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  1. #991
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    If it weren't for the world cup, I would really be fearing a return to an artificial surface.
    The first year seemed fine until the playoffs
    Last year worked out great,
    This year there has been a noticeable decline
    What happened? Did our head groundskeeper retire?

  2. #992
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    AFAIK Heggie and his guys are still plugging away. I can only surmise that the replacement pitch hasn't settled as nicely as we all hoped it would.

  3. #993
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    We had a wetter summer

    We had a shorter settling period

    Perhaps the quality of this pitch was less than the previous one

  4. #994
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    The last game the sand became really noticeable. At least from a visual perspective. There were numerous times when players were just outside the box on the north end and you could see sand being kicked up as they ran.

  5. #995
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    BMO field taking a beating today. Some aerial shots of the field shows the amount of sand and patches of non grass. Divets everywhere. I was skeptical on how bad the field was because from a distance it looks great.

  6. #996
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    Quote Originally Posted by glaze View Post
    If it weren't for the world cup, I would really be fearing a return to an artificial surface.
    The first year seemed fine until the playoffs
    Last year worked out great,
    This year there has been a noticeable decline
    What happened? Did our head groundskeeper retire?
    That's many years away. If they wanted to put in a plastic pitch and put in a temporary grass surface for the WC, it could easily be done. Last year wasn't so great! Seba was complaining about the green sand last year too! This year has been worse because of the long winter and the early start to the season. TFC ruined the first one. It was replaced in July. The Argos are ruining this one. A groundskeeper can't stop divots or make grass grow faster beyond the heat lamps which obviously were not needed in this hot summer.

  7. #997
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    This was inevitable. Perhaps the hybrid surface will help to a degree in the future but it isn't a miracle solution.

  8. #998
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    They won't put in a plastic pitch because

    a) reduces the potential player pool

    b) some marquee opponents won't play on it

    (see Zlatan)

  9. #999
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyDM View Post
    Yes it can. The highevel players we want should be playing on grass. Just grass. Old Trafford, juve type grass.
    Old Trafford and Juve grass is hybrid grass. Same with Barca and Man City. Are you saying we want players too good for those clubs?

  10. #1000
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    I think people forget that when we talk about hybrid grass, it effectively is grass. It's something like 98% or 99% actual grass, with artificial strands sewn down into the roots.

  11. #1001
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    Quote Originally Posted by magmadragon View Post
    I think people forget that when we talk about hybrid grass, it effectively is grass. It's something like 98% or 99% actual grass, with artificial strands sewn down into the roots.
    I thought I remembered reading that the hybrid could go up to 10% artificial, and that was what TFC had considered if they had chosen hybrid a couple of years ago.

  12. #1002
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    Quote Originally Posted by BritSOL View Post
    I thought I remembered reading that the hybrid could go up to 10% artificial, and that was what TFC had considered if they had chosen hybrid a couple of years ago.
    Frankly 10% is nothing.

    The benefits of hybrid outweigh going 100% natural in our weather climate. Even if the Argo's didn't wreck the field I would still opt for hybrid.

  13. #1003
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    I remember discussing this back when there was talk of the Argo timeshare. A strong polymer anchor grass is planted 2cm apart from each other, with the natural grass growing inbetween the anchors. It's supposed to provide more strength, and they use this in some NFL cities like Devnver. They also use it at Wembley, but the NFL still tears it up when they play there. If something happens to the grass even with the anchors, it's a lot harder to replace than if it was all natural.

  14. #1004
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    Quote Originally Posted by Initial B View Post
    I remember discussing this back when there was talk of the Argo timeshare. A strong polymer anchor grass is planted 2cm apart from each other, with the natural grass growing inbetween the anchors. It's supposed to provide more strength, and they use this in some NFL cities like Devnver. They also use it at Wembley, but the NFL still tears it up when they play there. If something happens to the grass even with the anchors, it's a lot harder to replace than if it was all natural.
    I remember it like that too. Someone from TFC said it was stronger but presents a new problem because they can’t patch/replace it very easy.

  15. #1005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Frankly 10% is nothing.

    The benefits of hybrid outweigh going 100% natural in our weather climate. Even if the Argo's didn't wreck the field I would still opt for hybrid.
    Quote Originally Posted by Initial B View Post
    I remember discussing this back when there was talk of the Argo timeshare. A strong polymer anchor grass is planted 2cm apart from each other, with the natural grass growing inbetween the anchors. It's supposed to provide more strength, and they use this in some NFL cities like Devnver. They also use it at Wembley, but the NFL still tears it up when they play there. If something happens to the grass even with the anchors, it's a lot harder to replace than if it was all natural.
    Exactly, hybrid has some advantages, but has disadvantages as well. If the Argos have a couple of games in the rain on the hybrid (plus throw some TFC games in the mix), then sections of the field will be mud, painted green, for the rest of the season. It won't coming up in chunks like 100% grass will, but it will still affect the games & the movement of the ball a great deal.

    BTW the Denver Broncos ditched hybrid a few years ago. Their surface is now 100% Kentucky Bluegrass. The Packers are the only NFL team still using hybrid. And most of the top-rated NFL surfaces are now 100% grass, but those stadium don't share with soccer team. NFL teams have far fewer games, and tend to have two weeks between home games. I believe most of the grass NFL stadiums have few other events taking place: https://www.si.com/nfl/2015/10/01/nf...grass-rankings

  16. #1006
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    Exactly, hybrid has some advantages, but has disadvantages as well. If the Argos have a couple of games in the rain on the hybrid (plus throw some TFC games in the mix), then sections of the field will be mud, painted green, for the rest of the season. It won't coming up in chunks like 100% grass will, but it will still affect the games & the movement of the ball a great deal.

    BTW the Denver Broncos ditched hybrid a few years ago. Their surface is now 100% Kentucky Bluegrass. The Packers are the only NFL team still using hybrid. And most of the top-rated NFL surfaces are now 100% grass, but those stadium don't share with soccer team. NFL teams have far fewer games, and tend to have two weeks between home games. I believe most of the grass NFL stadiums have few other events taking place: https://www.si.com/nfl/2015/10/01/nf...grass-rankings
    And once the Raiders move to Las Vegas it mark the end of an era, as there will not be a single MLB/NFL shared stadium left. Houston is the one example where American football is played on a regular basis at a MLS facility as Texas Southern plays there.

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

  17. #1007
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    They won't put in a plastic pitch because

    a) reduces the potential player pool

    b) some marquee opponents won't play on it

    (see Zlatan)

    ?? are you calling hybrid a plastic pitch?

  18. #1008
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    In regards to patching. Have we ever actually cut out sections of grass and laid new sod down? Perhaps I'm not remembering correctly, but we have always just replaced the whole field when it came time to do so.

  19. #1009
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    Quote Originally Posted by jabbronies View Post
    ?? are you calling hybrid a plastic pitch?
    No I was responding to the one post which feared we were getting an artificial suface again.


    Hybrid isn't artificial.

  20. #1010
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    No I was responding to the one post which feared we were getting an artificial suface again.


    Hybrid isn't artificial.
    cool - I thought I was missing something

  21. #1011
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    Quote Originally Posted by magmadragon View Post
    In regards to patching. Have we ever actually cut out sections of grass and laid new sod down? Perhaps I'm not remembering correctly, but we have always just replaced the whole field when it came time to do so.
    That's a good point. I don't think they have replaced patches in a while, perhaps since the Argos came in. I remember them replacing some patches after the field was prepared for rugby (after the supports for the rugby goal posts were installed), but I think that was earlier.

    I've noticed lots of patching on other pro grass fields, but not at BMO recently...?

    I believe the damage recently has been too spread out & random to make replacing patches worthwhile. Perhaps that's why the decided that the switch to hybrid is worth the risk.

    Have we ever had an Argos game during a heavy/prolonged downpour? I don't think so. That still worries me, that there may be areas that are really churned up as a result, and patching would be worth it.
    Last edited by Auzzy; 09-11-2018 at 08:41 PM.

  22. #1012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    Have we ever had an Argos game during a heavy/prolonged downpour? I don't think so. That still worries me, that there may be a areas that are really churned up as a result, and patching would be worth it.
    I don't believe so. We've been lucky so far.

    That's ultimately where my question lay. If we haven't been patching in some time, we have essentially been avoiding the drawback of GrassMaster. But who the hell knows if it will work out anyways. Maybe a bad downpour does it in in the future. It's an experiment that works until it doesn't. But it's not my money. ML$E can do whatever they want as long as it's not artificial turf.

  23. #1013
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    Quote Originally Posted by magmadragon View Post
    I don't believe so. We've been lucky so far.

    That's ultimately where my question lay. If we haven't been patching in some time, we have essentially been avoiding the drawback of GrassMaster. But who the hell knows if it will work out anyways. Maybe a bad downpour does it in in the future. It's an experiment that works until it doesn't. But it's not my money. ML$E can do whatever they want as long as it's not artificial turf.
    Too bad we can't have the alternate surfaces for different events, like some stadiums do...

  24. #1014
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    In the midst of this story, we get this on the new turf next season

    Manning said that TFC will switch from a natural grass surface to a hybrid grass-turf field after they wrap CCL play in 2019. Surface snobs can relax – this won’t be the same type of artificial turf used in other stadiums around MLS. The SIS Grass hybrid pitch that TFC will install next season is 95 percent grass and five percent synthetic fiber. The surface was used at six of 12 World Cup stadiums this summer, is used by several EPL teams and by the NFL’s Green Bay Packers. According to Manning, it’ll play like grass, but hold up much better than the all-natural surface that TFC has had problems with this season.

  25. #1015
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    In the midst of this story, we get this on the new turf next season
    Since this will be installed during the season, I wonder if we will have the same issues as this year? Our current pitch hasn't really settled all that well. But since we don't have much of an offseason/it's winter, I'm not sure when else it could be done.

  26. #1016
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    Quote Originally Posted by magmadragon View Post
    Since this will be installed during the season, I wonder if we will have the same issues as this year? Our current pitch hasn't really settled all that well. But since we don't have much of an offseason/it's winter, I'm not sure when else it could be done.
    Maybe they can schedule a couple of away games in MLS play to start the season, to give the new pitch a rest. (I would rather not have so many early-season/crappy-weather home games anyway.) At least the hybrid should prevent it coming up in chunks as badly as this season.

  27. #1017
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    Or maybe hybrid doesn't need so long to settle.

  28. #1018
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    Maybe they can schedule a couple of away games in MLS play to start the season, to give the new pitch a rest. (I would rather not have so many early-season/crappy-weather home games anyway.) At least the hybrid should prevent it coming up in chunks as badly as this season.
    Don't forget that the CCL will come early in the year.

  29. #1019
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Don't forget that the CCL will come early in the year.
    I realize that. Manning said the hybrid will he installed after CCL. So CCL first; pitch replacement; then start MLS with away games to give the new pitch time to settle.

  30. #1020
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auzzy View Post
    I realize that. Manning said the hybrid will he installed after CCL. So CCL first; pitch replacement; then start MLS with away games to give the new pitch time to settle.
    Will be interesting to see what happens when the Reds advance through the CCL and it begins to overlap with the start of the MLS regular season? Got to be optimistic !!

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

 

 

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