Argos to BMO decision - Wednesday, May 20th

[Fort York Redcoat]

Nobody is killing off anyone. The only people that could kill TFC is the fans, if they stop supporting. So your call.

Also, Argo support is 4:1 over TFC right now, and the Argos are the weakest support in the league. So we can talk all day long about how big footy MIGHT become in the future, but the fact is right now the CFL is a lot bigger of a show. And money talks now.

On tv it sure is. Not so in the local stadium. Did you have anything to say about your support of Toronto FC?

[Borga]

As for those Ricky Foley tweets, all I can say is, "Yes, I would like some fries with that." And enjoy your CTE.

[Fort York Redcoat]

more than $3 million specifically on technology to ensure BMO Field has one of the best pitches in Major League Soccer. Yours truly,
	Tim Leiweke President and CEO MLSE

But don't tell us what that tech is, okay? WE TRUST YOU.

AnnounceFAIL.

[Roca]

I was annoyed that both Larry T and Tim L. at the presser had that bemused "where do these wacky TFC fans get this concern about field quality?" look on their faces.
History - baby - history
The Argos and the Blizzard once shared Exhibition Stadium. I attended some of those games- it could have been played on a parking lot painted green.

I attended the 1982 Grey Cup at Exhibition Stadium in rainstorm conditions.

The Argos have built a reputation over the last decade (or two) of being a money-losing, cheap, afterthought team supported by older fans, shrinking fanbase, losing ground to the NFL. If Larry T and Bell are going to erase that legacy, fine and good, but don't insult us and pretend that legacy does not exist. Today Larry T. said "no compromise to the quality of the field for TFC". Sorry, but the events running up to all of this hoopla for the new, broke tenant for BMO Field have been all too coy for me to think that clinches it. No details on the price the Argos fetched, 3 million on the field and 20 million on the stands that move to make way for the longer field - but no mention of whether that was part of purchase price or whose money that is. And some coyness as to the actual ownership team for the next few months? These situations reeks of compromise, so the field remains a concern. The fact is that both a MLS team and a CFL team have playoffs and championships in November, so concern about field quality might not be a hot button issue until November 2016. Will the hockey team misdirect be used then?

The weasel-worded email Tim Leiweke sent out today makes not one mention of the pitch.

"MLSE's commitment to delivering the best soccer experience for TFC and its fans is unmatched."

Give me a fucking break! Who else "delivers" a "soccer experience" if not the team owners? How could anyone match it, since they don't deliver it? Empty marketing sloganeering.

Tautology: a statement that is true by necessity or by virtue of its logical form.

[arsenal]

But don't tell us what that tech is, okay? WE TRUST YOU.

AnnounceFAIL.

One of the best in MLS? Werent we shooting for world class facilities before? Now we will settle for being a bit better than most of the league (where many have crappy artificial turf).

[TFC07]

Rickey Foley Everybody

Argo Star & Proud Canadian


Latest twitter rant something to behold

Ricky Foley @Foley4Real · 24m 24 minutes ago

Dick move announcing Babcock news the day #Argos r finally sold. Guess some people still jealous we the only team who wins in this city @CFL


I feel sorry 4T.O sports fans...Every yr hype 4teams who don't EVER win...Spending $ 2come see mostly Foreigners play with no heart/effort

I'll tell you one thing these CDN #CFL boys don't claim 'wetheNORTH' then head home to the south during off seasons... #NBA

And our Captains and vet leaders don't play like a bunch of soft ass punks with no emotion or passion for the game or its fans... #NHL

So congrats on Ur new coach @MapleLeafs...Hopefully 50mil & sky high ticket prices r enough 2give Ur players heart & a compete level #CFL



*************

Not sure any of that is aimed at TFC.

What a dick move from Argos. Bunch of whiny little cunts who can't accept their role and know where they stand in this market.

[Gringo Starr]

I know this is nitpicking but the prominent use of the word soccer has been irritating today. Football is right in the team...

[TFC07]

LOL @ Tim Leiweke especially in the end telling us to contact our ticket rep (I still don't know who's my ticket rep since last one left) if we have any questions.

[Red CB Toronto]

I know this is nitpicking but the prominent use of the word soccer has been irritating today. Football is right in the team...

I think for the most part its innocent, just a way to differentiate the two sports.

[OgtheDim]

...Also, Argo support is 4:1 over TFC right now, and the Argos are the weakest support in the league. So we can talk all day long about how big footy MIGHT become in the future, but the fact is right now the CFL is a lot bigger of a show. And money talks now.

Ti Cat fan and TFC supporter here.

Don't count TV numbers as nobody has any idea what % of people watch CFL Argo games because they are supporting the other team.

Fact - Argo SSH are nowhere near the 20K TFC has now.

Fact - Argo attendances are not 4-1 over TFC

Fact - Argos lose money operationally, TFC does not

Fact - Argo fans spend per seat is nowhere near TFC spend per seat

Soooooooooooooo......not much of what you said is actually correct.

I get you are here for a reason, but don't embarrass yourself with misinformation.

[OgtheDim]

What a dick move from Argos. Bunch of whiny little cunts who can't accept their role and know where they stand in this market.

Foley has always been ...ahem...talkative. Its him talking, not Argos.

[Red CB Toronto]

Ti Cat fan and TFC supporter here.

Don't count TV numbers as nobody has any idea what % of people watch CFL Argo games because they are supporting the other team.

Fact - Argo SSH are nowhere near the 20K TFC has now.

Fact - Argo attendances are not 4-1 over TFC

Fact - Argos lose money operationally, TFC does not

Fact - Argo fans spend per seat is nowhere near TFC spend per seat

Soooooooooooooo......not much of what you said is actually correct.

I get you are here for a reason, but don't embarrass yourself with misinformation.

Cheapest Argo season ticket for nine games is $255, TFC was $189 for the south end during the renewal period for $19 games.

[TFC07]

Foley has always been ...ahem...talkative. Its him talking, not Argos.

I bet you any money many in Argos feel same way as this Foley guy. They probably bitter about Maple Leafs news taking spotlight away from them.

[flatpicker]

Do we know if the distance between folks in the South end and the pitch will change because of the Argos? Or will retractable seating keep things the same for TFC games?

[Still Kicking]

To the Tim L letter...


Wow, so much spin my computer is dizzy.
No mention of the Blue Jays evicting the old dble blue. No mention that Argos have never had to play a home date AND compete against a Blue Jays home date. That changes in 2016. Argos must compete against Jays for three months, if TFC gets first shot at schedule - Argos suffer. Bills will continue to draw Canadian fans...Argos suffer.
Does iconic = constant money losing even though your entire CFL team salary is less than Michael Bradley? Two CFL teams are still less than Kyle Lowry. I had to look back at the top to make sure the letter was addressed to TFC fans - Rejuvenate the Argos- what the hell has that got to do with TFC? Face it the oldest team in North America is the orphan team of Ontario. I have had a lifetime of watching soccer forced to take a back seat to other sports, sick of it. I would gladly trade Argos at BMO for a TFC Women's team at BMO. Spin Spin Spin....I am also sick of the media and the feeding of the notion that sports fans support all the teams. That just feeds money and viewers to the owners and helps create feeble bandwagon fans.

[Beach_Red]

I bet you any money many in Argos feel same way as this Foley guy. They probably bitter about Maple Leafs news taking spotlight away from them.

All the Argo fans I know are just happy the team didn't move to Quebec City or Moncton. They know perfectly well where they fit in this market.

[Fort York Redcoat]

LOL @ Tim Leiweke especially in the end telling us to contact our ticket rep (I still don't know who's my ticket rep since last one left) if we have any questions.

Yeah because they'll know examples of whatever mystery tech the pitch they will be using...

SOCCER EXPERIENCE = DIVERT ATTENTION FROM PITCH.

Thunder stick me, bro.

[OgtheDim]

Cheapest Argo season ticket for nine games is $255, TFC was $189 for the south end during the renewal period for $19 games.

% of tickets in the low range is higher for Argos.

Argo shirt bought once and never buy another.

Don't buy as much beer.

CFL commish admitted they skew older demographically and need to change that.

[flamehawk]

Anyone willing to be interviewed about concerns regarding Argos moving in?

Contact Morgan Campbell from The Star:
https://www.facebook.com/MorganPBCampbell?fref=ts
mcampbell@thestar.ca

He's looking for someone to interview and I didn't feel like taking it on.

[OgtheDim]

All the Argo fans I know are just happy the team didn't move to Quebec City or Moncton. They know perfectly well where they fit in this market.

Agreed. I think there is a lot of trolling going on around the net because of the chip on the shoulder of a lot of CFL fans from out West who really do believe the sunshines out of their league when the NHL is not playing. And there is little understanding of why grass is important to a good soccer product.

There is a lot of hope that BMO will be like Percival in Montreal. We'll see. Bell laid it out there today they are expecting a sell out for the opening Argo game in July 2016.

First game sell outs are easy.

Hard is 4 years later on a cold and wet late October Friday night. Who among the current Argo fans ares going to go down to BMO through the traffic and the transit after work to get to a 7 pm game? I have my doubts.

[GabrielHurl]

What a dick move from an Argos player.

Fixed

[Beach_Red]

Hard is 4 years later on a cold and wet late October Friday night. Who among the current Argo fans ares going to go down to BMO through the traffic and the transit after work to get to a 7 pm game? I have my doubts.

For sure. But that's likely been factored in. They don't need to sell-out every game. The home opener, the one playoff game they're practically guaranteed, the games against the Ti-Cats and that's probably enough.

The big thing is there will be at least ten years before there's any more talk of the NFL coming to Toronto so they might actually be able to sell some tickets to younger people.

[Ultra & Proud]

All the Argo fans I know are just happy the team didn't move to Quebec City or Moncton. They know perfectly well where they fit in this market.

You know Argos fans?

I honestly have never met one, minus my Dad, and he would never go to a game ever. I'm 41 and not some young kid and every single person I know from work, to friends, to the guys in my locals, to band mates and other bands; not one person who gives the Argos or CFL a second thought. I even have friends with Rock season tickets but know no one who even watches the Grey Cup.

Maybe my personal group of co-workers, friends, and acquaintances is out of touch but most of them are males who range in age from the early 20's to late 50's. All sports fans but not one who cares even a little about that league or the Argos.

[brad]

You know Argos fans?

I honestly have never met one, minus my Dad, and he would never go to a game ever. I'm 41 and not some young kid and every single person I know from work, to friends, to the guys in my locals, to band mates and other bands; not one person who gives the Argos or CFL a second thought. I even have friends with Rock season tickets but know no one who even watches the Grey Cup.

Maybe my personal group of co-workers, friends, and acquaintances is out of touch but most of them are males who range in age from the early 20's to late 50's. All sports fans but not one who cares even a little about that league or the Argos.

Same here. Not one that I can remember. The only people I know that go to Argo's games are ex-Saskatchewan residents that go when the Riders are in town.

Also don't recall ever hearing a discussion about the Argos around the cooler at work or anywhere else. I hear this about every other team - even the Rock.

[Still Kicking]

For sure. But that's likely been factored in. They don't need to sell-out every game. The home opener, the one playoff game they're practically guaranteed, the games against the Ti-Cats and that's probably enough.

The big thing is there will be at least ten years before there's any more talk of the NFL coming to Toronto so they might actually be able to sell some tickets to younger people.

I think young adults in the GTA who are football fans will watch US College and NFL. The game day experience they seek is tailgate based so they travel to the US for a weekend...no matter how much NFL in Toronto is on a distant horizon....CFL is not going to turn young adult football fans away from US football...the CFL booted a few generations around here and nobody is bringing that back...

[billyfly]

I support all teams.

How weird of me.

[trane]

I do not give too much about this. What I give a shit about, is that we keep on losing. I would care if we played on a field with yard lines.

[__wowza]

The overreaction to this is really sad to hear out of the "supporters group" forum.

The hate for MLSE is funny too because it is such a two way street with their fans, especially for this team. Unlike the established sports they need to ensure they appeal to the fans here in order to maintain their attendance. They have done so by continually spending money on talented players, unfortunately none of them have worked out. On the flip side, they have the same mentality as a fanatic rather than a supporter when it comes to their managers. Constantly overreacting to every little thing and creating so much turnover that it's impossible to build a successful team.

At the end of the day, TFC will continue to play at BMO and management seems to want to make this a success, otherwise why else would they invest all this money into a stadium/players/training academy/usl team/usl stadium etc.

As Larson once mentioned on twitter.. this is North America, multipurpose stadiums are the norm especially when it comes to public ownership of these stadiums. Personally I don't care that this is happening, I will continue to cheer on this team because I love the sport. If you can't do that because a pitch has a faint line on it, or an extra divot than off you go. The stadium won't miss you.

i've got no issue with the argos, but from everything i've heard and read about the team, having their own stadium would be in the best interest of the team, their fans, and pretty much everyone but ownership group. the issue is, i'm not even upset, i'm just disappointed. when the teams done nothing but disappoint since the lustre wore off, many folks here fell back on the notion that, at the end of the day, BMO could still be considered "ours". it's like how someone can lose their job and have their friends remark "well, at least you still have your health!".

BMO was like the little stadium that could.
now, it seems.. tainted.

i know that sounds melodramatic. i echo your positivity, i really do, i just don't want anything to happen to our pitch that could put our players at risk, and i don't wanna see anything done to the stadium that would impact how we support the team. unfortunately i don't see either of those two things panning out.

[mr k]

Rather than relying on friends, co-workers & relatives which has a degree of confidence of 5%, let's look at what a recent survey said:

University of Lethbridge researcher Reginald Bibby commissioned a survey to find which team had more public support. What he found, in a survey of 4,022 Canadians, was significantly more interest in the Canadian Football League -- across the country and in Toronto. In Ontario it was 21 per cent to 10 for the CFL while in Toronto it was 24 per cent for the CFL and only 7 per cent for the MLS.

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/eh-game/survey-shows-toronto-argonauts-have-public-on-their-side-in-bmo-stadium-issue-202051528.html

[TFC07]

Rather than relying on friends & relatives which has a degree of confidence of 5%, let's look at what a recent survey said:

University of Lethbridge researcher Reginald Bibby commissioned a survey to find which team had more public support. What he found, in a survey of 4,022 Canadians, was significantly more interest in the Canadian Football League -- across the country and in Toronto. In Ontario it was 21 per cent to 10 for the CFL while in Toronto it was 24 per cent for the CFL and only 7 per cent for the MLS.

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/eh-game/survey-shows-toronto-argonauts-have-public-on-their-side-in-bmo-stadium-issue-202051528.html

This survey is based on leagues not teams. It already has been discussed on this thread and how much value this survey really has on Argos' popularity in this market.

Also, we don't know how they define Toronto (if includes Hamilton and 905 region) on this survey.