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    Default Regulear Season - Phase 1 Game 1 Whitecaps @ TFC Tuesday August 18 8pm




    **********

    Have at It People

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    This is BS, let the adults make the choice if they want to go or not? There were just under 3,000K at the Dallas game Wednesday night and as such those that attended make that choice. Don't tread on me, If I can go to movie I can go to a game. Not sure i would but at least I want a choice. Fuck this Canadian BS.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    This is BS, let the adults make the choice if they want to go or not? There were just under 3,000K at the Dallas game Wednesday night and as such those that attended make that choice. Don't tread on me, If I can go to movie I can go to a game. Not sure i would but at least I want a choice. Fuck this Canadian BS.

    You and I will have to agree to disagree on this point. In fact my mindset is that we should not even be playing the remainder of the year. People's health and well being will always trump sports in my books. The disease is a lung shredder and leaves behind a wake of long term health issues that we are only just scratching the surface of. On the other hand I do see and respect your point of "my body my choice." As a grown adult you should be allowed to make your own choices on how to live your life provided they fall within the laws of the land.

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    Vancouver as a team is hard to read for me. They can put the ball in the net as shown in the tournament and that was without Cavallini in the line up. Their defense however is shambolic and now without their number 1 keeper they are even worse in the back. I am going with 3-2 for the good guys in this one.

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    Very interesting that this 'Phase' also acts as the qualification for the Canadian Championship.

    Just like the old days!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    This is BS, let the adults make the choice if they want to go or not? There were just under 3,000K at the Dallas game Wednesday night and as such those that attended make that choice. Don't tread on me, If I can go to movie I can go to a game. Not sure i would but at least I want a choice. Fuck this Canadian BS.

    I will say this only once

    A group of 25 within Toronto has a liklihood of 0.6% of somebody being there with Covid

    A group of 2.5K within Toronto would have a liklihood of 43.3% of there being a person with covid at it.

    &

    Infectious period starts & peaks BEFORE symptom onset


    Conclusion:

    You don't get to make this choice because Covid does not care about whether you choose or not and others you run into CAN'T make that choice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    I will say this only once

    A group of 25 within Toronto has a liklihood of 0.6% of somebody being there with Covid

    A group of 2.5K within Toronto would have a liklihood of 43.3% of there being a person with covid at it.

    &

    Infectious period starts & peaks BEFORE symptom onset


    Conclusion:

    You don't get to make this choice because Covid does not care about whether you choose or not and others you run into CAN'T make that choice.
    I get different numbers (0.26% and 26.25%), but this also assumes none of the people who have tested positive are self-isolating for 14 days. I'm not sure that is a reasonable assumption--in fact, I would assume the vast majority of those testing positive would be self-isolating. Of course, there are always the unknown, untested, undiagnosed people, but the positive test numbers have been around 0.26% (for all of Ontario, including Windsor) of all daily tests--but those numbers would also be high for the general population since people with symptoms are much more likely to seek out testing. I believe your numbers are way past worse case scenario.

    However, your final conclusion is accurate--the virus does not care about percentage odds, etc.--anyone could be that 0.26% person.

    I would temper the comments regarding the peak of infectiousness--that is still a much debated concept and likely won't be resolved without much cleaner data, which will take some time to assemble.

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    This is not about your freedom, it's about being a decent fucking human being and not giving it to other people who may not have the ability to go cope with the virus.

    This Canadian "BS" seems to be working, you want to join the American Yahoos, then be my guest and pack your bags.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    This is BS, let the adults make the choice if they want to go or not? There were just under 3,000K at the Dallas game Wednesday night and as such those that attended make that choice. Don't tread on me, If I can go to movie I can go to a game. Not sure i would but at least I want a choice. Fuck this Canadian BS.
    CB I love you man, but I have to vehemently disagree with you. This and your whole travel to the US for a game thing is so wrong headed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Graeme View Post

    I would temper the comments regarding the peak of infectiousness--that is still a much debated concept and likely won't be resolved without much cleaner data, which will take some time to assemble.
    Fair comment

    I got that from a study from June retweeted by a respected Toronto based epidemiologist (David Fisman) again this morning. The study agreed with you about needing cleaner data. All good.


    ************
    I understand the desire for a return to normal. My life is not normal either.

    I'm a front line worker in a declared essential service where social distancing is not possible to do our jobs - me and my team are the people with the face shields etc. taking temperatures of staff as they arrive.
    I'm not in medical - I ain't no hero - that's my neice the ER nurse & IIRC also some people in here.

    There are thousands of people like me across this city trying to keep you all in stuff so your lives can be a bit normal. The amount of us doing that in this city is going to grow x10 in the next few weeks. Many of my colleagues come from the poorer neighbourhoods of Toronto, with multiple generations in a household and are working because they have no choice how to put food on the table (I don't really either, to be honest, but I'm here so there we go). If you've seen the Toronto Star articles, you know about where I'm talking about.

    This is our reality. Face masks, as good PPE as is available, taking transit to and from work, unable to social distance completely, unable to work from home - numerous people in a setting. So, I have a personal & professional interest in people in this town taking Covid 19 seriously.


    And some people, in wanting to get back to what normal was, in trying to do what we all want to do - well they are going to endanger others - somebody like me, somebody like my team, somebody like the people I am hiring, they or their families are going to be the ones that pay the price.

    As I said, I ain't no hero medical person (ya'll really should be thinking about your relatives but it seems people need to think about somebody noble to take this seriously).

    But I'm not going to support in any way behaviour that strongly if indirectly puts me, my colleagues, and our families (not to mention all of you, your colleagues & families) at risk. Which is why if Montreal DOES open up to a crowd, I will completely ignore that game. And which is why I am pretty much compelled to respond at least once to somebody wanting Toronto games to be open to the public.


    Fin
    Last edited by OgtheDim; 08-14-2020 at 10:36 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    This is BS, let the adults make the choice if they want to go or not? There were just under 3,000K at the Dallas game Wednesday night and as such those that attended make that choice. Don't tread on me, If I can go to movie I can go to a game. Not sure i would but at least I want a choice. Fuck this Canadian BS.

    Whether you wear a bike helmet on a bicycle is 100% your choice. If you get a concussion only you are directly affected.

    If you get COVID-19, not only are you affected but those you come into contact with, and their contacts as well. Is it worth someone's grandma dying to see a football match live? It's not about politically correct BS (which I agree we have too much of), it's about considering others.


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    As adults, we all know freedom of choice isn't in an individual vacuum. If your choice infringes my freedom it can be limited. The classic example is yelling 'fire' in a movie theatre. A public health crisis with a communicable disease meets that test I'd say. Even so, we also accept measures that only protect individuals, like having to wear a seat belt.

    We've done fairly well in Canada, and reopening phases have been rolled out methodically. There is some push and pull as political officials make the call and have to decide whether to accept professional expert advice or no, but I'm sure most Canadians prefer our strategy and outcomes to that of the US.
    That's all I'll say about that.

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    We play in about 104 hours.


    I think we will go with the same group as played in Orlando - maybe shouldn't go with that, but I think we will go with that.

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    Didn't realize this was on Tuesday. That is my evening sorted.

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    6 Games in 21 days, Does Jozy play, is Akinola healthy? When is the transfer window this year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmancan View Post
    6 Games in 21 days, Does Jozy play, is Akinola healthy? When is the transfer window this year.
    Transfer window is now open.

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    So is BMO field under the NHL bubble? Would be interesting to see NHL players in the stands during the games...

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    I'm glad there will be semblance of continuity to the season. I also agree with keeping the stands empty for the time being, as unfortunate as that may be.

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    If I got Covid I can assure you that i would never put anyone at risk , I would happily be staying home ordering take out each day. People who take the TTC on a daily basis are really taking a chance, it is not worth the risk in my eyes. I got out of Toronto the moment this pandemic hit, staying at my families place in the country. It was the best place to be. Having been in bars a number of times in the last couple of weeks, people are being really respectful here in Toronto minus a few examples of stupid stuff.

    If they let people into BMO in a smart way the risk would not be great. Outdoor transmission is pretty low compared to an indoor setting. They would spread people out and have a police in the aisles to keep things in check, making sure people are respecting social distancing. It is really not that hard to do. It just comes down to a thoughtful process.

    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Fair comment

    I got that from a study from June retweeted by a respected Toronto based epidemiologist (David Fisman) again this morning. The study agreed with you about needing cleaner data. All good.


    ************
    I understand the desire for a return to normal. My life is not normal either.

    I'm a front line worker in a declared essential service where social distancing is not possible to do our jobs - me and my team are the people with the face shields etc. taking temperatures of staff as they arrive.
    I'm not in medical - I ain't no hero - that's my neice the ER nurse & IIRC also some people in here.

    There are thousands of people like me across this city trying to keep you all in stuff so your lives can be a bit normal. The amount of us doing that in this city is going to grow x10 in the next few weeks. Many of my colleagues come from the poorer neighbourhoods of Toronto, with multiple generations in a household and are working because they have no choice how to put food on the table (I don't really either, to be honest, but I'm here so there we go). If you've seen the Toronto Star articles, you know about where I'm talking about.

    This is our reality. Face masks, as good PPE as is available, taking transit to and from work, unable to social distance completely, unable to work from home - numerous people in a setting. So, I have a personal & professional interest in people in this town taking Covid 19 seriously.


    And some people, in wanting to get back to what normal was, in trying to do what we all want to do - well they are going to endanger others - somebody like me, somebody like my team, somebody like the people I am hiring, they or their families are going to be the ones that pay the price.

    As I said, I ain't no hero medical person (ya'll really should be thinking about your relatives but it seems people need to think about somebody noble to take this seriously).

    But I'm not going to support in any way behaviour that strongly if indirectly puts me, my colleagues, and our families (not to mention all of you, your colleagues & families) at risk. Which is why if Montreal DOES open up to a crowd, I will completely ignore that game. And which is why I am pretty much compelled to respond at least once to somebody wanting Toronto games to be open to the public.


    Fin

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Whether you wear a bike helmet on a bicycle is 100% your choice. If you get a concussion only you are directly affected.

    If you get COVID-19, not only are you affected but those you come into contact with, and their contacts as well. Is it worth someone's grandma dying to see a football match live? It's not about politically correct BS (which I agree we have too much of), it's about considering others.
    If I get Covid I can assure you I would not be exposing it others I would lock myself in my home and stay there, living off of delivery etc. That is common sense.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    If I got Covid I can assure you that i would never put anyone at risk , I would happily be staying home ordering take out each day. People who take the TTC on a daily basis are really taking a chance, it is not worth the risk in my eyes. I got out of Toronto the moment this pandemic hit, staying at my families place in the country. It was the best place to be. Having been in bars a number of times in the last couple of weeks, people are being really respectful here in Toronto minus a few examples of stupid stuff.

    If they let people into BMO in a smart way the risk would not be great. Outdoor transmission is pretty low compared to an indoor setting. They would spread people out and have a police in the aisles to keep things in check, making sure people are respecting social distancing. It is really not that hard to do. It just comes down to a thoughtful process.
    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    If I get Covid I can assure you I would not be exposing it others I would lock myself in my home and stay there, living off of delivery etc. That is common sense.
    Often you will have no idea you have Covid until after you have been infectious. In fact you can be infectious w/o having any symptoms. And if you get seriously ill, you'll have to go to the hospital, therefore creating risk for those treating you, and costing our public healthcare system which is funded by our tax dollars. (BTW even though younger people w/o pre-existing conditions don't die often, lots of them have had to go to the hospital, and lots of them have lasting damage to organs such as lungs and blood vessels, with unknown long-term effects.)

    Also studies have shown that public transit is much less dangerous than settings such as bars: people need to take their masks off to drink & eat in a bar; there's lots of loud talking which is a great way to spew up the virus; people face each other as they talk; people often stay in bars much longer than they do in public transit; people are much less likely to follow rules after they've had a few; and such locations are often not well ventilated. Could be that the places you've visited have been pretty well run. But a few examples of stupid stuff are enough to cause infections. There have been hundred cases of infection around the world linked to bars, including some super-spreader events. As far as I know there are no cases that have been proven to be tied to public transit; at least it's very rare.

    Somebody else can explain the issues with larger events such as sports...
    Last edited by Auzzy; 08-14-2020 at 11:24 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mastermixer View Post
    So is BMO field under the NHL bubble? Would be interesting to see NHL players in the stands during the games...
    Yes. Including barricades and security guards.
    "Failure simply isn't an option at this stage. TFC pushed its chips to the middle of the table when it splurged on Bradley and Defoe and reinforced its bet by making savvy acquisitions elsewhere. This collection of players is capable of delivering on the promises made during the close season. There are no more excuses available for TFC. Only success will continue the process of atoning for the past and establishing a higher standard for the future." FOX Sports

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bushmancan View Post
    6 Games in 21 days, Does Jozy play, is Akinola healthy? When is the transfer window this year.
    Jozy wasn't game ready, and was lazy about coming to training, why do we give him so much leeway, he is becoming the fat out of shape Wayne Rooney type player, 10 -20 minutes off of the bench.

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    On one hand Jozy is behind only Giovinco in all time goals. On the other, he once got injured taking a pk, and does not always seem engaged. At this point we are definitely paying him for past performance. As a club you can't be ruthless with all of your aging stars.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    If I got Covid I can assure you that i would never put anyone at risk , I would happily be staying home ordering take out each day. People who take the TTC on a daily basis are really taking a chance, it is not worth the risk in my eyes. I got out of Toronto the moment this pandemic hit, staying at my families place in the country. It was the best place to be. Having been in bars a number of times in the last couple of weeks, people are being really respectful here in Toronto minus a few examples of stupid stuff.

    If they let people into BMO in a smart way the risk would not be great. Outdoor transmission is pretty low compared to an indoor setting. They would spread people out and have a police in the aisles to keep things in check, making sure people are respecting social distancing. It is really not that hard to do. It just comes down to a thoughtful process.
    If you got Covid you wouldn't even know you've transmitted it to other people until days at best after your symptoms appeared. How do you think it travelled from China to basically everywhere on earth in a matter of weeks. You're not that good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PaceyWinger View Post
    If you got Covid you wouldn't even know you've transmitted it to other people until days at best after your symptoms appeared. How do you think it travelled from China to basically everywhere on earth in a matter of weeks. You're not that good.
    That is why getting tested on a regular basis is key.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Whether you wear a bike helmet on a bicycle is 100% your choice. If you get a concussion only you are directly affected.

    If you get COVID-19, not only are you affected but those you come into contact with, and their contacts as well. Is it worth someone's grandma dying to see a football match live? It's not about politically correct BS (which I agree we have too much of), it's about considering others.
    I thought bike helmets were mandatory too ... (?)

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    Thanks to everyone on here that is actually posting about TFC game/roster decisions In this thread. All I see/hear is Covid news EVERYWHERE, and to be perfectly honest, I hate reading about it in here. Can’t someone who’s interested in “everything covid” create their own thread and leave this one to people who just want to escape it for a bit and read/discuss soccer? Sorry if this sounds harsh, but let’s keep on topic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by James17930 View Post
    I thought bike helmets were mandatory too ... (?)
    In Ontario, bike helmets are only mandatory for cyclists under age 18.

    But yeah let’s focus on the game rather than all this other stuff.

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    I will be in Montreal loud and proud, Toronto FC til I die. See I live life like today is my last, the spectacular now. Front line workers going to work is their choice ,they made it, that does not mean I can not live my life.

    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Fair comment

    I got that from a study from June retweeted by a respected Toronto based epidemiologist (David Fisman) again this morning. The study agreed with you about needing cleaner data. All good.


    ************
    I understand the desire for a return to normal. My life is not normal either.

    I'm a front line worker in a declared essential service where social distancing is not possible to do our jobs - me and my team are the people with the face shields etc. taking temperatures of staff as they arrive.
    I'm not in medical - I ain't no hero - that's my neice the ER nurse & IIRC also some people in here.

    There are thousands of people like me across this city trying to keep you all in stuff so your lives can be a bit normal. The amount of us doing that in this city is going to grow x10 in the next few weeks. Many of my colleagues come from the poorer neighbourhoods of Toronto, with multiple generations in a household and are working because they have no choice how to put food on the table (I don't really either, to be honest, but I'm here so there we go). If you've seen the Toronto Star articles, you know about where I'm talking about.

    This is our reality. Face masks, as good PPE as is available, taking transit to and from work, unable to social distance completely, unable to work from home - numerous people in a setting. So, I have a personal & professional interest in people in this town taking Covid 19 seriously.


    And some people, in wanting to get back to what normal was, in trying to do what we all want to do - well they are going to endanger others - somebody like me, somebody like my team, somebody like the people I am hiring, they or their families are going to be the ones that pay the price.

    As I said, I ain't no hero medical person (ya'll really should be thinking about your relatives but it seems people need to think about somebody noble to take this seriously).

    But I'm not going to support in any way behaviour that strongly if indirectly puts me, my colleagues, and our families (not to mention all of you, your colleagues & families) at risk. Which is why if Montreal DOES open up to a crowd, I will completely ignore that game. And which is why I am pretty much compelled to respond at least once to somebody wanting Toronto games to be open to the public.


    Fin

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

 

 

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