Hamilton was really good. But our midfielders kept waiting too long when his runs demanded an early ball. The times they did that, the team made something happen.Originally Posted by paul-collins
From where we sat, Ciman and Delgado had much better games than normal.
But something is off with the team. They were yelling at each other. A lot. But I don’t think it is that. I think it’s the lack of balance catching up with us. Whatever it is, without Jozy, this is our level.
Delgado to me was hot and cold, but his hot was looking more like 2017 at least. I agree that Ciman looked good until he went down (and that did not look good at all). That happened right in front of me, it was like he had been shot. I'm kind of pissed that the guy he had just beaten to win the ball stepped around him and shot at net. Cheap.
I noticed the yelling early on too. Less of it in the 2nd half, but the frustration with either the bad timing of runs or the bad passes was boiling over. (I lean toward the passes being off, rather than the runners going to the wrong place)
One thing I notice is that we are not having someone run into a space in the middle of a defensive setup, we have a lot of perimeter targets but I don't see how you're supposed to go side to side over 3 defenders other than the swing around through the back. We need midfielders coming into the closer space, turning and putting it to the next target. This started to get better in the 2nd half but it was obvious for the first 60 minutes. (Was true against Portland too)
Read John Molinaro's article after today's game: Vanney again saying that the players aren't playing the way they are asked to. He's said that a couple of times in recent interviews. If that happens repeatedly, that's a big problem.
he wants to play like man city ,without the proper players..maybe we will get some wingers in the next 2 years.
Did you read the article?
No one reads anything... it’s the internet.
yes i did...why do you ask
I agree that Vanney doesn't seem very realistic. For example the lineup & formation, compared with the capabilities of the players out there. But some of what he said in this & previous interviews, isn't unreasonable. People on here have been crying for some of the same things. I.e. don't just pass the ball around for possession sake. Pass with an attacking purpose (and take some friggin shots: the way they pass the ball around in the opposing penalty area is nuts).
There seems to be a disconnect. Coach often doesn't seem realistic. The players often aren't listening to the coach. And what they do instead, isn't really any better.
i agree...i also think vanney doesnt have the horses he wants and needs to play the way he wants to
Bradley is the core issue for me. I think that he has been told by the team that they are not going to re-sign him as a DP. That (like most of the folk here think) he will only be offered a TAM deal... He knows that there are several MLS teams that will give him a 3 year DP deal... and well he has become less vested in TFC. He is leaving at the end of the year and he knows it.
interesting observation. Accounts for my point that “something was off”. Only bright spots are that Westburgh and Chapman continue to develop.[/B]
Last edited by MightyDM; 05-12-2019 at 10:27 AM.
Chapman cost us a goal yesterday doing something professional footballers shouldn’t be doing.
Unless the system changes or players follow what Vanney is telling them then no amount of new TAM wingers, CBs, or forwards will make any difference.
The core issues must be addressed first and if they don't change then lets get to some good ol' trading, 2011 style. Turnover a chunk of the squad and see what happens.
I wish it was easier to edit the quotes on my phone...
I realize that you don’t need two CBs who can pass to play out the back, but our CBs are currently Moor/Zavaleta and Mavinga/Ciman. I agree Zavaleta was supposed to step up and be the Moor successor after a good season, but he makes a lot of money for a player of his caliber who is pretty middling at this point for an MLS defender. He’s not fast, not good in the air, doesn’t have the IQ, etc. He’s an MLS 1.0 defender who sometimes plays well.
That’s on the FO again.
Pozo had 84% pass accuracy and was 5/5 for long balls. He was literally calling for the ball multiple times while open and the rest of the players felt like passing it back or losing it. The weak link was Bradley.
Hamilton was okay but he did nothing when he had the ball, he’s slow, and he missed runs.
They were still swinging the ball in and missing too.
Again — this wasn’t a bad game, but it highlights the issues.
A CB has to be signed. Ciman is the best one and that shouldn't be the case. Mavinga has been clowning most of the year, I'm not even sure he likes soccer, just the slide tackle. Moor is done, Zavaleta is terrible and showed why again yesterday not being able to win headers against a player he's got half a foot on, also looking slow and silly on the second goal against.
While we do need a CB, Mavinga is our best CB, fits Vanney’s needs, and is only 27. He’s one of the best CBs in the league and has saved us numerous times. Only reason for the OG yesterday is that he had to try to do the job our two other CBs (Ciman and Zavaleta) should have done.
Zavaleta isn’t good but he is a typical MLS defender, just on an inflated salary.
If Bradley leaves its a good thing. He isn’t worthy of a DP spot, he isn’t connecting with Pozuelo well. To me your three DPs should be a 10 (Poz), Striker(Jozy) and an elite winger.
I don't agree, your opinion obviously but I don't know what you are seeing, not the same as me, MJavinga has saved so many goals this season I cannot count them
Really turning into a hot takes thread here....
Sorry guys, wasn't expecting a couple of player sacrifices as well.
I agree with what you are saying about Mavinga in general, but he got caught on the wrong side of the player on that goal, and it happened a few other times as well. His concentration/positioning seemed a bit off to me Saturday. A bit slow to react, although he usually makes up for that with his speed and insane tackling ability.
On a good number of those the ball was pinging around the box and just wouldn't fall for anyone to shoot.
Yeah, but it was more a minor error and everything. Had the ball come in an inch one way or another and it would have bounced off his knee differently and either missed the net or been slow enough for Westberg to grab it.
The attack came through a whole lot of people doing nothing and playing too high, Ciman made little attempt to shut down the cross or angle, and Mavinga prevented the shot albeit from the wrong side and then it came off his knee into goal...
Second goal was just as silly... Zavaleta, Ciman and Morrow all useless with Bradley jogging behind.
Both attacks came through the same side.
That was the pattern last season as well. That side is often weak in defending and of course Zavaleta is there so...
Yeah, absolutely. I was just commenting on the last bit of that play. If Mavinga was goal side it wouldn't have been a goal. But, yeah, that was probably the smallest mistake in a line of things that happened in the lead up.
We were bad on that second goal, but I want to recognize Monteiro's quality there, he really created something out of nothing.
I understand why Philly moved Accam now (they apparently are using the dollars on Monteiro's buyout). Monteiro is a player.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Mavinga wasn't good when not injured last year either, he's not right since 2017. So often out of position and I've lost track of how many penalties he's given up from completely unnecessary tackles.
Oh yeah Monteiro I think that's who Zavaleta couldn't win a header from.
Our defence has issues being able to adjust on the fly when Moor isn't on the pitch.
If Moor is on the pitch, he sees Auro hobble & immediately starts yelling at his teammates to get them in position. Ciman hasn't the experience with this lot to do that, yet.
^ Someone did a good breakdown of each goal yesterday on Twitter.
Goal #1: Delgado gives away the ball. Auro is instantly caught high. Zavaleta goes tight to prevent the Union player from turning and running at speed. Not a bad decision; however, the second the runner starts moving up the flank for the break out Zavaleta has to make the tactical foul and stop the play. He doesn’t. The union player releases the runner who crosses the ball in for the goal as Ciman can’t cover on time and Mavinga is just plain unlucky.
Goal #2. We actually had a numerical advantage in terms of players defending vs. Attacking but Zavaleta is slow, doesn’t spot the danger inside from the late run, and moves to double team the winger with Ciman when he shouldn’t. This puts someone (Mivinga I think) in a tough spot coming across late to close down the player. Again it’s too late and it’s 2-1 union.
Honestly Zavaleta’s continues inclusion within the team has gone long after its best-before date. I would take the chance on someone else who could develop as opposed to a player we already know is too slow and can’t read the game well.
This has become a farsical charitable exercise at nearly 300k a year in salary
Separately, I think part of the reason we are seeing this crap is because Bradley’s recovery runs and physically dominance in the midfield isn’t what it used to be. It once covered for the fact we pushed a lot of players forward and at least some of our CB’s were shit. No more, it seems.
Last edited by ag futbol; 05-13-2019 at 11:36 AM.
For sure.
Yeah. I’m fine with Ciman as a Maviga backup, which I thought was why he was here. Zavaleta doesn’t have any upside as he isn’t even cheap, and if Vanney is playing them this way it doesn’t even make sense.
At some point, you can’t just hope Moor can play — you have to adjust towards a style of play that doesn’t see us as easily exploited. If we score 4 goals a game and win 4-3, that’s one thing. But when the “goals will come” but don’t, there has to be some changes. Adding another CB who is anonymous isn’t going to help when you’re losing the ball constantly and everyone is too far up the pitch to even defend the counters.
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