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  1. #121
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    This is why I hate parity. Small market teams with little interest in the community is given the same means to succeed as big powerhouse clubs with lots of followers. It's simply a dumb way to run any sport. Imagine the 100 meter if you handicapped the runners based on speed, so you'd end up with all 10 finishing pretty much at the same time. Wow, what drama. Anyone can win it! /Sarcasm.

    You don't get the big clubs with the best players that play the best football. You get average performances across the board. I know some people argue that it's much more fun because everyone can win it, but if that's the case then why are the vast majority of people still watching the big leagues? Because they provide the most drama. In comparison to the top leagues in Europe there is really very little drama here. Sure, you have surprise results, but who can really say one team beating another team in the MLS is really as much of a surprise compared to a mid-ranking team beating a top-ranking team in Europe - which does happen. Here club success is mainly about the competence of the manager. In Europe you add many other factors, such as fan support, financial support, etc.

    If football has genuinely arrived in North America then we should do away with the cap. If it hasn't, then we shouldn't. But then we can't really call ourselves a top 25 league in the world - if we're kept alive by these means. Healthy markets will support their clubs. And right now we're ballooning in size, adding teams every year. I'd rather have a 20 team league with 5-10 top clubs (the list of teams able to spend BIG money in this league is much bigger vs. Prem, Italy, Spain, etc. in percentage of their top leagues) than 40 teams (we're heading in that direction) where half the markets are shit and dragging down the other half.

    Fans who support parity keep us below the top 25 leagues in the world. Just think about it. Fans do have a say if we can all just come together, you know.

    Getting rid of parity would improve the game in the MLS like no other move could. We'd instantly become a top 10 league in the world.
    Last edited by Super; 11-11-2015 at 02:52 PM.

  2. #122
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    They need to make a balanced schedule if they want more parity. But with the travel can't see that happening.

  3. #123
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    MLS will always be a joke until the salary cap goes way up and they can sign players especially defenders that aren't total untalented scrubs. Seriously at times you watch better defending watching international woman's football and that is already atrocious.

    They would also have to up the amount of international spots as no one really wants to see a team made up of 50% north americans...
    Last edited by vortexdr; 11-11-2015 at 04:07 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vortexdr View Post
    MLS will always be a joke until the salary cap goes way up and they can sign players especially defenders that aren't total untalented scrubs. Seriously at times you watch better defending watching international woman's football and that is already atrocious.

    They would also have to up the amount of international spots as no one really wants to see a team made up of 50% north americans...
    Well you're wrong about that. Not only do I want to see NA players improve and play with the best but to lump Mexico in with NA as a comparable league standard is the joke.
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

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    Quote Originally Posted by vortexdr View Post
    MLS will always be a joke until the salary cap goes way up and they can sign players especially defenders that aren't total untalented scrubs. Seriously at times you watch better defending watching international woman's football and that is already atrocious.

    They would also have to up the amount of international spots as no one really wants to see a team made up of 50% north americans...
    You've got to be kidding!

    Granted, I don't want them playing in the league until they're ready but if you give a damn about Canada, you'd do better wanting to see a team of 50% North Americans. Canada made it to the 86 World Cup precisely because the Whitecaps, Manic and Blizzard were playing a lot of homegrown players ... at times more than 50%! They were required to play three but almost always played more .... and as Canadians were not imports in the USA, a lot were playing on US teams too!

    I dream of the day when TFC and the Impact are starting more than one Canadian per game and when the Whitecaps will play at least one Canadian in a big play-off match!

    B

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    Well you're wrong about that. Not only do I want to see NA players improve and play with the best but to lump Mexico in with NA as a comparable league standard is the joke.
    Very good point!

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    That's the high end of the scale... Those teams won't fold.
    Its the DC's and Dallas' of the league that have 10,000 attendance and don't generate much revenue.
    Cant see a team like DC, selling 2 dollar beers, being able to pay 7m for the roster alone (considering other costs of running a team in the MLS are about 6miliion per year - last I heard) and still survive.
    Actually, $30 million is the low end of the scale (the top end is $40 million). Revenue sharing evens out a lot of things between the teams.
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by vortexdr View Post
    MLS will always be a joke until the salary cap goes way up and they can sign players especially defenders that aren't total untalented scrubs. Seriously at times you watch better defending watching international woman's football and that is already atrocious.

    They would also have to up the amount of international spots as no one really wants to see a team made up of 50% north americans...
    I think most want to see a team made up of mostly NA players, especially Canadians. If not then what is the point in having a domestic league? you may as well just spend your money going to the ICC games if all you want to see is random euro players.

    More osorios/Morgans/Henry's etc and less Moore, kantari, jacksons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    I think most want to see a team made up of mostly NA players, especially Canadians. If not then what is the point in having a domestic league? you may as well just spend your money going to the ICC games if all you want to see is random euro players.

    More osorios/Morgans/Henry's etc and less Moore, kantari, jacksons.
    Was that a cricket reference?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    Was that a cricket reference?

    No it was a shameful "International Champions Cup" reference.... ill give myself a timeout for bringing up that sham of a competition.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    I think most want to see a team made up of mostly NA players, especially Canadians. If not then what is the point in having a domestic league? you may as well just spend your money going to the ICC games if all you want to see is random euro players.

    More osorios/Morgans/Henry's etc and less Moore, kantari, jacksons.
    Id agree with you that most want to see that.

    I however dont care if we have a team from Timbuktu as long as we win the leauge. Developing players for both the CMNT and USMNT isn't the job of the clubs its the jobs of the federations. Less emphasis on a players passport and more on there actual ability is what I want to see.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BuSaPuNk View Post
    Id agree with you that most want to see that.

    I however dont care if we have a team from Timbuktu as long as we win the leauge. Developing players for both the CMNT and USMNT isn't the job of the clubs its the jobs of the federations. Less emphasis on a players passport and more on there actual ability is what I want to see.
    Is it TFC's primary job to develop CMNT players? No its it TFC primary job to win the league. But being 1 of 5 professional teams in the country you do have some responsibility to develop local talent both for sustainability within a cap league as well as for the national federation.

    I don't want to see canadian players for the sake of them being canadian but i do want to see our club producing canadian players capable of earning and winning starting jobs both in MLS and abroad.

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    Its the pride of any team in any part of the world to have a local kid start or end his career there and, depending on the quality level of said team, having a career on one of best teams in the world in between.
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    Its the pride of any team in any part of the world to have a local kid start or end his career there and, depending on the quality level of said team, having a career on one of best teams in the world in between.
    Definitely true about DeRo. But that's about it. I'm all for developing Canadian talent, but they shouldn't be starting for TFC unless they've earned it based on skill level. I don't want us throwing away our chances at any success because we want to feed the national team. We should loan out players to NASL/USL unless they're good enough to start for TFC.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Super View Post
    Definitely true about DeRo. But that's about it. I'm all for developing Canadian talent, but they shouldn't be starting for TFC unless they've earned it based on skill level. I don't want us throwing away our chances at any success because we want to feed the national team. We should loan out players to NASL/USL unless they're good enough to start for TFC.
    agreed, make TFC2 75% canadian if you want to develop talent, but when they get to TFC they better be good enough on their own without quotas

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    True but its about the opportunity being given. Last season I will still maintain that Q would have been about the same as our other keepers if given a shot. Babouli, manella, chapman all wouldn't be step downs from what was occasionally trotted out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    True but its about the opportunity being given. Last season I will still maintain that Q would have been about the same as our other keepers if given a shot. Babouli, manella, chapman all wouldn't be step downs from what was occasionally trotted out.
    so what do you think it is thats holding them back, I mean MLS isnt exactly the old boys board room

    I maye agree with canadian quota only because MLS has their silly domestic rule

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    Quote Originally Posted by C.Ronaldo View Post
    so what do you think it is thats holding them back, I mean MLS isnt exactly the old boys board room

    I maye agree with canadian quota only because MLS has their silly domestic rule
    We were in a battle all year to make the playoffs and using older mls vets is safer. Also at the point in the year where we may have gotten them some time they were all away at PanAm's

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    Quote Originally Posted by Super View Post
    Definitely true about DeRo. But that's about it. I'm all for developing Canadian talent, but they shouldn't be starting for TFC unless they've earned it based on skill level. I don't want us throwing away our chances at any success because we want to feed the national team. We should loan out players to NASL/USL unless they're good enough to start for TFC.
    Starting a career is not starting for the team.

    I don't believe in quotas to re-enforce mediocrity but I believe most years we have serviceable Canadian talent that can get the opportunity to prove he's of the level we'd want to succeed. That's it. This is a club and there's a big world with plenty of different leveled talent. I agree that our USL team is a better place to be serious about starters.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    True but its about the opportunity being given. Last season I will still maintain that Q would have been about the same as our other keepers if given a shot. Babouli, manella, chapman all wouldn't be step downs from what was occasionally trotted out.
    Great examples.

    It will be an eternal question between "how much time do we give the kids" to "we need solid (foreign) established (but largely unknown) talent".

    Playing the hindsight game is no guarantee but as long as the club isn't entirely one away or another to the point of spiting themselves I'm ok with using both and every opportunity to find talent to improve.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    Great examples.

    It will be an eternal question between "how much time do we give the kids" to "we need solid (foreign) established (but largely unknown) talent".

    Playing the hindsight game is no guarantee but as long as the club isn't entirely one away or another to the point of spiting themselves I'm ok with using both and every opportunity to find talent to improve.
    Yep, how much worse could Thomas have been than Kantari? vs the benefit of him getting MLS time this past season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    Yep, how much worse could Thomas have been than Kantari? vs the benefit of him getting MLS time this past season.
    I like Thomas. He's not up there yet. Let's not rush the kids. Simonin is better, just keeps getting injured.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    Is it TFC's primary job to develop CMNT players? No its it TFC primary job to win the league. But being 1 of 5 professional teams in the country you do have some responsibility to develop local talent both for sustainability within a cap league as well as for the national federation.

    I don't want to see canadian players for the sake of them being canadian but i do want to see our club producing canadian players capable of earning and winning starting jobs both in MLS and abroad.
    Well said!

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    Something that I suspect Manning will be pondering (hat tip to an old friend who posted this elsewhere)

    http://www.soccermetrics.net/footbal...y-2015-edition
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by vortexdr View Post
    MLS will always be a joke until the salary cap goes way up and they can sign players especially defenders that aren't total untalented scrubs. Seriously at times you watch better defending watching international woman's football and that is already atrocious.
    Agreed that the cap needs to be raised substantially and the current DP and off-budget restrictions amended. Right now the cap is $3.49 million US but despite it being a somewhat grey line the league has drawn, it's still far too low to entice interest from top-quality players both home and abroad.

    They would also have to up the amount of international spots as no one really wants to see a team made up of 50% north americans...[/QUOTE]

    Disagree with that one. I'd say there are more fans than not who would love to see more domestic players in this league.
    Did the USA , of all countries, just fix soccer? - C. Ronaldo, May 27th commenting on the FBI-led investigations into fraud and corruption throughout FIFA.

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    Umm the Country would have to invest significant money into young player development. As this stage the vast majority of Canadian youth would dream of being a hockey star rather than football....

    Don't get me wrong if Canada would have the youth development of say Germany id also love to see more Canadians on a team. But until then the country simply isn't producing enough halfway decent players to warrant the hard on for so many domestic players.

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    Yep. Ala Germany in the late 1990s

    http://www2.tsn.ca/soccer/story/?id=422202

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    Quote Originally Posted by pdubs View Post
    Yep. Ala Germany in the late 1990s

    http://www2.tsn.ca/soccer/story/?id=422202
    From the article of 2 years ago.

    We cannot carbon copy the German development structure in Canada, for a multitude of reasons.
    And if you don't see any changes that have happened since then it would be a fun idea to compare a Canadian kids opportunities now vs then. The change is there but if some of you are waiting for German level change I suppose you'll know it when we get there. I, for one, will appreciate the steps in the way.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vortexdr View Post
    Umm the Country would have to invest significant money into young player development. As this stage the vast majority of Canadian youth would dream of being a hockey star rather than football....

    Don't get me wrong if Canada would have the youth development of say Germany id also love to see more Canadians on a team. But until then the country simply isn't producing enough halfway decent players to warrant the hard on for so many domestic players.
    Just the last 2 league rookies of the year but go ahead and save hard on talk for less shots at roster spots for Canadian talent coming up through the system...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    From the article of 2 years ago.



    And if you don't see any changes that have happened since then it would be a fun idea to compare a Canadian kids opportunities now vs then. The change is there but if some of you are waiting for German level change I suppose you'll know it when we get there. I, for one, will appreciate the steps in the way.
    I agree we cannot copy the Germans. Our whole system is a mess tho.

    More recent article by DeVos:
    http://www.tsn.ca/apathy-toward-cana...hange-1.189326

    "For decades, the CSA has taken a "hands off" approach to youth player development. There are many reasons for this, not least of which is our nationwide governance structure – an upside down mess that puts all of the power in the hands of the people at the bottom, rather than in the hands of those at the top. The byproduct of this governance structure is that is it virtually impossible for the CSA to mandate change – in large part because a significant portion of the CSA's operating budget comes from player registration dollars (which pass through the hands of the provinces on their way to the CSA).

    Because of this, the tail wags the dog when it comes to player development. The provinces, rather than the CSA, hold all the power. The provinces do what their districts want them to do; the districts do what their clubs want them to do; and the clubs do what their customers want them to do – which is rarely what is in the best interests of player development."


    Until the CSA can wrap both of its hands around grassroots soccer and completely overhaul our player development system – and that incorporates a wide range of topics, from coach education to training curriculum to competition structures - nothing will change. We will continue to struggle at the international level, we will continue to produce a fraction of the players that a nation with our resources should produce, and we will continue to hang our heads in shame when we tell people we are involved in soccer in Canada."
    Last edited by pdubs; 11-18-2015 at 03:19 PM.

 

 

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