Page 3 of 50 FirstFirst 123456713 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 90 of 1495
  1. #61
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    3,388
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaz View Post
    I don't disagree beyond that all the other teams in the league have spent 8 weeks building attacking chemistry, while we have been playing a very defensive form a football.. not Preki Ball but still very defensive. It can work, so long as we don't loose any pieces. A injury her and a suspension there and we can fall apart because we aren't building that chemistry upfront. We have seen that with missed chances, and miscommunication.

    My hope is that it gets better... however we are getting close to a set of games where we are going to lose likely both our primary strikers.. It would be nice to find a balance. Of course teams in this league play very differently at home than away, So that may change once we get home more.. like I say the Sky isn't falling but it isn't all Roses and Gummie Bears. There are things I'm concerned about, which may fade away by the end of May or may be full worry by the end of June.

    This season will show what Vanney is capable off. He has everyone he could want really (minus striker depth) we need to be sitting in the top 3 of the east this year for this team to be a success. All that being said. I'm really pleased with the start of this season point wise.. I just wish they were a little hungry offensively. There is a balance that can be struck. We are supposed to have a League MVP and Golden Boot winner, and nearly the guy with the top assists last year. we should be more of an offensive threat. It is a concern.

    weve had injuries here and there.
    jozy
    moore sick
    endoh hurt
    cheyrou red card / hurt
    oasrio hurt

    and we still did well.


    If Morrow steps it up to his usual self, Osario plays as creatviely as he did last game and we find a winger I think we will do damn well.

    Plus Jozys goals are coming, I sense he will hit his stride soon

  2. #62
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    1,133
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    7 Weeks in... 7 straight road games and one more to go... and we're sitting first place in the power rankings. Anyone else think that that was going to happen?

    I always supported Vanney in getting time to work with this team. He needed at least 3 years to be properly judged. He has done very very well so far this year, and he's gotten this group of guys playing as a team, believing in themselves and each other.

  3. #63
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    21,543
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Vanney is getting it done right now. BUT the fact that it took him three years to get a basic system going, does not mean that he needed three years to do so, and that he should have been given three years. He should have been implement the system much earlier, and he could have been justifiably been fired by the middle of last season if not earlier.

    No football coach unless we are talking about a team being build around young talent needs three years.

  4. #64
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    3,073
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KurtLarSUN View Post
    This is why I've been preaching patience since the end of the 2014 season, when Vanney took over and the team was poor.

    Toronto FC was bad. Among the worst in the league. It was always going to take at least two full seasons to dump bloated deals and get in some quality pieces.

    Vanney has created a culture that didn't exist under Nelsen/Winter ...

    The players trust and respect him. He arguably works just as hard or harder than all of them.

    we cannot know what it was like under Nelsen for the players, although it appeared to me that he commanded respect because of his experience, but I think it's a bit unfair to imply that he brought in the bloated contracts that Bez had to clean out. He was cleaning out contracts too, and the team he started with was pretty basic skill wise.

    also, Vanneys lack of tactical adjustments in the Montreal games at the end of last season have nothing to do with culture or contracts - it was on him. He never adjusted players or tactics once Montreal started attacking down the left, and he could have done both. That's why his significant improvement in tactics this year is so noticeable and welcome.
    Last edited by Oldtimer; 04-26-2016 at 09:18 PM. Reason: fix quote syntax

  5. #65
    RPB 2019
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    221
    Posts
    14,331
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by trane View Post
    ...No football coach unless we are talking about a team being build around young talent needs three years.
    Its actually been less then two. Last year was his first full season. This is just about the time where we should be seeing significant improvement.


    For an example of who also is on the hot seat in MLS having to prove themselves- Maestroni, Heath, Coyle, Curtin


    The first year guys like Biello, Vierra and that guy in Chicago? They will have a longer leash (Vierra will be given 1.5 years).


    Pretty much every coach gets 2 seasons of preseason and then they have to go somewhere if they havn't already.

  6. #66
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    sec 107
    Posts
    491
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KurtLarSUN View Post
    This is why I've been preaching patience since the end of the 2014 season, when Vanney took over and the team was poor.

    Toronto FC was bad. Among the worst in the league. It was always going to take at least two full seasons to dump bloated deals and get in some quality pieces.

    Vanney has created a culture that didn't exist under Nelsen/Winter ...

    The players trust and respect him. He arguably works just as hard or harder than all of them.

    What I will say is the lack of depth in the attack is worrisome, but most teams in this league have deficiencies. Toronto's is a lack of strikers.

    There's something being overlooked, however. Something that could be putting pressure on president Bill Manning. I'll have more on this during the summer, potentially.

    Larson
    maybe the fact that they are losing C$21 million per year and can't keep losing that kind of money. Now some of that is C$ related and out of ML$Es control. But its an issue when they just spent $140m on a stadium and when the argos come in year 1 and look like they will make a couple mil at worst (plus another $8-9mil they make on the grey cup) and will probably make $5m+ on outdoor hockey game, there must be pressure to operate profitability especially when the top MLS clubs last year were some of the worst spenders.

    I see Jozy and the general gone for sure after this year. Just enjoy this year folks.
    Last edited by Onyx; 04-26-2016 at 07:45 PM.

  7. #67
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    459
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by barticusz View Post
    7 Weeks in... 7 straight road games and one more to go... and we're sitting first place in the power rankings. Anyone else think that that was going to happen? ...
    So what - a pretty good streak on the road - whoopi doo. The proof of the pudding is the first half dozen HOME games. If they dominate, then I am a belieber - top 3 all the way. If they foul the nest in the first few games, then we are back to same old, same old. I want them to win, but they MUST deliver at home - right way - no bullshit - no injury excuses - no blaming the ref. Four wins out of six. Otherwise chevy396 have at it - I have been too traumatized from 9 years of Bullshit to be drawn in too soon. It is what they do at home that matters and they have done sweet dick all at home - yet.
    Last edited by tiberius; 04-26-2016 at 08:55 PM.

  8. #68
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Stoney Creek
    Posts
    2,856
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tiberius View Post
    So what - a pretty good streak on the road - whoopi doo. The proof of the pudding is the first half dozen HOME games. If they dominate, then I am a belieber - top 3 all the way. If they foul the nest in the first few games, then we are back to same old, same old. I want them to win, but they MUST deliver at home - right way - no bullshit - no injury excuses - no blaming the ref. Four wins out of six. Otherwise chevy396 have at it - I have been too traumatized from 9 years of Bullshit to be drawn in too soon. It is what they do at home that matters and they have done sweet dick all at home - yet.
    baby, baby, baaabyyyyy, uhhhhhhhhh

  9. #69
    RPB 2019
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    221
    Posts
    14,331
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Onyx View Post
    maybe the fact that they are losing C$21 million per year and can't keep losing that kind of money. Now some of that is C$ related and out of ML$Es control. But its an issue when they just spent $140m on a stadium and when the argos come in year 1 and look like they will make a couple mil at worst (plus another $8-9mil they make on the grey cup) and will probably make $5m+ on outdoor hockey game, there must be pressure to operate profitability especially when the top MLS clubs last year were some of the worst spenders.

    I see Jozy and the general gone for sure after this year. Just enjoy this year folks.

    a) Argos don't make money operationally, which is true for every team outside of Regina, and with not that big a season ticket base, it remains to be seen if the TV money is enough for them to be profitable. Yes, the Grey Cup makes money but that's not really an Argo thing.

    b) They can't sell players for cash - neither of those players are going anywhere

    c) the DP salaries arn't that big a thing for MLSE

    d) that $21 million figure is disputed


    What this has to do with Vanney is

  10. #70
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Tahrawnah
    Posts
    2,149
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Onyx View Post
    maybe the fact that they are losing C$21 million per year and can't keep losing that kind of money. Now some of that is C$ related and out of ML$Es control. But its an issue when they just spent $140m on a stadium and when the argos come in year 1 and look like they will make a couple mil at worst (plus another $8-9mil they make on the grey cup) and will probably make $5m+ on outdoor hockey game, there must be pressure to operate profitability especially when the top MLS clubs last year were some of the worst spenders.

    I see Jozy and the general gone for sure after this year. Just enjoy this year folks.
    MOD EDIT: Personal attack. Not necessary. Life marches forward. ~Shakes
    Last edited by Shakes McQueen; 04-27-2016 at 08:28 AM.

  11. #71
    RPB Member Past President
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Dichio Country
    Posts
    12,226
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by trane View Post
    Vanney is getting it done right now. BUT the fact that it took him three years to get a basic system going, does not mean that he needed three years to do so, and that he should have been given three years. He should have been implement the system much earlier, and he could have been justifiably been fired by the middle of last season if not earlier.

    No football coach unless we are talking about a team being build around young talent needs three years.
    He's had his system in place since the beginning, but he's tweaked it and worked on it ever since. He inherited a bit of a mess in his first half-season as interim manager. Then they started to fix things during his first full season. This is his second full season and they look pretty good. That's a quick turnaround from shit-show to (potential) contender, in my eyes.

    This league has a decent history of coaches learning on the job and improving rapidly. I think Vanney has shown all the signs of moving along that same path. We've seen improvement from him during his whole time here and we've seen improvement in our team, as well. The players believe in him and his system, they are playing well and he is getting better with experience. I think it's a good formula for MLS. We just don't have a depth of a manager/coach pool that can come in here and know the league, the style, the roster limitations and the travel schedule. What TFC is doing with Vanney is a proven strategy in our league, so I'm all for it. The guy is making strides. I don't think it's a good idea to fire someone who has shown constant improvement throughout his tenure.
    Toronto FC baby...best team everrrrrrrrrr -Jozy

  12. #72
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Section 110 Row 24
    Posts
    6,652
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Too small a sample. A good team can easily fail to get 8 points in 8 road games. A bad team could get 8 points without deserving it. Plus the context (injuries, things not known publicly) could matter a lot.

    It's a moot point, Manning skated it, but I would have been upset had Manning canned Vanney after 8 games, and not because I love Vanney.

    Really, you never see this, no leader should ever do this to a manager. It's not the right way to run the business. As I respect Manning and his managerial resume, I actually think/hope it was just a tactic used to create urgency with the players, and Manning never intended to fire Vanney regardless of how the season started, and if so, I hope he told Vanney that from the beginning.

    Ya i agree - firing Vanney based on the "8pts" would be short sighted. But I don't mind him laying it down and aiming for that number. Wasn't an absurd goal by any means IMO.

  13. #73
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    1,133
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by trane View Post
    Vanney is getting it done right now. BUT the fact that it took him three years to get a basic system going, does not mean that he needed three years to do so, and that he should have been given three years. He should have been implement the system much earlier, and he could have been justifiably been fired by the middle of last season if not earlier.

    No football coach unless we are talking about a team being build around young talent needs three years.
    ............. I'm sorry but wasn't the problem that we didn't have the right players? We're back to the diamond the system he wanted, with high pressure, and possession... but now we've got the personnel that can play defense and work as a team. He's been greatly influential in getting the players to all buy into the working hard mentality and working as one. Name me all the examples of head coaches that have come into MLS and have had success right from the get go?

  14. #74
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    International waters
    Posts
    1,014
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Vanney wanted the 4-3-3 and it was an utter failure. I think Seba was fed up and had a nice long chat with Vanney to get this team heading into the right direction.

  15. #75
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    3,073
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ronzilla View Post
    Vanney wanted the 4-3-3 and it was an utter failure. I think Seba was fed up and had a nice long chat with Vanney to get this team heading into the right direction.
    Or, Altidore came back and we needed a lineup that integrated the both of them without sacrificing a lot on the defensive side. 4-3-3 also wasn't an utter failure. We'll probably see it more later in the season at home when the team get's more comfortable.

  16. #76
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,469
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Our 4-3-3 was essentially a 4-5-1 most of the time

  17. #77
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    3,073
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    Our 4-3-3 was essentially a 4-5-1 most of the time
    For all intents and purposes they're basically always the same thing. The Dutch are the only ones who ever truly play a proper 4-3-3

  18. #78
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    International waters
    Posts
    1,014
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    Our 4-3-3 was essentially a 4-5-1 most of the time

    Yes, it was 4-5-1 while defending and then sprung into 4-3-3 in attack. The team was pinned back for most of the game with this formation.

  19. #79
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    3,464
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    Wardrobe choices this season have been sub-par. I was really digging the 80's Miami Beach vibe last year.

    Yeah I was hoping "Miami Vanney" as a nick name would stick. But he's not doing the Miami vice thing anymore it seems.

  20. #80
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    798
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Nobody has seen the books so nobody knows how much we are losing.

    Losing $21M CAD annually seems high, but depending on the long-term stadium repayment structure, it is possible.

    Things that need to happen for TFC to continue to pay for three of the highest priced DPs:

    We need to average 25k - 28k per game.

    Win the Canadian Championship and get into champions league.

    We need a playoff run. IMO, Eastern Conference Finals are the minimum to justify the highest payroll in MLS for three straight years.

    More people will watch playoff games on TV. TFC vs. IMFC had very respectable ratings and if we make a run, it could get even better.

    Playoffs will also mean increased sponsorship, increased ticket sales in the following year, increased merchandise sales, etc.

    If at least some of these things don't happen, the club will have to cut back on expenditures.

  21. #81
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Oakville
    Posts
    259
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Maybe this is the year they learn you can win by picking up the Moors, Will Johnsons, Clint Irwins of the league and then spend big on one forward for a few goals.

  22. #82
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Scarborough
    Posts
    4,116
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TFC/Everton View Post
    Nobody has seen the books so nobody knows how much we are losing.

    Losing $21M CAD annually seems high, but depending on the long-term stadium repayment structure, it is possible.

    Things that need to happen for TFC to continue to pay for three of the highest priced DPs:

    We need to average 25k - 28k per game.

    Win the Canadian Championship and get into champions league.

    We need a playoff run. IMO, Eastern Conference Finals are the minimum to justify the highest payroll in MLS for three straight years.

    More people will watch playoff games on TV. TFC vs. IMFC had very respectable ratings and if we make a run, it could get even better.

    Playoffs will also mean increased sponsorship, increased ticket sales in the following year, increased merchandise sales, etc.

    If at least some of these things don't happen, the club will have to cut back on expenditures.
    I still don't buy the $21M in the hole line after everything captured in revenues is tallied but all of the above are important minus the CCL. Besides the hardcore supporters, no one really cares about it and it doesn't pay out well. Most important things are playoff success and some solid play in the summer after the Euros are over when there's a chance for some more eyes on our matches.

  23. #83
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    798
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    I still don't buy the $21M in the hole line after everything captured in revenues is tallied but all of the above are important minus the CCL. Besides the hardcore supporters, no one really cares about it and it doesn't pay out well. Most important things are playoff success and some solid play in the summer after the Euros are over when there's a chance for some more eyes on our matches.
    Toronto fans certainly don't care about the group stage, but if we advance to the knockout rounds, it could mean a big game or two in March. Our 2012 run was pretty awesome.

  24. #84
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,469
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BelfastBoy View Post
    Maybe this is the year they learn you can win by picking up the Moors, Will Johnsons, Clint Irwins of the league and then spend big on one forward for a few goals.
    Just a correction... Moor, not Moore. Moore was a giant waste of space here.

  25. #85
    RPB 2019 Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    On the Interwebs
    Posts
    16,703
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by barticusz View Post
    ............. I'm sorry but wasn't the problem that we didn't have the right players? We're back to the diamond the system he wanted, with high pressure, and possession... but now we've got the personnel that can play defense and work as a team. He's been greatly influential in getting the players to all buy into the working hard mentality and working as one. Name me all the examples of head coaches that have come into MLS and have had success right from the get go?
    I think this is the key thing. I think most of us were skeptical when yet another coach lacking first team experience was hired for the position, instead of say Sigi Schmid. However every coach starts as a new one at some point and Vanney appeared to be learning well from early on. Now a couple of years on, his decisions this year seem overall quite good. Certainly the defense-first focus, while not pretty has been just what this team needed on the road.

    Ultimately any coach gets judged on his results, so once we are further along in the season we'll be able to more objectively evaluate his team. However the start has exceeded everyone's expectations, I don't think anyone here expected 11 points at this point.
    "Of all the things in life that don't actually matter, football matters the most." - Stuart McKeown

    Supporting since 2007


  26. #86
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Niagara Falls
    Posts
    2,623
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Vanney's record speaks for itself... we've played 7 games and we have yet to win a single game at home.. I mean we haven't played any.. but that doesn't matter.. we should have won at least one anyway.. send him packing

  27. #87
    RPB 2019 Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    On the Interwebs
    Posts
    16,703
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    After being impressed Vanney's discipline with the away games, I'm feeling pretty let down by the home games. Does anyone else feel that way?

    With the NY City game they showed a pretty poor start, and the short-passing sucked. They stepped it up after NY's goal, and tactically corrected to play a longer-passing game. That's good, but why were the tactics wrong at the beginning?

  28. #88
    RPB 2019
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Ajax (Top O'114 on gameday)
    Posts
    2,669
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    The whiteboard in the locker room says "pass it side to side until you can pass to Seba". Teams know this now. Vanney needs to change tactics and say it is ok to pass to anyone that is in the best position even if not Giovinco.

  29. #89
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    1,246
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Kool View Post
    The whiteboard in the locker room says "pass it side to side until you can pass to Seba". Teams know this now. Vanney needs to change tactics and say it is ok to pass to anyone that is in the best position even if not Giovinco.
    Everyone is always looking for Seba. One play Babouli had Johnson driving down the middle wide open and also Seba semi-covered out wise, he decides to hammer it out wide to Seba only to smash it into Johnson who was rightfully pissed.

  30. #90
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Niagara Falls
    Posts
    2,623
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    After being impressed Vanney's discipline with the away games, I'm feeling pretty let down by the home games. Does anyone else feel that way?

    With the NY City game they showed a pretty poor start, and the short-passing sucked. They stepped it up after NY's goal, and tactically corrected to play a longer-passing game. That's good, but why were the tactics wrong at the beginning?

    This is 100% on Vanney.

    There is not offensive creativity. Last year we scored goals that were team efforts not just.. give the ball to seba. The reason he is involved in all the goals is because they aren't trying to get goals any other way. That is hurting.

    The back passes are sloppy and getting sloppier, and it isn't hard to see that TFC has no teeth. It is starting to show through.

    Sky still isn't falling but my assessment earlier nearly a month ago stands. The teams strategy which is all Vanney is heavily flawed and is not dynamic enough to handle the smarter coaches in the league. Like Robinson and Vieira for example.

 

 

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •