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  1. #3211
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    ^^ beautiful strike!

    btw those dark grey way kits still look great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by benito View Post
    ^^ beautiful strike!

    btw those dark grey way kits still look great.
    A couple years ago I picked up a brand new with tags signed onyx Gilberto kit from a thrift store for a toonie.

    My second best Gilberto memory other than that goal, I think.

  3. #3213
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    So... anyone with 2019 transfer news? I think we're pretty much done except for what happens with player renewals.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    So... anyone with 2019 transfer news? I think we're pretty much done except for what happens with player renewals.
    Yep renwals an maybe a homegrown promotion or two.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by stegosaurus View Post
    A couple years ago I picked up a brand new with tags signed onyx Gilberto kit from a thrift store for a toonie.

    My second best Gilberto memory other than that goal, I think.
    God damm

  6. #3216
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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    Gilberto hit the post maybe 8 or 9 times that season. Really unlucky.
    And he had that one called back against Chicago for which the the league had to apologize.
    Last edited by MightyDM; 08-06-2019 at 04:32 PM.

  7. #3217
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    Quote Originally Posted by benito View Post
    ^^ beautiful strike!

    btw those dark grey way kits still look great.
    Indeed!

    Made sure to get me one ah them (Osorio on the back; huge thanks to pekduck for helping me out, back then).

  8. #3218
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    This is interesting:



    Northern Tribune


    Alessandro Busti may be Canadian, but heís a name that may be more familiar to football fans in Italy than North America. The 19-year-old goalkeeper is a product of the Juventus Academy, where he has featured for the Juventus U-23 squad which plays in Serie C.
    After nine years developing as a Juventus player, the youngster seems to have been quietly released at the end of his contract this July. Neither Juventus nor the player himself Ė who was just wrapping up his highschool finals at the time Ė have made any public statement about the matter, or announced the signing of a new contract.
    It now appears that the Toronto-born keeper may have returned to his roots: today, Busti is making an appearance for the TFC2 squad as it takes on the SK Selects for the SK Summer Soccer Series in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan. Given that this is an exhibition match as opposed to an official USL League One fixture, itís possible that Busti may simply be trialing with the club.


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    Kloke confirms that Busti spent a week with TFCII but is no longer with them. I wonder if he was only there to get some practice and TFC was doing him a favour or if he was actually on trial for a spot with the club.

  10. #3220
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    Quote Originally Posted by noxx98 View Post
    Kloke confirms that Busti spent a week with TFCII but is no longer with them. I wonder if he was only there to get some practice and TFC was doing him a favour or if he was actually on trial for a spot with the club.
    I'm going to guess the former not the latter and was practicing. If he's good enough for juve u23 then he's definitely good enough for tfc2 which is essentially tfc u23.

    Although transfrmarkt lists him as a free agent since July 1st,but I still think he aims to stay in Italy over coming to usl league 1
    Last edited by rydermike; 08-13-2019 at 09:04 PM.

  11. #3221
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    Default Toronto needs a new DP in 2020, or they need to start selling.

    Toronto needs a new DP in 2020, or they need to start selling.


    Regardless of what happens this MLS season and post season, TFC will eventually need to make a decision on their future; and that future could and should mean they need to be either all in with this group of DP's or all out.

    Unlike most professional leagues, MLS teams make the frequent decision to invest more then half of their entire teams salary in 2-3 players, the designated player slot; which for Toronto currently includes Jozy Altidore, Michael Bradley and Alejandro Pozuelo.

    Over the last 3 MLS seasons, the teams that have formed the best 3 players on the pitch have had the greatest advantage in MLS. The last groups of MLS winners all had the greatest trios that year, which have included Seattle, Toronto FC, Atlanta and this year LAFC joining the fold as the newest member of MLS's elite.

    Right now Toronto is 8th in the eastern conference, and while they could still go on a run, they will have to compete with LAFC and Atlanta, who currently are more established and simply put, better.

    Treading water in sports is the worst thing you can do and treading water in sports while making large investments in players that have declining market values year over year is even worse. Altidore (29) and Pozuelo (27) are in their prime now, which means each year, they will start to lose significant market value. We need to capitalize on their prime now, or we need to move them in a transfer for max compensation.

    Here are our realistic options.

    Picking a strategy and sticking to it.

    1) Go full force, go for championships with big money DPís like LAFC and Atlanta. We need to go for a Giovinco, Vela, Martinez level DP at minimum and try and get Bradley to a TAM deal and if we can't make it work, let him walk. We must invest in a top global player to add to our DP trio. Not a top 50 player but maybe top 100. I'm talking like a striker like Willian Jose on the high end or Michy Batshuayi. A Batshuayi, Alitodre, Pozuelo trio get's TFC in the mix with MLS's best again with their improving supporting cast. We go all in and the additional playoff revenue helps pay for the player.

    2) Sell. While some people (Ensco) will say we can't get a Giovinco tier player or better, fine. I also see that as one potential reality. But If the funds aren't there, we need to quickly adapt and recognize we can't compete. Sell Jozy Altidore and Pozuelo (yes after only 1 year) to mitigate the inevitable crash in market value from our prized DP's. Right now we can get about 10 million for Altidore (if the rumoured interest from China is real) and maybe 10-15 million for Pozuelo. That's 20-25 million and if we wait 3 + years, it could be 0. Re-invest the money in young DP's, our academy and youth. Go for players like Brian Fernandez, Brian Rodriguez... young players with upside that can play that are 18-24 and you aren't going to lose money. If you do it will be very minimal. For example, Brian Fernandez is 24, Portland bought him for 10 million. His value will rise, and they can sell him for a profit, or when he's 27-28 they will get similar money for him in a sale. Even when players bust, it won't be like having his value fall off a cliff like Bradley. TFC will need to operate as a buy-sell club. Holding on to players like giovinco, Bradley until their values are 0 won't make sense long term and isn't sustainable.


    Not doing either of these things would be a huge mistake in my mind. I just donít see the point in having declining assets like Altidore and Pozuelo if weíre not going to go contend, at the very least it's high risk.

  12. #3222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Defoe View Post
    Toronto needs a new DP in 2020, or they need to start selling.


    Regardless of what happens this MLS season and post season, TFC will eventually need to make a decision on their future; and that future could and should mean they need to be either all in with this group of DP's or all out.

    Unlike most professional leagues, MLS teams make the frequent decision to invest more then half of their entire teams salary in 2-3 players, the designated player slot; which for Toronto currently includes Jozy Altidore, Michael Bradley and Alejandro Pozuelo.

    Over the last 3 MLS seasons, the teams that have formed the best 3 players on the pitch have had the greatest advantage in MLS. The last groups of MLS winners all had the greatest trios that year, which have included Seattle, Toronto FC, Atlanta and this year LAFC joining the fold as the newest member of MLS's elite.

    Right now Toronto is 8th in the eastern conference, and while they could still go on a run, they will have to compete with LAFC and Atlanta, who currently are more established and simply put, better.

    Treading water in sports is the worst thing you can do and treading water in sports while making large investments in players that have declining market values year over year is even worse. Altidore (29) and Pozuelo (27) are in their prime now, which means each year, they will start to lose significant market value. We need to capitalize on their prime now, or we need to move them in a transfer for max compensation.

    Here are our realistic options.

    Picking a strategy and sticking to it.

    1) Go full force, go for championships with big money DP’s like LAFC and Atlanta. We need to go for a Giovinco, Vela, Martinez level DP at minimum and try and get Bradley to a TAM deal and if we can't make it work, let him walk. We must invest in a top global player to add to our DP trio. Not a top 50 player but maybe top 100. I'm talking like a striker like Willian Jose on the high end or Michy Batshuayi. A Batshuayi, Alitodre, Pozuelo trio get's TFC in the mix with MLS's best again with their improving supporting cast. We go all in and the additional playoff revenue helps pay for the player.

    2) Sell. While some people (Ensco) will say we can't get a Giovinco tier player or better, fine. I also see that as one potential reality. But If the funds aren't there, we need to quickly adapt and recognize we can't compete. Sell Jozy Altidore and Pozuelo (yes after only 1 year) to mitigate the inevitable crash in market value from our prized DP's. Right now we can get about 10 million for Altidore (if the rumoured interest from China is real) and maybe 10-15 million for Pozuelo. That's 20-25 million and if we wait 3 + years, it could be 0. Re-invest the money in young DP's, our academy and youth. Go for players like Brian Fernandez, Brian Rodriguez... young players with upside that can play that are 18-24 and you aren't going to lose money. If you do it will be very minimal. For example, Brian Fernandez is 24, Portland bought him for 10 million. His value will rise, and they can sell him for a profit, or when he's 27-28 they will get similar money for him in a sale. Even when players bust, it won't be like having his value fall off a cliff like Bradley. TFC will need to operate as a buy-sell club. Holding on to players like giovinco, Bradley until their values are 0 won't make sense long term and isn't sustainable.


    Not doing either of these things would be a huge mistake in my mind. I just don’t see the point in having declining assets like Altidore and Pozuelo if we’re not going to go contend, at the very least it's high risk.
    I hope we add a well-known DP and not some South American 20 year old. I know it worked for Atlanta, but Tata knew the market very weel, Ali Curtis and Greg Vanney do not.

  13. #3223
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    Quote Originally Posted by TFC/Everton View Post
    I hope we add a well-known DP and not some South American 20 year old. I know it worked for Atlanta, but Tata knew the market very weel, Ali Curtis and Greg Vanney do not.
    You want another Bloody Big Deal...didnít work for Rooney...Lampard...Gerrard...Pirlo...

    My concern is that we are not the elite team that we take think we are. We had two good seasons...we havenít demonstrated the ability to sustain being at the top of the league. That takes an organization and development.

    IF you look at Pozueloís situation...he looked better than Giovinco after his first few games. Then we threw a couple of hard away games ...half the team fucked off to some meaningless tournament that is always in the US. Iím thinking that Poz is thinking ďwhat the fuck..like we only have to try hard in half our games... then get hot for a while and have a run in the play offs...if we donít we get a 5 month break.Ē

    On top of that there seem to be an insane Bradley contract that you canít do anything about until we win or are knocked out of the MLS Cup. If we win...he is automatically our DP next season. He has played like someone with an uncertain future all season and it has permeated into our outlook. This team hasnít had a winning mentality since Guadalajara.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamilton_Red View Post
    You want another Bloody Big Deal...didnít work for Rooney...Lampard...Gerrard...Pirlo...

    My concern is that we are not the elite team that we take think we are. We had two good seasons...we havenít demonstrated the ability to sustain being at the top of the league. That takes an organization and development.

    IF you look at Pozueloís situation...he looked better than Giovinco after his first few games. Then we threw a couple of hard away games ...half the team fucked off to some meaningless tournament that is always in the US. Iím thinking that Poz is thinking ďwhat the fuck..like we only have to try hard in half our games... then get hot for a while and have a run in the play offs...if we donít we get a 5 month break.Ē

    On top of that there seem to be an insane Bradley contract that you canít do anything about until we win or are knocked out of the MLS Cup. If we win...he is automatically our DP next season. He has played like someone with an uncertain future all season and it has permeated into our outlook. This team hasnít had a winning mentality since Guadalajara.
    There are good potential DPs that arenít washed up retirement home signings or reasonably young South Americans.

    Of the TAM signings we made this season, only Omar Gonzalez has looked to potentially be worth it. The others either havenít played enough to judge and the season is almost over or were a mistake (Osorio).

    Bradley isnít a good use of resources, unfortunately, because even with a DP DM our defence hasnít looked great.

    Pozo is a very talented player but his ability isnít unlocked by digging the ball up from the furthest points of the universe, playing both sides of midfield, and trying to create while also potentially scoring goals. If you watch how he played at Genk, for example, heís being wasted here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Defoe View Post


    ....While some people (Ensco) will say we can't get a Giovinco tier player or better...
    No. I never said they wouldn’t come. I always said we would have to pay full freight, because we are not NY or LA and I used to say that Manning wouldn’t spend USD 30M+ on a player the way Leiweke had (I thought Manning would go the Dallas/NYRB route, that's his background). But he and MLSE proved me wrong on that when they ponied up for Pozo.

    Would MLSE let Manning come right back and do that again? I was wrong the first time, so I will stay out of the prediction business this time. I note though that Manning spent $50M combined on Pozo and Jozy in last 6 months, so it's not obvious he has any of those kind of big caliber bullets left in his chamber.
    Last edited by ensco; 08-15-2019 at 10:10 AM.
    ďWhat the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.Ē

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    Divock Origi on a free next June. Please please please.

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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    Divock Origi on a free next June. Please please please.
    He signed an extension recently. Hes way too good/young for mls.

  18. #3228
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hamilton_Red View Post
    You want another Bloody Big Deal...didn’t work for Rooney...Lampard...Gerrard...Pirlo...

    My concern is that we are not the elite team that we take think we are. We had two good seasons...we haven’t demonstrated the ability to sustain being at the top of the league. That takes an organization and development.

    IF you look at Pozuelo’s situation...he looked better than Giovinco after his first few games. Then we threw a couple of hard away games ...half the team fucked off to some meaningless tournament that is always in the US. I’m thinking that Poz is thinking “what the fuck..like we only have to try hard in half our games... then get hot for a while and have a run in the play offs...if we don’t we get a 5 month break.”

    On top of that there seem to be an insane Bradley contract that you can’t do anything about until we win or are knocked out of the MLS Cup. If we win...he is automatically our DP next season. He has played like someone with an uncertain future all season and it has permeated into our outlook. This team hasn’t had a winning mentality since Guadalajara.
    I don't agree about Bradley. Early doors he totally took control. we were doing well (although lucky to win some of the games) and it was primarily due to his play. Lately he has slowed down. But i dont see a lck of intensity - I watched him closely the entire time two games ago and he was really aggressive defensively, winning tackle after tackle.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikmacdo View Post
    He signed an extension recently. Hes way too good/young for mls.
    Shit I missed that

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikmacdo View Post
    He signed an extension recently. Hes way too good/young for mls.
    Yeah, but heís never won the Campeones Cup! Imagine the sorrow in his eyes each and every time he passes by the empty spot in his trophy case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikmacdo View Post
    He signed an extension recently. Hes way too good/young for mls.
    True, to date that would be true. But they said that about Giovinco when he was 28, same with Carlos Vela
    They said that about Josef Martinez/ Miguel Almiron (they were 22-23)
    Some people probably say that about Christian Pavon (what will his final sale to MLS be?? 15-20 million?
    There's a first for everything. Divoick Origi tier player is a tier up on those guys, but there will be a first for a team to spend 22+ million on a young player like that, maybe in the next couple years. Not saying it will be us, but also not saying it won't be Let's call that the transition to MLS 4.0 when it does happen

  22. #3232
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    I like Oso and appreciate his game, but I think he needs to go to free up funds that can move this team forward. MLS systems still require midfielders with defined roles; guys who can either play defensive midfield or a more attacking position. Oso doesn't really do either, and Vanney doesn't know where to play him anymore. If (big if) Vanney is still coaching here next season, Oso will find himself riding the bench again. Not worth it.

  23. #3233
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    Quote Originally Posted by Defoe View Post
    True, to date that would be true. But they said that about Giovinco when he was 28, same with Carlos Vela
    They said that about Josef Martinez/ Miguel Almiron (they were 22-23)
    Some people probably say that about Christian Pavon (what will his final sale to MLS be?? 15-20 million?
    There's a first for everything. Divoick Origi tier player is a tier up on those guys, but there will be a first for a team to spend 22+ million on a young player like that, maybe in the next couple years. Not saying it will be us, but also not saying it won't be Let's call that the transition to MLS 4.0 when it does happen
    Origi is just such a legend now at lfc. 7 goals last year and they all seemed like game winners. Hes only 24 too. Maybe in 3 or 4 years ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Defoe View Post
    True, to date that would be true. But they said that about Giovinco when he was 28, same with Carlos Vela
    They said that about Josef Martinez/ Miguel Almiron (they were 22-23)
    Some people probably say that about Christian Pavon (what will his final sale to MLS be?? 15-20 million?
    There's a first for everything. Divoick Origi tier player is a tier up on those guys, but there will be a first for a team to spend 22+ million on a young player like that, maybe in the next couple years. Not saying it will be us, but also not saying it won't be Let's call that the transition to MLS 4.0 when it does happen
    It won't be us with this Manning/Curtis duo. #BringBackLeiweke

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobo View Post
    I like Oso and appreciate his game, but I think he needs to go to free up funds that can move this team forward. MLS systems still require midfielders with defined roles; guys who can either play defensive midfield or a more attacking position. Oso doesn't really do either, and Vanney doesn't know where to play him anymore. If (big if) Vanney is still coaching here next season, Oso will find himself riding the bench again. Not worth it.
    I dunno, I find LAFC is smashing that idea. Atuesta and Kaye are very interchangeable.

    However, that almost seems like luck in their part. Finding players of that quality who can play two way is not easy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I dunno, I find LAFC is smashing that idea. Atuesta and Kaye are very interchangeable.

    However, that almost seems like luck in their part. Finding players of that quality who can play two way is not easy.
    Talent level is obviously key. Average-to-kinda good MLS players and managers lack the IQ to consistently make it work, IMO. LA is far above the norm. Atuesta will be playing for a major European club soon, and Bradley is a very good coach by MLS standards.
    Last edited by Bobo; 08-18-2019 at 09:11 AM.

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    We have to start looking ahead to the expansion draft. If you can only protect 11 guys not counting homegrown or generation adidas players who would they be?

    1. Pozuelo
    2. Gallardo
    3. Osorio
    4. Omar
    5. Deleon
    6. Auro
    7. Laryea
    8. Westburg
    9. Endoh
    10. Morrow
    11. Mavinga

    Bradley is a free agent and I doubt any expansion team would want to pay Jozy 6 million and I would totally be ok with both Bradley and Jozy gone. Jozy is a good player but doesn’t play enough.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikmacdo View Post
    We have to start looking ahead to the expansion draft. If you can only protect 11 guys not counting homegrown or generation adidas players who would they be?

    1. Pozuelo
    2. Gallardo
    3. Osorio
    4. Omar
    5. Deleon
    6. Auro
    7. Laryea
    8. Westburg
    9. Endoh
    10. Morrow
    11. Mavinga

    Bradley is a free agent and I doubt any expansion team would want to pay Jozy 6 million and I would totally be ok with both Bradley and Jozy gone. Jozy is a good player but doesn’t play enough.
    Homegrown players that aren't on the supplemental or reserve roster aren't exempt. E.g. Delgado is available for selection if unprotected, but Fraser and Chapman are automatically protected (assuming the rules are kept the same).

    https://www.mlssoccer.com/rosters/2019/toronto-fc
    Last edited by notthesun; 08-18-2019 at 12:01 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notthesun View Post
    Homegrown players that aren't on the supplemental or reserve roster aren't exempt. E.g. Delgado is available for selection if unprotected, but Fraser and Chapman are automatically protected (assuming the rules are kept the same).

    https://www.mlssoccer.com/rosters/2019/toronto-fc
    I would keep delgado and let endoh go but who knows he might be a free agent?

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    Aketxe hit for Deportivo Coruna today in La Liga..

 

 

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