Given how many ways teams find around cap issues it isn't completely surprising that the player and the agent - who really know nothing about the intricacies of the cap or the league - accepted the handshake deal. Don't side deals go on in every industry with big contracts and weird rules?Originally Posted by ensco
One of my kids was put on that waiting list 11 years ago and even then we were told it would be at least a 6 month wait in Ottawa. We were extremely fortunate that the Province threw money at the backlog to make it go away and we were able to join an Intensive Behavioral Intervention (IBI) therapy program on a part-time basis. Combined with part-time preschool to learn social interaction, the improvement was like night and day between the start and finish of the program. There is no way we could afford to do it on our family's salary, so I could understand why Ciman would jump at the chance to get in the program, especially as the clock is ticking on any child with ASD - the earlier the treatment, the better the chance of a good result.
Is a deal for an amount that is close to 10% of the cap a side deal?
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
add to the fact that its your kids....I would swim across the lake, no questions asked, if you told me it would help out me kid
Moderator
Regardless of the details, this news certainly makes Saputo and the Impact organization look pretty fucking awful. And perhaps that's the most important point to consider - the perception by the fans and other players in the league. Especially when you see how his move to Montreal and the struggles of his family was covered by the league:
Family First: Montreal Impact's Laurent Ciman uproots life to give autistic daughter the care she needs
Did the USA , of all countries, just fix soccer? - C. Ronaldo, May 27th commenting on the FBI-led investigations into fraud and corruption throughout FIFA.
Send the MLSE private jet over!
We have an 11 year old son who was diagnosed with autism when he was 3. Our son was also was put on a waiting list for a couple of months to receive IBI. Our son went through the same with part time therapy coupled with regular school when he turned 5. It's a very devastating disorder for any family to deal with. That's why I have a great amount of sympathy for the Ciman family, however they must take some responsibility themselves. Ciman could have had that put in to his contract, isn't that what agents are for? I'm not willing to crucify Saputo or the Impact for that reason alone.
I don't know where they get this 3500 dollars a week figure for therapy from either. We were told when our son was waiting for IBI and other therapies that we could pay for it ourselves but if I remember correctly it was about 700 dollars a week for a person trained in IBI to come to our home to give IBI therapy. They charge about 20 -25 bucks an hour and it's typically a 30 - 35 hour week. The only way I could see it being anywhere near 3500 a week is if it's for a live in care giver trained in IBI and even then that doesn't really add up.
Does MLS or their teams provide health care for player's and their families? I know especially in the US healthcare can be outrageously high.
I would have to think that MLSE employees including players should be part of their health and dental coverage package. That would probably pay for this.
Question is are TFC players considered MLSE employees or are they MLS employees basically being rented by TFC/MLSE?
If it's the latter then I can see no health coverage because the cheapos who call the shots on money in this league want to nickel and dime everything.
I wouldn't be surprised if the reason it's not in the contract is precisely because the L'impact were trying to pull a fast one on the salary cap. Then sometime down the line there's a disagreement about how much the club was on the hook for "helping out" considering the facility Ciman quoted is charging 4-5x what habstfc's family paid.
It's not just IBI therapy for Ciman's daughter. It's a specialized private school that's supposed to be among the best in the world in both treating & educating severely autistic kids. That's why he came to Montreal specifically.
I am so sorry you had to go through that.
Most of my work is around mental health, which in itself is a horrible system, but I was appalled when I had to venture into the Developmental sector for clients with both mental health concerns and developmental issues. It was complex and frustrating for me as a social worker, let alone for family. It often takes months just to get the initial screening done by a psychologist before you get put on to a one year wait list just for another assessment to be done to determine eligibility in funding.
And then there is the issue of individuals that have fallen through the gap. I have clients that never received the support growing up, other than the determination and persistence from family, but now that the family learned of the potential for funding, the client is found ineligible as they are over 18 because psychologists cannot diagnose developmental issues with certainty. Then, these individuals are passed on to a mental health system that is ill prepared for behavioural challenges. I see these clients shuffled from shelter to shelter, program to program.
If it is, then what do you call Gerrard getting a $20,000 per week home leased for him as part of his deal with LAG? That works out to just under 30% of the cap...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3019969/Steven-Gerrard-wife-Alex-set-live-16-8m-Malibu-home-outgoing-Liverpool-captain-prepares-life-LA-Galaxy.html
^^^^
The league is a joke, I'm sure MLS is in some way breaking laws with how they're running their competition except MLS is small time so no one cares to investigate.
I watch less MLS than I used to 5 years ago, for a lot of obvious reasons. This stuff ranks high on that list.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Im a CYC at a hospital and often they are brought into us for respite, unfortunately very few people, outside of myself and a few others (often from agencies) are trained to be able to work with them. My heart breaks for the kids and the families of their kids as this is a vicious circle that isnt being dealt with. Stay up parents, hope at some point you and your children can get the help you need.
Gerrard is a DP so it's a bit different as they are already free to pay him as much as they want over and above the cap hit. Defoe had similar perks here - free flights to and from England for him and his family for instance.
For non-DPs though it's a different situation.
Fair point about the DP salary, but then at least include it when they report salary numbers then...
I read the article (in French based on my basic abilities) and understood most of it minus some details. I don't usually trust google translate but maybe someone can explain a detail for me. Was he promised private care or access to Quebec public care? I felt they were referencing public care but I was not sure. By the sounds of it, he's taking his daughter to private care based on the understanding that he was promised that. But it sounds like the Impact's claim is that they would direct him to whatever the resources are in the province.
One thing I have realized about Quebec is that it's a two tiered system in terms of health care. If you think Ontario is bad, come move to Quebec and you'll be begging for OHIP.
Due to the public system being so inefficient, the government of Quebec was sued because someone didn't have and alternative options to waiting for years to get served for surgery (I believe the case was a hip surgery). So instead of the government fixing the public system, they instead opened the system so that doctors could open private or semi private practices. Every citizen can get free health care, if they're willing to go the long wait route (by going to a government run walk-in clinic or a hospital). If you're lucky enough to have a doctor, they may be at a semi-private clinic where you won't be charged for a visit, but you will be if you ever decide to do blood work, or any basic tests normally covered by public insurance. In which case you would then have to go to a hospital on a different day and get those done (months later depending on the tests. And I mean basic ones you could get done within a week in Ontario).
So based on this, I wonder if there is more to the story about if the team tried forcing him the public route- which I am certain would have been a long wait list. And since he cares about his daughter so much, the family opted for private care that costs an arm and a leg and now feel cheated about the costs.
I really hope he didn't come for Quebec's public health care system- it's the worst in the country. Or that he was sold on a great system by the team. I am just speculating of course.
That makes more sense. I actually thought of that after posting that it must be some private school specializing in autism. That's a huge amount of money to pay. My question though is at what point has this become an issue, Ciman's been here since February so who's been paying since his daughter started at this school?
Brain cramp on my part. Thanks.
I still remember Nesta supposedly making $125K or whatever. There is a problem, and Montreal is in the middle of it.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Wasn't the rumor Saputo bought Nesta a house in Miami?
According to the latest salary postings by the union Ciman is due 401K this year.
I'm not saying what is happening is right, but I don't have the same amount of sympathy for someone who is in the 2% bracket of wages earned.
Last edited by Richard; 07-17-2015 at 10:53 AM.
No one is any more or less human than anyone else, he makes what he makes because he deserves it. in fact he could probably make more in Europe. He is sacrificing income to be in Canada
Just to clarify I sympathize with his situation and I can imagine its not easy for him and his family regardless how much he makes, and only that he is very fortunate and has the means to pay for it out of his own pocket.
Last edited by Richard; 07-17-2015 at 11:19 AM.
As someone else commented, while Ciman's circumstances are significantly less challenging than some of the families I work with (in terms of services they can access), I can still empathize at how challenging it is to support a child with developmental issues. Perhaps the issue wasn't money. I wonder if Saputo promised that he had contacts to get Ciman's kid into that school and bypass waitlist, but did not follow through?
Soumare already traded --- For Kyle Bekker from Dallas
Good move by Montreal to get rid of that contract. Bekker will probably be there about as long as Rey was with Columbus last year.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Soumare isn't highly touted to start in Dallas, despite starting 19 of 24 in Montreal, then asking for more time, then saying players don't want to be there.
https://translate.google.ca/translat...-text=&act=url
I bet you're pretty close on this one; there's probably some typical sleazy contract clause in their deals that says they can be released if they don't cut some new services deal with their new team or something. Or that the team can buy out a deal without a cap hit if it's with 30 days of a trade, or some other MLS bullshit.
According to the new CBA, Bekker's contract is guaranteed as he's 24, had a year of service and was on a roster at the beginning of the season.
Bekker's guaranteed salary is only $87K and he's not exactly homesick wanting to go back to Spain like Rey was.
I think he is essentially calling out Oyongo/Impact without naming names. He didn't say players don't want to be there in a general sense, he said the impact this year was forcing players that didn't want to be there to stay.
I could imagine he was not happy at the fact that Oyongo is now starting after refusing to report to camp earlier in the year.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote