TFC 2019 player in-season moves/speculation/rumours [Seba-free zone from page 74 on]

[OgtheDim]

Now that Garber et al have got over that "top 5 in the world" nonsense, Belgium is the type of league MLS wants to emulate - buy young, sell, good crowds, good technical skill, develop local youth.


If somehow the salary cap were to be 3x what we currently have, we might pry away a few of those VV/Poz type guys to come here instead. Not going to happen unfortunately but being the second or third choice for skilled players who can't make it in Germany, France, Spain or England is where MLS wants to be - right now its probably the 4th choice after Belgium, Netherlands, & Portugal.

**********

If there is a player finalized to be announced next week, we should hear a rumour by this weekend.

[stegosaurus]

People bloom at different ages or steps in their life. Anything is possible. If he serves his purpose as depth RB then good, if he doesnt then they will make changes which is why they are leaving a player acquisition open for the summer.

I just meant he’s not a developing youth player playing out of position... Hopefully we have enough RB depth to not have to play him there, otherwise we get Creavalle vol. 2 and that’s not good.

[PopePouri]

I just meant he’s not a developing youth player playing out of position... Hopefully we have enough RB depth to not have to play him there, otherwise we get Creavalle vol. 2 and that’s not good.

Or you get Robbie Rogers. This is a wait and see.

[jabbronies]

Belgiums Jupiter league is on part with Portugal, France, Netherlands it's a secondary top league

Outside of the top 4 teams....maybe even top 5 teams, the Portuguese league is shit. There are good players on lower teams, yes, but the teams play shit soccer. Watch the Portimonense/Moreirense match this weekend and tell me otherwise.

Also - the notion that Belgium lower teams would spank MLS teams is ignorant. the top 3-5 teams ya, I would say they should give MLS teams a hard run, but to say the rest are far superior is laughable.

[Redskiesatnight]

I think the difference comes down to depth. I'm sure that most starting 11's in MLS could go toe-to-toe with the starting 11's in Belgium. However, once you start dipping into the bench/reserve depth, then you see the difference. Over the course of a season MLS teams couldn't match that level of depth.

[stegosaurus]

Thinking that pace is not dependent on a countries climate is moronic.

I’ve watched both leagues. If you want to see the difference in MLS pace, watch an MLS playoff match this November or games played at 8-14 degrees. This isn’t some conspiracy theory that temperature changes the game play and it’s not complex for most people. Playing in the winter also has its challenges.

LIGA mx has slower pace league then Belgium A as well. Are they a worse league? They are probably similar.

There acedemies are better but MLS is at a point where many teams can field a starting 11 where average players salary is 600 k + on but the DP spend on top end strikers is actually higher.

What is your actual point though? Because mine is that there isn’t as big of a gap as you think. Belgium league A and Liga MX are in a tier slightly above MLS. I think most people would agree with that.

I’ll ignore the personal attack.

The outlier cold MLS games aren’t an excuse for the pace of the league. Decent Belgian team average salaries 4 years ago were higher than the top MLS teams currently including more than just the starting XI. We pay 3x the salary for one of their top players. Paying Giovinco more than any other Italian player didn’t make him the best Italian player so you can’t even compare MLS salaries to ones in Europe because they’re inflated. We massively overpay our talented players.

Academies are miles better, the depth players are miles better, the football is better, the top teams are playing in CL/EL, and our top transfer targets for years now were their league’s best players, all of whom went on to or are likely to go on to light up MLS.

I’m a TFC fan. I like MLS. I want MLS to be the #1 league, sure, but let’s not be delusional now. There’s a huge gap between the Belgian league (or Dutch, or Portuguese) and MLS. Minnows in those leagues not be spectacular, but they’ve developed world class players as well. The top and mid-table teams are far better than their equivalents in MLS...

Thinking the gap is close is absolutely hilarious considering we got obliterated by a Panamanian team in poor league form starting a 40 year old...

[jabbronies]

I think the difference comes down to depth. I'm sure that most starting 11's in MLS could go toe-to-toe with the starting 11's in Belgium. However, once you start dipping into the bench/reserve depth, then you see the difference. Over the course of a season MLS teams couldn't match that level of depth.

That's a different conversation.

If you were to even the playing field financially, I still think MLS would do better than the above mention leagues.

[stegosaurus]

Outside of the top 4 teams....maybe even top 5 teams, the Portuguese league is shit. There are good players on lower teams, yes, but the teams play shit soccer. Watch the Portimonense/Moreirense match this weekend and tell me otherwise.

Also - the notion that Belgium lower teams would spank MLS teams is ignorant. the top 3-5 teams ya, I would say they should give MLS teams a hard run, but to say the rest are far superior is laughable.

There are bad teams at the bottom of the table in Italy or Germany too.

Minnow teams are kind of the outlier because every MLS team with a few exceptions has loads of money and is in a prime market. If we put a team in Gander playing in front of 1,250 people you would have the same issue.

The parity thing is a benefit but it also prevents building a team that is quality too to bottom.

We thought MLS was getting better (it is) and closing the gap with Liga MX and we’ve all seen how that ended up this year.

[stegosaurus]

That's a different conversation.

If you were to even the playing field financially, I still think MLS would do better than the above mention leagues.

Of course it would. The Chinese league would also be best in the world if they didn’t have limitations on number of foreign players or a 100% tax on foreign transfers.

[jabbronies]

We thought MLS was getting better (it is) and closing the gap with Liga MX and we’ve all seen how that ended up this year.

The only people who thought this were people not thinking with their heads. and this is the same issue I had when people were asking "Where's this depth TFC keep bragging about".

MLS teams have the ability to create a very competitive Starting XI - we saw that with TFC and NYRB. I think MLS Starting XI's with no health issues could roll with most 2nd tier clubs in the world. Not 2nd division clubs, 2nd tier clubs - so basically teams you don't see in the champions league or Europa league Final 16.

But once MLS teams starting losing Starting XI players, that's where it get's hairy.

TFC had MLS depth. meaning they had more than a couple players who could be on a Starting XI in MLS (in 2017 it was Edwards, Hasler, Irwin, Cheyrou, Copper). Doesn't mean they could all play in the same Start XI and be competitive, but fitted into the right system in small doses - they could handle their own.

If an MLS team loses 2 maybe 3 Starting XI players, they could still remain competitive as long as they are not in Key positions.
MLS teams do not have viable starting strikers, CBs or attacking/defensive mids sitting on the bench. Where teams with more financial clout may have.

TFC lost 2 starting CB, starting striker, starting Creative Mid, Starting left and right backs for the majority of 2018
A doubt any of these 2nd Tier European team could survive that decimation, but its more detrimental to an MLS side since their depth isn't really there.

[Redskiesatnight]

That's a different conversation.

If you were to even the playing field financially, I still think MLS would do better than the above mention leagues.

Is it though? We're talking about comparing one league to another. That takes into account more than just starting line-ups. When one of our defenders goes down, we turn to Eric Zavaletta. I'm pretty sure that any team in the Belgian league would have a better first choice back-up than this. But you're right that this difference is based on other factors such as money, academy quality, etc. But until MLS teams can look to depth with the same quality as teams in leagues like the Belgian league, then MLS will be slightly less competitive with these other leagues.
However, I truly believe that day is coming, and it's only the money situation here that holds MLS back. This league is on the ascendancy.

[reggie]

why are we having this conversation.its apples and oranges.the mls is a cap league.until we lose the dp ,tam gam spam stuff and make it a 30 mil top end and 10 to 15 low end cap we will jus tread water.

[Redskiesatnight]

The only people who thought this were people not thinking with their heads. and this is the same issue I had when people were asking "Where's this depth TFC keep bragging about".

MLS teams have the ability to create a very competitive Starting XI - we saw that with TFC and NYRB. I think MLS Starting XI's with no health issues could roll with most 2nd tier clubs in the world. Not 2nd division clubs, 2nd tier clubs - so basically teams you don't see in the champions league or Europa league Final 16.

But once MLS teams starting losing Starting XI players, that's where it get's hairy.

TFC had MLS depth. meaning they had more than a couple players who could be on a Starting XI in MLS (in 2017 it was Edwards, Hasler, Irwin, Cheyrou, Copper). Doesn't mean they could all play in the same Start XI and be competitive, but fitted into the right system in small doses - they could handle their own.

If an MLS team loses 2 maybe 3 Starting XI players, they could still remain competitive as long as they are not in Key positions.
MLS teams do not have viable starting strikers, CBs or attacking/defensive mids sitting on the bench. Where teams with more financial clout may have.

TFC lost 2 starting CB, starting striker, starting Creative Mid, Starting left and right backs for the majority of 2018
A doubt any of these 2nd Tier European team could survive that decimation, but its more detrimental to an MLS side since their depth isn't really there.

100%. That was the point I was trying to make in my earlier post.

[jabbronies]

100%. That was the point I was trying to make in my earlier post.

this is why pub talk on the internet doesn't work LOL

[cincy]

Any talk of actual players ? Tfc have been talking about this TAM being a week away for a month now

[Mikmacdo]

Any talk of actual players ? Tfc have been talking about this TAM being a week away for a month now

we have no idea who, we don't even know where Ali flew to sign a player after the press conference.

[sidvan]

we have no idea who, we don't even know where Ali flew to sign a player after the press conference.

Allegedly gong to MLS meetings in NY first and then off to SA per https://torontosun.com/sports/soccer...for-more-depth
"TFC is hoping to get the first TAM signing done within a couple of weeks.
Curtis will first attend MLS meetings in NYC before heading down to South America."

[Defoe]

I’ll ignore the personal attack.

The outlier cold MLS games aren’t an excuse for the pace of the league. Decent Belgian team average salaries 4 years ago were higher than the top MLS teams currently including more than just the starting XI. We pay 3x the salary for one of their top players. Paying Giovinco more than any other Italian player didn’t make him the best Italian player so you can’t even compare MLS salaries to ones in Europe because they’re inflated. We massively overpay our talented players.

Academies are miles better, the depth players are miles better, the football is better, the top teams are playing in CL/EL, and our top transfer targets for years now were their league’s best players, all of whom went on to or are likely to go on to light up MLS.

I’m a TFC fan. I like MLS. I want MLS to be the #1 league, sure, but let’s not be delusional now. There’s a huge gap between the Belgian league (or Dutch, or Portuguese) and MLS. Minnows in those leagues not be spectacular, but they’ve developed world class players as well. The top and mid-table teams are far better than their equivalents in MLS...

Thinking the gap is close is absolutely hilarious considering we got obliterated by a Panamanian team in poor league form starting a 40 year old...

Didn't mean to attack you mate, more or less saying it's a bit insane not to see the correlation of climate and how fast players can run for extended periods of time. If you felt it was an attack, I withdraw my comment or should have phrased it better in a more constructive manner. I didn't really appreciate your claim that I've never watched Belgium league football and that my opinions are nonsense.

Portugal and Belgium is not in the same tier at all. The Portuguese league is better then Belgium league A by quite a bit. I don't even think Belgium league is as good as Super Lig. We disagree here.

Genk's defence is not that good. I only watched Genk a few games during the Pozuelo saga, sure. The TFC offence will be quite close to Genk's from the 270 minutes I watched of Genk and what I expect from Pozuelo, Altidore, Bradley and new recruits. They are not worlds apart. Seriously.

[Auzzy]

Any talk of actual players ? Tfc have been talking about this TAM being a week away for a month now

we have no idea who, we don't even know where Ali flew to sign a player after the press conference.

Allegedly gong to MLS meetings in NY first and then off to SA per https://torontosun.com/sports/soccer...for-more-depth
"TFC is hoping to get the first TAM signing done within a couple of weeks.
Curtis will first attend MLS meetings in NYC before heading down to South America."

I'll think we'll hear about further signings mañana. Tomorrow it will still be mañana though. Next week it might still be mañana as well.

What worries me a bit in that Sun article: no mention of defensive depth needed...

[stegosaurus]

You can’t run if it’s too hot either, and there’s no way MLS teams would be topping the Brazilian or Argentinian league. The Russian league is also better than MLS and it gets pretty cold there too.

If you want to have an opinion, that’s fine. MLS is a cap league and pays higher salaries to its star players than they’d get anywhere outside the Middle East or China. A lot of people argue whether the French league is better than the Portuguese one, and there isn’t a huge consensus.

If you look to the stats and coefficients, which I don’t think is super helpful, MLS ranks below plenty of leagues, and is way further down the pole than the Belgian league.

MLS has parity so the worst teams are never quite as bad as they are in smaller European or South American competitions, which is another reason it’s hard to judge. People saying watch the worst teams in Portugal doesn’t make the Portuguese league worse in general than MLS. The Quakes would still be bad in Belgium or the Netherlands.

Comparing a best possible XI isn’t the same as comparing entire squads, leagues, and teams.

MLS is moving forward, and TFC is no longer the worst team in the world. But if you have to triple someone’s wages to get them to come here it shows a lot about how the players themselves consider MLS.

[Oldtimer]

This is completely off-topic to player movements.

Please get back on topic. If you want to discuss this further, do it in the general banter thread, I'll even do the first post: http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/showth...TFC-MLS-banter

[Ultra & Proud]

What worries me a bit in that Sun article: no mention of defensive depth needed...

I'm not sure Curtis mentioned much really. Maybe just a bone to Buffery to have something to write. The FO is now super tight lipped. Quieter than ever before.

[zorsofstesab]

this is completely off-topic to player movements.

Please get back on topic. If you want to discuss this further, do it in the general banter thread, i'll even do the first post: http://forums.redpatchboys.ca/showth...tfc-mls-banter

best post all day. Sorry if this upsets some...

[OgtheDim]

Both Manning & Curtis have mentionned defender depth as something they are looking for.

Meanwhile, I would have thought the mention of "he's going to South America" would have had people in a tizzy on here. This is what people have been asking about for years - forgetting for the moment we have had Urruiti, Auro & Gilberto.

Aaaa...the memories

[A Stick]

Both Manning & Curtis have mentionned defender depth as something they are looking for.

Meanwhile, I would have thought the mention of "he's going to South America" would have had people in a tizzy on here. This is what people have been asking about for years - forgetting for the moment we have had Urruiti, Auro & Gilberto.

Aaaa...the memories

I still say to to this day that Urruiti didn't get a fair chance to show what he could do.

[MightyDM]

Both Manning & Curtis have mentionned defender depth as something they are looking for.

Meanwhile, I would have thought the mention of "he's going to South America" would have had people in a tizzy on here. This is what people have been asking about for years - forgetting for the moment we have had Urruiti, Auro & Gilberto.

Aaaa...the memories

Not auro....

[MightyDM]

I still say to to this day that Urruiti didn't get any chance to show what he could do.

Fixed

[Red CB Toronto]

Fixed

Two games, 37 minutes played, the exact same number as on his jersey. I at least have signed photos from his brief time here. I personally don't care where Ali goes and where the player is from as along as they feel good about him and he fits in, performs well and makes the team better. Simply as that.

[Hamilton_Red]

Both Manning & Curtis have mentionned defender depth as something they are looking for.

Meanwhile, I would have thought the mention of "he's going to South America" would have had people in a tizzy on here. This is what people have been asking about for years - forgetting for the moment we have had Urruiti, Auro & Gilberto.

Aaaa...the memories

Not to forget Cooper, Plata, Guevara, Maicon, Vitti, Jackson, Varic, Velez... those are just the ones that played a fair number of matches.

[Auzzy]

Not to forget Cooper, Plata, Guevara, Maicon, Vitti, Jackson, Varic, Velez... those are just the ones that played a fair number of matches.

Yes there have been a number of them over the years... But Cooper, Guevara, and Velez weren't from South America.