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  1. #1471
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    I'm far from a "All Canadian Homegrowns Forever!" guy but if we can successfully develop young players like NYRB then I am all for it. I hope we turn into what NYRB were. Winning shields and being top drawer consistently sounds good to me.
    We should be able to do both, we'd be a powerhouse if we can actually incorporate our local talent while still spending big on DPs/TAM players. I've become a big fan of our national team over the last few years and think we're missing out on all these really good local players.

    We're lucky that the club is spending big on DPs, if you compare us to NYRB or FC Dallas (probably the best team in terms of homegrowns), we've had way better DPs recently. Right now Pozuelo, a hopefully healthy Altidore, and whoever we sign will likely be the best DP combo outside of the LAs or Atlanta.

    Then you have around 6 spots filled by TAM players, our current ones are really solid (especially considering Bradley is now one). Throw in maybe a few veterans like Deleon and Westberg and already you have a solid core.

    Beyond the players I've listed I honestly think the rest of the roster should be our homegrowns unless we're severely lacking in certain spots like GK or CB. I know there are a lot of TFC fans who hate on our Canadians for some reason but they're a lot better than people give them credit for and I think they don't get enough chances. People bring up that they have to earn their spot but some do yet they still don't get playing time, meanwhile Vanney gives a lot of Americans continued chances even if they play like ****. We've had to pay money to watch Ben Spencer (HOW DID HE CONVINCE MANAGEMENT THAT HE'S A PROFESSIONAL SOCCER PLAYER?!?!?!?!?!), Terrance Boyd, Patrick Mullins, nephew, etc.

    People hate on Jordan Hamilton but he actually scored a few important goals and at times looked decent, I'm not going to use him as a main example of said local talent but the 18 appearances made between Boyd/Spencer could have gone towards development and playing time for him instead. Then they get rid of him for Mullins, a guy so useless that we were better up top in the playoffs without playing a striker. I'm sure Perruzza or even Akinola are already better than him. Even Delgado had a bunch of awful games in I think 2018 but will never lose his spot, I know he did look decent last year but if he was Canadian I'm sure Vanney would bench his ass. Look at Fraser as a guy who hasn't put a foot wrong but doesn't get enough play time. He looked great in the disaster that was 2018, he looked great whenever he played last year and he has been great for our NT. Laryea basically helped us get to the finals last year yet doesn't get a start all playoffs, Morrow has lost a bit of a step and Auro can play LB but we didn't see that happen.

    I also think we miss out on too many players, I know some might have wanted to take a different path than TFC such as NCAA but here are some youngish guys from Southern Ontario: Godinho, Cornelius, Manjrekar James, Kamal Miller (that's a kinda solid backline right there), Kaye, Borges, Buchanan, Liam Millar, Larin, St Clair, plus a few CPL guys that looked good. I know I'm turning this into a rant but I truly think some of these kids have high ceilings and it's worth playing them even if they make some mistakes. Let's see what Okello, Perruzza, Shaffelburg, and Fraser are actually capable of. If Nelson shows that he can contribute, give him some minutes. Don't acquire some below average player within the league because you're scared to play the kids.

  2. #1472
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    Mentioned this before, might not be a bad idea to grab Beitashour if he wants to play here. He knows the system and is consistent. Just a thought since nothing else seems to be happening.

    Does anyone know if we have any trialists training atm?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canuckistan View Post
    Mentioned this before, might not be a bad idea to grab Beitashour if he wants to play here. He knows the system and is consistent. Just a thought since nothing else seems to be happening.

    Does anyone know if we have any trialists training atm?
    Just academy guys and draft picks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon T View Post
    We should be able to do both, we'd be a powerhouse if we can actually incorporate our local talent while still spending big on DPs/TAM players. I've become a big fan of our national team over the last few years and think we're missing out on all these really good local players.

    We're lucky that the club is spending big on DPs, if you compare us to NYRB or FC Dallas (probably the best team in terms of homegrowns), we've had way better DPs recently. Right now Pozuelo, a hopefully healthy Altidore, and whoever we sign will likely be the best DP combo outside of the LAs or Atlanta.

    Then you have around 6 spots filled by TAM players, our current ones are really solid (especially considering Bradley is now one). Throw in maybe a few veterans like Deleon and Westberg and already you have a solid core.

    Beyond the players I've listed I honestly think the rest of the roster should be our homegrowns unless we're severely lacking in certain spots like GK or CB. I know there are a lot of TFC fans who hate on our Canadians for some reason but they're a lot better than people give them credit for and I think they don't get enough chances. People bring up that they have to earn their spot but some do yet they still don't get playing time, meanwhile Vanney gives a lot of Americans continued chances even if they play like ****. We've had to pay money to watch Ben Spencer (HOW DID HE CONVINCE MANAGEMENT THAT HE'S A PROFESSIONAL SOCCER PLAYER?!?!?!?!?!), Terrance Boyd, Patrick Mullins, nephew, etc.

    People hate on Jordan Hamilton but he actually scored a few important goals and at times looked decent, I'm not going to use him as a main example of said local talent but the 18 appearances made between Boyd/Spencer could have gone towards development and playing time for him instead. Then they get rid of him for Mullins, a guy so useless that we were better up top in the playoffs without playing a striker. I'm sure Perruzza or even Akinola are already better than him. Even Delgado had a bunch of awful games in I think 2018 but will never lose his spot, I know he did look decent last year but if he was Canadian I'm sure Vanney would bench his ass. Look at Fraser as a guy who hasn't put a foot wrong but doesn't get enough play time. He looked great in the disaster that was 2018, he looked great whenever he played last year and he has been great for our NT. Laryea basically helped us get to the finals last year yet doesn't get a start all playoffs, Morrow has lost a bit of a step and Auro can play LB but we didn't see that happen.

    I also think we miss out on too many players, I know some might have wanted to take a different path than TFC such as NCAA but here are some youngish guys from Southern Ontario: Godinho, Cornelius, Manjrekar James, Kamal Miller (that's a kinda solid backline right there), Kaye, Borges, Buchanan, Liam Millar, Larin, St Clair, plus a few CPL guys that looked good. I know I'm turning this into a rant but I truly think some of these kids have high ceilings and it's worth playing them even if they make some mistakes. Let's see what Okello, Perruzza, Shaffelburg, and Fraser are actually capable of. If Nelson shows that he can contribute, give him some minutes. Don't acquire some below average player within the league because you're scared to play the kids.
    Good points, is there a Coles notes version available,lol⚽️⚽️😁😁

  5. #1475
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon T View Post
    People hate on Jordan Hamilton but he actually scored a few important goals and at times looked decent, I'm not going to use him as a main example of said local talent but the 18 appearances made between Boyd/Spencer could have gone towards development and playing time for him instead. Then they get rid of him for Mullins, a guy so useless that we were better up top in the playoffs without playing a striker
    Mullins is much better than Hamilton.

    And the reason Hamilton had guys like Spencer get minutes over him is because they work hard in training as opposed to loafing. That's how it works. Rewarding a loafer with starters minutes undermines the team fabric.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brandon T View Post
    Let's see what Okello, Perruzza, Shaffelburg, and Fraser are actually capable of. If Nelson shows that he can contribute, give him some minutes. Don't acquire some below average player within the league because you're scared to play the kids.
    It's the Shaffelburg situation that blows me away. Vanney has been calling out for wingers for years, Shaff gets a couple of games, which we're told impressed the FO so much that they shifted their attention from the left to the right and signed Gallardo, then suddenly, Shaffelburg is stuck to the bench at best and doesn't get a sniff. I just don't understand what went on there. It's like Vanney just decided one day that no, I don't like you anymore. Unless he was one game away from a contract clause that would give him a pay rise!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by East Coast Red View Post
    It's the Shaffelburg situation that blows me away. Vanney has been calling out for wingers for years, Shaff gets a couple of games, which we're told impressed the FO so much that they shifted their attention from the left to the right and signed Gallardo, then suddenly, Shaffelburg is stuck to the bench at best and doesn't get a sniff. I just don't understand what went on there. It's like Vanney just decided one day that no, I don't like you anymore. Unless he was one game away from a contract clause that would give him a pay rise!!
    Many games Shaffelburg didn't even make the bench anymore. Games where TFC could have used some speed late in the game. Instead Pozuelo was often stuck on the left wing.

    I'm happy they made the finals again. Testament to many things being done right, plus a bit of luck. But some of the things happening during the past two seasons were bizarre. Many folks on here are saying now: no biggie if they don't hire a DP now; better market to get players in the summer anyway. Then why didn't it work out in 2019? Pozuelo replaced Vazquez and did a good job at that. But all year we were told we're getting TAM wingers to play the way Vanney wants it; and to provide scoring threat and alternatives to Altidore after Giovinco left. Gallardo came but didn't play much. Is that Curtis' fault, if the reason was Gallardo isn't that good, or wasn't quite fit & ready? And/or was it Vanney's fault, for not being pragmatic enough to work with the players he got? I don't know; likely both. Benezet came, was quite good. But he wasn't a winger, and didn't play much -- due to his contract status as we found out now. And at times Altidore was played too much when it looked like he needed a break, but we didn't have enough options. A long-term injury followed.

    I don't know how people are reasoning that other MLS teams can sign DPs now, despite it being only the winter transfer period, and despite an MLS labour deal not being in place -- but TFC can't. And I don't know where people's confidence comes from that if not now, they'll sign an amazing DP in the summer instead, that both Curtis and Vanney actually agree upon.

    Maybe they'll still sign someone in the next few days and things will turn out great; fingers crossed. But you have to realize, the concerns of some people are not only a reaction to the situation at this moment; but also a reaction to what has happened within TFC over the past two years.
    Last edited by Auzzy; 01-27-2020 at 09:57 AM.

  8. #1478
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    Mullins is much better than Hamilton.

    And the reason Hamilton had guys like Spencer get minutes over him is because they work hard in training as opposed to loafing. That's how it works. Rewarding a loafer with starters minutes undermines the team fabric.
    i agree Hamilton wasn’t cutting it but Spencer getting minutes defied all logic. There is no way that kid was good enough in training to warrant anything more than a 93’d minute substitution.

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    Quote Originally Posted by East Coast Red View Post
    It's the Shaffelburg situation that blows me away. Vanney has been calling out for wingers for years, Shaff gets a couple of games, which we're told impressed the FO so much that they shifted their attention from the left to the right and signed Gallardo, then suddenly, Shaffelburg is stuck to the bench at best and doesn't get a sniff. I just don't understand what went on there. It's like Vanney just decided one day that no, I don't like you anymore. Unless he was one game away from a contract clause that would give him a pay rise!!
    Agreed, definitely a point people have raised before. He can’t be developed if we’re going to be so scatterbrained about his minutes.

    I think it’s also worth pointing out that we were reportedly offered a fairly good fee for Noble Okello. Given our historical track record with prospects why not ring the register?

    It’s been pulling teeth to get Fraser a game in midfield. What chance does Okello have and how much more can he really learn from USL 2?
    Last edited by ag futbol; 01-27-2020 at 10:37 AM.

  10. #1480
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    i agree Hamilton wasn’t cutting it but Spencer getting minutes defied all logic. There is no way that kid was good enough in training to warrant anything more than a 93’d minute substitution.
    Yes Ben Spencer proved not to be an MLS level player but to rag on a guy who played only 261 minutes in parts of two seasons with the club is not worth the effort in my eyes. The back end of the roster spots 26-30 are really interchangeable , guys in those spots will come and go. As we have seen the Reds sign three young kids this maybe one or two of them will evolve into a good player, who knows at this point. The fact that Marinaro Mino occupied an international spot for this club says a lot when you get towards the end of the roster.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

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    Really don't get this attendance talk here, you'd swear it was a ghost town

    We're 2k below the average we had during the greatest season in MLS history (and that 2k below number came based mainly on season tickets sold after a non play off year and our star player leaving so you expect a drop), and our average is has consistently been a few thousand above the old capacity of the stadium before the apparently disastrous expansion (!), so we're generating more revenue now and have future proofed ourselves to gain even more at no more cost

    Here's the numbers https://i.redd.it/ncxuwitc5a241.png
    Last edited by JoesphNdo; 01-27-2020 at 11:22 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by East Coast Red View Post
    It's the Shaffelburg situation that blows me away. Vanney has been calling out for wingers for years, Shaff gets a couple of games, which we're told impressed the FO so much that they shifted their attention from the left to the right and signed Gallardo, then suddenly, Shaffelburg is stuck to the bench at best and doesn't get a sniff. I just don't understand what went on there. It's like Vanney just decided one day that no, I don't like you anymore. Unless he was one game away from a contract clause that would give him a pay rise!!
    Teams figured out shaffleburg, it wasn't hard to see and his production was poor.

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    I get we seem to be good at rebirths - Jozy, DeLeon, Seba to a certain extent, Laryea - but all those people were at a certain level. Spencer was plainly not going to get back to speed and that should have been noticeable in training.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikmacdo View Post
    Teams figured out shaffleburg, it wasn't hard to see and his production was poor.
    He’s young and learning every game. There will be ups and downs but overall you would expect improvement longer term. However, that doesn’t happen unless he plays.

    As others have pointed out, there were games were we missed the type of attributes he has (particularly as a second half sub). So it’s not like it was some sort of painful decision to put him on. It was literally a situation where both player and TFC could have benefited if he was available.

    It doesn’t get much easier than that. If we can’t find the time to play youth when it makes sense, tough to picture us formulating a plan to bring in players when it has to be balanced against other priorities.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikmacdo View Post
    Teams figured out shaffleburg, it wasn't hard to see and his production was poor.
    Also he was small and getting beaten down. You could see it. That's why this offseason there have been all these Tweets with him lifting weights and doing some lifting.

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    I noticed I think in the Cinci game at home when Shaff started that I don't think Poz passed to him once all half, maybe he was realizing that the other teams were figuring him out. A few times he had his head up and saw Shaff making the runs and he was open but he still didn't deliver him the ball.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    Mullins is much better than Hamilton.

    And the reason Hamilton had guys like Spencer get minutes over him is because they work hard in training as opposed to loafing. That's how it works. Rewarding a loafer with starters minutes undermines the team fabric.
    Thats always been said about Hamilton but we don't know it. if his attitude was that bad why did Bez pick him up? I think the issue is different - he drifts in and out of games mentally. its about concentration .
    Last edited by MightyDM; 01-27-2020 at 02:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    He’s young and learning every game. There will be ups and downs but overall you would expect improvement longer term. However, that doesn’t happen unless he plays.

    As others have pointed out, there were games were we missed the type of attributes he has (particularly as a second half sub). So it’s not like it was some sort of painful decision to put him on. It was literally a situation where both player and TFC could have benefited if he was available.

    It doesn’t get much easier than that. If we can’t find the time to play youth when it makes sense, tough to picture us formulating a plan to bring in players when it has to be balanced against other priorities.
    This.^

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    Also he was small and getting beaten down. You could see it. That's why this offseason there have been all these Tweets with him lifting weights and doing some lifting.
    And this ^

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikmacdo View Post
    Teams figured out shaffleburg, it wasn't hard to see and his production was poor.

    Not this^

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    I get the Schaff benching last year. It's about protecting his future. The guy is young and small. You let a player get hammered and battered too long and it can ruin them for good. Lots of matches you could see he was totally spent when he came off and it's not that he isn't in shape. It's just difficult for a small kid to have larger adults putting bodies on him at all times. Totally wore him down and that's how those freak injuries end up happening too. Hopefully the weight training pays off and he can handle the banging a bit better this season.

    Also, let's get him some pre-season action at LB.

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    LOLOL...Shaff and LB....what's next? Pozuelo in net?

    Anyway...after that ridiculous email sent out about Additional seats or whatever from MLSE, here was my response to my rep.

    "A few things.

    My account is up to date and the address is correct.


    I am not excited one bit about the upcoming season as the Front Office continues to mislead the loyal SSH's about player acquisitions and have done nothing on that front at all while every other team has improved. This is an absolute disgrace. The "two more weeks" lie has to stop and action is required.


    I will never want any more seats and will refer no one to you. Every person out there knows that they can get cheap tickets below market value anytime they want for any game they want. As a SSH, I am not able to even sell my tickets at face value because of the horrible mismanagement.


    Please stop asking me if I'm interested in other seats. I am not, nor will I ever be. Those premium seats are coming back because management doesn't care about their fan base so why would they want to return.


    This is how I feel. When the full rebuild of the team is finally confirmed a la the Toronto Blue Jays...you will have another unhappy SSH."

    Not holding back...getting sick and tired of this...been a 4-seat SSH in an expensive area since day one, been to all the road playoff games since they started qualifying...my loyalty is strong..but now it is being tested and disrespected....

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    Thats always been said about Hamilton but we don't know it. if his attitude was that bad why did Bez pick him up? I think the issue is different - he drifts in and out of games mentally. its about concentration .
    Actually, we do know it. Hamilton himself talked about his attitude at the start of last season and said he learned that he would have to pick up his game. I think they gave him a chance and judged that it wasn't enough. It wasn't just concentration.
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    I get the Schaff benching last year. It's about protecting his future. The guy is young and small. You let a player get hammered and battered too long and it can ruin them for good. Lots of matches you could see he was totally spent when he came off and it's not that he isn't in shape. It's just difficult for a small kid to have larger adults putting bodies on him at all times. Totally wore him down and that's how those freak injuries end up happening too. Hopefully the weight training pays off and he can handle the banging a bit better this season.

    Also, let's get him some pre-season action at LB.
    Yes, I think you are right. And they were kicking him too. Only way for some to to handle speed but not good for a young player and threatens his career. Still a bit surprising that he wasnt used as a sub now and then but.
    Last edited by MightyDM; 01-27-2020 at 03:51 PM.

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    I think this is a tad speculative. He was getting kicked too much and we were concerned for his safety so we sent him to the USL for the duration of the year?

    Really tough time believing that. He has to adjust to the level of athleticism in MLS sure but he’s not made of glass. He can strengthen himself in the off-season but let’s not overplay this.

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    Shaffelburg would have been a great super sub to run at tired defenders, no idea why we didn’t see that.

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    When it comes to down the stretch, Vanney has his 3 subs picked before the game and picks his other 3 non-GK to be options for just in case situations. Not sure I agree with it, but left sided speed wasn't enough of an option compared to what else the team might have needed in the 18. IIRC, Gallardo was in the 18 a lot and he didn't get into games either.

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    We made the final, but the side was up against it constantly. Imo, issues run deeper than not having enough pace. I don't think standing pat is the right move. The team is stale. Moves and decisions need to be based on the ability to replicate performances.

    How repeatable is relying on lucky bounces and wonder strikes? We made the final. Cool. Will we do it again? Highly unlikely.

    Three finals in four years is amazing. But it is entirely plausible for there to be major differences between 2016/2017 and 2019.

    2019 was a bitch to watch and that's because we were bad. Even after the signings we were average at best.

    Ask yourself, really, do you think this team can do it again? The club is quiet on everything but this: They expect to be competing at the top end of the league year in year out. If that's the case we are not currently good enough.

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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    Ask yourself, really, do you think this team can do it again? The club is quiet on everything but this: They expect to be competing at the top end of the league year in year out. If that's the case we are not currently good enough.
    Since the east is pretty shit, yes I think we could do it again and also it's about 2 weeks before our window even opens so it's not like we've tanked the year and this is all we're doing.

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    Don't take any stock in this whatsoever, but a friend through a friend in England is saying Giroud is in play here....I personally doubt it as I think he goes to Inter Milan...but he's been blowing up my phone for the past hour...damn trolls...lol

 

 

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