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  1. #1531
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yohan View Post
    it helps if you don't suck
    He could develop into a useful player, just needs some time.

    Could see him breaking into the 11 during the Canadian Championship or potentially when half of our midfield is away on national team duty.

    We've all heard that the coaches and front office is very high on Chapman... Can't say the same thing for Hamilton.

  2. #1532
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    I believe Jay Chapman can develop into something. There were a number of European teams interested in signing him out of college, for a reason, which was one of the reasons why MLS bent the Homegrown Player rules to allow us to sign him, so MLS didn't lose him.


    Toronto FC’s home grown claim on the Canadian was a little murky to say the least, but they were able to convince the league that it should hold up. There were growing concerns that if Chapman hadn’t been allowed to sign with the Reds as a Home Grown Player, he would test the waters in Europe instead, a chance that the league was not willing to take. The Daily Mail had reported in December that Sunderland was monitoring Chapman and a number of other clubs in Eruope were interested in his services.


    http://mlsmultiplex.com/2015/01/16/j...-grown-player/


    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...ears-move.html
    Last edited by rydermike; 12-20-2015 at 12:07 PM.

  3. #1533
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    In addition to TFC II, some of these players need to get some minutes in out on loan, most usefully in NASL. Not sure of the MLS World HQ's current view on that (loans to NASL), but seems like that would be the best venue short of going overseas.

  4. #1534
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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    LOL I played this in prep school in England in the 70s, before moving over here. 5 forwards. We actually played 3-2-5 most of the time as it was a very old and TRADITIONAL prep school.
    I did too! We payed the "W M" Forgotten how that worked exactly but it worked very well defensively.

    a quick google showed this:

    The Question: Did Herbert Chapman really invent the W-M formation? | Jonathan Wilson | Sport | The Guardian

    hope the link works!
    Last edited by MightyDM; 12-20-2015 at 02:14 PM.

  5. #1535
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    If you are really interested, check out inverting the pyramid by jonathan Wilson.

  6. #1536
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    O'Dea linked with MLS again, says he's spoken to a few teams.

    Assuming Kantari's buyout is a foregone conclusion,(surely?) what would people think about O'Dea taking Perquis' spot and using Perquis as an asset in a trade? Comparable contracts and contributions for the club but O'Dea is younger and less injury prone. Left-footed to boot and by all accounts genuinely loves the city. Comes on a free and I'll stress again, TFC could use a guy with trade value to possibly get a wide forward.

    I'd have no complaints, seems like good asset management to me.
    Last edited by Bobo; 12-20-2015 at 03:22 PM.

  7. #1537
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobo View Post
    O'Dea linked with MLS again, says he's spoken to a few teams.

    Assuming Kantari's buyout is a foregone conclusion,(surely?) what would people think about O'Dea taking Perquis' spot and using Perquis as an asset in a trade? Comparable contracts and contributions for the club but O'Dea is younger and less injury prone. Left-footed to boot and by all accounts genuinely loves the city. Comes on a free and I'll stress again, TFC could use a guy with trade value to possibly get a wide forward.

    I'd have no complaints, seems like good asset management to me.

    Perquis is not movable at all in MLS, he is on a high salary and poses to much of a risk because of that, you have no idea what he is going to give you this year not to mention he is going to miss games due to injury.

    If somehow Perquis was moved then yes O'Dea would be a great move.

  8. #1538
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    Oh, look, its the bi-annual "I'd really like to go back to MLS" report about O'Dea.

    I don't get this love for him. He was a step up from what we had but we've had better since. I wouldn't rate him above Kantari. He's a younger version of Orr. No thanks.

  9. #1539
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yohan View Post
    it helps if you don't suck

    Thats pretty harsh. Give up on a young guy after one season where he got limited chances?

  10. #1540
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    On another note, there is a rumour that Drogba might be going back to Chelsea as an assistant. Anybody we would like out of Montreal that would be a decent return on Moore?

  11. #1541
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    On another note, there is a rumour that Drogba might be going back to Chelsea as an assistant. Anybody we would like out of Montreal that would be a decent return on Moore?
    You think Montreal would be looking to replace Drogba with Luke Moore?

  12. #1542
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yohan View Post
    We got shredded on counter way too many times due to lack of speed in midfield, esp the reckless way the midfield pushed up and get caught. A stud DM might have prevented a lot of goals by using speed and covering up the mistake of others.

    A team without ton of speed can recover from losing possession, but that requires midfielders to play smarter soccer and team chemistry. RSL under Kreis was maybe average in speed in midfield, but they had great chemistry and understanding of each other's game to make up for a lot of lost possession in the midfield. Beckerman isn't exactly athletic DM, but he worked well with other box to box mids to create turnovers.
    But for TFC, since we lack team chemistry to work in tandem, we need a destroyer DM who can cover a lot of space to shield the back 4. Cheyrou isn't that guy.
    Esp if fullbacks will be only ones providing width, meaning the DM will have to do a lot of work to cover.

    If WJ and Bradley ends up being the 2 box to box mids, I see a lot of squirrels chasing a nut soccer in the mid. Those 2 play high press soccer to create turn overs and best as late arrivals in the box on attack. This still means TFC needs a CAM, or another playmaker because neither Bradley or Will Johnson are creative enough to be the offensive spark in the midfielder. Good passers yes. Not Javier Morales type of playmaker. Which means TFC relies on Giovinco to create everything again.

    I don't mind if Osorio becomes a sub because 1) you need depth and 2) there will be enough rotation going around and Oso will get enough mins. Come to think of it, TFC is spending way too much on starters and I'm concerned more about depth. And we still don't have a starting GK or a stud DM and cap space is dwindling fast.

    Picking up Beita and Moor are good starts. WJ IMO is a luxury signing at this point.
    well said , squirrel chasing the nut , brilliant ..also....Just think when Canada and the USA have to play , depth ? Also ,don't think we can survive with Bono or Roberts . I guess we're waiting for another brilliant move .
    ALL HELL'S BROKEN LOOSEhttp://gfycat.com/SharpKindArrowana

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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    Chapman doesn't suck though he's just a young player
    yes , he has some moves and when he had the chance took players on , we definitely should not let him go to waste . My fear with Vanney .
    ALL HELL'S BROKEN LOOSEhttp://gfycat.com/SharpKindArrowana

  14. #1544
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Oh, look, its the bi-annual "I'd really like to go back to MLS" report about O'Dea.

    I don't get this love for him. He was a step up from what we had but we've had better since. I wouldn't rate him above Kantari. He's a younger version of Orr. No thanks.
    Has'nt O'Dea been cut from most teams he has played for recently? He is playing to his skill level, which in India, means the NASL or lower. Please do not bring him back to TFC.
    Last edited by 69Chevy396; 12-20-2015 at 05:20 PM.

  15. #1545
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soccerpro View Post
    Thats pretty harsh. Give up on a young guy after one season where he got limited chances?
    Yeah I'm being a bit harsh when I say Chapman 'sucks' right now.

    Chapman has at least average level technical skills at MLS level. It's his footy brain that's lacking. I always put a big question mark whenever a creative midfielder gets drafted out of NCAA because most of them struggle to process the game at pro level. Very few NCAA trained attacking midfielders make it at MLS level.
    After Kyle Bekker disaster... well. *shrug*

    I think Chapman is at least another year away, esp if he's to play as AM of some sort at MLS. I wish Chapman had the youth soccer education Osorio has. Hopefully Chapman gets loaned to NASL team so that he can learn the game a bit more.
    “Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.

    I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’

    And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”

    -Eduardo Galeano

  16. #1546
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soccerpro View Post
    You think Montreal would be looking to replace Drogba with Luke Moore?
    I think Montreal would be desperate for a big name DP & a second decent backup.

  17. #1547
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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    Oh, look, its the bi-annual "I'd really like to go back to MLS" report about O'Dea.

    I don't get this love for him. He was a step up from what we had but we've had better since. I wouldn't rate him above Kantari. He's a younger version of Orr. No thanks.
    I'd go as far as saying that despite his flaws, O'Dea is a WAY safer option in the back compared to Kentari and I'd even say he's better than Perquis, not to mention the fact that he can aslo play at fullback and is younger.

    Keep in mind that O'Dea was sitting behind the worst midfield since Joseph Nane was getting minutes.

  18. #1548
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    Quote Originally Posted by 69Chevy396 View Post
    Has'nt O'Dea been cut from most teams he has played for recently? He is playing to his skill level, which in India, means the NASL or lower. Please do not bring him back to TFC.
    Released from Metallurh Donetsk along with most of the other foreign players due to the war. Released from Blackpool at end of short contract in the midst of a club management crisis. The ISL is a three month tournament league. After all that, TFC probably seems a beacon of stability in comparison, and the guy loves TO. Likely to be flexible about wages than he was back in 2013.
    Last edited by Detroit_TFC; 12-20-2015 at 06:41 PM.

  19. #1549
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    How can anyone assess chapman based on what they've seen so far? Gets an incomplete at best.

    I worry less about a midfielder getting a shot than a forward or a defender (usually - obviously every defender had a run out with us last year).

  20. #1550
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    O'Dea isn't worth anything more than 250k and even then his ceiling isn't as high as Damien's, also worth noting that Damien's floor is also lower
    Last edited by portu; 12-20-2015 at 07:06 PM.

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    O'Dear ----- Please no

  22. #1552
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedsYNWA View Post
    O'Dear ----- Please no
    Your right pal. Perquis and Kantari are class. If they weren't playing for us they'd probably be at real or bayern. We don't need any more central defenders.

  23. #1553
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    Quote Originally Posted by burlington Red View Post
    Your right pal. Perquis and Kantari are class. If they weren't playing for us they'd probably be at real or bayern. We don't need any more central defenders.
    Lets not talk about our record with that loser in our back line...NO Thanks Genius....... O'Dear is clearly wanted by Barca

  24. #1554
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    Quote Originally Posted by portu View Post
    O'Dea isn't worth anything more than 250k and even then his ceiling isn't as high as Damien's, also worth noting that Damien's floor is also lower
    Curious, what do you think Perquis is worth?375k for 2/3s of a season? Personally, I think O'Dea even at 320k is much better bang for the buck.

    Are there better CBs out there in world football? Obviously. Can Bez and Vanney spot them and sign them? Not likely. I don't think we're in a position to scoff at any MLS-level player who actually wants to play here.

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsYNWA View Post
    Lets not talk about our record with that loser in our back line...NO Thanks Genius....... O'Dear is clearly wanted by Barca
    This is a rather senseless argument. Look at that whole team, top to bottom.
    Last edited by Bobo; 12-20-2015 at 08:36 PM.

  25. #1555
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobo View Post
    Curious, what do you think Perquis is worth?375k for 2/3s of a season? Personally, I think O'Dea even at 320k is much better bang for the buck.

    Are there better CBs out there in world football? Obviously. Can Bez and Vanney spot them and sign them? Not likely. I don't think we're in a position to scoff at any MLS-level player who wants to play here.



    This is a rather senseless argument. Look at that whole team, top to bottom.

    we have seven 7 cb's and we just signed drew moor. there will be no more Cb's coming. let's move on.

  26. #1556
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    http://www.transfermarkt.com/darren-.../spieler/37430

    http://www.transfermarkt.com/schnell...39;dea&x=0&y=0

    Look at the numbers...... Mumbai City is just another name for Manchester City

  27. #1557
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    I apologize for getting emotional..however I hate the Toronto attitude of the good guy, hard working but lacks talent guy being venerated.
    We have a great team going forward for 2016.... just need a GK

    PEACE

  28. #1558
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    Well we certainly don't need any more Darren O'dea. I fail to see how he solves anything other than being more expensive and less effective than any other potential signing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    How can anyone assess chapman based on what they've seen so far? Gets an incomplete at best.

    I worry less about a midfielder getting a shot than a forward or a defender (usually - obviously every defender had a run out with us last year).
    You might not be able to make a complete assessment of a player based on 202 minutes, but it was obvious that he lacked certain things that he's unlikely to develop at this point. First thing that stuck out to me was a lack of positional awareness and lack of general field awareness. Not seeing the obvious play when on the ball and being in plain weird positions off the ball. Certain things are noticeable pretty immediately. For example, Bekker's inability to pressure off the ball was the first thing I noticed about him when he was playing for the Canadian U-23 team in the 2012 Olympic qualifier tournament. I figured it was a minor thing that he would improve, but it never did.

    Of course it's always possible that he can become a useful player if coached into a very defined role (ie cover this part of the pitch, try to make yourself available to this player, and get the ball to this other player), but I would bet against him being an above average player. He certainly hasn't shown anything that makes me super concerned that he won't get more playing time because we got Will Johnson.

  30. #1560
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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    Well we certainly don't need any more Darren O'dea. I fail to see how he solves anything other than being more expensive and less effective than any other potential signing.
    Because in all probability he'd be LESS expensive and MORE effective than an oft-injured Perquis will be, which has been my point all along.

    Perquis is a lower value CB whose experience would probably attract some interest on the trade market from teams willing to gamble. I just don't think TFC need to be the ones who gamble. In O'Dea's case we know what they'd get. Not greatness (probably a little less than Perquis on the top form we've yet to see) but competence and a little more durability. And some extra cap space which is never a bad thing.

    That's as much as I have to say on this topic.
    Last edited by Bobo; 12-20-2015 at 09:06 PM.

 

 

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