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  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Talk that Mavinga asked to come off at the same time. May not have been planned.
    Until the player physically comes off they can cancel a sub. Vanney easily could've told Omar to stay once Mavinga asked to come off.
    I've seen a player walking off, the 4th official with the sign up and numbers on and then cancelled last second.

  2. #242
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    Don't know if anyone else feels this way, but sports seems unimportant these days.

  3. #243
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    Something in the back of my head tells me we are missing RFs counsel on the bench. That was as bizarre a substitution as you’ll ever see. If you want to rotate your squad you do it at half time, and if a defender is injured you sub him alone. Common sense dictates you upset your backline as little as possible during live play, no matter the scoreline.

    Im also increasingly worried about this blind spot Vanney has for his nephew. Given some of the players we’ve released in recent times it is baffling Zavaletta is still in the squad.

    I’d be more content to take this on the chin if I thought we would learn from this but evidence shows that we won’t. TFC seem utterly incapable of seeing out games no matter the advantage they have.

  4. #244
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    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2020/...inst-dc-united

    Okay, this makes more sense...

    "Ten minutes into the second half, Omar is cramping up and can't take a step," Vanney said. "Right before the water break, Chris is cramping up. This is the first game in extreme temperatures, so the question becomes: How much do you push guys in the first game of a tournament, the first game in months? So we went with the changes. It really disrupted our ability to start attacks, keep possession and also we struggled in some transition defending."
    I'd drop MB4 to CB and bring on Fraser for DM... actually is Fraser even dressed?
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  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by rydermike View Post
    Zavaleta tried to draw a free kick on the second goal. You're a centre back, you need to be strong in your own box and get the ball out no matter how, not trying to be cute and draw a free kick.
    Wow, good call, I just figured it was one of our mids that got out jumped there. Really terrible play from someone who is counted on to do those sorts of things game in and game out.

    Anyway, I look at this more as pre-season /sideshow more than anything else. Really hard to take this tournament seriously.

    Just want to see how the young guys look and the guys coming off injuries.

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by pekduck View Post
    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2020/...inst-dc-united

    Okay, this makes more sense...



    I'd drop MB4 to CB and bring on Fraser for DM... actually is Fraser even dressed?
    agreed. Neither Zavaleta or Ciman is capable of organizing.

  7. #247
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    Upon second look at the highlights, I don't think I can blame Zavaleta for either of those goals as much as I would blame Ciman. The only thing that I would blame Zavaleta for is losing the aerial duel on the set piece in stoppage time. Both goals, however, should be placed on Ciman's feet, one for the risky pass (instead of passing back to Westberg), and the other for not contesting the second header.

  8. #248
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    Ciman has regressed quite badly from his Montreal days and it is only gonna get worse. Anyone know how much longer his contract runs for?

  9. #249
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    I'd like to see a rule (by handshake) for the next game...TFC vs Montreal with them both agreeing to play with Canadian Championship rules (!?). That means they each start with three CANADIAN starters. Today TFC had no Canadian starters and brought in Richie Laryea for the second half. Blame the tie on an old French guy and the coach's nephew. When will the Canadians play? "Oh we've got to win the next game and we've got to win the last group game and we've got to win each knockout game or we're out". I guess TFC needs a 3-0 lead or to be behind by three goals before we see some of their young Canadians.

  10. #250
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    This team needs to put Pozuelo as an attacking midfielder not a number 9. He's to slow and we can leverage his best assets if he plays as a CAM the same way Vazquez did. He can produce up top because he's one of the best player in MLS but I feel he would be more dominant as a no 10.

  11. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by noimpactinmtl View Post
    Upon second look at the highlights, I don't think I can blame Zavaleta for either of those goals as much as I would blame Ciman. The only thing that I would blame Zavaleta for is losing the aerial duel on the set piece in stoppage time. Both goals, however, should be placed on Ciman's feet, one for the risky pass (instead of passing back to Westberg), and the other for not contesting the second header.
    I don't even blame either Zavs or Ciman much – it was more the strategy of 'trying to waste time and kill the game off' that I hate. We should've been pressing for that third goal.

  12. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by James17930 View Post
    I don't even blame either Zavs or Ciman much – it was more the strategy of 'trying to waste time and kill the game off' that I hate. We should've been pressing for that third goal.
    Agreed. It sends the wrong message to the team.

    I hope that today's result makes the boys that much hungrier on Thursday.

  13. #253
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    I stayed away (the time was awkward for me anyway), all I knew was the score, just watched the highlights, then came on the board here.

    All the agonizing about blowing the lead, meh. Seeing Akinola create that strike, and then crack it, that was the big thing. Especially with Achara out for many months, this is a must. If defenders have to start respecting Ayo, watch out. Go Ayo!

    Otherwise, we learned that if you pull down Pozo, we have no attack, and if you pull down Mavinga and Gonzalez, we are maybe not that good at the back.

    I think we knew that already.

    Now for the rant: Vanney made an EXCELLENT decision to try to play the percentages and protect important guys. That mattered WAY MORE than this stupid game. Good for him! We should have Vanney's back 150% on this, not criticize him. (I want him using all five subs, he should use them at halftime, btw)

    I want every decision heavily influenced by the desire to protect guys. I want to see NOBODY in an effing Florida hospital right now. Nobody. That heat/humidity creates the potential for injuries all by itself, especially as DCU was gooning it up in 4 minutes of highlights, so I assume all game (as less talented teams do).

    I am disappointed seeing so many usually thoughtful people here getting caught up in a meaningless game/tournament and lose perspective about that.

    If you are all revved up about a 1 in 24 chance for a Concacaf spot in a morally indefensible tournament, you need more faith in your team's ability to qualify normally and/or maybe some new interests in life. Jesus Christ, it was only 3-4 years ago that they deprived us of our spot for some stupid scheduling reason.

    Honestly, the real discussion is whether, if you actually love your players, you shouldn’t be rooting for them to lose so they can just get out of that virologic cesspool faster.

    Also cmon, sometimes good bets don't pay off. A bad outcome is not the same thing as a bad decision.
    Last edited by ensco; 07-13-2020 at 07:04 PM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  14. #254
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    they were better

    looking forward to doing the same when opposition leads and we are outnumbered

  15. #255
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I stayed away (the time was awkward for me anyway), all I knew was the score, just watched the highlights, then came on the board here.

    All the agonizing about blowing the lead, meh. Seeing Akinola create that strike, and then crack it, that was the big thing. Especially with Achara out for many months, this is a must. If defenders have to start respecting Ayo, watch out. Go Ayo!

    Otherwise, we learned that if you pull down Pozo, we have no attack, and if you pull down Mavinga and Gonzalez, we are maybe not that good at the back.

    I think we knew that already.

    Now for the rant: Vanney made an EXCELLENT decision to try to play the percentages and protect important guys. That mattered WAY MORE than this stupid game. Good for him! We should have Vanney's back 150% on this, not criticize him. (I want him using all five subs, he should use them at halftime, btw)

    I want every decision heavily influenced by the desire to protect guys. I want to see NOBODY in an effing Florida hospital right now. Nobody. That heat/humidity creates the potential for injuries all by itself, especially as DCU was gooning it up in 4 minutes of highlights, so I assume all game (as less talented teams do).

    I am disappointed seeing so many usually thoughtful people here getting caught up in a meaningless game/tournament and lose perspective about that.

    If you are all revved up about a 1 in 24 chance for a Concacaf spot in a morally indefensible tournament, you need more faith in your team's ability to qualify normally and/or maybe some new interests in life. Jesus Christ, it was only 3-4 years ago that they deprived us of our spot for some stupid scheduling reason.

    Honestly, the real discussion is whether, if you actually love your players, you shouldn’t be rooting for them to lose so they can just get out of that virologic cesspool faster.

    Also cmon, sometimes good bets don't pay off. A bad outcome is not the same thing as a bad decision.
    It's not a meaningless tournament. These games count toward the season wether you like it or not, and things didn't get cancelled, they're there, so if they have to play they better bloody well play to win, which they didn't do for the whole second half.

    I've been thinking about it - they can't cancel the season. Many clubs, at minimum, would fold. They have to play, no matter what.

    So we can't afford to not take it seriously.

  16. #256
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    Quote Originally Posted by James17930 View Post
    It's not a meaningless tournament. These games count toward the season wether you like it or not, and things didn't get cancelled, they're there, so if they have to play they better bloody well play to win, which they didn't do for the whole second half.

    I've been thinking about it - they can't cancel the season. Many clubs, at minimum, would fold. They have to play, no matter what.

    So we can't afford to not take it seriously.
    So say the bar owners, too. “We have to open, or else.” Doesn’t make it right.

    Three “regular season games” in a season that maybe has a 25% chance of happening is meaningless, friend.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  17. #257
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    Being in Florida right now is beyond me, if TFC had used the postponed match on Sunday as a the reason they needed to pull up stakes and head home I would have fully supported that. The game was what it was, whatever the reason TFC and playing a man up has always presented issues but with Vanney's apparent strategy of protecting guys as you mentioned I get it. I think even one trip to an Orlando hospital at this time for the Reds is one too many.

    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I stayed away (the time was awkward for me anyway), all I knew was the score, just watched the highlights, then came on the board here.

    All the agonizing about blowing the lead, meh. Seeing Akinola create that strike, and then crack it, that was the big thing. Especially with Achara out for many months, this is a must. If defenders have to start respecting Ayo, watch out. Go Ayo!

    Otherwise, we learned that if you pull down Pozo, we have no attack, and if you pull down Mavinga and Gonzalez, we are maybe not that good at the back.

    I think we knew that already.

    Now for the rant: Vanney made an EXCELLENT decision to try to play the percentages and protect important guys. That mattered WAY MORE than this stupid game. Good for him! We should have Vanney's back 150% on this, not criticize him. (I want him using all five subs, he should use them at halftime, btw)

    I want every decision heavily influenced by the desire to protect guys. I want to see NOBODY in an effing Florida hospital right now. Nobody. That heat/humidity creates the potential for injuries all by itself, especially as DCU was gooning it up in 4 minutes of highlights, so I assume all game (as less talented teams do).

    I am disappointed seeing so many usually thoughtful people here getting caught up in a meaningless game/tournament and lose perspective about that.

    If you are all revved up about a 1 in 24 chance for a Concacaf spot in a morally indefensible tournament, you need more faith in your team's ability to qualify normally and/or maybe some new interests in life. Jesus Christ, it was only 3-4 years ago that they deprived us of our spot for some stupid scheduling reason.

    Honestly, the real discussion is whether, if you actually love your players, you shouldn’t be rooting for them to lose so they can just get out of that virologic cesspool faster.

    Also cmon, sometimes good bets don't pay off. A bad outcome is not the same thing as a bad decision.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

  18. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    playing a man up has always presented issues but with Vanney's apparent strategy of protecting guys as you mentioned I get it. I think even one trip to an Orlando hospital at this time for the Reds is one too many.
    Agree in general and maybe you guys are getting back channel criticism, but it isn't the Vanney decision in this specific circumstance other than getting burned with 10 men against on a counter attack is just unacceptable. Doesn't matter who is on but that was shameful between Zavaleta and Ciman, they are professionals and completely inexcusable. Ciman played very well when we had someone covering (Mavinga or Gonzalez) in the playoffs. Watching that play just made me ill.. Zavaleta has to be prepared for something like that and stay back, their line was too high. Thats the frustration, in a normal season, those two should never get on alone together. If that occurs again, then it is more than fair to criticize Vanney. With this tournament, I agree some slack should be given until hopefully we get to the knock out rounds.

    I didn't care as much about the tying goal other than "SHIT did that just happen!" Bad bounces and physical play sometimes produce breaks.

    Overall feels like a loss but you have to love this team...

    COYRs

  19. #259
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    Dunfield rips into Ciman in the podcast.

  20. #260
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    On a positive note ... I thought Michael Bradley was dynamite yesterday ...

  21. #261
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    So say the bar owners, too. “We have to open, or else.” Doesn’t make it right.

    Three “regular season games” in a season that maybe has a 25% chance of happening is meaningless, friend.
    Couldn't agree more.

    Even mild cases of COVID-19 can result in permanent lung damage. For a soccer player that probably means "career over." How would we feel if Osorio could never play again at 28? Or Liam at 22?

    Even worse, how would we feel if a player (from any team) died because of this tournament? It would be devastating, and would cross team allegiances.

    One thing this period of time has done for a lot of us, including myself, is given us some perspective on what is truly important, and this tournament ain't it.
    Last edited by Oldtimer; 07-14-2020 at 08:46 AM.

  22. #262
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Couldn't agree more.

    Even mild cases of COVID-19 can result in permanent lung damage. For a soccer player that probably means "career over." How would we feel if Osorio could never play again at 28? Or Liam at 22?

    Even worse, how would we feel if a player (from any team) died because of this tournament? It would be devastating, and would cross team allegiances.

    One thing this period of time has done for a lot of us, including myself, is given us some perspective on what is truly important, and this tournament ain't it.
    I do not want anyone to get this virus, regardless of how serious it is for yourself, you can end giving it to someone whose symptoms could be far more serious. Any sports league is playing a game of Russian roulette here. Yesterday Canada as a country had 565 new cases while Orange County which includes Orlando had 936 added to their total. Florida is a dumpster fire right now and being down their is a risk I would not want to take. The US finished the day with 65,488, a whopping 116 times the total we had up here. This all come down to your best judgement and common sense, something I am thinking MLS is not using right now.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

 

 

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