is a lot of suggestion at least over on the Vs board that the issue for the Forge comes down to the CSA not setting a firm date, that if a date had been set a while back they would have be able to get permission to train. That to get permission that they needed to be training for something specific but that sounds too simple to me. The CPL said the approached the government in October to get Forge an exemption so wonder where that went, if they gave one to TFC would they not have to do the same for Forge, can not look like there was a double standard, but I do not know. There is no doubt Covid protocols are costly right now and a lot of companies are looking forward to the days that they are no longer necessary but currently that is the cost of doing business during this pandemic.

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    Amazing to see the difference in discussion here and in the Canadian soccer forums where TFC are seen as pure evil

    I think this should have either been played in the States in the fall or at least scheduled earlier but I'm pretty unimpressed by Forge acting shocked that this game was scheduled before the CCL start

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    ...The CPL said the approached the government in October to get Forge an exemption so wonder where that went, if they gave one to TFC would they not have to do the same for Forge, can not look like there was a double standard, but I do not know. There is no doubt Covid protocols are costly right now and a lot of companies are looking forward to the days that they are no longer necessary but currently that is the cost of doing business during this pandemic.
    Assuming CPL approached, they would have to provide protocols for how stuff would be done, same as MLSE/MLS did.

    Its not like MLS just went up to Public Health Canada & Public Health Ontario/BC/Quebec & said, "We are MLS. Let us play." That didn't even work with the NHL & hasn't worked with Major Junior hockey in a lot of Canada - both of which are institutions with a lot of political power.

    The idea that the date needed to exist to provide public health support doesn't jive with how every other approval went down.

    I get that Forge/CPL fans are miffed but at some point you have to look at your owners and hold them accountable. I get the love for Bob Young but as I explained before, he has form for letting bonehead decisions occur by people he has hired.

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    Forge tweeting out information this morning



    Confirmation they have been trying but just havn't been able to get Public Health approval for training.

    Fault for that is with somebody, but it certainly isn't TFC/MLS/MLSE.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Forge tweeting out information this morning



    Confirmation they have been trying but just havn't been able to get Public Health approval for training.

    Fault for that is with somebody, but it certainly isn't TFC/MLS/MLSE.
    I know each case for exemption will be evaluated on its own merit , so I am curious what did MLSE/TFC offer up/do that Forge/CPL did not, is it testing, is it having their own secure training facility, were the risks to the community deemed to be different. I assume the government has a check list for these type of things like they would for any work place. God I do not envy the HR types that have had to deal with these protocols/situations on a daily basis.

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    Well TFC got COVID now, just to make it fair for everyone... :-/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    Well TFC got COVID now, just to make it fair for everyone... :-/
    Quarantine means that there likely will be TFC players missing for this key match.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Quarantine means that there likely will be TFC players missing for this key match.
    Yes, plus for now the whole team isn’t training.

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    Obviously we don't have the full picture of the requirements the Gov't has for allowing a team to train but if I had to bet, my gut tells me that Forge lack some resource which is a sticking point for approval. TFC is a part of MLSE. They have all the necessary resources to meet ANY standard the Gov't has no matter the cost. That simply isn't the same for Forge. And if I had to guess why they have yet to gain approval, my sense is that Forge is unable to meet some standard that has been met by the other Major sports.

    CPL teams have a $1M budget for the whole organization. They have players earning sub-poverty level wages. Do they even have the resources to run a short, bubbled training camp? TFC leased an entire hotel and a stadium, chartered flights, employed and housed staff to care for, feed, and treat the team while bubbled, in order to participate in last year's season.

    I can easily imagine the 2 proposals that would have come before the gov't and why they may be viewed differently. And let's not forget that the Blue Jays ran training camp last year with incredibly strict rules (i.e. not being able to leave the hotel connected to the stadium). It's not like the gov't is being punitively harsh to just Forge.

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    Financials would not be an issue when it comes to Forge owners and CPL co-founder Bob Young.

    Quote Originally Posted by PaceyWinger View Post
    Obviously we don't have the full picture of the requirements the Gov't has for allowing a team to train but if I had to bet, my gut tells me that Forge lack some resource which is a sticking point for approval. TFC is a part of MLSE. They have all the necessary resources to meet ANY standard the Gov't has no matter the cost. That simply isn't the same for Forge. And if I had to guess why they have yet to gain approval, my sense is that Forge is unable to meet some standard that has been met by the other Major sports.

    CPL teams have a $1M budget for the whole organization. They have players earning sub-poverty level wages. Do they even have the resources to run a short, bubbled training camp? TFC leased an entire hotel and a stadium, chartered flights, employed and housed staff to care for, feed, and treat the team while bubbled, in order to participate in last year's season.

    I can easily imagine the 2 proposals that would have come before the gov't and why they may be viewed differently. And let's not forget that the Blue Jays ran training camp last year with incredibly strict rules (i.e. not being able to leave the hotel connected to the stadium). It's not like the gov't is being punitively harsh to just Forge.

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    Suspect dedicated single use facilities are an issue. Leafs and TFC own their own training facilities and 100% control access to them 24/7. Easy to imagine that being a criteria... I have no idea how or where CPL teams train but I am willing to bet they generally “beg, borrow and steal”...
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    Onesoccer are reporting that the finals are being postponed. Tfc will be given the ccl qualification while Forge get to host the finals, if it ever actually gets played.

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    Seen no confirmation apart from one tweet showing a screen grab of a 3 person discussion including Wheeler with a headline below.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Seen no confirmation apart from one tweet showing a screen grab of a 3 person discussion including Wheeler with a headline below.
    Wow, I haven't posted here for almost a decade lol.

    When I tweeted that I was also paranoid, surprised at the radio silence. You have to go on the onesoccer platform to see the segment. I actually have it recorded - but apparently journalists were expecting a CSA press release and was caught off guard when it never came out.

    In the segment, they claim that this was negotiated with Forge. How there were concerns that the province has still not granted Forge permission to train - so in a hypothetical situation where the situation was reversed with Forge being granted the CCL spot, they wouldn't be able to play the game vs Leon anyways because of match fitness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SirBobSaget View Post
    Onesoccer are reporting that the finals are being postponed. Tfc will be given the ccl qualification while Forge get to host the finals, if it ever actually gets played.
    If this is true, what a crappy way to decide the CCL spot. Embarrassing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flamehawk View Post
    Wow, I haven't posted here for almost a decade lol.

    When I tweeted that I was also paranoid, surprised at the radio silence. You have to go on the onesoccer platform to see the segment. I actually have it recorded - but apparently journalists were expecting a CSA press release and was caught off guard when it never came out.

    In the segment, they claim that this was negotiated with Forge. How there were concerns that the province has still not granted Forge permission to train - so in a hypothetical situation where the situation was reversed with Forge being granted the CCL spot, they wouldn't be able to play the game vs Leon anyways because of match fitness.
    LOL... Thanks for the clarification - sorry if I came over a tad blunt - I deal with disinformation at work about Covid and that mindset of "check everything" sometimes leaks into this forum


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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    LOL... Thanks for the clarification - sorry if I came over a tad blunt - I deal with disinformation at work about Covid and that mindset of "check everything" sometimes leaks into this forum


    Oh yea, no worries, like I said, I started to think I had imagined it when I was the only one tweeting about it (other than the journalist that deleted their tweet shortly after posting). That's why I reloaded onesoccer to rewatch and record lol.

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    And now confirmed

    TBD remains TBD

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    Bring on Leon! Worst case scenario it will be a really good preseason for the guys.

 

 

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