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  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by molenshtain View Post
    same could be said about Montreal. I would never want them to go under. Disliking them is a defining feature of my fandom for TFC. If they were to go I'd be none too pleased.

    Similar sentiment Celtic fans had when Rangers went under. Hate them, but it's better to hate them than not have them at all.
    Ya i agree with what your saying. I wouldnt want to see the Crew go under but i have no idea why another team with derby "enemy" history to dispay so much support. You just wouldnt see that for big league rivalrys.I read somewhere someone saying we should have #SaveTheCrew as a banner or show a banner of support. I think the support for the Toronto @ Columbus game was enough by our supporters.

  2. #152
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    I think this sort of thing can be both.

    You want them to exist because if they don't, you can't enjoy hating them and beating them.

    However if they do go (which is entirely out of your own hands,) you can also enjoy laughing at their misery.

  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan View Post

    However if they do go (which is entirely out of your own hands,) you can also enjoy laughing at their misery.

    This is the crux of the issue. Banter aside, I find laughing at their misery particularly shameful and disrespectful in a way that crosses the line. A lot of people are getting something they've invested a lot of time, money and energy caring about ripped away from them. For some it may be a massive part of who they are. All of that is getting taken away from them, much in the same way any team could be taken away in this league. Laughing and derision is an ironically distasteful reaction to this.

    Imagine our club was getting taken away on the whim of some billionaire and other teams decided to laugh at us instead of support us. I would be distraught. If it can happen to them it can happen to anyone. Laughing at their misery doesn't do anything but make our fan base look bad (the Texan flag and Welcome to Austin sign hung in the south end were noticed and derided by US soccer twitter). It's not a good look really is what I'm saying.
    Last edited by molenshtain; 12-03-2017 at 06:16 AM.

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by molenshtain View Post
    This is the crux of the issue. Banter aside, I find laughing at their misery particularly shameful and disrespectful in a way that crosses the line. A lot of people are getting something they've invested a lot of time, money and energy caring about. For some it may be a massive part of who they are. All of that is getting taken away from them, much in the same way any team could be taken away in this league. Laughing and derision is an ironically distasteful reaction to this.

    Imagine our club was getting taken away on the whim of some billionaire and other teams decided to laugh at us instead of support us. I would be distraught. If it can happen to them it can happen to anyone. Laughing at their misery doesn't do anything but make our fan base look bad (the Texan flag and Welcome to Austin sign hung in the south end were noticed and derided by US soccer twitter). It's not a good look really is what I'm saying.
    Very true!

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by molenshtain View Post
    This is the crux of the issue. Banter aside, I find laughing at their misery particularly shameful and disrespectful in a way that crosses the line. A lot of people are getting something they've invested a lot of time, money and energy caring about ripped away from them. For some it may be a massive part of who they are. All of that is getting taken away from them, much in the same way any team could be taken away in this league. Laughing and derision is an ironically distasteful reaction to this.

    Imagine our club was getting taken away on the whim of some billionaire and other teams decided to laugh at us instead of support us. I would be distraught. If it can happen to them it can happen to anyone. Laughing at their misery doesn't do anything but make our fan base look bad (the Texan flag and Welcome to Austin sign hung in the south end were noticed and derided by US soccer twitter). It's not a good look really is what I'm saying.
    Totally agree with this.

  6. #156
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    Spoke with a few of their supporters post match outside of BMO - echoing some of the other comments on here, they were nothing but class. Even as a friend and I spoke to a few of the guys in yellow, some of our supporters walking by started the Austin Texas chants and the crew fans let it go...although I don't think they had much choice, anyway.

    As per my earlier post, I don't like this situation at all. It is a cold reality that a perfect storm of selfish, callous ownership, a few bad seasons and some horrible luck that really turn any franchise into a dark place. It's my own naive see-the-whole-world-as-glass-half-full attitude, but besides the SJ to HOU fiasco (chalk up to a one off, of sorts) and the Florida contractions (done for the better of the league at the time), I always thought that MLS' embracing supporters culture would deny franchise movement similar to what we see in other NA sports leagues. Reality is that MLS is no different than the NBA/NHL/NFL/MLB, supporters be damned.

  7. #157
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    This issue is fundamentally why I gave up my SSH in 2013. (I had good seats and spent about $20K over the first six years.)

    Those years taught me the bitter realities of the relationship between fans and ownership, in a way somehow that a lifetime supporting the Leafs (I was an SSH there too) never did.

    Ownership and management were just so cynical towards us.

    It's better now, but we're always only one board meeting away from everything changing.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  8. #158
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    I just feel like a renaissance can occur for the Crew in the same way it did for Sporting KC when they got a new stadium. I had no hope aand was extremely dissapointed by KC when they were the wizards. But what a turnaround with a new stadium and name change.

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by molenshtain View Post
    This is the crux of the issue. Banter aside, I find laughing at their misery particularly shameful and disrespectful in a way that crosses the line. A lot of people are getting something they've invested a lot of time, money and energy caring about ripped away from them. For some it may be a massive part of who they are. All of that is getting taken away from them, much in the same way any team could be taken away in this league. Laughing and derision is an ironically distasteful reaction to this.

    Imagine our club was getting taken away on the whim of some billionaire and other teams decided to laugh at us instead of support us. I would be distraught. If it can happen to them it can happen to anyone. Laughing at their misery doesn't do anything but make our fan base look bad (the Texan flag and Welcome to Austin sign hung in the south end were noticed and derided by US soccer twitter). It's not a good look really is what I'm saying.

    I assure you nobody in Columbus would shed a tear if Toronto failed in MLS. You're naive if you think otherwise. Absolutely nonsense to think they wouldn't be in stitches at our misfortune.

    I also disagree we look bad and think the world has gone too far in a world of political correctness and playing nice with sport. I hate my rivals and love every second of it. That's part of what makes sports so great to spend my time on for me. If you want to sign kumbaya and hold hands with Crew fans down the street, be my guest. I won't and I don't have to apologize for it. There's nothing wrong with this, you might not like it, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with this.
    Last edited by ryan; 12-04-2017 at 11:14 AM.

  10. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by molenshtain View Post
    This is the crux of the issue. Banter aside, I find laughing at their misery particularly shameful and disrespectful in a way that crosses the line. A lot of people are getting something they've invested a lot of time, money and energy caring about ripped away from them. For some it may be a massive part of who they are. All of that is getting taken away from them, much in the same way any team could be taken away in this league. Laughing and derision is an ironically distasteful reaction to this.

    Imagine our club was getting taken away on the whim of some billionaire and other teams decided to laugh at us instead of support us. I would be distraught. If it can happen to them it can happen to anyone. Laughing at their misery doesn't do anything but make our fan base look bad (the Texan flag and Welcome to Austin sign hung in the south end were noticed and derided by US soccer twitter). It's not a good look really is what I'm saying.
    Bang on.

  11. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan View Post
    I assure you nobody in Columbus would shed a tear if Toronto failed in MLS. You're naive if you think otherwise. Absolutely nonsense to think they wouldn't be in stitches at our misfortune.

    I also disagree we look bad and think the world has gone too far in a world of political correctness and playing nice with sport. I hate my rivals and love every second of it. That's part of what makes sports so great to spend my time on for me. If you want to sign kumbaya and hold hands with Crew fans down the street, be my guest. I won't and I don't have to apologize for it. There's nothing wrong with this, you might not like it, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with this.
    Totally agree with you!

  12. #162
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    Boy, some people are awfully defensive about being called out for making fun of fans who were attending their club's funeral.

  13. #163
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    lol who are you going to hate if all your rivals either cease to exist or move to markets where your rivalry becomes irrelevant...

    This isn't an issue of all of a sudden feeling all warm and fuzzy for other clubs and watering down any rivalries that may exist. IMHO, this is a much bigger issue in that we as supporters dedicate a lot of time, money and effort to support TFC and also MLS. Again, maybe its my own view but I can separate between hating Cbus for issues on the pitch throughout a regular season and what happens in the boardroom. This issue is bigger than hating a rival, clubs moving cities is bad for MLS in general.

    BTW this is all aside from the fact that Austin makes little to no business sense, and adding a franchise there under current CBus ownership adds little value to MLS anyway.

  14. #164
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    Mate where have you been for the past 100 years? This is how pro sports in North America works. It's not new. It's how it is. Nobody is changing it. How much time money and love was poured into the San Diego Chargers? Cleveland Browns? Winnipeg Jets? Montreal Expos? Seattle Supersonics? MLS isn't special, it's playing the same game in the same economy.

    If you think a social media tweeteroo is going to stop some rich dudes from moving their plaything to where they want you're a bit nuts IMO. There's a reason the Austin clause was in the purchase contract for PSV ya know eh?

    I think people are fools for thinking MLS would be different than the rest. These guys want money just like everyone else, that's all it's ever going to be about. I can't stop it, nobody can. So I'm going to get something out of it by laughing at the piss stains.

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan View Post
    Mate where have you been for the past 100 years? This is how pro sports in North America works. It's not new. It's how it is. Nobody is changing it. How much time money and love was poured into the San Diego Chargers? Cleveland Browns? Winnipeg Jets? Montreal Expos? Seattle Supersonics? MLS isn't special, it's playing the same game in the same economy.

    If you think a social media tweeteroo is going to stop some rich dudes from moving their plaything to where they want you're a bit nuts IMO. There's a reason the Austin clause was in the purchase contract for PSV ya know eh?

    I think people are fools for thinking MLS would be different than the rest. These guys want money just like everyone else, that's all it's ever going to be about. I can't stop it, nobody can. So I'm going to get something out of it by laughing at the piss stains.
    that seems a tad silly

    i enjoy beating them if the lose but i'd prefer they not lose their team - go figure

    as for the shoulder shrug of, 'that's just the way it works', well the world would be a pretty sorry place if everyone kowtowed to that and nobody showed any sign of gumption.

  16. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by backbeat View Post
    that seems a tad silly

    i enjoy beating them if the lose but i'd prefer they not lose their team - go figure

    as for the shoulder shrug of, 'that's just the way it works', well the world would be a pretty sorry place if everyone kowtowed to that and nobody showed any sign of gumption.
    I've already said I'd prefer them to exist in order to continue to be able to have my laughs at them, but that's not how this works. That's not a choice we get to have, or make for that matter. This move was the plan all along, that much is proven. So yes this is how it's going to go whether you, me, or anyone else likes it. So enjoy what you can out of it I say. Remind yourself that they, Montreal and Vancouver would be making us feel the pain if it was us on the move. You think these bastards would shed a tear for Toronto, Canada? LOL.

    We should be toasting glasses of Bill Archer's tears right now, the sympathy is too much for me. I want to barf at some of this.

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    Just because other north American teams have done it doesn't make it right. The league loses integrity when a club moves. If real Madrid or Barcelona moved to moscow or beijing because the owner thinks he could make mote money you'd be okay with it ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DinamoTFC View Post
    Just because other north American teams have done it doesn't make it right. The league loses integrity when a club moves. If real Madrid or Barcelona moved to moscow or beijing because the owner thinks he could make mote money you'd be okay with it ?
    Your comparing apples to oranges bud.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DinamoTFC View Post
    Just because other north American teams have done it doesn't make it right. The league loses integrity when a club moves.
    They don't care about integrity, only fans think this matters. They will out date the outrage and we'll find something else to yell about in due time. The public's attention span isn't very good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by T.O TILL I DIE View Post
    Your comparing apples to oranges bud.
    Nope its quite fair. You're just using that statement to avoid a counter argument.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan View Post
    They don't care about integrity, only fans think this matters. They will out date the outrage and we'll find something else to yell about in due time. The public's attention span isn't very good.
    Imagine TFC continued to be shit during the dark years, Tim Leiweke never came in to save the day, and MLSE gave up with soccer due to decreasing attendanace and TV viewership. In your opinion, it would be okay if MLSE wanted to sell/relocate to another market instead of actually trying to get their shit together and acting like smart owners?

    Prime example: Kansas City. They were a huge mess and turned themselves around to become succesful and relevant in their market.

  22. #172
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    The other NA leagues do it argument doesn't really fly given how MLS have really tried to position themselves as engaged with the community and fans. In fact using this to try and differentiate against NFL/MLB et al.

    The three stars on the MLS crest are supposed to stand for " For Club, For Country, For Community"

    Obviously they should have added the disclaimer " except in cases of poor business metrics"

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    Quote Originally Posted by DinamoTFC View Post
    Imagine TFC continued to be shit during the dark years, Tim Leiweke never came in to save the day, and MLSE gave up with soccer due to decreasing attendanace and TV viewership. In your opinion, it would be okay if MLSE wanted to sell/relocate to another market instead of actually trying to get their shit together and acting like smart owners?

    Prime example: Kansas City. They were a huge mess and turned themselves around to become succesful and relevant in their market.
    MLSE can do what it wants, they paid millions for it. It's their's, not ours. That's the disconnect. Of course it's okay. It sucks for us, sure I'd hate it. It's certainly okay from a business perspective though.

    You want it to be like Europe, it's never going to be like Europe.

    Quote Originally Posted by Areathrasher View Post
    The other NA leagues do it argument doesn't really fly given how MLS have really tried to position themselves as engaged with the community and fans. In fact using this to try and differentiate against NFL/MLB et al.

    The three stars on the MLS crest are supposed to stand for " For Club, For Country, For Community"

    Obviously they should have added the disclaimer " except in cases of poor business metrics"
    It's marketing, not positioning. You've fallen for it. What's true? Their words or their actions? HELLO?

    Mark my words Columbus will not be the last. Although I'd wager in the future teams will "fold up" and then a new franchise will "be born", as opposed to "moving."

  24. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan View Post


    It's marketing, not positioning. You've fallen for it. What's true? Their words or their actions? HELLO?

    Mark my words Columbus will not be the last. Although I'd wager in the future teams will "fold up" and then a new franchise will "be born", as opposed to "moving."
    I haven't fallen for anything thank you very much. MLS is currently out their parroting that bullshit to expansion markets to fleece them of public money.

    It's not right.

    You can go with the "that's the way it's always been" or you want something better.

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    What exactly do "team owners" own? They are investors into MLS and are granted the right to operate a team in the league. All the players are signed to the league. The individual team IP belongs to the league (iirc). The individual investors may or may not own some assets like stadium leases, etc. The idea that Precourt can say "I'm moving the team to Austin" is no more valid than you or me saying it. The LEAGUE is moving the team.

    People should be mad at Precourt. He's a shitty owner-investor. He planted the seed for this by getting it written into the investment agreement. But the sign offs for all this run through Garber and the MLS Board.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Detroit_TFC View Post
    What exactly do "team owners" own? They are investors into MLS and are granted the right to operate a team in the league. All the players are signed to the league. The individual team IP belongs to the league (iirc). The individual investors may or may not own some assets like stadium leases, etc. The idea that Precourt can say "I'm moving the team to Austin" is no more valid than you or me saying it. The LEAGUE is moving the team.

    People should be mad at Precourt. He's a shitty owner-investor. He planted the seed for this by getting it written into the investment agreement. But the sign offs for all this run through Garber and the MLS Board.

    This is kind of what I'm trying to say here. The league is complicit in this ENTIRE process (which started the day he became owner, not this summer), but we're supposed to believe MLS is different because of what their 3 stars in their crest means? Come on.

    MLS is not what some of you think it is.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan View Post
    This is kind of what I'm trying to say here. The league is complicit in this ENTIRE process (which started the day he became owner, not this summer), but we're supposed to believe MLS is different because of what their 3 stars in their crest means? Come on.

    MLS is not what some of you think it is.
    You really missed the point on that, eh ?

    But from your POV, MLS has carte blanche to do as it pleases? Is that what your saying?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DinamoTFC View Post
    Just because other north American teams have done it doesn't make it right. The league loses integrity when a club moves. If real Madrid or Barcelona moved to moscow or beijing because the owner thinks he could make mote money you'd be okay with it ?
    Please continue. What would you do for Real Madrid or Barcelona in this example?

    I don't believe it's right but I don't see much change in it.

    Atlanta got a hockey team. Twice. They may or may not want the club model over the franchise model but you'd think we'd see more talk of that here in NA if people that follow other sports cared.

    So Columbus supporters want to add names to a list to petition? Will there be demonstrations? All this may cause a spectacle that may be a back page headline but stopping the move? That would be akin to stopping Real Madrid and Barcelona from scoring.
    Last edited by Fort York Redcoat; 12-06-2017 at 02:23 PM.
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

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    Quote Originally Posted by Areathrasher View Post
    You really missed the point on that, eh ?

    But from your POV, MLS has carte blanche to do as it pleases? Is that what your saying?
    They do what they please already FYI.

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    Looks like there is hope for the crew after all

    Saved the Crew? Local group in negotiations to keep MLS in Columbus
    https://www.thescore.com/mls/news/1622152

    Ultimately, I think this is good for mls
    From an Ohio rivalry pov. relocation is the worst possible outcome to solve a franchises problems in the league, so it's good from that view as well.

 

 

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