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  1. #301
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    I hate when people say they are proud. We lost. You should never be proud of a loss. We where the better team and lost.... now we have nothing else to play for
    What next ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaz View Post
    I thought the same...

    Though knowing this... you would think that the "coach of the year" would have though hey, we lost a trophy on PKs once.. maybe just maybe we should have the boys spend some time taking PKs to get their muscle memory working.. just in case..... oh no no ... just like why prepare the team just in case the other team is going to play the high press style they are capable of in Toronto instead of assuming they will sit back and then see the boys gets flustered when they don't.

    I'm sorry but like MLS Cup 2016 this loss is in very large part on Vanney. And MB total lack of PK ability, and Delgado's off form with his final touch right now.
    Not on Oso for hitting the bar first? The loss isn’t on Vanney, he won the technical game, he out coached them in their house, 2-1. we suck at penalties, have always sucked, it is what it is. You could blame Bono for going the wrong way on 3 of the 4 kicks as well, but it’s his Birthdyay, so he gets a pass right?

    Delgado missed 2 sitters in the final tie, one in the first game in Toronto and that beaut setup from Gio, anyone else would have buried that.. if he had sunk either of those balls, we’d be having a completely different conversation

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yohan View Post
    I knew it was not going to be TFC winning the trophy once I saw the Delgado miss. Had the same feeling after Frei save on Altidore during MLS Cup 2016 game.

    I get that Hasler was gassed after playing in Houston game, but why Hamilton and going 4-3-3 when Jay Chapman was available? Leaving a gassed out Vazquez meant Delgado and Osorio had to run all over the place, hence why Chivas overrun TFC and was on powerplay for a lot of 2nd half. I dunno if the pressure got to Osorio, but he made a horrible giveaway for Chivas goal and had a really nervous look when tfaking the PK.

    And Michael Bradley should never, ever take a PK ever ever ever again. He's just so bad at PKs.
    The Hasler substitution was the turning point in the game. After he went off it was wave after wave of Chivas attacks. We stopped winning second balls in their half and slowly dried up as an attacking threat.

    Hamilton is just not the standard we require if we’re being honest. Neither is Ricketts if we’re being honest. I get that it’s hard to get a quality player to sign up to play a supporting role, but maybe a little pressure on Séba and Jozy for a starting spot wouldn’t be such a bad thing. I’d really to see us go out and get a quality striker before the window closes and return the players recently promoted from TFC II where they belong

  4. #304
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    The rest of the mls season is basically a wash now. Expect Altidore and Mavinga both to have surgery soon

  5. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valdal View Post
    I hate when people say they are proud. We lost. You should never be proud of a loss. We where the better team and lost.... now we have nothing else to play for
    What next ?
    We won the game, lost the tie... be proud of how far they’ve come in the last two years, similarly how proud leafs fans of their team even though they are generally golfing by this time of year....

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carter View Post
    We won the game, lost the tie... be proud of how far they’ve come in the last two years, similarly how proud leafs fans of their team even though they are generally golfing by this time of year....
    Soldiers shouldn't be praised when they loose wars and a team shouldnt be praised when they lose. Face it we lost...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carter View Post
    Not on Oso for hitting the bar first? The loss isn’t on Vanney, he won the technical game, he out coached them in their house, 2-1. we suck at penalties, have always sucked, it is what it is. You could blame Bono for going the wrong way on 3 of the 4 kicks as well, but it’s his Birthdyay, so he gets a pass right?

    Delgado missed 2 sitters in the final tie, one in the first game in Toronto and that beaut setup from Gio, anyone else would have buried that.. if he had sunk either of those balls, we’d be having a completely different conversation
    Ignore him, he literally pops up after every big TFC loss and finds an angle to blame Vanney, but is curiously either completely silent or forgets we have a coach when we pull off a big win. More predictable than the sun rising tomorrow.

    The biggest thing is it came down to a few critical moments where if we had executed, we'd have won. These were two well-coached, talented teams and the margins are razor thin in those circumstances.

  8. #308
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    Will that be the last PK of Bradley's career? In any future penalties he should be one of the last guys to kick. Although even if he scored I dont think they miss the next kick.

  9. #309
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    Look what happened last time we lost in PKs.

    We will come back harder.

    To the people complaining about season play, we just need to make playoffs.
    Play-by-Play Commentator for League 1 Ontario.
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  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voodooman View Post
    Look what happened last time we lost in PKs.

    We will come back harder.

    To the people complaining about season play, we just need to make playoffs.
    Totally agree. We started the season terrible last year as well. With a win Saturday we'd have only one point less than we had last season after 6 games

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    I’m sorry but concacaf is fucken house league. How can a big tournament like this end on PK’s after 180 mins? That is absolutely ridiculous. Let teams decide it on the field. The way the card situation works is also embarrassing. How it doesn’t reset for the finals, I’ll never know.

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    We've gone further than any MLS team before so that's a bit of solace. Taking a penalty in a shoot out is the worst type of pressure ever, so I can never blame anyone for missing. Who really pissed me off is Delgado for skying that open goal, he's been atrotious all season so far and that was the culmination. Whatever we are still TFC and I'll support my team till I die

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    I'm down for an MLS Cup-style redemption story arc next season. Nothing about this run feels miraculous. We deserved to be here and we can get back.

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    Heartbreaking to lose on penalties once again. The boys did an amazing job to make it this far. Just look at who we hax on the pitch. We took Chives to extra time with Morgan, Hamilton, Chapman closing out the game. Missing 3/4 of our starting back line. A squad so depleted we had Ryan1 freaking Tefler on the bench.

    Not to mention the toll on the body it must take take traveling back and forth from Mexico.

    We were handed the toughest draw in champions league history and unfortunately came up just short.

    Now the focus has to shift on preparing for the Voyageurs Cup. Most important competition left imo. It's the path to the CCL and that has to be priority #1 Now that we conquered MLS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PizzaEatingYeti View Post
    My problem is that Chivas needs not to be beaten, but to be beaten with 2 goals!
    It's a humongous difference between the 2 things.

    I can see us winning with 1-0 or 2-1, but anything else would be highly unprobable.

    And if it's ending regulation time 2-1 for TFC, and penaties looming, we know that we suck ass at penalties...
    I made this post Wednesday at 10:46 AM.
    2 major cups lost in 3 years due of being horrible at penalties.
    How many more to come?

    Congrats to the team for this very nice CONCACAF run!

    But IMO not winning this CONCACAF Champs Cup comes down ultimately to playing basically the whole tournament having too many important players sidelined with injuries. No way any fucking good team can triumph in a major tropy having so many fucking basic players injured. Just no fucking way!

    Just imagine we had this many players injured last season in the last 10 games of the regular season and through the whole playoffs.
    We would have not been winning anything... no sheld, no MLS cup.

    PS: One questions still looms:
    The team as a whole is horrible on penalties, or Vanney has a serious hand in this, because of faulty selection of those who are taking such penalties?
    Last edited by PizzaEatingYeti; 04-26-2018 at 12:55 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lennon View Post
    Heartbreaking to lose on penalties once again. The boys did an amazing job to make it this far. Just look at who we hax on the pitch. We took Chives to extra time with Morgan, Hamilton, Chapman closing out the game. Missing 3/4 of our starting back line. A squad so depleted we had Ryan1 freaking Tefler on the bench.

    Not to mention the toll on the body it must take take traveling back and forth from Mexico.

    We were handed the toughest draw in champions league history and unfortunately came up just short.

    Now the focus has to shift on preparing for the Voyageurs Cup. Most important competition left imo. It's the path to the CCL and that has to be priority #1 Now that we conquered MLS.
    Yes.
    Add to the draw the injuries we had the whole tournament, and it is clear that the Goods of Football have staked everything they could against TFC in this CONCACAF Champs Cup run.

    The bad thing is nobody who's not a TFC fan will care about these a few years from now.
    History keeps glorified just the name of the winners, not the name of the losers, and the conditions of why they were losers.

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    I was at the game and will have a bunch to say tomorrow. But for tonight...

    - Welcome to World Football. I don’t know how that looked on TV, but that stadium, full, is a very hostile environment. The advantage Chivas had there, in general and especially in PKs, was massive.

    - Anyone who demonizes Bradley or Delgado over this is not being fair.

    - Chivas did to us, what we did to Tigres.

    - We exited the stadium to find that there was a massive fire on the hillside very close to the stadium (and not far from where the buses used by TFC supporters, were parked). Started by misfired fireworks used in the postgame, apparently. Definitely put an End of Days capper on the evening. The buses left before the fire threatened the artery road out (although it may have subsequently). A seriously weird and crazy end to a crazy evening.
    Last edited by ensco; 04-26-2018 at 01:16 AM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Penalties are a crapshoot. Training penalties means nothing if your goalie isnt even strong enough to deflect the ball out.

    Chivas took advantage of their chances(and our mistakes), we didn’t. For “95% goal chances” we outbumbered them quite a bit. Altidore should have had a brace at home, and Delgado skied great chances in both legs.

    Hopefully the finishing touch comes back to the reds during the MLS season because I don’t see any teams matching up with a healthy TFC. Honestly I’m okay with Mavinga etc having surgery as long as they are back before playoffs. A team with Giovinco and Bradley at the helm should be good enough for at least a playoff spot, and from there I’m confident we can get all the way to the top, we may just have to be on the road for the MLS cup this year. If you want to look at points to make up for MLS, we’re only 6 behind 6th place with a game in hand. A win vs Chicago and our team is back in business. I just hope they use this loss as motivation instead of dwelling on the result.

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    I've coached and played in too many games decided by penalties to really feel that bad about losing in that manner any more. Why in every other FIFA tournament there is extra time but not in this one I don't know.

    When we saw the line-up really it seemed like an impossible task to win this game. Despite that they found a way to win despite all the injury set backs. I hope Delgado recovers from that miss that could haunt him for a long time.

    In some ways winning that tie could have meant completion of a project - it might have meant taking the foot off the gas for a while. Another way to look at it is that there is one more step to complete - there is unfinished business. We have seen what this team does when it is obsessed with a goal. The improvement of some of our young players is incredible..Osorio...Morgan...Delgado...Auro Jr all brilliant...Van der Wiel as a Centre Back wow. Fuck we had Mavinga, Moor, Zavaletta, Morrow, and hagglund all out injured. If Chivas had 5 defenders injured we would have won easily.

    It has been an incredible achievement - the level this team has played this early in the season against far better teams than we see in MLS is astonishing. This result points out the limitations of a salary cap league vs one that isn't capped. Despite all that we were the equal of the best teams in Mexico. Long may this be the case. For me Sign up Vanney long term...extend DP contracts...Sign up Auro Jr long term...Oso...keep the group together. Add depth.

    S
    Last edited by Hamilton_Red; 04-26-2018 at 01:21 AM.

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    Penalties, man, penalties

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    Quote Originally Posted by Valdal View Post
    I hate when people say they are proud. We lost. You should never be proud of a loss. We where the better team and lost.... now we have nothing else to play for
    What next ?
    Quote Originally Posted by Valdal View Post
    The rest of the mls season is basically a wash now. Expect Altidore and Mavinga both to have surgery soon
    Why is the MLS season a wash? The MLS Cup should be our priority year after year. We should be trying to build a dynasty a BMO, and you build dynasties by adding stars to your jersey. For me the season is just about to begin, now the distraction of CCL is done. Yes it would have been great to win it, but it’s a bonus if you ask me. So the chance of getting humped by Real Madrid in some Arab country passed us by, it might have been a nice experience but the MLS is our bread and butter. The only problem is this CCL campaign has left us banged up and trailing badly we’ll have our work cut out to get a reasonable play off spot and have probably kissed the SS goodbye. Nevertheless we need to pull out all the stops to make up lost ground and should fortune favour us for another go at CCL next year perhaps the lesson is not to put all our eggs in one basket. The Colorado and Houston games have shown our depth is perhaps not as deep as we thought. If your comments about Jozy and Mavinga are true then we might need to act before the window closes to find a suitable replacement up top

    Tonight was my biggest fear come true, 2nd place. Yes it was a great run, but we have nothing but a decimated squad to show for it. 2nd should be equivalent to last in any sidethat has true ambitions for greatness
    Last edited by General Woolfe; 04-26-2018 at 01:33 AM.

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    We learned after the Seattle Cup final penalties loss that soccer doesn't stop - it keeps going with the next game, the next season. Mourn, grieve do what needs to be done.

    Then come out on Saturday for the boys.


    All the games after the Colorado series were the most compelling technically interesting football we have ever seen with TFC.


    I want that again.


    Good league results will set us up for a good Voyageurs run. The road back starts on Saturday.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    We learned after the Seattle Cup final penalties loss that soccer doesn't stop - it keeps going with the next game, the next season. Mourn, grieve do what needs to be done.

    Then come out on Saturday for the boys.


    All the games after the Colorado series were the most compelling technically interesting football we have ever seen with TFC.


    I want that again.


    Good league results will set us up for a good Voyageurs run. The road back starts on Saturday.
    QFT

    Especially the point that these were the most technically interesting games TFC has ever played. For those who would deprioritize this tournament, I guess you want wins more than entertaining soccer.

    Now the league begins.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Valdal View Post
    Soldiers shouldn't be praised when they loose wars and a team shouldnt be praised when they lose. Face it we lost...
    Did you really just compare CCL football to war? It is obvious you’ve never served, because yes, people are proud after a war, loss or not, why are those people proud? Because they had the courage/bravery/strength of character to stand up and fight for something, protect something.. and yes their families are proud too, Because they came home(when they do, god rest the souls of those who don’t), some lived to fight another day, they are proud that the have members in their family with the fortitude to do something as fearless as putting their life at risk, protecting rights of the citizens of their countries and your right to be an internet keyboard warrior.

    oh and I know we lost, the tie in penalties, big deal, doesn’t mean I can’t praise and be proud of my team for the tremendous effort they put in and what they left there on the field in Mexico.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Valdal View Post
    I hate when people say they are proud. We lost. You should never be proud of a loss. We where the better team and lost.... now we have nothing else to play for
    What next ?
    This is the dumbest comment I’ve ever read on this forum. And that’s saying a lot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Valdal View Post
    Soldiers shouldn't be praised when they loose wars and a team shouldnt be praised when they lose. Face it we lost...
    Well, you’ve outdone yourself, raising the dumb to another level.

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    I have been thinking all night about what I wanted to say....so here goes....

    First things first, I was wrong.....I was one of those people who said it was foolish to "waste" the first part of our MLS season in this fruitless endeavour as the chances of success were almost nil once the draw came out in December.....beating Tigres, then Club America, then another likely Mexican team in the Finals....that was a gauntlet, no team could hope to overcome.....and yet we almost did.....it would have been easy to come on here and say -"see - that was a "waste" as we lost anyways so who cares", but again I would be wrong....sports is about caring, its about investing emotionally in something you have no control over and still caring about it irrespective of logic most of the time....and by the way I am PROUD of my team, contrary to some others who only think we should be proud of winning and nothing else --- I get it, I want to win too - I was heartbroken yesterday, but if there ever was a noble attempt, an audacious attempt, this team and attempting to fill that trophy case in a way that no MLS team ever has - this was that attempt......

    Sports is designed to break your heart - only one Champion emerges from a season or a tournament and the rest are somehow deemed "failures" every year --- well under those metrics - in the post-expansion era of North American Top flight sports leagues we in Toronto have exactly 3 championships that really matter in my opinion - Jays 92 and 93 and TFC 2017 - that's it -- forget pre-expansion 6 team hockey (4/6 teams make the semi-finals!), or 8-9 team Grey Cup titles where a 9-9 team can "win a division", gets a home game and a neutral site game to win a title (and I'm an Argos STH too - but I will be the first to acknowledge that accomplishment is nowhere near the other titles), sorry Rock (yes I've been to NLL championships too - again it's nowhere near the same accomplishment as 92/93 and 17.....).....so in about 50 years of post expansion hockey and 40+ years of baseball and 22 years of NBA and 11 years of MLS we have 3 titles in 125 seasons......so if only winning a title is your metric then sports will disappoint you 97% of the time.....

    So why am I proud after a devastating loss --- I am proud because I remember what it was like following the Blue Jays since their inception as a cute novelty to false hope in '85 (oh George Brett and Jim Sundberg), more disappointment in 89 and 91 until the ultimate in 92 and 93. Do you know what was the worst period -- from 1994-2014 -- when we were irrelevant, and apathy was the common sentiment towards that team --- then 2015-2016 happened and the city/country became re-invigorated with baseball again - we had "a moment" (Bautista Bat Flip), more moments (Edwin walk-off and Donaldson's scramble home)......but we ultimately lost.....so I guess what was the point, we should have never even tried to be great and trade our future for our present - damn those Tulo and Martin contracts and Syndergaard in NY.....well unfortunately sports doesn't guarantee you success when you make the noble attempt but it sure as heck was better than being apathetic for 20 years of baseball in this town, I'm glad we tried, better than not even trying to be great in fear of failure ---- sound like TFC?

    We were an afterthought in this city for 8 years until the 2015 season --- most people looked at a TFC jersey with either confusion (what is that?), or disdain (you cheer for those losers, in that league?!), and then 2015 happened and we were competent enough to lose 3-0 to our hated rivals and just like that back to being a joke......then 2016 happened and we found something crazy in this team, hope, belief and a desire to win --- only to be let down in the most painful way possible.....I guess it wasn't worth it those memories of a Montreal comeback, because "hey, we didn't win - so it was all just a waste".....and then 2017 happened and that crazy confluence of events occurs where almost every break goes your way and we have a Captain, yes OUR CAPTAIN who takes this team by the scruff of the neck and is the heartbeat of this team and says we will dominate from wire to wire and do something no one else has done - they set records, overcome adversity and win a championship in glorious fashion......in that moment we say "let's be great, let's be audacious, let's try to run the Concacaf Gauntlet" and do something that's never been done before......and with no Vazquez for 5/6 games against Mexican teams, losing Jozy 7 minutes into Azteca and coming through with a result, beating Tigres who I think are the best team in the region, playing a final leg in Mexico down a goal and needing two away goals with no true CBs and our Captain playing out of position, only to lose on penalty kicks --- and I am going to "pile on them" for the attempt because Delgado missed a sitter or Osorio missed a penalty or even that Bradley missed a penalty "again"?! --- ummmm Morrow missed a penalty in 2016, and he turned out ok in 2017, Osorio and Delgado have blossomed in this tournament and any team would love to have either of them......and when they retire 4 and 17 and 10 (and they 100% will!!), I really hope you don't think of Bradley missing penalties, or Jozy pulling up lame at the most inopportune moments, or Seba being petulant Seba - we all can point out the weaknesses of "our guys" -- but I am going to think of how Bradley has led this team and been an exemplary Captain both on and off the field ("we played with balls and bravery" he said last night - you're damn right you did Michael!!), I will think of clutch Jozy goals that led us to many playoff victories, and I will think of Seba being magic on that field and producing goals that no one in this league (and in many leagues) could have produced.....I will proudly wear those jerseys 20 years from now and tell others that "I was there" when TFC were magic......kind of like telling people I saw Alomar play back in the day when we won World Series (FYI - he wasn't a perfect hero either on and off the field - but the legacy still remains)......

    So yes, I am PROUD of this team --- we are supporters --- let's support....we have a tough MLS Season ahead of us, and our team needs us now to lift them up, we have a team to be immensely proud of who have had unparalleled success over the last 18 months or so --- this may be (and likely is) the golden age of TFC football --- enjoy it people, cheer, cry, invest emotionally.....but it's way better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all.....


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    The outcome of penalties doesn't bother me as much, kinda knew that was likely if it got to that point. The things that kept me awake last night was the Hasler sub and the missed chance in the goal mouth scramble right at the end.

    Not going to bag on Bradley, I'll leave that to folk who tend not to pay much attention to him unless he fucked up.

    The only thing I want now is a run of good results in the league to show that this was all for real.

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    Terrible way to lose a final, but Giovinco is right.....TFC didn't do the job at home and it came back to get them.

    But I am extremely proud of the run this team had. Against all odds, and full of injuries, the trophy was there for the taking.

    These players left every bit of what they had left on the field in Guadalajara last night, and penalties is the cruelest way to lose, especially with no extra time.

    Thanks for a great run, boys! Now, go get the V's Cup so you can take us on another wild ride next year, and win it all! TFC till I die.......

  30. #330
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    Forever Red, next stop is dousing the Fire, simple as that, not excuses. The past is the past, the present is the present and the future is the future. Onward, forward.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

 

 

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