Whitecaps to set up ontario academy just outside TFC 50mile limit

[Qman]

The whitecaps are setting up an academy in London.



CSN has confirmed that the Vancouver Whitecaps have partnered with the North London Soccer Club to set-up a satellite academy in that Ontario city. The announcement of the partnership is expected in July.
According to an e-mail sent to members of the London soccer community, the club will be called the London Youth Whitecaps and it will be “the sole club within the district with the ability to enter teams in Regional and Inter-District Leagues for the (2016) U14 and below age divisions.”

The e-mail, which was by London area coach Geoff Painter. In it, he explains the decision: “Our view is that it is advantageous for our players and teams if they have other high level teams from within the same Club above and below them in age division to allow for call ups and also to provide a unified administration. Consequently, we will be initiating the necessary process to transfer the TPS rights for our current OYSL and WOYSL teams to London Youth Whitecaps.”

It’s important to note that the club will not be participating in the Ontario Premier Development League, the Ontario Soccer Accociation’s preferred system for elite development. Additionally, CSN has been told that efforts to start an OPDL team in London are actively being resisted by the district. A source said that the district went so far as to write a letter of non-support for the OPDL application.

The OPDL approval process is confidential so there is no way of knowing if the alleged letter has negatively affected the application. Regardless, even if the OPDL application is successful the two clubs will be in direct competition for talent, with the London Youth Whitecaps operating in the YSL system, which does not have the same level of LTPD standards required (which is different from saying the Whitecaps won’t employ those standards – CSN reached out to the Caps to comment).

Of note, Painter has a contentious past with the CSA and OSA. In 2009 he was suspended by the OSA for six months for, in the OSA’s opinion, “actions detrimental to the game.” The charge relates to him allowing his team to play a game at the national championships with nine players during the second half of that game. His team had already clinched advancement and Painter later claimed that he had no choice but to play with nine players due to fatigue and injury. He said the charge was without cause.

The London Free press reported on it at the time. You can read that article here.

Beyond the youth development implications, the move by the Whitecaps is a brazen one. They are moving into the doorstep of TFC’s restricted academy area. It’s important to note that TFC would be unable to do a similar thing. The Whitecaps have exclusive rights to everywhere in Canada west of the Ontario/Manitoba border, whereas TFC only has exclusive rights to a 50 mile radius from its training facility in Downsview Park.

[molenshtain]

Beyond the youth development implications, the move by the Whitecaps is a brazen one. They are moving into the doorstep of TFC’s restricted academy area. It’s important to note that TFC would be unable to do a similar thing. The Whitecaps have exclusive rights to everywhere in Canada west of the Ontario/Manitoba border, whereas TFC only has exclusive rights to a 50 mile radius from its training facility in Downsview Park.

how in holy fucking hell is this possible?

[TFC07]

I see Whitecaps are desperate for talent that they need to come to TFC land (Southern Ontario) to recruit players now.

[molenshtain]

I see Whitecaps are desperate for talent that they need to come to TFC land (Southern Ontario) to recruit players now.

they already did that with Teibert and Alderson.

I refuse to lose more local talent to those fucking lumberjack west coast fucks.

[TFC07]

they already did that with Teibert and Alderson.

I refuse to lose more local talent to those fucking lumberjack west coast fucks.

Blame MLS for creating this academy rights area crap so they can balance it out to make it fair for small market teams to field competitive academy teams.

This is why Whitecaps can come to Ontario and steal players but TFC can't since they live in market (GTA) that is rich with talented soccer players.

If you look at number of kids playing soccer outside of Ontario, you will be shocked how small that number is.

[SirBobSaget]

TFC has done a pathetic job with the talent at their disposal. In the 50 mile radius protected zone they are drawing from almost 8 million 1st world citizens, no other club in the world has this. Look at what Sigma FC has generated recently; Larin, Bekker, Welshman.

[molenshtain]

Getting a guy like Uccello goes a long way to showing we're capable of poaching and continuing the development of the best the GTA has to offer. We're getting better at it.

[mistercorporate]

Since the rest of Ontario is apparently a neutral zone, TFC should setup an academy in London right down the street from the Shitecaps, and blow them out of the water. Show them whose boss of the East! Heck, show them whose boss of this country! :P That sort of disrespect is not tolerated by any proud institution...

[ag futbol]

TFC has done a pathetic job with the talent at their disposal. In the 50 mile radius protected zone they are drawing from almost 8 million 1st world citizens, no other club in the world has this. Look at what Sigma FC has generated recently; Larin, Bekker, Welshman.

Agreed - we could be pushing it a lot harder in terms of mining local talent. They should be setting up similar things to what the caps have here, but inside the GTA.

There are just too many players to have one TFC setup academy in this city.

[spark]

TFC has done a pathetic job with the talent at their disposal. In the 50 mile radius protected zone they are drawing from almost 8 million 1st world citizens, no other club in the world has this. Look at what Sigma FC has generated recently; Larin, Bekker, Welshman.

Yeah I would say instead of getting bent out of shape realize this ^ - As well, TFC have had eight years to establish themselves in this province at the grassroots level and have done a horrible job. This is TFC reaping what they've sowed (or not I guess would be more accurate). If this club knew what was what in terms of building for the future, this wouldn't have happened because they would have had a relationship established. And to add insult - SirBob mentions Sigma, an academy who is 15 mins from BMO and they have stronger ties with Seattle, RSL and SKC.

[PopePouri]

TFC has done a pathetic job with the talent at their disposal. In the 50 mile radius protected zone they are drawing from almost 8 million 1st world citizens, no other club in the world has this. Look at what Sigma FC has generated recently; Larin, Bekker, Welshman.

Aligning with Vancouver is even worse. They've had 5 years and only now they are producing decent talent for the first team. And Teibert is not one of them.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

Yeah I would say instead of getting bent out of shape realize this ^ - As well, TFC have had eight years to establish themselves in this province at the grassroots level and have done a horrible job. This is TFC reaping what they've sowed (or not I guess would be more accurate). If this club knew what was what in terms of building for the future, this wouldn't have happened because they would have had a relationship established. And to add insult - SirBob mentions Sigma, an academy who is 15 mins from BMO and they have stronger ties with Seattle, RSL and SKC.

Hate to say it but this is very true, that being said i dont think its fair that TFC has such a limited area at its disposal or that the white caps can march into our province and grab ontario players. Should be an equal playing field for all

[spe18]

http://www.wakingthered.com/2013/5/1...and-exceptions

[Richard]

Hate to say it but this is very true, that being said i dont think its fair that TFC has such a limited area at its disposal or that the white caps can march into our province and grab ontario players. Should be an equal playing field for all

Its not limited when you've got a population of over 5 million, but yes I do agree these territory rules are idiotic, but lets be frank though TFC has done a pathetic job with what's available to them.

[Soccerpro]

TFC has done a pathetic job with the talent at their disposal. In the 50 mile radius protected zone they are drawing from almost 8 million 1st world citizens, no other club in the world has this. Look at what Sigma FC has generated recently; Larin, Bekker, Welshman.

This ^

TFC have put in little to no effort mining for talent in the hotbed of Canadian soccer known as the GTA. At this point, they get what they deserve.

Whitecaps have academies all throughout B.C, Saskatoon and Regina SK, Winnipeg, MB and now London Ont. If TFC had the rights to those areas what would they have in place? Absolutely nothing.

[Ossington Mental Youth]

This ^

TFC have put in little to no effort mining for talent in the hotbed of Canadian soccer known as the GTA. At this point, they get what they deserve.

Whitecaps have academies all throughout B.C, Saskatoon and Regina SK, Winnipeg, MB and now London Ont. If TFC had the rights to those areas what would they have in place? Absolutely nothing.

I see them as two different issues.
1) TFC has failed on a local level
2)MLS regions in Canada are out of wack

[Ajax TFC]

As much as I want to be outraged at Vancouver and think that they're stealing talent from TFC, I can't. Let's be honest, if London produced a top soccer talent, does anyone here think that TFC would discover him, let alone secure his MLS rights? This team has a hard enough time securing the MLS rights of top players in their own city. TFC can focus on developing players in Toronto. If the Whitecaps want to help out soccer in London, then that's good for Canadian soccer and I don't have a problem with that. It's not like they're displacing an existing TFC academy

Maybe MLS should do away with protected regions all together. Protection from competition is what allows companies to be shitty at what they do. For example, if the Whitecaps were allowed to set up an academy in downtown TO and started actually working with the local soccer clubs, it might force TFC to up their game if they don't want to see the top GTA talents signed by other teams. Then again, we already have local talents going in the MLS draft that this team should have been able to lock up

[Fort York Redcoat]

Yeah I would say instead of getting bent out of shape realize this ^ - As well, TFC have had eight years to establish themselves in this province at the grassroots level and have done a horrible job. This is TFC reaping what they've sowed (or not I guess would be more accurate). If this club knew what was what in terms of building for the future, this wouldn't have happened because they would have had a relationship established. And to add insult - SirBob mentions Sigma, an academy who is 15 mins from BMO and they have stronger ties with Seattle, RSL and SKC.

Sure, now they do.

Knowing people from Sigma, they were excited to work with the local team as much as anyone would be. I Wouldn't blame them for their business savvy and TFC's failure to rate players coming in and getting their evaluation wrong.

The relationship would've been very different if we had all the levels we do today when the Academy first began.

[james]

not saying we don't have any good soccer players in this country...but for a country with a population of around 35million and so many of them coming from countries where Soccer is everything, we have many people who watch and play the sport, yet we are ranked something like 110th. Why can't we actually compete to make the world cup every now and then?

Only thing I could think of is, once you reach a teenager years the sport is not taken serious enough and not the proper training has been available in this country and to often the sport is looked at as a soccer mom's sort of thing where the sport is more just for recreation as a kid but not taken as serious as some take say Hockey. I just hope clubs like Whitecaps, TFC or Montreal Impact can create some good players for the near future. I would love to see more Canadians in MLS and a much better Team Canada.

[molenshtain]

not saying we don't have any good soccer players in this country...but for a country with a population of around 35million and so many of them coming from countries where Soccer is everything, we have many people who watch and play the sport, yet we are ranked something like 110th. Why can't we actually compete to make the world cup every now and then?

Only thing I could think of is, once you reach a teenager years the sport is not taken serious enough and not the proper training has been available in this country and to often the sport is looked at as a soccer mom's sort of thing where the sport is more just for recreation as a kid but not taken as serious as some take say Hockey. I just hope clubs like Whitecaps, TFC or Montreal Impact can create some good players for the near future. I would love to see more Canadians in MLS and a much better Team Canada.

kids from canada regularly compete well with eruopean and south american teams in international tournaments until they're about 14, when tactics and real coaching comes into play. Most of our problem historically his been inter-club and inter-jurisdiction politics and the orginizations like OSA and specifically CSA are rampant with it. It's getting a bit better now, but you can blame our not being good on poor coaching in the teenage years and stupendous amounts of fuckery on behalf of our governing bodies.

[oldtraffordPEI]

Great for soccer in the country. More grassroots development and competition the better. This will only result in more talent being found locally, more potential on the national level, and more Canadians in the MLS. TFC are going to have to compete and invest more with Vancouver forcing their hand. Its a win win...but yeah, fuck the whitecaps!

[portu]

TFC has done a pathetic job with the talent at their disposal. In the 50 mile radius protected zone they are drawing from almost 8 million 1st world citizens, no other club in the world has this. Look at what Sigma FC has generated recently; Larin, Bekker, Welshman.

Oh my fucking god I'm sick of hearing how there is "an abundance of talent in Ontario", to put it simply there really isn't, it's just a shit ton of registered players

[ag futbol]

kids from canada regularly compete well with eruopean and south american teams in international tournaments until they're about 14, when tactics and real coaching comes into play. Most of our problem historically his been inter-club and inter-jurisdiction politics and the orginizations like OSA and specifically CSA are rampant with it. It's getting a bit better now, but you can blame our not being good on poor coaching in the teenage years and stupendous amounts of fuckery on behalf of our governing bodies.

Bit of a red herring. Proportionately they do better than the senior team, but at the same time the competitive landscape is different. We take that shit way more seriously than most other countries who would rather not spend the money. I'm not saying they don't care at all, but they often don't see the ROI in sending small children across the world to compete at an "elite" level. The money gets spent on training kids at home which is a much better use of someone's time rather than running an international piss fest, which is really more about the parents than the participants.

My $0.02 as a coach who's mainly focused on age groups under 12 in Canada and watched completely random games at similar age levels in countries from Mexico, Brazil, France, and England: we are laughably behind.

[ag futbol]

Oh my fucking god I'm sick of hearing how there is "an abundance of talent in Ontario", to put it simply there really isn't, it's just a shit ton of registered players

I'm half way there with you on this. The GTA has a lot clubs who provide fairly good training and kids play at a competitive level; it goes further than participation. Nationally, it's a cheap form of kids exercise and the numbers are vastly inflated. Things are slowly changing... but have a long way to go.

If this club were to actually drill down and scout at the local level if could uncover some real diamonds. They are simply not active enough. The club relies on recommendations and some really ridiculous referral sources with obvious conflicts of interest. I have some doubts about the actual training being top notch as well... but have nothing to confirm that one way or another.

[Soccerpro]

Oh my fucking god I'm sick of hearing how there is "an abundance of talent in Ontario", to put it simply there really isn't, it's just a shit ton of registered players

Why are there more pro players out of Onatario than any other Province? Why do Ontario teams usually win all star nationals and club nationals?

[portu]

I'm half way there with you on this. The GTA has a lot clubs who provide fairly good training and kids play at a competitive level; it goes further than participation. Nationally, it's a cheap form of kids exercise and the numbers are vastly inflated. Things are slowly changing... but have a long way to go.

If this club were to actually drill down and scout at the local level if could uncover some real diamonds. They are simply not active enough. The club relies on recommendations and some really ridiculous referral sources with obvious conflicts of interest. I have some doubts about the actual training being top notch as well... but have nothing to confirm that one way or another.

I am 100% with you on this.

[Pookie]

Those who follow the developments with the OPDL and know the history of TFC-A in terms of relationships with local clubs won't find this London-Vancouver connection surprising in the least.

There is an OSA question in here too. TFC-A was in the OPDL last year (U13) but not anymore.

[molenshtain]

that reminds me, pookie.

Those who know the history of the TFC academy will know that their inability to poach the best talent isn't entirely their fault. We definitely didn't do our best, or even all that much, to build relationships with local clubs when the Academy started. But the amount of offense taken by teams like Woodbridge and Vaughan because we didn't bend over backward for them was truly astonishing. We could have done more to build relationships and involve local clubs in the process but their pettyness after the fact did a significant amount of damage to our Academy for a while. They would advise players not to sign/train with us etc. There's a reason why a lot of our Academy players came from very certain Scarborough and Missisauga/Brampton clubs for a while.

It's getting better now. The Johnston era was ignorant with the Academy, the Rongen/Winter era was arrogant. From what I've heard, Bez and Co. are doing A lot to go out and mend relationships with these clubs and build a community around the city that integrates local clubs with the Academy. I suspect it's true judging from the certain kids we've been poaching and having TFC play and share resources with a lot of the top clubs from the GTA. I think we're getting everything on track after a pretty bumpy start.

For instance, the last round of academy players from the Winter/Rongen group didn't do us much good. The last under 20 CMNT squad was dominated by the whitecaps and we only had 2 guys on it, Aparicio and Hamilton (though Roberts gets semi-frequent call ups from the National team). On the Other hand, the under 17 team, which Bez and Vanney and co. were mostly responsible for, had 11 of our guys by my count on the last squad. Many of those guys, like Thomas Mickoski, were top players from the GTA and were recently picked up.

I can't really speak to TFC's involvement in recruiting etc. outside the wider limits of the GTA. I have no info on that subject.

[denime]

Tthis just shows how shitty job TFC does when it comes to development. They are so many talented players in Ontario and for some strange reason they do not play for TFCA.

Month ago there was U15 National team show case at Downsview park, and it was sad to see how bad TFC performed.Vancouver beat them 5-1,Montreal if I'm not mistaken 4-1,and at the end national selection made up from REP-provincial teams lead 3-0 up to 70 minutes,just to drop the game to TFC after they changed half of the lineup.

Sigma sends their players to Vancouver residential program rather then TFC,always wondered why,but but now I get it,Vancouver is serious with their academy,TFC is all about PR.

Shitcaps setting up academy in London is good for Canadian soccer,at least one club in this country is taking development seriously,unfortunately it's not TFC.

If TFC wants to make it right,they should fire all local former REP coaches from their academy,bring coaches for outside,coaches without local REP clubs agendas and coaches with proper knowledge how to develop players,as long TFCA has Ontario REP coaches coaching academy kids,there will be no real progress.

[ensco]

I don't know the ins and outs of this, but I know something about labour laws. What is to stop us from poaching a Whitecaps Academy player, whether that player plays in Vancouver or London or anywhere else?

Because that is what happens in Europe...