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  1. #361
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    Quote Originally Posted by TFC1154ever View Post
    Manning was on TSN 1050 this morning, and he said that he has asked questions of the sports medicine department, and why they have had all muscular injuries this year bar one. He also said they need to fix their defensive lapses, and they will look at the roster at the end of season. Said team needs 15-16 plays to compete in 3 competitions. Must not think we have 15-16 guys.
    Manning interview:

    https://www.tsn.ca/radio/toronto-105...rday-1.1167392

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    Bradley, Bez and Vanney went before the press after training. Lot's of interesting stuff.

    Michael Leech seems to have posted it all https://twitter.com/MLeach680News

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    Quote Originally Posted by Areathrasher View Post
    Bradley, Bez and Vanney went before the press after training. Lot's of interesting stuff.

    Michael Leech seems to have posted it all https://twitter.com/MLeach680News
    Great thread. Thanks!
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

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    Interesting to see management discussing the schedule problem. That's the first time I've seen them do that.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Leach makes a good point today about all this discussion



    Team as a whole is facing up to the criticism. May not make decisions moving forward that people like but at least they are acknowledging that people are ticked off.

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    Ding ding ding. He should've taken steps to alleviate our dependence on Moor and Mavinga prior to this season but at least Bez seems to be seeing the same thing.

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    Beyond that: all of Mavinga, Altidore, and Vasquez have enough injury history where teams need to plan for times when they will not be in the lineup.

    I believe with Janson (or maybe another similar player if he doesn’t stick) we’ve moved to address Altidore.

    Mavinga, you’d have figured we were okay coming into this year and they’ll likely get another CB in the offseason to end the possibility of any further Zavaleta/ Hagglund partnerships.

    Vasquez... this one scares me. We do not look like a team that can move the ball through midfield and feed the front men without him. Obviously, as is the case with any team, the replacement is never as good as the first choice but it just feels like we drop multiple levels without him healthy. It’s a real weakness of the team. We have to figure out something here. There has to be a way to inject more passing into the lineup without the first choice option.
    Last edited by ag futbol; 09-04-2018 at 04:18 PM.

  8. #368
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    Beyond that: all of Mavinga, Altidore, and Vasquez have enough injury history where teams need to plan for times when they will not be in the lineup.

    I believe with Janson (or maybe another similar player if he doesn’t stick) we’ve moved to address Altidore.

    Mavinga, you’d have figured we were okay coming into this year and they’ll likely get another CB in the offseason to end the possibility of any further Zavaleta/ Hagglund partnerships.

    Vasquez... this one scares me. We do not look like a team that can move the ball through midfield and feed the front men without him. Obviously, as is the case with any team, the replacement is never as good as the first choice but it just feels like we drop multiple levels without him healthy. It’s a real weakness of the team. We have to figure out something here. There has to be a way to inject more passing into the lineup without the first choice option.
    I don’t understand why the team stopped recruiting Serie A or B players. The Italian leagues are dirty, tough, and defensive, much like MLS, except with a surfeit of talent. I thought Seba was going to represent the first of these players, not the first, and only one.

  9. #369
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevep View Post
    actually I spent a lot of time trying to figure this number out( the expected win probability with all our starters).But you are correct it is subjective. however I do think I am fairly accurate with this 10% number.
    I would be curious to know what others think how the odds in any given game would change with 6 starters all playing??

    this would be the equivalent: of playing with 6 starters out and the odds were 2.0. or even money then with our guys playing the odds being around 1.70 50%win probability vs 60% win probability

    This is a difference of 10% win probability. so you mulitiply 0.10X34X3=10ppg
    the difference in win probability X 34 games per year X 3 points for a win.
    so injuries cost us 9-10 points.


    I saw they way the odds changed with jozy getting the second suspension the day before the Portland game and how the odds changed when the lineup announced no seba, no jozy no victor, no mavinga. they started on Monday at 3.3 (30%) and went to almost 5.0 or 20% at gametime

    so throwing away 4 points for the colorado houston games, underperforming by 10 points and injuries costing a further 10points

    that equals 51points, so good news is we are still an elite team and we should be back next year
    also underperforming could have been due to fatigue that bettors did not fully know about which was due to ccl and schedule.
    and/or what Bradley said of the guys not pushing like last year
    Thanks for effort in posting this, it is pretty interesting.

    For the bold part, it is subjective for sure, and to be honest, just off the top of my head I can easily count at least ten dropped points due to injuries in the first 6-8 games alone(also not including the two TFC2 games). Most notably with Bradley as CB early on, and pretty much any time Zavalleta/Hagglund paired up as CBs throughout the rest of the season without Mavinga. I would, for me, comfortably put the number closer to 20pts lost.

    To me, the loss of Mavinga/Vasques/Altidore this season was just to significant. Each player around them is much better because of them, but average or slightly above without. I think that is why we underperformed throughout the season, and sadly defied the odds in the way we did.

    I still think this team is fine, but we need Vasques, or his equal replacement to turn things around for next season/CCL, and for our next top 6 players to stay healthy. The rest are important, but not as critical as we have seen this season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Leach makes a good point today about all this discussion



    Team as a whole is facing up to the criticism. May not make decisions moving forward that people like but at least they are acknowledging that people are ticked off.
    I suspect a lot of people have chosen not to renew their season seats. they might be in panic mode

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    Quote Originally Posted by TMAN80 View Post

    I still think this team is fine, but we need Vasques, or his equal replacement to turn things around for next season/CCL, and for our next top 6 players to stay healthy. The rest are important, but not as critical as we have seen this season.
    Vazquez is spelt with two zeds, btw, not two s or a zed and an s. You are spelling the name the Mexican way. Our player is from Spain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stevep View Post
    I suspect a lot of people have chosen not to renew their season seats. they might be in panic mode
    Yeah not the timing they want. For people who had seats for a long time it is been there done that but anyone who bought seasons last year during all the hype are probably backed out for renewals.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TFC1154ever View Post
    Manning was on TSN 1050 this morning, and he said that he has asked questions of the sports medicine department, and why they have had all muscular injuries this year bar one. He also said they need to fix their defensive lapses, and they will look at the roster at the end of season. Said team needs 15-16 plays to compete in 3 competitions. Must not think we have 15-16 guys.
    1. Giovinco,
    2. Altidore
    3. Bradley
    4. Moor,
    5. Mavinga
    6. VDW
    7. Osorio
    8. Vazquez
    9. Janson
    10. Morrow

    These 10 fit the bill.

    Then you have fringe players:

    11. Delgado
    12. Auro Jr.
    13. Bono
    14. Irwin

    Then you have the guys who aren't good enough; but are ok to keep around if they don't see much playing time

    15. Hagglund
    16. Morgan
    17. Bakero
    18. Ricketts



    Then you have players who have played in actual MLS games who are no where near MLS level. It's embarrassing they are even in the league; they wouldn't cut it in third division England football.

    19. Hamilton
    20. Hernandez
    21. Telfer
    22. Zavaleta.


    Then you have the young guys who really should not be getting much minutes; but at least there young so they can learn

    23. Chapman
    24. Fraser

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    Quote Originally Posted by Defoe View Post
    1. Giovinco,
    2. Altidore
    3. Bradley
    4. Moor,
    5. Mavinga
    6. VDW
    7. Osorio
    8. Vazquez
    9. Janson
    10. Morrow

    These 10 fit the bill.

    Then you have fringe players:

    11. Delgado
    12. Auro Jr.
    13. Bono
    14. Irwin

    Then you have the guys who aren't good enough; but are ok to keep around if they don't see much playing time

    15. Hagglund
    16. Morgan
    17. Bakero
    18. Ricketts



    Then you have players who have played in actual MLS games who are no where near MLS level. It's embarrassing they are even in the league; they wouldn't cut it in third division England football.

    19. Hamilton
    20. Hernandez
    21. Telfer
    22. Zavaleta.


    Then you have the young guys who really should not be getting much minutes; but at least there young so they can learn

    23. Chapman
    24. Fraser
    I agree with your assesment but I would be inclined to swap Telfer with Hagglund and Morgan with Delgado. In my opinion both Hagglund and Delgado had run there course with this club and it is time to move on. Both Morgan and Telfer have shown more positive moments this year and could be part of the club moving forward.

  15. #375
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    So what happens if a player who is on loan with us is chosen in the expansion draft?

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    I'm not renewing my expensive seats. Just not worth it. To pay 6k for another season. No thanks. Plus harder to sell tickets to games I can't make in beginning of season. Because there too much supply than demand
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Kool View Post
    Yeah not the timing they want. For people who had seats for a long time it is been there done that but anyone who bought seasons last year during all the hype are probably backed out for renewals.

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    I would somewhat agree with the list... however, Fraser has good potential and is 20. Certainly worthy of more playing time and he looks capable.

    Chapman is 24 and after the last few years at TFC you have to wonder if his boat has sailed. Surely there are a few younger attacking prospects ready to take that spot.

  18. #378
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    Michael Bradley’s comments are spot on. There was an arrogance to the preparations this year - overconfidence - that manifested itself in the player acquisitions, the selection of players not at MLS level (like the high school kids who played v Houston), a belief that our depth was better than it was, and a lack of respect for the difficulty of playing in the league as champions. The travel schedule didn’t help, there is a serious problem with the training regime, and we could quibble about selections (for example, Hagglunds aerial skills are an important part of team balance, despite his other weaknesses). But it starts with attitude and that goes to the top.

    losing Paul Marhue to paternity leave was the final straw. Just not our year.

  19. #379
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post

    losing Paul Marhue to paternity leave was the final straw. Just not our year.
    love it!
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blindside16 View Post
    I agree with your assesment but I would be inclined to swap Telfer with Hagglund and Morgan with Delgado. In my opinion both Hagglund and Delgado had run there course with this club and it is time to move on. Both Morgan and Telfer have shown more positive moments this year and could be part of the club moving forward.
    I would swap Morgan for Telfer - and I disagree with swapping delgado

    Morgan is only around cos its the nice thing to do. He's a good guy who works hard and more importantly - HE'S CHEAP - but he's not more valuable than delgado. with the right guys around him, Delgado can play a role. Morgan needs too much support. He's isn't MLS level. More suited to USL.

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    I'm renewing cause I'm at the cheapest price point, but it's been difficult to give tickets away this year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    Michael Bradley’s comments are spot on. There was an arrogance to the preparations this year - overconfidence - that manifested itself in the player acquisitions, the selection of players not at MLS level (like the high school kids who played v Houston), a belief that our depth was better than it was, and a lack of respect for the difficulty of playing in the league as champions. The travel schedule didn’t help, there is a serious problem with the training regime, and we could quibble about selections (for example, Hagglunds aerial skills are an important part of team balance, despite his other weaknesses). But it starts with attitude and that goes to the top.

    losing Paul Marhue to paternity leave was the final straw. Just not our year.
    There’s an interview on sportsnet posted currently with a reporter from 680 news. He noted the team fielded a weak, 2nd choice roster at several points early in the season against beatable opponents. If the plan was to catch up later in the season, that was always going to be an uphill battle with NYC, ATL, and RBNY (among others) on the schedule late.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Red4ever View Post
    I'm renewing cause I'm at the cheapest price point, but it's been difficult to give tickets away this year.
    Ignoring the already discussed problems with the team’s performance for a second, the schedule in general, sucked. It looks to me that we either got stuffed by the schedule makers, didn’t think about scheduling at all, or bent over by our TV overlords to fill shitty 3rd rate time slots.

    There was basically no rhythm in the early part of the year. We played night games in the winter, daytime games in the summer. Friday games, Sunday games... total bullshit.

    We should be sticking to consistent start times. On appointment TV viewing is for dinosaurs.

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    Completely agreed. Games generally should be the same time and day ie Saturday 3 pm and we'd 730. I can accept the odd move to Sunday and night games on Saturdays in the summer, but night games in Toronto in March and April is just stupid. As is no rhythm to the matches: league play should starve to have a home game every second Saturday.

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    Nothing will happen unless the team radically change their relationship with the league.

    We are insiders getting walked all over.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Completely agreed. Games generally should be the same time and day ie Saturday 3 pm and wed 730. I can accept the odd move to Sunday and night games on Saturdays in the summer, but night games in Toronto in March and April is just stupid. As is no rhythm to the matches: league play should strive to have a home game every second Saturday.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Nothing will happen unless the team radically change their relationship with the league.

    We are insiders getting walked all over.
    I think you are right. Would a Trump owned team have this kind of travel schedule, or any other team owned by a tantrum throwing two year old? Or a team with tough management who knew how to make like extremely difficult for people if they did not get their way?

  28. #388
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    I think you are right. Would a Trump owned team have this kind of travel schedule, or any other team owned by a tantrum throwing two year old? Or a team with tough management who knew how to make like extremely difficult for people if they did not get their way?
    Trump would likely not be allowed to own a team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    Michael Bradley’s comments are spot on. There was an arrogance to the preparations this year - overconfidence - that manifested itself in the player acquisitions, the selection of players not at MLS level (like the high school kids who played v Houston), a belief that our depth was better than it was, and a lack of respect for the difficulty of playing in the league as champions. The travel schedule didn’t help, there is a serious problem with the training regime, and we could quibble about selections (for example, Hagglunds aerial skills are an important part of team balance, despite his other weaknesses). But it starts with attitude and that goes to the top.

    losing Paul Marhue to paternity leave was the final straw. Just not our year.

    MLSE did itself no favours either. How long did they drag on the best team ever mantra this year. They felt at times like they were beating a dead horse with it. The team underestimated that challenge that laid ahead this year and when you compound that with the injury bug, the underwhelming line ups, bad luck etc it was a recipe for disaster. This team needs a proper mental reset, some fine tuning with the line up and most of all they need to go into next season pissed off, with the win everything approach we saw last year.

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    Seba says after the very first game "stop talking about last year"

    The last "have your picture with the cup" event was in August.

    Seba knew.


    I get it for MLSE - December January is no time to maximise revenues from a cup win. But, that's this league.

 

 

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