Diskerud voted most overrated; Altidore 2nd; Bradley 6th

[ManUtd4ever]

Valid points on both sides of the argument. That's why I qualified my opinion that they are both overpaid by stating that they are still both worthy of DP slots/salaries.

The question is, should it matter to us as supporters if they are overpaid?Their cap hits would be exactly the same if they were earning 1 million dollars a year, and thus, have absolutely no bearing on management's ability to build a team around them.

As DPs go, they are definitely among the best in MLS in terms of quality. Seba is in a class of his own.

[ag futbol]

this doesn't require paying someone 5 mil a year to do.

you can find a ball playing DM for far cheaper.

Fully agree. This role we have him playing right now is great, but not worth 5 mil.

Last year just didn't work, stats aside. There were large caps exposed in the midfield.

[ag futbol]

The question is, should it matter to us as supporters if they are overpaid?

Let's put it this way: if with the money we spent on Seba we got the equivalent of Clint Depsy would we be okay with it? That takes our team down several notches, easily.

Salary cap is a red herring here. We need to generate the most talent per dollar spent if we want to be the best (or among the best) teams in the league.

[Onyx]

Let's put it this way: if with the money we spent on Seba we got the equivalent of Clint Depsy would we be okay with it? That takes our team down several notches, easily.

Salary cap is a red herring here. We need to generate the most talent per dollar spent if we want to be the best (or among the best) teams in the league.

only issue is are these guys earning the $475k in cap space they are taking up? (we shouldn't care about the other 5m in salary ... thats MLSEs problem).
Seba worth every cent
Bradley and Jozy: very debateable? largely due to MLS games missed, than performance

[ag futbol]

I disagree. It's about efficiency, not a cap hit.

Most teams in this league now have designed players. If we do a worse job at signing ours than other teams that puts us at a disadvantage.

The fact that we spend more money just leaves us a larger margin for error, it doesn't mean we stop caring once the dollar amount is greater than the cap hit.

And if we're talking about us vs. the other top spenders, we should care about where every dollar of that money is going and how much we are getting back in return.

[notthesun]

I disagree. It's about efficiency, not a cap hit.

Most teams in this league now have designed players. If we do a worse job at signing ours than other teams that puts us at a disadvantage.

The fact that we spend more money just leaves us a larger margin for error, it doesn't mean we stop caring once the dollar amount is greater than the cap hit.

And if we're talking about us vs. the other top spenders, we should care about where every dollar of that money is going and how much we are getting back in return.

I see what you mean, but the other side of it makes sense as well. For example, what if we were paying Giovinco $12 million a year instead of $7 million? That's less efficient, but should I care? He will still be the best player in the league, and MLSE will still continue spending money. The team isn't hurt in any way.

On the other hand, Michael Bradley is probably not a $5 million-a-year player. But we have to remember that MLS is still a relatively fledgling league, and so the more talent you want to acquire to fill that DP slot, the bigger the premium you need to spend to convince players to come over, especially if they are still in their 20s. The TFC plan, like it or not, appears to be to emulate L.A. You can either sign very good DPs for relatively cheap and win a championship like Portland, or you can pay those premiums for DPs a cut above the others and win multiple championships like the Galaxy.

So once you get into those multiple million dollar salaries and start paying those premiums, the question is whether you've signed a very good player or an excellent player. Giovinco obviously passes that test, and anyone who scoffed at his salary when he was signed has had to admit he's been worth every penny. I think Bradley has been one of the most misused TFC players ever, so the perception on him in terms of value for money isn't great at the moment, but I think he can be excellent. I look at the top defensive mids in the league, some already mentioned in this thread - Alonso, McCarty, Beckerman, throw Chara in there too - and they are all good enough to be part of a championship team no doubt, but I don't think I'd say any of them are better players than Bradley. I don't agree with the notion either that I've seen from time to time that it's too much money to spend on a DM (de Vos used to rag on TFC for this all the time and then coincidentally shut up about it since Laba moved to Vancouver), so overall I'm okay with having Bradley on his salary. Not thrilled, but okay. That just leaves Altidore. He's easily the most questionable spend of our current DPs; between a troublesome hamstring and a decent (but not $4 million worthy) first season, I think it's fair to say that's the DP slot we could be making much better use of (keeping in mind he was likely more of a convenient bit of improvisation out of the Defoe fiasco rather than a top-of-the-wishlist target).

[OgtheDim]

disagreed. Alonso, McCarty, Beckerman all do the job as well as him at DM

No.

None of them have his range of passing, coverage of the ground and ability to see the open spaces.

Most importantly, none of them come close to Bradley in his speed of thought on the pitch.

That and people are forgetting who laid out the passes that sprung Seba in the first couple of games.Seen this before last season - we don't score and people seem to think Bradley can't pass.

[jabbronies]

And yet we've had a stout defense through our first three away games. Maybe that has something to do with Bradley being in a position he's very good at.

As I said earlier - This year he's been doing very well and playing the way I expected him to play. More of a pacer/controller in the midfield and being that link between the Defence and the attack. if he keeps playing like this and improving - then yes he eventually shouldn't be on that list.

[Fort York Redcoat]

this doesn't require paying someone 5 mil a year to do.

you can find a ball playing DM for far cheaper.

disagreed. Alonso, McCarty, Beckerman all do the job as well as him at DM

I won't question those players worth but I would challenge you to find someone like them and woo them here for less or even money then they are making being a keystone on teams they're all a big part of.

We didn't have Bradley for years and watch him grow into the leader he is. We had to pay up front and hope he can get the results we want.

[portu]

Irrespective of salary I think Jozy is overrated and Bradley isn't

[Areathrasher]

One part of this confuses me...

Who exactly overrates Jozy?

[Fort York Redcoat]

One part of this confuses me...

Who exactly overrates Jozy?

Hahaha well said. I suppose its people that DON'T watch our team?

[Areathrasher]

Hahaha well said. I suppose its people that DON'T watch our team?

Well his reputation was pretty low leaving Sunderland and USMNT fans have the same gripes about him that TFC fans do,so???

[T-boy]

I wouldn't call Jozy overrated - as that would assume somebody rated him that highly in the first place. I think he's a good MLS level player - but certainly not world class or even international class. I do like watching him play, however, and I do like that he plays for us and not another MLS team.

[shwade]

Overpaid not overrated.

[OgtheDim]

For "over rated' insert "hyped a lot"

[jloome]

No.

None of them have his range of passing, coverage of the ground and ability to see the open spaces.

Most importantly, none of them come close to Bradley in his speed of thought on the pitch.

That and people are forgetting who laid out the passes that sprung Seba in the first couple of games.Seen this before last season - we don't score and people seem to think Bradley can't pass.

McCarty does. He's as good a DM as Bradley; he doesn't have the all-around game though. Bradley once scored 18 in a season in the Eredivisie, which while not the best defensive league is still well more than anyone on that list would accomplish.

Beckerman is shot, it looks. His legs looked half-gone last year and they can't have gotten better. Mids burn out young from all that two-way traffic.

[portu]

For "over rated' insert "hyped a lot"

yeah that's probably more accurate

[MartinUtd]

Are you sure you are not mixing Bradley passes up with Cheyrou?

Nope. I've seen plenty of the bald man hoofing balls towards the goal line with too much weight for the pursuing winger to catch up with.

[OgtheDim]

Nope. I've seen plenty of the bald man hoofing balls towards the goal line with too much weight for the pursuing winger to catch up with.

Hmmm....havn't noticed. I'll watch for that in Colorado.

[MartinUtd]

Hmmm....havn't noticed. I'll watch for that in Colorado.

I could be over inflating the issue due to expectations and wanting better, but I've seen it a few times already this season and numerous times in 2015.

[ag futbol]

Cheyrou's passing is exceptional. Even with the reduced mobility we are lucky to have him. On any game where we start with an attacking mindset he's absolutely key to keeping things moving.

Can only imagine how good he was back in the day. Hard to believe he was never scooped up by a mega club, not that OM is a terrible outfit by any means.

[Yohan]

Cheyrou's passing is exceptional. Even with the reduced mobility we are lucky to have him. On any game where we start with an attacking mindset he's absolutely key to keeping things moving.

Can only imagine how good he was back in the day. Hard to believe he was never scooped up by a mega club, not that OM is a terrible outfit by any means.

He's our Pirlo, except he actually tries to defend still, even if he no longer has the legs for it.

[jloome]

He's our Pirlo, except he actually tries to defend still, even if he no longer has the legs for it.

He was repeatedly linked with the Prem when he was younger; don't know why it never happened. I don't think he was ever very fast, so maybe that was it.

[Yohan]

He was repeatedly linked with the Prem when he was younger; don't know why it never happened. I don't think he was ever very fast, so maybe that was it.

I can see that. Cheyrou will have to play in a 3 man midfield with someone to cover for him all the time.

[portu]

He's our Pirlo, except he actually tries to defend still, even if he no longer has the legs for it.

I was kind of disappointed that we didnt move him in the Johnson deal and then kept Warner on the bench

[trane]

People who overrated the MLS homegrown talent, always think that DPs are overrated, unless they preform at amazing levels. It is bullshit, Altidore is as good as it gets for a CF in this league, and Bradley is a world class CM/CDM. They are both well worth it, for the most part home grown talent is serviceable but overrated.

Bottom I do not give a shit about polls, lets get fucking results on the pitch.

[Hamilton_Red]

Bradley for me was far from World Class last season. He had an element of a chicken without a head to his game. Trying to be a mythical "box to box" midfielder. He played like he wasn't being coached last year. So far this season he seems to have a clear water carrier DM brief and he has been playing the role a lot more effectively and we are looking a lot more solid. Btw the arrogant Cantonaesque dispersion of the DM role is poor form. It's the most under appreciated role in the game and likely the most valuable to team that want to win. I think we are set up for success finally - except in the striking department where we have no depth. Unless Jozy proves he can be fit week in and week out - we are entirely dependent on Giovinco.

[portu]

People who overrated the MLS homegrown talent, always think that DPs are overrated, unless they preform at amazing levels. It is bullshit, Altidore is as good as it gets for a CF in this league, and Bradley is a world class CM/CDM. They are both well worth it, for the most part home grown talent is serviceable but overrated.

Bottom I do not give a shit about polls, lets get fucking results on the pitch.

As good as it gets is Keane and Villa end of.

[vortexdr]

People who overrated the MLS homegrown talent, always think that DPs are overrated, unless they preform at amazing levels. It is bullshit, Altidore is as good as it gets for a CF in this league, and Bradley is a world class CM/CDM. They are both well worth it, for the most part home grown talent is serviceable but overrated.

Bottom I do not give a shit about polls, lets get fucking results on the pitch.

Don't think you know what World class is.....Toni Kroos is world class, Ozil is world class and Ruben Neves will turn world class. Bradley isn't even in the same universe.

Not really a surprise this....USMNT players are vastly overrated and overpaid in MLS. Is Bradley a bad footballer? No but please he is never worth a $5 million salary...Honestly having the word world class in the same sentence as Bradley a joke.