User Tag List

Page 6 of 10 FirstFirst ... 2345678910 LastLast
Results 151 to 180 of 285
  1. #151
    RPB Member Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Centre of My Bloody Universe.
    Posts
    17,073
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    And I agree it can be improved upon by a large margin but to disregard changes made or worse still, disregarding the entire program until its equal to Germany or hockey in this country isn't taking much of an interest at all. Comparisons without the context you give above come off as naive.
    WCQ Canada vs Honduras Fri., Sep. 2nd
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

  2. #152
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Niagara
    Posts
    1,539
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Doesn't have to be equal. Needs to be an example which we can build upon. I am just highly dubious of this current CSA governing body.

    I am not being naive. Just do not want to get into massive dialog about our wonderful CSA governing body. Off topic anyway.

    For anyone interested (most of you have probably read it) this is the CSA plan.
    http://www.canadasoccer.com/files/Ca...14_2018_EN.pdf

    Call me naive but comparing ourselves to Germany or Belgium (1/3 of our population) has merits. Have we and are we doing enough? Do we have the will? It is out of our hands anyway, the 2014-2018 "Leading a Soccer Nation" is underway... peace.

  3. #153
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Scarborough
    Posts
    2,809
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I think a better comparison would be Sweeden or Russia, look at how many hockey players they have produced but also have an excellent football program all things considered.

  4. #154
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    F5
    Posts
    8,971
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Call me crazy, but screw fixing the entire country's soccer structure. You'll be fighting a million needless battles and the association doesn't have the resources to take everyone on and win.

    The GTA and surrounding area has enough population base to provide an entire national team of high quality players IF it was run properly. Just focus on fixing that - the others will feel pressure to follow when they realize they are falling behind.

  5. #155
    RPB Member Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Centre of My Bloody Universe.
    Posts
    17,073
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    And I agree it can be improved upon by a large margin but to disregard changes made or worse still, disregarding the entire program until its equal to Germany or hockey in this country isn't taking much of an interest at all. Comparisons without the context you give above come off as naive.
    Quote Originally Posted by pdubs View Post
    Doesn't have to be equal. Needs to be an example which we can build upon. I am just highly dubious of this current CSA governing body.

    I am not being naive. Just do not want to get into massive dialog about our wonderful CSA governing body. Off topic anyway.

    For anyone interested (most of you have probably read it) this is the CSA plan.
    http://www.canadasoccer.com/files/Ca...14_2018_EN.pdf

    Call me naive but comparing ourselves to Germany or Belgium (1/3 of our population) has merits. Have we and are we doing enough? Do we have the will? It is out of our hands anyway, the 2014-2018 "Leading a Soccer Nation" is underway... peace.
    Read the bolded.

    I'm agreeing that a model is useful. I am crediting you for providing context. I am not calling you naive. We could always do more. It's not in our hands alone but more attention on it helps those move towards accountability.

    Thank you for your input.

    Please consider that while Germany in the comparison provided was incredibly successful I'm sure there are examples you could provide where a German player was on the bubble to make the squad or start and was chosen over another of equal quality.

    I think people use this preference as a crutch to claim that its blind patriotism when it should always be a measured decision on a player by player basis.

    The weakness in the comparison of our country to Germany is the yawning gap of average level between the two. We should be aiming for Canadians to get shots at the first team (but never in spite of better value) while elsewhere they look at how many start on the pitch.

    Just some perspective.
    WCQ Canada vs Honduras Fri., Sep. 2nd
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

  6. #156
    RPB Member Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Centre of My Bloody Universe.
    Posts
    17,073
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    Call me crazy, but screw fixing the entire country's soccer structure. You'll be fighting a million needless battles and the association doesn't have the resources to take everyone on and win.

    The GTA and surrounding area has enough population base to provide an entire national team of high quality players IF it was run properly. Just focus on fixing that - the others will feel pressure to follow when they realize they are falling behind.
    You're absolutely right. Toronto FC is in the business of winning. It's not their priority to drag the Country's talent to a better level but it should be a symptom or reaction of them making Toronto home. Them making their Academy as strong as possible and providing a route to the first team now through the toonies will help Canadians achieve but more likely kids more local.

    We got to this derail from an attitude that it doesn't matter who we field on the team or where they are from. It's a credo that bears with it ignorance of the fact we have a priority to look locally and use the talent around us. Without that caveat that we get scooped by other teams in the league and the country.
    Last edited by Fort York Redcoat; 11-19-2015 at 08:33 AM.
    WCQ Canada vs Honduras Fri., Sep. 2nd
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

  7. #157
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    F5
    Posts
    8,971
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    ^ One of the major lessons from the old NASL was people needed more local players to relate to the team.

    Without a strong local pipeline the growth of the game in North America has a ceiling.

  8. #158
    RPB Member Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    On the Interwebs
    Posts
    14,362
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    ^ One of the major lessons from the old NASL was people needed more local players to relate to the team.

    Without a strong local pipeline the growth of the game in North America has a ceiling.
    That's true. While we like to see great players, it's meant something to have Ashtone Morgan on the team.
    Supporting the worst team in the world since 2007.







  9. #159
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,344
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    MLS needs local talent and here is why.

    MLS needs to produce local talent to grow its consumer base, when a national team does well (USMNT for example) it grows demand for the domestic soccer consumption.

    The biggest thing TFC could ever do to grow the interest in the team is produce local talent that takes our national team to the next level. I have no doubt that if a CMNT made the world cup with a prime age osorio starting or contributing that TFC could sell 40,000 tickets a game.

  10. #160
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Niagara
    Posts
    1,539
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    Read the bolded.

    I'm agreeing that a model is useful. I am crediting you for providing context. I am not calling you naive. We could always do more. It's not in our hands alone but more attention on it helps those move towards accountability.

    Thank you for your input.

    Please consider that while Germany in the comparison provided was incredibly successful I'm sure there are examples you could provide where a German player was on the bubble to make the squad or start and was chosen over another of equal quality.

    I think people use this preference as a crutch to claim that its blind patriotism when it should always be a measured decision on a player by player basis.

    The weakness in the comparison of our country to Germany is the yawning gap of average level between the two. We should be aiming for Canadians to get shots at the first team (but never in spite of better value) while elsewhere they look at how many start on the pitch.

    Just some perspective.
    Ah sorry misread what you were saying!

  11. #161
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    116
    Posts
    811
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    MLS needs local talent and here is why.

    MLS needs to produce local talent to grow its consumer base, when a national team does well (USMNT for example) it grows demand for the domestic soccer consumption.

    The biggest thing TFC could ever do to grow the interest in the team is produce local talent that takes our national team to the next level. I have no doubt that if a CMNT made the world cup with a prime age osorio starting or contributing that TFC could sell 40,000 tickets a game.
    Respectfully disagree.

    I think only the hardcore supporters (10,000ish) care about local talent. The rest of the herd to fill the other 30,000 seats only care about supporting a winning team. That's the Toronto fan base. Fill the entire team with SA no-names that win the league and the fans will come.

  12. #162
    RPB Member Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    On the Interwebs
    Posts
    14,362
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KGH View Post
    Respectfully disagree.

    I think only the hardcore supporters (10,000ish) care about local talent. The rest of the herd to fill the other 30,000 seats only care about supporting a winning team. That's the Toronto fan base. Fill the entire team with SA no-names that win the league and the fans will come.
    Take away the 10,000 and there is no atmosphere. That actually matters as well to the average ticket buyer, so much so that they successfully sold a losing team for 3 years based on that.
    Supporting the worst team in the world since 2007.







  13. #163
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,344
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KGH View Post
    Respectfully disagree.

    I think only the hardcore supporters (10,000ish) care about local talent. The rest of the herd to fill the other 30,000 seats only care about supporting a winning team. That's the Toronto fan base. Fill the entire team with SA no-names that win the league and the fans will come.
    Winning would fill the stadium but it would not even come close to maximizing the demand for the sport. Winning brings in the people who currently are on the fence about the team or sport but it does not create a market.

    A winning team is like putting a soda on sale, you will have more people buying your product and you may in fact actually convert some people into loyal customers if your sale is good enough or long enough. But during the process but you are not expanding your market base you are only selling more to people that already acknowledged your product.

    To actually expand your market you need to get new eyes on what you are selling and have them become interested, this is where a national team doing well comes in. We all know people who only watch soccer every 4 years and for 2 or 3 weeks they are captivated by the game, now if some of those players play for the local team they could become tempted to start following that local team.

    What you are saying is correct, winning will fill 30,000 seats but IMO what the people at the top of this organization need to worry about isn't filling the 30,000 seats but building a larger market for their product moving forward.

  14. #164
    RPB Member Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Centre of My Bloody Universe.
    Posts
    17,073
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pint View Post
    MLS needs local talent and here is why.

    MLS needs to produce local talent to grow its consumer base, when a national team does well (USMNT for example) it grows demand for the domestic soccer consumption.

    The biggest thing TFC could ever do to grow the interest in the team is produce local talent that takes our national team to the next level. I have no doubt that if a CMNT made the world cup with a prime age osorio starting or contributing that TFC could sell 40,000 tickets a game.
    I agree that it would be the biggest thing for the game in Canada from a Toronto POV but for interest in the team...

    Quote Originally Posted by KGH View Post
    Respectfully disagree.

    I think only the hardcore supporters (10,000ish) care about local talent. The rest of the herd to fill the other 30,000 seats only care about supporting a winning team. That's the Toronto fan base. Fill the entire team with SA no-names that win the league and the fans will come.

    ...I think its worse than that when it comes to showing up for winners in Toronto.

    The Golden Boot winner is here. Where were the bandwagoners? I mean the true sellout peeps throw around when they talk like this? Winning it all with no names wouldn't sellout till playoffs. Sure I don't have an example to reference yet but we sure as hell haven't seen true sellouts yet.

    Toronto needs winning AND names to sellout.
    WCQ Canada vs Honduras Fri., Sep. 2nd
    FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER

  15. #165
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    F5
    Posts
    8,971
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KGH View Post
    Respectfully disagree.

    I think only the hardcore supporters (10,000ish) care about local talent. The rest of the herd to fill the other 30,000 seats only care about supporting a winning team. That's the Toronto fan base. Fill the entire team with SA no-names that win the league and the fans will come.
    From what I understand that's actually not true. A lot of what gets casual fans off the fence is a local connection - or at least that's the popular belief.

  16. #166
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    F5
    Posts
    8,971
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Fort York Redcoat View Post
    I agree that it would be the biggest thing for the game in Canada from a Toronto POV but for interest in the team...




    ...I think its worse than that when it comes to showing up for winners in Toronto.

    The Golden Boot winner is here. Where were the bandwagoners? I mean the true sellout peeps throw around when they talk like this? Winning it all with no names wouldn't sellout till playoffs. Sure I don't have an example to reference yet but we sure as hell haven't seen true sellouts yet.

    Toronto needs winning AND names to sellout.
    Should acknowledge the damage the poor management of the past has done. If they had capitalized on the initial momentum the market would look a lot better than it has today.

    They need to work hard to build up a lot of that lost goodwill with the fan base.

  17. #167
    Registered
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    11,242
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Bumping this thread to speculate on something interesting Kurt Larson said in the Vanney thread.

    Per Larson yesterday: There's something being overlooked, however. Something that could be putting pressure on president Bill Manning. I'll have more on this during the summer, potentially.

    My guess: TFC are bleeding dough and MLSE can't possibly want to subsidize this much longer. Manning wasn't hired to execute the Leiweke vision, he was hired to bring his own vision. There has been no bump in TV ratings and attendance is stabilized. TFC payroll is $20M+ while very successful teams are competing effectively with $4-5M payrolls. Manning owns the problem of how to get payroll back into the stratosphere. Selling Seba this summer, if he can be sold, seems obvious, to me. Maybe Bradley and Altidore too (they make no sense from a marketing POV here)

    Also don't forget that Kreis is still out there. He wasn't the guy to carry out the year two of the Leiweke plan, but he sure as heck could be the guy to rebuild on a normalized budget.


    Last edited by ensco; 04-26-2016 at 07:14 PM.
    “We can easily forgive the child who is afraid of the dark - the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light” - Plato

  18. #168
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Stoney Creek
    Posts
    2,753
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    Bumping this thread to speculate on something interesting Kurt Larson said in the Vanney thread.

    Per Larson yesterday: There's something being overlooked, however. Something that could be putting pressure on president Bill Manning. I'll have more on this during the summer, potentially.

    My guess: TFC are bleeding dough and MLSE can't possibly want to subsidize this much longer. Manning wasn't hired to execute the Leiweke vision, he was hired to bring his own vision. There has been no bump in TV ratings and attendance is stabilized. TFC payroll is $20M+ while very successful teams are competing effectively with $4-5M payrolls. Manning owns the problem of how to get payroll back into the stratosphere. Selling Seba this summer, if he can be sold, seems obvious, to me. Maybe Bradley and Altidore too (they make no sense from a marketing POV here)

    Also don't forget that Kreis is still out there. He wasn't the guy to carry out the year two of the Leiweke plan, but he sure as heck could be the guy to rebuild on a normalized budget.

    I can agree on Bradley and Altidore; Seba, no way.

  19. #169
    Registered
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    11,242
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I can agree on Bradley and Altidore; Seba, no way.
    Not sure they can be moved. We all know Seba can.
    “We can easily forgive the child who is afraid of the dark - the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light” - Plato

  20. #170
    RPB Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Gone
    Posts
    1,949
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Theyll sell him after this season. No way they sell this summer

  21. #171
    RPB Member Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Kitchener
    Posts
    16,182
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Financial suicide to sell giovinco. How is tfc going to fill 30k stadium without giovinco?

    "
    Hell is always loose here. It can't break loose again
    ."
    -Fort York Redcoat, on the state of TFC

  22. #172
    Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Edmonton
    Posts
    9,511
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    From what I understand that's actually not true. A lot of what gets casual fans off the fence is a local connection - or at least that's the popular belief.
    I believe it's a naive and out-of-date perspective.

  23. #173
    RPB Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    7,068
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    The club needs to admit it's taken half measures up until recently.

    The shitty tin stadium, plastic pitch for 6(?) seasons, revolving door of D and F grade coaches, Tom Anselmi, not having a solid TV deal in place thus making it impossible to follow the team, putting literally any Canadian on the pitch in an effort to stoke patriotism, their silly seat relocation process, fucking around DeRo for the sake of a few hundred grand because they bought the farm with De Guzman, drafting like shit then trading away any decent young commodities for short term gain, doubling season ticket prices in the the first 5 seasons despite the product getting worse relative to the rest of the league and most recently sharing with the Argo's.

    Take your lumps and stop trying to find short cuts, MLSE.
    “In an age of instant gratification, Leeds United is having a long, drawn-out affair with plenty of foreplay and slow arousal...We may have had two disappointing results, but we will get there”

  24. #174
    RPB Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Northwest Territories (Section 226)
    Posts
    4,915
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Well, if what they really want to do is completely nuke the franchise, they'll sell Giovinco.

  25. #175
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    401
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    If they sell Giovinco they may as well quit the soccer business. I doubt they're that stupid.

  26. #176
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,344
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    What you are speculating is 100% nonsense, not my opinion but fact. TFC for better or worse will always be on the higher end of DP spending.

    Move on to next speculation.

  27. #177
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    453
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    ...Selling Seba this summer, if he can be sold, seems obvious, to me.
    Selling Seba effectively ends the franchise - MLSE has spent a fortune on players and the stadium. To trade the player who has been in on every last goal this season? They would have to be beyond fuckin nuts. 99% of the time you speak complete reason ensco - this idea tho, is just fantasy. Even Mo, Cochrane, Anselmi or Mariner could not be that stupid... have you been smokin the wacky tabaccy again?

  28. #178
    RPB Member Moderator
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    On the Interwebs
    Posts
    14,362
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I don't see them selling Giovinco.
    Supporting the worst team in the world since 2007.







  29. #179
    RPB Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    683
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    This isn't a question of selling Giovinco. MLSE would sooner move Jozy or Michael, full stop.

    Bottom line: this club needs big gates and big results this year.

    Three straight years we've had the highest payroll in MLS. If we don't win this year, time to rebuild.

    But on the bright side, this is our bloody year!!!
    Things overheard in the South End of BMO Field: "Look men, there is General Bradley standing like a stonewall."

  30. #180
    Registered
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    11,242
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tiberius View Post
    Selling Seba effectively ends the franchise - MLSE has spent a fortune on players and the stadium. To trade the player who has been in on every last goal this season? They would have to be beyond fuckin nuts. 99% of the time you speak complete reason ensco - this idea tho, is just fantasy. Even Mo, Cochrane, Anselmi or Mariner could not be that stupid... have you been smokin the wacky tabaccy again?
    Thanks for your kind words, 99%, wow, you need to talk to my wife!

    If the suits want TFC to stop bleeding money, what would you do?

    I bet someone talks about NYRB and Dallas at every board meeting.
    Last edited by ensco; 04-26-2016 at 09:34 PM.
    “We can easily forgive the child who is afraid of the dark - the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light” - Plato

 

 

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •