Very true. I wonder what the state of operations is right now at TFC with respect to player acquisition? Is it at a stand still?Originally Posted by Ossington Mental Youth
All said and done this isn’t a bad time for someone new to take over. They have basically a year to think about how they want to take the team forward. Contract flexibility is good, in this case.
The big question is what does our budget look like? Will there be big dollars available for our next round of DPs in 2020?
This makes me sick that we are picking up leftovers in Curtis; why did they not evaluate all options before the signing; feels like they rushed to conclusions
If Manning doesn't always have irons in the fire for a future GM & coach in case of emergency, I'd be shocked - that has to be a basic requirement of his job.
Leftovers? He's imo the best free agent GM in MLS.
Somebody in the off-season thread (Ultra and Proud) made a really good point about how much our players looked better working with our stars at full strength in 2017, and how they got exposed without them in 2018 (the data doesn’t totally support the point, we had real absences with our DPs in 2017, but I think the point is correct)
The same may be true upstairs. Bez was at least somewhat helped by the DPs. Do a Moor or a Vazquez come if the DPs aren’t here?
I don’t say this because I want Bez to leave (I don’t) but I think his record is hard to evaluate.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
“We are excited to add a player with Laurent’s vast experience,” Toronto GM Tim Bezbatchenko said in a statement. “This is a player who has been a captain of two MLS teams, an all-star and the defender of the year.“He is an excellent passer, an organizer in the back and a passionate, fiery competitor. We look forward to him joining our club immediately and becoming an important part of our group.”
That "We" by Bez lol. Only a week ago
“Hard to evaluate” is a good way to put it.
ok guys...
I heard that Chris Mavinga courting another French National to TFVC. His name is Alex Lacazette. Currently sitting on the bench...
DO you think there is any truth behind this?
Are you serious? It was two friends having a laugh on twitter
At the end of the day he's moving from a team competing for continental titles to a team that's not. Speaks to his ego in my opinion that he'd rather be the captain of a mid tier ship than second in command at a top of the line one.
I wouldn’t describe him as sitting on the bench at Arsenal but I do think he’s marginally out of favour. That’s a no truth from me.
His bio reads very similarly to what Bez's did when we got him but with more experience. He worked with Bez for the league helping design the salary cap system so he knows the ins and outs just as good as Bez but now has experience roughly equivalent to Bez from his NYRB time.
As for further options, I would only want someone with MLS and especially MLS cap experience and with that in mind there isn't anyone better available right now (that's out of work).
He was Bez's boss at league HQ IIRC
Honestly that isn’t obvious. Their record of achievement over any period you want is better than ours. Even in 2017 they came within an inch of knocking us out.
Re continental ambition... Our CCL run was distinctive, but right now it’s a one off. We’ll see if your statement holds true in a couple of years.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Even better. I only knew they worked together.
Since consistency is a primary point for TFC now as part of our plan for success, he seems the most seamless to integrate.
The signal here re MLSE's post 2019 strategy is worrying. Bez may know (he certainly is in a position to make a more intelligent guess than the rest of us) that we are going a different, cheaper way. If so, may as well do that in your home town.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Here I thought you were going to say that Bez's shortcomings were exposed in the absence of Leiweke.
You won’t see me ragging on the guy. Three finals in 18 months, losing none, he was core to that.
He was part of bringing in:
Moor
Mavinga
Vazquez
Hasler
Ricketts
Irwin
Will Johnson (important in 2016)
Beitashour
We had been able to fix mistakes pretty easily (eg Kantari) until the big air balls with Aketxe and vdW
What we don’t know is how much of this record is Bez vs others, and how much of a halo affect the 3 DPs had on attracting players.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Check out this tweet at [COLOR=#14171A][FONT="]https://twitter.com/joshuakloke/status/1080570524252569600[/FONT][/COLOR]
That's that thenToronto FC President Bill Manning will meet with the media tomorrow morning, presumably to formally announce Bezbatchenko leaving the club. No word of whether his successor will be present. #TFCLive
11 am as per Wheeler
They must be being nice to Molinaro who is on a plane coming back from holiday today.
Perhaps this is simply a matter of Bez taking advantage of an opportunity for a higher ranking position with an organization that is close to home.
That being said, I agree with ensco in that our payroll is going to be reduced beyond 2019. We can still target young talented DPs and utilize the TAM to remain competitive without having 3 players making 4-7 million dollars each per season.
Our model was unsustainable in the long run based on team revenues. It was great while it lasted and we got our share of hardware as a result with one more kick at the can with the existing core.
The overall salary budget should be increasing from 2020 on under the new CBA.
While I don't think there will be ~$18M a year in DP spending, I think the overall salary number will still be in the top tier of MLS sides.
I don't see TFC changing our salary system into something like Dallas or the Revs. What I do see is us following the MLS 3.0 model of targeting younger, more affordable players salary-wise while paying transfer fees with the intent to sell on. This is not new now as it's been done recently with Auro, Jansen, & Aketxe. Problem is that these moves can back fire as often as come up winners. I think that will be the new way for MLS until some other team has success with something else.
Agree with this. Still think they will try to have one big name thats played in a top European league for marketing reasons.
I think the days of spending $10 million on a transfer may not be over (that was Bradley).
Just not sure we will spend $18-$19 million a year on salaries.
As long as we get Curtis, I'm good.
Since this is all going down so fast I assume it's been in the works since the Crew sale was made official so Manning has had time to work on it.
I was trying to come to grips with Vanney possibly being handled the dual role but I wasn't fully on board with that. Just don't hire some Euro suit for the job. That's the main thing.
Could be. I don't understand how the financials of TFC makes sense (but the same goes for many other sports teams). However people have predicted the same thing a number of times in the past, yet TFC hasn't gone the low-spending route yet. Maybe this time?
Some previous predictions that never came true. No one particular poster in mind; just a few events I remember; some of these predictions I believed myself at the time:
- Bogers control of MLSE will be a disaster, will only last a short time, and will make major spending & other major decisions difficult in the meantime.
- The Bloody Big Bust means the big-spending days are over: didn't work on the field and didn't adequately move the needle on revenue.
- Leiweke ("P.T. Barnum") leaving means the big-spending days are over.
- Friisdahl hiring as MLSE prez & CEO means the big-spending days are over for sure; look at all the cost cutting he did at Air Canada.
- The Bill Manning hiring means the big-spending days are over. At RSL he showed you can be efficient & successful with a much lower budget.
- The 2016 TFC season, despite the spending & despite making it to MLS Cup, didn't pan out in terms of significantly increased TV viewership or revenue. The big-spending days are over.
- The record-setting (& record-spending) 2017 TFC season didn't really move the needle either on TV viewership or revenue. The big-spending days are over.
- 2018 didn't get any better. CCL near-success didn't generate much hype. TFC bombed in the standings, in the stands, and on TV.
Yet despite all this becoming evident partway through 2018, they still blew a pile of money on Aketxe and others. They maxed out on TAM, GAM, WHAM, and other MLS shams. They signed (probably overpaying) a new long-term deal with Jonathan Osorio, 'that will make him “one of the highest-paid Canadian players in the world,” according to team president Bill Manning.' They already had the most expensive pitch installation & maintenance in MLS, yet they are replacing & upgrading it all again for 2019: redoing much of the irrigation & other subsurface systems; brand new hybrid pitch; more grow lights; more turf consultants etc. Oh and a major upgrade in the sports science department, to improve performance & reduce injuries.
Now Bez leaving, and Ali Curtis possibly coming, may signal that TFC is choosing a cheaper way? Maybe.
Note I'm not that worried about some cost cutting anyway, if they're smart about it. I've loved Gio, Jozy & Bradley, but other MLS teams have found success with less spending. (Or they've gotten bigger stars that sold more jerseys, more tickets, more TV viewership, & had other financial impact.) Finding some gems in SA or elsewhere, and selling them on after a few years, is smart if it works. The Academy has to eventually provide more return on the investment.
However everything I've seen from Manning tells me: gradual, slow change. For sure something will happen with 3 DP contracts expiring after this year, but I bet Manning would want to keep 1 or 2 of them, possibly on longer / cheaper deals, and stagger the transition. In the meantime they'll try to win everything in 2019. And what I've seen from MLSE tells me they will continue to have high spending on their teams, and to charge close to the league max for tickets.
(Any other past cost-cutting predictions I've forgotten about?)
Last edited by Auzzy; 01-02-2019 at 05:43 PM.
That's a very risky strategy with the way the league is going and how they killed Golden Goose. It was brought back to life by saint Tim Leiweke who should have a statue and his name on the wall of honor.
MLSE upper management may have short term memories but us fans do not.
Since TFC, like the leafs and raptors, are simply content generation devices for Bell/Rogers and their sports broadcasting empires. I don't see spending going down, since TFC do not need to be profitable, but they do need to be good. Great is much better that good, and if max spend can get them reliably from good to great MLSE will spend. They may spend on transfers, but even atlanta with their likely signing of Pity Martinez are going for in their prime players. Neither of ATL's Martinezes are going to Europe. Both are in their prime players who will be making big $$$ Josef sounds like he is going to be resigned for 5-7 Million, and I bet Pity is coming in not just on a massive transfer, but at his age and talking about not being respected by European teams, he will also likely be on 5-7 Million. We may not have the highest salary in the new year, and if we don't it will likely be a lot closer.
In a world where we keep all our DPs - All 3 DP's will HAVE to come down in Salary.
Seba - $2-3m (down from $5.6m)
Bradley - $1.5m (down from $6m)
Jozy - $1.5m (down from $5m)
With that being said - can we get better for slightly more? We'd still be spending less than we are now.
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