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  1. #3451
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    It was a mistake, but let's not overdo it.

    It's 20/20 hindsight, Frei was not the keeper he became (Sigi deserves the credit for getting it out of him, RIP) and international spots were and are rarely used on GKs.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  2. #3452
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    It was a mistake, but let's not overdo it.

    It's 20/20 hindsight, Frei was not the keeper he became (Sigi deserves the credit for getting it out of him, RIP) and international spots were and are rarely used on GKs.
    I was always under the impression that we couldn't afford him anymore.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Every time Jozy is injured, the same discussion happens:

    "Is he worth it?"

    As soon as he comes back, the same discussion happens:

    "Oh MY GAWD I'm glad he is with us as he is unique in the league and going right now"


    *****

    I'm not sure of the solution but I would temper any "he's not good enough" talk.
    Jozy's talent really has never been a concern for me. It's how tied our MLS performance has been to him staying on the pitch. There are other factors to consider but look at these numbers:

    2019 - 1691 Minutes - 50 Points
    2018 - 877 Minutes - 36 Points
    2017 - 2194 Minutes - 69 Points
    2016 - 1487 Minutes - 53 Points
    2015 - 1796 Minutes - 49 Points

    If we consider a starting player in this league to be hitting ~2000 minutes (or 22 full games), Jozy has only hit that mark once. Our DP striker isn't even playing starter minutes. The guy's played 53% of possible regular season minutes since he got here. Our seasons live and die on a guy that plays 50% of the time.

  4. #3454
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    It was a mistake, but let's not overdo it.

    It's 20/20 hindsight, Frei was not the keeper he became (Sigi deserves the credit for getting it out of him, RIP) and international spots were and are rarely used on GKs.
    I don't know how much we overdo it or not, but IMO Frei was the best keeper in TFC-s history. I'm afraid we'll never have one not better, but not sure even as equal quality, unless at some point MLS will evolve that much that we can pay at least $1 million per season for a goalkeeper.
    That guy must be a hero in Seattle, they should erect him a statue at the stadium... too many times he was the sole reason for Seattle getting results in important matches.
    (Of course I'm not including in TFC's history that famous Brasilian GK who has played very few games being on loan.)

  5. #3455
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    Quote Originally Posted by portu;1911274[B
    ]Jozy's talent really has never been a concern for me. It's how tied our MLS performance has been to him staying on the pitch.[/B] There are other factors to consider but look at these numbers:

    2019 - 1691 Minutes - 50 Points
    2018 - 877 Minutes - 36 Points
    2017 - 2194 Minutes - 69 Points
    2016 - 1487 Minutes - 53 Points
    2015 - 1796 Minutes - 49 Points

    If we consider a starting player in this league to be hitting ~2000 minutes (or 22 full games), Jozy has only hit that mark once. Our DP striker isn't even playing starter minutes. The guy's played 53% of possible regular season minutes since he got here. Our seasons live and die on a guy that plays 50% of the time.
    I am sure I mentioned that was your thought and concern about Jozy when posted sometime last year, some people just don't get what you are saying

  6. #3456
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    international spots were and are rarely used on GKs.
    I believe Frei isn't considered an international. I remember him getting a call up with the US national team a couple years ago. I believe he moved to the US as a kid. Unless he only became US eligible after he left us?

  7. #3457
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    Quote Originally Posted by rydermike View Post
    I believe Frei isn't considered an international. I remember him getting a call up with the US national team a couple years ago. I believe he moved to the US as a kid. Unless he only became US eligible after he left us?
    Yup, he got his US citizenship after he moved to Seattle

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derko View Post
    I am sure I mentioned that was your thought and concern about Jozy when posted sometime last year, some people just don't get what you are saying

    Oh, I get there are nuances in this discussion - one reason why I prefer this board for TFC discussion.

    All good.

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    I see the Frei thing as him just needing a change of scenery and a chance to play and regain confidence - things Seattle had and Toronto didn't. He had a few blunders his first year there but by the end of the season was one of the league's top keepers. Even if he had somehow won his job back from Bendik I doubt TFC would have been as patient with him

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    Quote Originally Posted by Derko View Post
    I am sure I mentioned that was your thought and concern about Jozy when posted sometime last year, some people just don't get what you are saying
    I think most of us share this concern. But the problem is what is the alternative? Any player we acquire is unlikely to match Jozy's level and might well be a Pity Martinez - highly touted but a bust. So for me we need either Benzet to be a secondary strong scorer or to restructure our TAM players so we can try for one

  11. #3461
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavemTFC View Post
    I see the Frei thing as him just needing a change of scenery and a chance to play and regain confidence - things Seattle had and Toronto didn't. He had a few blunders his first year there but by the end of the season was one of the league's top keepers. Even if he had somehow won his job back from Bendik I doubt TFC would have been as patient with him
    Wasn't it an injury thing? Didn't he get injured and then Bendik/Konopka took the job and he never got it back? Seattle did give him the opportunity to start, which is something he wasn't getting here, I'm sure that change definitely helped his confidence, knowing he wasn't a mistake away from being benched.
    Last edited by rydermike; 10-29-2019 at 01:26 PM.

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    Frei broke his leg in a training accident, iirc. There was so much negative karma accumulated the first 9 years that TFC should have a couple of decades of positive karma to balance it out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    Jozy's talent really has never been a concern for me. It's how tied our MLS performance has been to him staying on the pitch. There are other factors to consider but look at these numbers:

    2019 - 1691 Minutes - 50 Points
    2018 - 877 Minutes - 36 Points
    2017 - 2194 Minutes - 69 Points
    2016 - 1487 Minutes - 53 Points
    2015 - 1796 Minutes - 49 Points

    If we consider a starting player in this league to be hitting ~2000 minutes (or 22 full games), Jozy has only hit that mark once. Our DP striker isn't even playing starter minutes. The guy's played 53% of possible regular season minutes since he got here. Our seasons live and die on a guy that plays 50% of the time.
    Great post.

    Its absolutely silly to think we cant find a replacement for Jozy at the price we are paying him.

    Seriously people take off the rose tinted glasses and look at it objectively.

    I don't care about his cap hit, if you've got a DP playing close to less than 50% of the games you have a problem.

    The team was built around Gio and Vanney needed some time to rebuild the system successfully. The same can be done with Jozy gone, which is much easier considering he is never playing.

    Before someone says I'm a hater, Jozy, Gio, and Bradley all deserve their numbers retired.
    Last edited by Richard; 10-29-2019 at 04:54 PM.

  14. #3464
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Great post.

    Its absolutely silly to think we cant find a replacement for Jozy at the price we are paying him.

    Seriously people take off the rose tinted glasses and look at it objectively.

    I don't care about his cap hit, if you've got a DP playing close to less than 50% of the games you have a problem.

    The team was built around Gio and Vanney needed some time to rebuild the system successfully. The same can be done with Jozy gone, which is much easier considering he is never playing.

    Before someone says I'm a hater, Jozy, Gio, and Bradley all deserve their numbers retired.
    i agree with this..and i love jozy.he has been off form also i think he has one goal in like 2 mths,and missed a bunch of sitters,the fact that we are one game from the finals is incredible,credit to vanney and the rest of the players.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rydermike View Post
    Wasn't it an injury thing? Didn't he get injured and then Bendik/Konopka took the job and he never got it back? Seattle did give him the opportunity to start, which is something he wasn't getting here, I'm sure that change definitely helped his confidence, knowing he wasn't a mistake away from being benched.
    2011 and 2012 he lost out to Kocic due to injury but 2013 he was mostly healthy. Think he had a slight knock just before the season began so Bendik started but then he got healthy again and never won the starting job back. So injuries still kind of played a part the last year but it wasn't the reason he barely played

    Just to add: got my info from soccerway. Frei had 1 start and 26 bench "appearances". Interesting since I too assumed he was just injured that season. 2013 was probably the most forgettable year in TFC history tbh

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Great post.

    Its absolutely silly to think we cant find a replacement for Jozy at the price we are paying him.

    Seriously people take off the rose tinted glasses and look at it objectively.

    I don't care about his cap hit, if you've got a DP playing close to less than 50% of the games you have a problem.

    The team was built around Gio and Vanney needed some time to rebuild the system successfully. The same can be done with Jozy gone, which is much easier considering he is never playing.

    Before someone says I'm a hater, Jozy, Gio, and Bradley all deserve their numbers retired.
    Pretty sure we don’t retire numbers, but I would withhold their numbers until a player is worthy of carrying on the legacy of the number. Yes, I didn’t like how quickly we gave away the 10 shirt to Pozuelo.

  17. #3467
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    Quote Originally Posted by noimpactinmtl View Post
    Pretty sure we don’t retire numbers, but I would withhold their numbers until a player is worthy of carrying on the legacy of the number. Yes, I didn’t like how quickly we gave away the 10 shirt to Pozuelo.
    I would only add a plaque with their names and numbers on that wall outside gate 2 where we have our awards posted.

  18. #3468
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Great post.

    Its absolutely silly to think we cant find a replacement for Jozy at the price we are paying him.

    Seriously people take off the rose tinted glasses and look at it objectively.

    I don't care about his cap hit, if you've got a DP playing close to less than 50% of the games you have a problem.

    The team was built around Gio and Vanney needed some time to rebuild the system successfully. The same can be done with Jozy gone, which is much easier considering he is never playing.

    Before someone says I'm a hater, Jozy, Gio, and Bradley all deserve their numbers retired.
    Agreed. I like the guy and in no way wish to diminish what he’s done for TFC. But we need someone with more durability.

    For what we are paying there should be some real options. Saying you can’t replace him is a bit silly. We just replaced VV this year with Poz and nobody thought that would be easy. For the cheque size we pay Altidore there is room for error and big potential upside with someone new.

  19. #3469
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    Keep Jozy. Redeploy dollars from Gallardo and maybe Ciman, you get a $1.5-2M for a second striker and a different winger (you might keep Benezet, who would probably cost $750K or something)

    Guys like Heber, Diomande etc make less than a million.
    Last edited by ensco; 10-30-2019 at 12:14 PM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Keep Jozy. Redeploy dollars from Gallardo and maybe Ciman, you get a $1.5-2M for a second striker and a different winger (you might keep Benezet, who would probably cost $750K or something)

    Guys like Heber, Diomande etc make less than a million.
    No point in busting numbers and scenarios now as there is expected to be radical salary structure differences post CBA. I've heard everything from $12M cap to 5 DPs to no TAM spots.

    So really, it's pointless to even think about until they ratify the new deal.

  21. #3471
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    No point in busting numbers and scenarios now as there is expected to be radical salary structure differences post CBA. I've heard everything from $12M cap to 5 DPs to no TAM spots.

    So really, it's pointless to even think about until they ratify the new deal.
    Most likely TAM disappears with the salary budget "cap" being raised.
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

  22. #3472
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Keep Jozy. Redeploy dollars from Gallardo and maybe Ciman, you get a $1.5-2M for a second striker and a different winger (you might keep Benezet, who would probably cost $750K or something)

    Guys like Heber, Diomande etc make less than a million.
    Gallardo won't be TAM anymore so there's that. Think he was only TAM this year because of his transfer fee.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    No point in busting numbers and scenarios now as there is expected to be radical salary structure differences post CBA. I've heard everything from $12M cap to 5 DPs to no TAM spots.

    So really, it's pointless to even think about until they ratify the new deal.
    They should really just move away from all these fancy things and adopt a more standard and transparent salary structure. Fantasy sports / business of sports is a big part of the culture and MLS misses a lot opportunities by being so secretive.

    As far as the cap goes, I want an increase but not for this league to get ahead of itself. Put more money into developing domestic players and leave some time for lagging markets to catch up. Get more teams on non-turf fields. That should be the focus.

  24. #3474
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Keep Jozy. Redeploy dollars from Gallardo and maybe Ciman, you get a $1.5-2M for a second striker and a different winger (you might keep Benezet, who would probably cost $750K or something)

    Guys like Heber, Diomande etc make less than a million.
    They bought Gallardo and the kid is 22. Don't see him going anywhere. Far more likely that Benezet's purchase option isn't exercised.

  25. #3475
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    No point in busting numbers and scenarios now as there is expected to be radical salary structure differences post CBA. I've heard everything from $12M cap to 5 DPs to no TAM spots.
    Honestly, I'd be happy with a $10M salary cap, with DP salaries being worth $1M against the cap. At that point I think we reach wage parity with at least half the Mexican clubs.

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    Or maybe just play DeLeon up top a bit more!
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    So we are one win away from Michael coming back being locked in for 6.5M and a DP spot next season, guess it will be worth it if next Sunday goes the Reds way.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red CB Toronto View Post
    So we are one win away from Michael coming back being locked in for 6.5M and a DP spot next season, guess it will be worth it if next Sunday goes the Reds way.
    6.5 million vs what he probably deserves and would get , (2-3 mill) ? As Big game of an individual player game as I’ve ever seen lol

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    Jozy Replacement?

    Transfers MLS
    @TransfersMLS

    Lots of rumors swirling that Sergio Agüero will be leaving Man City in June on a free to come to an unnamed MLS club. With him being only 31 and the best striker in the premier league of the last decade this would be an amazing addition to the league! #MLS2020

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuku View Post
    Jozy Replacement?

    Transfers MLS
    @TransfersMLS

    Lots of rumors swirling that Sergio Agüero will be leaving Man City in June on a free to come to an unnamed MLS club. With him being only 31 and the best striker in the premier league of the last decade this would be an amazing addition to the league! #MLS2020
    Could see him going to the baby brother Etihad club NYCFC. Even though they have Heber, if Aguero is available you take him and sort out the rest later. They bring in a marquee head coach and Aguero and they're ready to roll again

 

 

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