Manning Failure listing Thread (formerly evaluation thread)

[Red CB Toronto]

Bill Manning is not only being judged based on on-field results, he overseas all of TFC's business operations, which are doing just fine, TFC has over 20K in season tickets. He overseas the Argos which are actually the most stable they have been in years. When it comes to him the football on the field is only a part of the overall picture for him. Plus you have to remember MLSE still have not hired a new president and ceo, so things are very fluid right now.

If Bob doesn't work out Manning needs to be the first to go.

MLSE need to have a complete rethink about how TFC should be structured.

First and foremost we need a director of football fully focused on this team.

At this point you might as well have Massai step in, we're in dire need of competency at the top.

The fact that Manning wasn't fired tells me mlse just doesn't give a crap about the club and winning.

[OgtheDim]

Bill Manning is not only being judged based on on-field results, he overseas all of TFC's business operations, which are doing just fine, TFC has over 20K in season tickets. He overseas the Argos which are actually the most stable they have been in years. When it comes to him the football on the field is only a part of the overall picture for him. Plus you have to remember MLSE still have not hired a new president and ceo, so things are very fluid right now.

Yeh, which is why this discussion is premature.

BB & BM will be judged based on playoffs.

Heck, even Voyageurs means nothing really to MLSE.

[FootBallAZ]

Yeh, which is why this discussion is premature.

BB & BM will be judged based on playoffs.

Heck, even Voyageurs means nothing really to MLSE.

wait so- we have to wait until they make the playoffs to judge them? so if they dont make the playoffs until 2025- we cant judge them ?

[Ultra & Proud]

wait so- we have to wait until they make the playoffs to judge them? so if they dont make the playoffs until 2025- we cant judge them ?

And only if we have a season without any injuries.

[jloome]

And only if we have a season without any injuries.

He's had 48(? something like that) games in complete control of the richest club in the league in pure spending power and it's still constantly qualified by how disrupted they are.

Everyone has injuries. Everyone has a cap to work with. Everyone has problems.

Why is it always at TFC that those equate to constantly giving people more chances? Has he learned nothing from Ali?

It's not working move on. Jesus H.

[Ultra & Proud]

He's had 48(? something like that) games in complete control of the richest club in the league in pure spending power and it's still constantly qualified by how disrupted they are.

Everyone has injuries. Everyone has a cap to work with. Everyone has problems.

Why is it always at TFC that those equate to constantly giving people more chances? Has he learned nothing from Ali?

It's not working move on. Jesus H.

I've been hearing we "need time to gel" since about May 2018.

[Hala Hrvatska]

Someone, anyone, please tell me Manning has been fired?

[reggie]

im a STH from day one.i will not renew if the sotto sotto clown manning is still prez,no more americans running this club

[ensco]

I have to say, the only way you get real change is by voting with your feet. I was a day one SSH, 4 good seats, and I walked away after 2012. As thousands did at that time. Leiweke was hired soon afterwards.

[Hala Hrvatska]

I have 4 seats...I can't even give some away now...no one wants to go..and its not because of the night starts and weather...Bradly and Manning have sucked the life out of this team...and this is WITH the Italians playing....the game in Phily, the NE game and last night...horrendous football....we need change and hope. And right now.

I will not renew if Bradley is the coach next year. Thats for sure. And the only way he isn't the coach is if Manning is fired.

What a disaster. And no more American retreads. Enough is enough.

[DinamoTFC]

Have to agree Manning has really dampened my enthusiasm once again this season. How many shit shows do we have to endure? His bosses need to put pressure on him.

[JoesphNdo]

My biggest worry with Manning's mismanagement has always been the opportunity cost. I know people think TFC is but a rounding error for MLSE, but my phone bill is but a rounding error for Bell and they'll still try to squeeze every penny from me. Bell & Rogers care about bottom line and bottom line only, and if there isn't a path to making money they will pull back spending. There's only so long they'll keep this money tap in with absolutely no return to show for it. We're, once again, the highest spending team in the league and, once again, basically crap despite that. They'll eventually ask why they're spending this money and the answer to that may be to stop spending it

I don't think we'll ever be a lowest spender in the league, but I think it's very possible we have a finite amount of chances to actually make something with the richest budget in the league before we stop having it and I just can't see how MLSEs patience isn't wearing incredibly thin. Mannings mismanagement may have pretty serious repercussions for our future even after he's gone

Saying all that, I thought they'd already be asking questions last year and instead they dropped 14m a year on Insigne, so who knows. But there's no way we can just last forever as the highest spending team getting mid table returns

[Joe Kool]

My biggest worry with Manning's mismanagement has always been the opportunity cost. I know people think TFC is but a rounding error for MLSE, but my phone bill is but a rounding error for Bell and they'll still try to squeeze every penny from me. Bell & Rogers care about bottom line and bottom line only, and if there isn't a path to making money they will pull back spending. There's only so long they'll keep this money tap in with absolutely no return to show for it. We're, once again, the highest spending team in the league and, once again, basically crap despite that. They'll eventually ask why they're spending this money and the answer to that may be to stop spending it

I don't think we'll ever be a lowest spender in the league, but I think it's very possible we have a finite amount of chances to actually make something with the richest budget in the league before we stop having it and I just can't see how MLSEs patience isn't wearing incredibly thin. Mannings mismanagement may have pretty serious repercussions for our future even after he's gone

Saying all that, I thought they'd already be asking questions last year and instead they dropped 14m a year on Insigne, so who knows. But there's no way we can just last forever as the highest spending team getting mid table returns

At that higher level I think nothing changes unless we lose season ticket holders. As long as our attendance is as strong as it is along with quite a high amount of season ticket holders I don't think their bottom line is affected. People have to walk from season tickets and attendance has to also drop considerably. That is what happened before the year 1 pricing thing came in before and is likely what is needed again for them to take note. Otherwise if tickets are still sold and getting around 20K people in there buying merch and food/drinks each game, there will be no real push to change from up top. My opinion anyway.

[reggie]

My biggest worry with Manning's mismanagement has always been the opportunity cost. I know people think TFC is but a rounding error for MLSE, but my phone bill is but a rounding error for Bell and they'll still try to squeeze every penny from me. Bell & Rogers care about bottom line and bottom line only, and if there isn't a path to making money they will pull back spending. There's only so long they'll keep this money tap in with absolutely no return to show for it. We're, once again, the highest spending team in the league and, once again, basically crap despite that. They'll eventually ask why they're spending this money and the answer to that may be to stop spending it

I don't think we'll ever be a lowest spender in the league, but I think it's very possible we have a finite amount of chances to actually make something with the richest budget in the league before we stop having it and I just can't see how MLSEs patience isn't wearing incredibly thin. Mannings mismanagement may have pretty serious repercussions for our future even after he's gone

Saying all that, I thought they'd already be asking questions last year and instead they dropped 14m a year on Insigne, so who knows. But there's no way we can just last forever as the highest spending team getting mid table returns

the prob is...they dont know how to spend it,manning is a ticket guy not a soccer guy,he may have been ok with a 3mil budget at RSL.he has no clue now

[JoesphNdo]

At that higher level I think nothing changes unless we lose season ticket holders. As long as our attendance is as strong as it is along with quite a high amount of season ticket holders I don't think their bottom line is affected. People have to walk from season tickets and attendance has to also drop considerably. That is what happened before the year 1 pricing thing came in before and is likely what is needed again for them to take note. Otherwise if tickets are still sold and getting around 20K people in there buying merch and food/drinks each game, there will be no real push to change from up top. My opinion anyway.

It depends on if MLSE believe that they could shave nearly $20m usd in expenses and not lose $20m usd in revenue, which is probably true, seeing as how even with that spending we aren't selling out right now and it'll get worse if we keep losing. So their question will be, for how much cheaper could we get similar ticket sales and results? And right now there is a strong, strong, strong argument that they could get a better ROI by significantly reducing cost

[ag futbol]

the prob is...they dont know how to spend it,manning is a ticket guy not a soccer guy,he may have been ok with a 3mil budget at RSL.he has no clue now

League has changed a lot too. That cup winning RSL team (as much as I liked it at the time) might not even make the playoffs in todays MLS. Skill set these days is different

[OgtheDim]

League has changed a lot too. That cup winning RSL team (as much as I liked it at the time) might not even make the playoffs in todays MLS. Skill set these days is different

I would have that issue for a Sporting Director who relied upon that information - a President, not so much.

[ag futbol]

I would have that issue for a Sporting Director who relied upon that information - a President, not so much.

Fair. But the way our franchise is managed doesn’t exactly feel like it’s kept up with the times. Like on paper we have all the fancy toys (analytics department, scouting, modern training ground) but doesn’t feel like they have been used properly.

[reggie]

where is TEFLON BILL these days,he seems really quiet

[Hala Hrvatska]

Keep hoping to wake up to an official statement from the club that he has been fired or "reassigned"...but alas, my hopes get crushed every day. ffs...

Get rid of this clown.....

He brought in Curtis, Armas, Bradley, one worse than the next....surely anyone's head would roll for such disasterous moves?

[Ultra & Proud]

Keep hoping to wake up to an official statement from the club that he has been fired or "reassigned"...but alas, my hopes get crushed every day. ffs...

Get rid of this clown.....

He brought in Curtis, Armas, Bradley, one worse than the next....surely anyone's head would roll for such disasterous moves?

I knew he would have this weekend's rematch to try to right the ship. Not going to happen but I see what's going on. These things take a bit of time when unprepared and have to be done in a good way.

[JoesphNdo]

I really would keep expectations low, I don't believe we do anything until we're playing in front of half empty crowds and out of play off contention (And the latter is damn near impossible to do in this league - as bad as we are, we should still make the play offs comfortably enough, so that means winter off season)

[Ultra & Proud]

as bad as we are, we should still make the play offs comfortably enough, so that means winter off season)

We're in 13th and falling like a stone. I haven't seen any reason to think we can turn this around and now we have a full XI of players injured. If Bob stays I predict we are last in the East by the long weekend. I would say wooden spoon placed but I don't have much faith in SKC or LA unless they change their managers. In that case I bet we're in solid complete last place by mid June.

[OgtheDim]

We're in 13th and falling like a stone. ...

1 game losing streak?

[Ultra & Proud]

1 game losing streak?

We could draw every match and we'd probably sink still. Definitely wouldn't gain and the table is the table. Only two teams lower in the east and both could get new couch bounces although that's unlikely with Klopas. Not sure how optimistic one would need to be to think we're trending in any direction other than down.

Also hard to use the 1 match losing streak as a defense when we only have 2 wins ane we're 13th. We were in 7th two weeks ago. That's a good fall. From that to looking close up at the spoon in our rear view.

[jloome]

I have a sense that Manning is not being fully informed by the staff.

My source informs me that he did not know Michael was going for surgery -- and if he did it was last-second -- and was expecting MB back sooner rather than later.

[Ultra & Proud]

I have a sense that Manning is not being fully informed by the staff.

My source informs me that he did not know Michael was going for surgery -- and if he did it was last-second -- and was expecting MB back sooner rather than later.

As the honcho he should probably try coming down from his MLSE ivory tower to see what's actually going on then.

[ag futbol]

We could draw every match and we'd probably sink still. Definitely wouldn't gain and the table is the table. Only two teams lower in the east and both could get new couch bounces although that's unlikely with Klopas. Not sure how optimistic one would need to be to think we're trending in any direction other than down.

Also hard to use the 1 match losing streak as a defense when we only have 2 wins ane we're 13th. We were in 7th two weeks ago. That's a good fall. From that to looking close up at the spoon in our rear view.

I played a season of youth football where we were resolute defensively but couldn’t score to save our lives. Ended the season with 2 wins - 3 losses and 12 ties. Finished second last.

Lesson learned: ties aren’t worth anything, especially if you are getting them at home. That’s bad football.

[Kamp Berg]

I have a sense that Manning is not being fully informed by the staff.

My source informs me that he did not know Michael was going for surgery -- and if he did it was last-second -- and was expecting MB back sooner rather than later.

So Manning thinks MB would right the ship?

[Ultra & Proud]

So Manning thinks MB would right the ship?

He's the guy bringing the missing goals.