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  1. #1831
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ultra & Proud View Post
    All I ask now is to practice penalties for the next few weeks.
    For sure.
    "Of all the things in life that don't actually matter, football matters the most." - Stuart McKeown

    Supporting since 2007


  2. #1832
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    The #vanneyout discussion seems to be strangely quiet recently.

    Unbeaten in 10
    Home playoff game (with help)
    The Athletic considers TFC a contender and gives a lot of the credit to Vanney.

    Vanney was frustrating as can be at times during the season, however he now has the team firing on all cylinders, playing well together, and Nephew isn't even on the bench. They are playing attractive attacking football and doing well. What's not to like?
    I never thought Vanney to be a bad coach.
    But this year and last he made many questionable decisions that left fans very frustrated.
    He was also not able to make a weaker TFC into a half decent team until he got better players.
    I'm glad things turned around for him and for the team. Everyone deserves second chances.

    Dropping his nephew, finally, was probably a realization his job was on the line after Zavs got that dumb red card in ATL after just coming on as a sub.

    Hopefully we just practice penalties more often!

  3. #1833
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    The #vanneyout discussion seems to be strangely quiet recently.

    Unbeaten in 10

    He now has the team firing on all cylinders, playing well together, and Nephew isn't even on the bench. They are playing attractive attacking football and doing well. What's not to like?
    It took a lot of faith for the fans to hang in....

    So I wouldn't quite say that, we aren't really clicking in the final third, finishing in particular. Additionally, if you look at Poz's reel, it is easy to see that he is playing out of position. What made him valuable in Belgium is that he could dribble with two feet and he could unlock someone into scoring opportunities with sublime passes when they ran to openings without the ball.

    I think Vanney is lucky we have spent money and in particular got OG to solidify the defence and that has really worked out.

    Sorry, I like him, just not raving about him. Still think if he was with any other team (i.e. one without money) he probably wouldn't be hosting a home game in two weeks.

    But more important ... COYRs

  4. #1834
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    Underdog, out of gas, of the road... It would have been so easy for Vanney to turtle and play for PKs. That was the percentage play.

    The Mullins and Laryea subs were the gamble that won this game.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

  5. #1835
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    Vanney is very very good when under pressure but his system relies upon a good CB general & like all coaches, he needs players that fit his system. He didn't have that for a good chunk of 2018 due to injury & for the first 5 months of this season due to turnover.

    I look forward to seeing what he comes up with if we play Atlanta next week. In some ways, I think he's been unshackled by Seba leaving. Now he can play his system & I'm trying to think of a team left that will counter it - most are just going to play their style.

  6. #1836
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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Underdog, out of gas, of the road... It would have been so easy for Vanney to turtle and play for PKs. That was the percentage play.

    The Mullins and Laryea subs were the gamble that won this game.
    Agreed. It worked, so no complaints.

  7. #1837
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    I had worried he had lost the room over the summer. So glad I was wrong.

    G'wan Greg ya daisy

  8. #1838
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Vanney is very very good when under pressure but his system relies upon a good CB general & like all coaches, he needs players that fit his system. He didn't have that for a good chunk of 2018 due to injury & for the first 5 months of this season due to turnover.

    I look forward to seeing what he comes up with if we play Atlanta next week. In some ways, I think he's been unshackled by Seba leaving. Now he can play his system & I'm trying to think of a team left that will counter it - most are just going to play their style.
    It was really great that Ciman stepped up the way he did with Gonzalez out the last two games. Made the signing worth it, and really helped Vanney to be able to stick to his game plan. Mavinga was roaming too much today considering he was likely tired. (He didn't even go forward for many of the corner kicks.) But Ciman was much more disciplined than he was earlier this season.

  9. #1839
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    Just think about how phenomenal our record has been in knockout competition since 2016, it's unheard of!

    2016 .... Voyageurs Cup 2 series wins .... MLS Cup 3 series wins 1 shootout loss (5-1)
    2017 .... Voyageurs Cup 2 series wins .... MLS Cup 3 series wins (5-0)
    2018 .... Voyageurs Cup 2 series wins .... MLS Cup no playoffs, injuries .... Champions League 3 series wins 1 shoot out loss (5-1)
    2019 .... Voyageurs Cup 1 series win 1 shoot out loss ... MLS Cup 2 series wins and to be continued ... Champions League 1 series loss (3-2)

    We are 18 wins 1 regulation loss and 3 shootout losses in knock out series in the last 4 years. Insanity. A win next week and we could be in a major final every year since 2016 plus the Canadian Championship final each of those years as well

  10. #1840
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaeltfc91 View Post
    Just think about how phenomenal our record has been in knockout competition since 2016, it's unheard of!

    2016 .... Voyageurs Cup 2 series wins .... MLS Cup 3 series wins 1 shootout loss (5-1)
    2017 .... Voyageurs Cup 2 series wins .... MLS Cup 3 series wins (5-0)
    2018 .... Voyageurs Cup 2 series wins .... MLS Cup no playoffs, injuries .... Champions League 3 series wins 1 shoot out loss (5-1)
    2019 .... Voyageurs Cup 1 series win 1 shoot out loss ... MLS Cup 2 series wins and to be continued ... Champions League 1 series loss (3-2)

    We are 18 wins 1 regulation loss and 3 shootout losses in knock out series in the last 4 years. Insanity. A win next week and we could be in a major final every year since 2016 plus the Canadian Championship final each of those years as well
    Yeah all of sudden last year looks like a blip on the radar.

    This team is still the real deal.

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    As much as I've been shouting against Vanney this year, fair play he should keep the job for next year. For reference, I still think the terrible performance of this team since we lost CCL 2018 up until literally a few weeks ago should have seen him sacked. And I also strongly believe that the club sorely lacks ambition at this point (making playoffs was the expectation this year guys). Regardless, conference finals is where I expect us to be and we've made it so respect where it's due, Vanney did it.

  12. #1842
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Yeah all of sudden last year looks like a blip on the radar.

    This team is still the real deal.
    Last year was a blip. The amount of injuries the team sustained was unreal, almost unprecedented. It had little to do with coaching, although coaches always get the blame. Maybe throwing all that effort into the CCL was a mistake given how little support the league gives, but that was decided at the Manning level.

    We now see, after the summer transfers settled in, and the team playing like Vanney wanted, it's pretty good.

    The club hasn't promised an MLS Cup win every year, but they promised a contender. This has already happened for this year IMO.

    Vanney is a super frustrating coach in that he always loses some regular season games that TFC should win due to experimentation, or by refusing to be pragmatic and play a less elegant game when faced with playing with a sub optimum squad.

    However, given a healthy squad and focused in the playoffs his tactical skills come to the forefront. He showed it against NYCFC this year and against Seattle in 2017. The team is now in an all time unbeaten streak. This despite missing two out of the starting XI.
    Last edited by Oldtimer; 10-24-2019 at 09:36 AM.

  13. #1843
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    Bobby Warsaw credits Vanney's tactics for the win against NYCFC, as well as the team's attitude.
    Second half of this article.

    https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2019/...-bobby-warshaw

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    I thought last year was a blip, due to injury and tiredness. BUT our defensive lapses and inability to defend a lead, are the reasons it took us so long to secure a spot in the playoffs, and as to why we do not have home games. AND it may cost us getting further.


    I am glad Vanney recognizes the need to address still address, this, but we need to do it.

    Since the middle of the season, I said that in Vanney gets us into the playoffs and we make a run, and make steps to address our defensive problems, we should stay the course, going forward to 2020. So at this point, I am staying with it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Last year was a blip. The amount of injuries the team sustained was unreal, almost unprecedented. It had little to do with coaching, although coaches always get the blame. Maybe throwing all that effort into the CCL was a mistake given how little support the league gives, but that was decided at the Manning level.

    We now see, after the summer transfers settled in, and the team playing like Vanney wanted, it's pretty good.

    The club hasn't promised an MLS Cup win every year, but they promised a contender. This has already happened for this year IMO.

    Vanney is a super frustrating coach in that he always loses some regular season games that TFC should win due to experimentation, or by refusing to be pragmatic and play a less elegant game when faced with playing with a sub optimum squad.

    However, given a healthy squad and focused in the playoffs his tactical skills come to the forefront. He showed it against NYCFC this year and against Seattle in 2017. The team is now in an all time unbeaten streak. This despite missing two out of the starting XI.
    I don't know how all season can be defined as a blip unless it's in the context of a decade or something similar. 34 games is no blip.

  16. #1846
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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    I don't know how all season can be defined as a blip unless it's in the context of a decade or something similar. 34 games is no blip.
    I would consider it a blip if our next couple years after this one are solid. Then you're looking at 5 of 6 years being good.

  17. #1847
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    It was more than a blip but it was injuries, then poor management of obvious problems (ie letting the DPs roll into 2019 and not being ready when that was a problem)

    Neither of those things were Vanney's fault
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    The cause of the poor year in 2018 were clear. We did have a good run at the begging of the year in the CL. In large part because of that run we had key injuries and key members were not fit all year.
    There may have been some management issues.

    However, I would think that Vanney himself would admit that he could have done more with the team then he did.

    Ultimately he is responsible for overall team performance. He has given us the not just by far the best run ever for us, but also one of the best runs in the MLS ever. Therefore, while we could have and should have done better last year, there are clear reasons that we did not, and light of the fact that the ship seems to be back in the right direction. I give Vanney my full confidence going forward.

    These things are not black and white, and the evaluation of managers and players is ever evolving.

  19. #1849
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    for fun i checked the vanneyout on twitter

    almost all the vanney outs have been removed. haha
    even the last diehard vanneyout guy named dynasy dondada has removed his vanneyout posts
    i dont have twitter so i never posted anything on twitter but i posted here vanney out

    boy was i wrong, vanney in
    vanney's greatness is only surpassed by ali curtis greatness

  20. #1850
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    Kaz, show yourself

  21. #1851
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    lol. I'll go on record and say I had lost a lot of faith in Vanney mid-season and I'll never make that mistake again.

    There's no disputing his record in knockout games, games that really matter. He always gives us a chance to win. Kudos.

  22. #1852
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    Greg is not going anywhere, simple as the fuck as that , Vanney In !!

    Remember The Man, The Legend, The Goal 5-12-07 and All That #9 Left On The Pitch, Thanks For The Memories !!!

  23. #1853
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    Here is too Seattle fans

  24. #1854
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    This is me as well. Had a bad month or so in the middle of the year. But I have no complaints now...

    #VanneyIn

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    Doyle just pointed out.

    We played 4 different formations in the second half of this game & the team didn't skip a beat defensively.

    4-4-2, 5-3-2, 5-4-1 & a 4-2-3-1


    People...in this league...this is unheard of.

    We were crud for a long time, and the high line was a mistake. But nobody adjusts better then Vanney in this league & nobody has come close to training their team to adjust like that in this league.

    Anybody who thinks there is somebody else that can do that just does not get how spoiled we are by that capability in this staff & in this team.

  26. #1856
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Doyle just pointed out.

    We played 4 different formations in the second half of this game & the team didn't skip a beat defensively.

    4-4-2, 5-3-2, 5-4-1 & a 4-2-3-1


    People...in this league...this is unheard of.

    We were crud for a long time, and the high line was a mistake. But nobody adjusts better then Vanney in this league & nobody has come close to training their team to adjust like that in this league.

    Anybody who thinks there is somebody else that can do that just does not get how spoiled we are by that capability in this staff & in this team.
    Peter Galindo of Sportsnet gives good diagrams explaining how these shifts hurt Atlanta's offense and gave opportunities to TFC.

    https://www.sportsnet.ca/soccer/tfc-...mls-cup-final/

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    Honestly wondering if the fact we perform so well in so-called 'crunch time' is intentionally tactical.

    Just looking at 2016, 2017 playoffs, 2018 CCL and now 2019 playoffs the guys seem to come to the match at an entirely different tempo. And I don't mean on an individual level. I think the way we've played in that above sequence has been far more about pressing, forcing mistakes, and capitalizing than the economical and predictable possession we moan about during the season. Anyone else see this? It's like watching an entirely different team. Watch CCL 2018 versus any 'important' MLS regular season match in 2017 for example. They're completely different styles, even though it's pretty much the same group.

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    I love what Vanney has done in the playoffs.

    But I got to comment on his post game interview. I did not like that he talked about us not being good, and Atlanta playing better. We gave too many chances early, but then we played just as we needed to organized, and gritty. I understand that he is "ideological" about how the game should look, and it is good that he has a vision. But the first priority should be winning. AND it clearly has been for him, and he has delivered. But I think that is why it took so long to address some of our defensive deficiencies.

    But I do believe in him, and will be willing to support his vision for some time.

  29. #1859
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    To be fair, (IIRC this was the first question) Vanney was asked "what do you think of what DeBoer said" which was just a little weird.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    To be fair, (IIRC this was the first question) Vanney was asked "what do you think of what DeBoer said" which was just a little weird.
    Yes, that true. But I found his comment to be instructive of his philosophy. Which I while I do not agree with all the way, I can get behind, because as I said having a vision of what you want is key. And you always want to do better. He clearly has a in game, short term, and long term vision, and it has been great for us.

 

 

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