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  1. #5311
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    I want to say something about the MLSE overlords. (This has nothing to do with Manning.)

    USD$30M commitment for Pozo. CAD$40M.

    That is around what they spent on average for Giovinco, Altidore, Bradley....

    Wow. Wow. Wow.

    I have argued pretty vociferously that TFC would never be allowed to spend money again like on any single palaver like they did on those three players. The economics just didn’t support it. I thought hiring Manning and Curtis was evidence of that.

    I was wrong about this. MLSE probably aren’t willing to spend that on three players ever again, but even if it's only one, I will take it!

    Very glad to be wrong about this.

    (Now the other thing I have been banging on about for a year, that Manning has not handled Gio and Jozy properly, that prediction is looking a little stronger!)
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  2. #5312
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    TRANSFERSOAP TUESDAY





    Good news on Pozo if true!!

    I don’t know if the Altidore story is true but I speculated multiple times that he might move to Tigres as part of this. The timing would work...

    http://www.espn.com/soccer/portland-...eduardo-vargas

    http://www.espn.com/soccer/soccer-tr...-vargas-source

    That Quaresma story cannot be true. If Manning stood up in front of a hundred people and said that “understanding character” is the reason they are taking so long to identify to get players, and then they move for Quaresma... a bunch of people here will lose their minds.
    Ah yes, signing a 35 year old with a terrible attitude. There’s no way this is true unless he’s coming for next to nothing. If the FO was in contact with them it was about Larin or Atiba (as much as I like Hutch, he’s not really the player we need now).

  3. #5313
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    Don't discount the fact that the timing of all this was Giovinco forcing the sale through. Where you can fault TFC is that they didn't think Giovinco would force the sale and that they could go for these dp targets next January.
    They won't sign any TAM players without the DP first. TFC would not have been told or known that poz promised to stay and that would cause issues. They see he has a release clause and we can get him now instead of another DP target in July when selling team can replace the player.

  4. #5314
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I have argued pretty vociferously that TFC would never be allowed to spend money again like on any single palaver like they did on those three players.
    I really hope you don't edit that out. We'll see how it all plays out, but it really has (and still is, for now) a palaver: "unnecessarily elaborate or complex procedure."

    I will be very happy if Pozuelo, and TAM player x & y, all work out, and the team is all settled & playing well together within a few weeks or months. And as you said, that still leaves the things they didn't do well last year (and most of us didn't pay attention to you on that). I do have to wonder if the current largesse -- even if it's the right player to target in the end -- isn't at least partly due to current panic on FO's part.

  5. #5315
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Some of you lot are just NEVER happy.


    A player who has the potential to be the most dynamic AM in this league, 2nd best player in a league that is better then ours, coming in his prime - "Its a shit show because he isn't coming until mid March" NEWS FLASH - he's missing 2 games.


    Jozy presents a transfer offer to leave - "Complete clusterfuck" NEW FLASH - He as much as told the team that back in October - the timing sucks but we've already seen the team has had DP replacements in mind for over a year. Heck, we are pretty sure Jozy wasn't being offered the amount he wanted or thought he could get. He wants the $.


    Do we seriously think this team is going to be satisfied with the forwards it currently has without Jozy?

    Lets see how this all plays out.
    TFC management all offseason “No changes except minor upgrades”

    2019: lose VV, Seba, Altidore (?) (VdW).

    Fair comment that this was all unplanned. In the UK the supporters would be singing “you don’t know what you are doing”. “Clusterfuck” , while not what I would say, is a not unreasonable comment on “unplanned”.

    While Poz looks exciting and it’s great to have a younger version of VV, we still have to see on the field if he turns out that way. In the meantime, we have lost the core of our championship team against the explicit commitments of management. At a minimum, they do not look great. Perhaps they can make the proverbial silk purse but for sure it is out of a sows ear.

  6. #5316
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    Quote Originally Posted by leafsman View Post
    Don't discount the fact that the timing of all this was Giovinco utterly predictably forcing the sale through. Where you can fault TFC is that they didn't think Giovinco would force the sale and that they could go for these dp targets next January.
    They won't sign any TAM players without the DP first. TFC would not have been told or known that poz promised to stay and that would cause issues. They see he has a release clause and we can get him now instead of another DP target in July when selling team can replace the player.
    Fixed
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  7. #5317
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    Some of you will forever defend every ill-planned & ill-timed move by management. I'll say it again: should have started (and finished) negotiating seriously much earlier. More players are available with less hassle during the international transfer windows. And I don't have to like what is happening to Genk at this time during their season. There's a reason the majority of player transactions happen during the transfer windows.

    Pozuleo is not just missing two games. He's also missing CCL.
    Agreed with this post

  8. #5318
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    Some of you will forever defend every ill-planned & ill-timed move by management. I'll say it again: should have started (and finished) negotiating seriously much earlier. More players are available with less hassle during the international transfer windows. And I don't have to like what is happening to Genk at this time during their season. There's a reason the majority of player transactions happen during the transfer windows.

    Pozuleo is not just missing two games. He's also missing CCL.
    They should have talked to Poz's club earlier, no doubt about that. However, the mismatch between Europe's and US/Canada's transfer window (the biggest factor in this mess) is 100% FIFA's fault. What the TFC braintrust needs to learn from this is to not just do due diligence on the player but on his club. They come across as floundering newbies at this international transfer game (which of course they are). In the past MLS teams mostly picked players out of contract or on free release.

  9. #5319
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    Well obviously, and at this point nobody was expecting him to play tonight. But he also missed last week, which might have helped the team actually stay in CCL.
    I know, just poking the bear Auzzy

  10. #5320
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Poz been on the radar for a year.

    Doesn't happen NOW - OH MY GOSH THEY ARE INCOMPETENT!!!


    Pah.....I have serious issues with how this team has spent its money in defence the last 2 years. WAY too much acceptance that 2017 performance was the norm.
    I also agree with people who think Manning & Bez screwed the pooch by not talking to the DP's last season - they acted like North American sports teams, not a team in a world wide competition for talent.

    But I ain't calling today a shit show because of a rumour of a disgruntled DP leaving & a 2 game delay when we get a all league class player.
    agree entirely with this post

  11. #5321
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    Yes
    Quote Originally Posted by Canary10 View Post
    From what I’ve seen Pozuelo really has an eye for that last ball in behind and Jozy has great instincts for that run in behind. I think they’ll combine well and Jozy will score a lot of goals this year, as long as he’s healthy and ON OUR TEAM.

    The money is a lot though, at first blush more than extending Giovinco would have been. Which makes me question again if low balling our best ever player was worth it in the end.
    Exactly.

  12. #5322
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    More immediately, has there been any Canadian confirmation of Poz and/or any hint of an announcement?

  13. #5323
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    Jozy not playing in CCL or for home opener due to mysterious "slight" strain, unrelated to his ankle.

    I'm sure his agent will ensure that he sees a doctor for a medical as soon as possible.

  14. #5324
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    Quote Originally Posted by Initial B View Post
    We probably won't know for at least two years.
    Sorry, but I think we will know (at a first stage level) by October, in playoffs or not.

  15. #5325
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary10 View Post
    The money is a lot though, at first blush more than extending Giovinco would have been. Which makes me question again if low balling our best ever player was worth it in the end.
    Originally I thought that the TFC mgmt miscalculated with GIo, seeing him as an over-priced asset based on the the calculus of the global transfer market (when the proper calculus would have been what is his value to this market - which in my mind is 7mil). But now, seeing the cash outlay for Poz, I'm beginning to wonder if not taking up the option, and then offering him a deal at less was a cynical ploy to get him to move on without TFC looking like the bad guy. Was he going to suit the tactical changes Vanney wants to make?

    Nevertheless, anyway you cut it, not having the complete team ready for the beginning of the season is a fail on TFC mgmt.

  16. #5326
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I want to say something about the MLSE overlords. (This has nothing to do with Manning.)

    USD$30M commitment for Pozo. CAD$40M.

    That is around what they spent on average for Giovinco, Altidore, Bradley....

    Wow. Wow. Wow.

    I have argued pretty vociferously that TFC would never be allowed to spend money again like on any single palaver like they did on those three players. The economics just didn’t support it. I thought hiring Manning and Curtis was evidence of that.

    I was wrong about this. MLSE probably aren’t willing to spend that on three players ever again, but even if it's only one, I will take it!

    Very glad to be wrong about this.

    (Now the other thing I have been banging on about for a year, that Manning has not handled Gio and Jozy properly, that prediction is looking a little stronger!)
    Even when they turn out to be wrong, your insights are really thought provoking. Keep ‘em coming

  17. #5327
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    Confirmation of Poz signing:

    https://www.revolvy.com/page/Chris-Pozniak

    Didn’t know he was coaching in our system!
    Last edited by Redpunkfiddle; 02-26-2019 at 09:15 AM.

  18. #5328
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    The pozo show has turned tfc into the bozo show

  19. #5329
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    I want to say something about the MLSE overlords. (This has nothing to do with Manning.)

    USD$30M commitment for Pozo. CAD$40M.

    That is around what they spent on average for Giovinco, Altidore, Bradley....

    Wow. Wow. Wow.

    I have argued pretty vociferously that TFC would never be allowed to spend money again like on any single palaver like they did on those three players. The economics just didn’t support it. I thought hiring Manning and Curtis was evidence of that.

    I was wrong about this. MLSE probably aren’t willing to spend that on three players ever again, but even if it's only one, I will take it!

    Very glad to be wrong about this.

    (Now the other thing I have been banging on about for a year, that Manning has not handled Gio and Jozy properly, that prediction is looking a little stronger!)
    Not sure why you would have ever doubted MLSE as they always spend. All MLSE are near the very top in spending for players ever year and they certainly don’t skimp on the fringe expenses like coaches, doctors, facilities.

    I’ve said many times, MLSE is desperate for quality tv content and that means competive teams people want to watch. (Butts in the stadium is very secondary). When people tune in, the advertising money rolls into Rogers/Bell.

    Leafs, Raps, TFC, Argos are all top 3 in league spending. I’m glad you’ve seen the light

  20. #5330
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasper View Post
    https://amp.hitc.com/en-gb/2019/02/2...mpression=true

    Rumour linking us to Ricardo Quaresma. Clearly can’t be a DP for us, but would be interesting on a TAM deal.
    "Retirement league" label be damned, that would be a dream come true for me. Could mayyybe be had for TAM money at this point, but he's very much a right-sided player and it's the left side that TFC need to sort out first. He seems to have lost his starting spot on Besiktas, but I doubt he leaves before the summer.

    (EDIT: KJ quashed the rumor)

    Regarding Pozeulo, I'm thrilled the club kept its nerve and pursued the transfer. Paying a couple mil extra isn't a loss - it only emphasizes this point. Missing up to a month (potential red tape, rest, getting up to speed) isn't ideal, but Manning and Co. wanted their man, and ultimately, got him without having to wait until it was potentially too late.
    Last edited by Bobo; 02-26-2019 at 10:10 AM.

  21. #5331
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    Bez should have sold Altidore to Club America this time last year. Legend who brought us MLS Cup, but nowadays he is rarely ready to play and when he does, the intensity isn't there. Hopefully Bradley comes back on TAM and TFC re-up on DPs for another run in 2020. Pozuelo not coming immediately is ridiculous.

    Old, but I can't believe Talisca went to China.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webdogg View Post
    Not sure why you would have ever doubted MLSE as they always spend. All MLSE are near the very top in spending for players ever year and they certainly don’t skimp on the fringe expenses like coaches, doctors, facilities.

    I’ve said many times, MLSE is desperate for quality tv content and that means competive teams people want to watch. (Butts in the stadium is very secondary). When people tune in, the advertising money rolls into Rogers/Bell.

    Leafs, Raps, TFC, Argos are all top 3 in league spending. I’m glad you’ve seen the light
    It's not just ad revenue. Winning drives a growth in all complimentary and ancillary revenue, including over-priced subscriptions to cable, internet, and phones. However, whether TFC winning it all drove these revenue streams up enough to justify continued ownership is something I wonder about. How long do they shell out tens of millions on transfers and a team that doesn't drive any of these associated revenue streams to any great degree?

  23. #5333
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    Regarding the money: if MLSE wants to be a sports brand of any really consequence, it won’t get there by spending on the Leafs. It’s the Raptors and TFC they need to put the big money into. Hockey has no international presence. So they should be spending on TFC.

  24. #5334
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    Quote Originally Posted by nonc View Post
    Bez should have sold Altidore to Club America this time last year. Legend who brought us MLS Cup, but nowadays he is rarely ready to play and when he does, the intensity isn't there. Hopefully Bradley comes back on TAM and TFC re-up on DPs for another run in 2020. Pozuelo not coming immediately is ridiculous.

    Old, but I can't believe Talisca went to China.
    That is the key point... "not coming immediately is ridiculous". He should be there on the bench on Saturday but complete fail if he is not in the line up for the Home Opener on Mar 17th.

  25. #5335
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    KJ shuts down Quaresma rumour.

  26. #5336
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redskiesatnight View Post
    It's not just ad revenue. Winning drives a growth in all complimentary and ancillary revenue, including over-priced subscriptions to cable, internet, and phones. However, whether TFC winning it all drove these revenue streams up enough to justify continued ownership is something I wonder about. How long do they shell out tens of millions on transfers and a team that doesn't drive any of these associated revenue streams to any great degree?
    Nobody thinks it’s just ad revenue -it’s all content. For every team game, there’s probably 5-10 spinoff shows that MLSE generates money from. Look at yesterday on Sportsnet - Leafs game, NHL Trade deadline, recap shows, etc... there was basically one full day of viewers packed in to watch every minute. That’s what makes MLSE the money.

    If you look at TFC, you get there games on tv, then you get the kickoff show, post match, highlights etc... that’s a fair bit of content for MLSE. Top in that TFC winning brought in viewers which now are also watching EPL, Champions League etc... that’s even more content to draw from indirectly due to TFC

    MLSE is a great owner to have as they know they need interest in the teams that will help content. Nobody will watch if the buzz isn’t focused on the team.

    Lastly look directly at TFC and even when they are not good, the transfer news is attracting people who want to read, search or watch reports on what might happen. That buzz is in infancy stage with TFC (unlike leafs/raps trade buzz that’s strong) but it’s coming. Having the team in on high price DP’s generates that buzz that something might happen and that s content for MLSE.

    In closing, tens of millions on TFC players is pocket change to them. I don’t think we’ll every see the day when MLSE gives up on spending to keep people interested.

    Back to transfer news, can’t wait to watch hours and hours of highlights of Poz arrival on Rogers/Bell. Will get to see highlight packages, shots of Poz walking thru the airport with his luggage, press conference, first practice, interviews, and game day arrival at the stadium. That’s a lot of content (not Leafs level where you get to see them parking their car, eating breakfast, walking their dog, dropping kids off at daycare, taking a nap, taping a stick, drinking water, signing autographs or walking they the hallways in a suit but it’s something to see.)

  27. #5337
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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary10 View Post
    Regarding the money: if MLSE wants to be a sports brand of any really consequence, it won’t get there by spending on the Leafs. It’s the Raptors and TFC they need to put the big money into. Hockey has no international presence. So they should be spending on TFC.
    They don’t spend big money on the Raps or TFC now? The Raps have blown past the luxury tax already, only 3 teams have, and have no signs of stopping in the future. Pretty sure TFC is top 2 in salary and the recent spending on both TFC facilities and Raps practice facilities are substantial investments.

    Think you've undervalued the spending they’ve been doing. I also think saying there no international prescence in the NHL is very wrong too. Both these views are dated about 10 years and neither are true today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canary10 View Post
    Hockey has no international presence.
    Off topic, but huh?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    Some of you will forever defend every ill-planned & ill-timed move by management. I'll say it again: should have started (and finished) negotiating seriously much earlier. More players are available with less hassle during the international transfer windows. And I don't have to like what is happening to Genk at this time during their season. There's a reason the majority of player transactions happen during the transfer windows.

    Pozuleo is not just missing two games. He's also missing CCL.
    Agreed. They’ve done themselves no favours with respect to timing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webdogg View Post
    They don’t spend big money on the Raps or TFC now? The Raps have blown past the luxury tax already, only 3 teams have, and have no signs of stopping in the future. Pretty sure TFC is top 2 in salary and the recent spending on both TFC facilities and Raps practice facilities are substantial investments.

    Think you've undervalued the spending they’ve been doing. I also think saying there no international prescence in the NHL is very wrong too. Both these views are dated about 10 years and neither are true today.
    Yeah they are spending, as they should. I’m defending that they paid big for Poz.

    Hockey’s international presence is worse now than 10 years ago. The NHL’s leadership is inward looking. Outside Canada hockey is a bit player.

 

 

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