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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Yeah, pretty much changes everything, lol.

    -----------Alitidore---Gilberto---------
    ---------------Giovinco---------------
    ---------Osorio------Bradley--------
    ---------------Delgado--------------
    Morrow--Caldwell--Hagglund--Bloom
    This is ideal and if we need to remove Gilberto, Moore fits in there nicely, with Findley and Dike as back ups.


    If we bring in some MLS quality Defenders (CB specifically) this could be a dangerous combination, even with out Gilberto, with Gilberto, assuming the two of them play unselfish football with each other and are willing to set each other up... and Bradley and Osorio are allowed to float and cross back and forth...


    The attacking half is really heavily covered.

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    Kristian Jack ‏@KristianJack 3m3 minutes ago Had a game of Subbuteo Toronto FC style after press conference with head coach Greg Vanney. Interview will be in a tactics piece on TSN.ca

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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Areathrasher View Post
    agreed. excellent read
    “Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.

    I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’

    And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”

    -Eduardo Galeano

  5. #35
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    Great read. It sounds like Vanney is going to use a 4-2-3-1 in possession. Bradley will be one of the DMs with the green light to join the attack and the other DM will provide defensive cover.


    ----------------------Bendik-------------------------

    Bloom-----Caldwell--------New CB---------Morrow

    ------------Bradley---------New DM----------------

    Jackson--------Osorio/Giovinco------------Gilberto

    ---------------------Altidore-------------------------

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManUtd4ever View Post
    Great read. It sounds like Vanney is going to use a 4-2-3-1 in possession. Bradley will be one of the DMs with the green light to join the attack and the other DM will provide defensive cover.


    ----------------------Bendik-------------------------

    Bloom-----Caldwell--------New CB---------Morrow

    ------------Bradley---------New DM----------------

    Jackson--------Osorio/Giovinco------------Gilberto

    ---------------------Altidore-------------------------
    If Vanney is going with 4-2-3-1, it will be after Giovinco arrives. But I think 4-3-3 makes more sense at least the start of the season.
    My reason being we don't have anyone else who can play a 10. Osorio doesn't have the range of passing. Bekker I already said enough about lol. Chapman is unproven.
    'Safer' to play 4-3-3 which IMO is less reliant on a CAM (depends on which version of 4-3-3 you play) and TFC has more wingers/wide forwards suited to a 4-3-3 than 4-2-3-1 at the moment.
    Of course, Vanney might just play a 4-4-2 variant. Maybe 4-1-4-1? Basically any formation that does not rely on a CAM to drive the offence
    “Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.

    I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’

    And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”

    -Eduardo Galeano

  7. #37
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    I love hearing Vanney talk about tactics. It's such a breath of fresh air to hear a TFC coach say things that make sense and that I agree fully with. Not just "our team's going to work really hard to win games".
    From what I gather, we could see something like:

    -------------Findley-----Altidore------------------
    -------------------------------------------Oduro---
    ----------Osorio--------------Bradley-------------
    ----------------------Delgado----------------------
    -Morrow-------Perquis---Caldwell--------Bloom-
    -----------------------Bendik----------------------

    When Giovenco comes in, it could be something like:

    -----------------------Altidore----------\----------
    ----Osorio-----Giovenco----------------Findley--
    ---------------------------------^-----------------
    -----------------Delgado----Bradley------------
    ----^-----------------------------------------^-----
    -Morrow------Perquis----Caldwell------Bloom--
    ----------------------Bendik-----------------------

  8. #38
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    Is Delgado the guy we got from the Chivas dispersal? I know nothing at all about him, is he good enough to walk into this team? I take it he's a DM.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by MartinUtd View Post
    Is Delgado the guy we got from the Chivas dispersal? I know nothing at all about him, is he good enough to walk into this team? I take it he's a DM.
    More a wide player; mostly played as a fullback but deputized at central mid and wing for Chivas. He's really young but looked great for the Goats; reads the play really well and has great technique. But he's has knee surgery twice already so he might be fragile. I think if he holds together he'd be a really good DM.

    EDIT: Having said that, I think Creavalle has much more potential that he has shown so far, too. He's the same kind of monster athlete as Henry.

  10. #40
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    Cheers.
    I was wondering about Craevalle and what his role will play, wasn't he supposed to be a DM but ended up at fullback? Then there's Warner, more depth or surplus to requirement now? It seems we have a lot of mediocrity in our midfield once you get past the star signings and I can't imagine them all staying the entire season considering our U22 roster being filled out as well.

  11. #41
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    This guy could sell ice to an eskimo. like others before him, you can talk about what you want, but the guys may not implement it. I hope to hell this thing floats

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    We can all find interviews from every last guy we've had here that left you feeling "aha this guy gets it".

    The spending spree is striking in comparison to how we cheap out on managers, and increases the pressure on Vanney.

    Only one of our eight managers in franchise history wasn't a raw rookie at this. My view is Vanney may be a great guy but I am sick of rookie managers, the likelihood of a midseason change seems damn near 100% to me.
    Last edited by ensco; 01-20-2015 at 07:44 AM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

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    ^Tbh, I can think of a number of times when I've thought that "this guy is just spewing out BS". Or they talk overall philosophy, but nothing about actual strategy. Some recent examples include: Mariner telling us that his approach will be to kick it into the (English) channel, or Nelsen saying that his team's style will be to work really hard all over the pitch to get wins. I think Vanney is the first guy since Bob de Klerk that has talked some sensible strategy. The difference is that Vanney's team looks to be a cohesive unit, and has the MLS experience to build a team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    The spending spree is striking in comparison to how we cheap out on managers, and increases the pressure on Vanney.
    Only one of our eight managers in franchise history wasn't a raw rookie at this. My view is Vanney may be a great guy but I am sick of rookie managers, the likelihood of a midseason change seems damn near 100% to me.
    This is exactly how I feel. If your gonna make it rain at least hire a proven leader.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajax TFC View Post
    The difference is that Vanney's team looks to be a cohesive unit, and has the MLS experience to build a team.
    11 games in, Vanney hasnt fielded a team that looks cohesive yet. He mentions some of the problems he was having last year in that article.
    I think a good team can succeed even without a good manager as long as theyre is unity and teamwork. I hope all these guys can get it right.
    Unfortunately with DP's and media attention and tons of failure. I believe we have always had one of the worst locker rooms in MLS
    where every saturday night, someone walks the plank

  16. #46
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    I think it's fairly evident that Vanney is a student of the game. Unfortunately, that in of itself does not constitute a successful manager at the professional level. It remains to be seen whether he can motivate and discipline our players. He needs to prove that he can be a leader.

    On paper, our squad should be a contender for a top playoff seed in the East when the dust settles. The rest is up to the coaching staff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dutch View Post
    11 games in, Vanney hasnt fielded a team that looks cohesive yet. He mentions some of the problems he was having last year in that article.
    I think a good team can succeed even without a good manager as long as theyre is unity and teamwork. I hope all these guys can get it right.
    Unfortunately with DP's and media attention and tons of failure. I believe we have always had one of the worst locker rooms in MLS
    where every saturday night, someone walks the plank
    Sorry, I just realized that I wasn't at all clear what I meant. By vanney's "team", i was referring to the management team around him. Him and Bez seem to be on the same page, and presumable the assistants are too since he picked them and has worked with them before

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    I prefer to watch attacking football, and if we're kicking off the season with 3-4 DP's - and considering their pedigree - surely we should be able to pull that off in this league. It's really all down to the coach.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Super View Post
    I prefer to watch attacking football, and if we're kicking off the season with 3-4 DP's - and considering their pedigree - surely we should be able to pull that off in this league. It's really all down to the coach.
    We're kicking off the season with 2 DPs unless we're permitted to have 4 on our roster. Giovinco isn't joining until the summer, iirc.

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    1. Pass to our own players, not the opposition

    2. Play all 90 mins plus extra T, no sleepy time at 89

    3. When we score, no sitting back on a one goal lead

    4. If the team loses after a crap game just say it was a crap game and we was poor, in the post match, not blame everything else or moons not in alignment for us, be honest and address it !!

  21. #51
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    "Ajax TFC: Tbh, I can think of a number of times when I've thought that "this guy is just spewing out BS". Or they talk overall philosophy, but nothing about actual strategy. Some recent examples include: Mariner telling us that his approach will be to kick it into the (English) channel, or Nelsen saying that his team's style will be to work really hard all over the pitch to get wins. I think Vanney is the first guy since Bob de Klerk that has talked some sensible strategy. The difference is that Vanney's team looks to be a cohesive unit, and has the MLS experience to build a team."


    Nelsen was out of the English tradition where managers do not reveal their tactics. And I agree with him. Vanney sounds good, and he seems like a nice man, but I'd rather he tell us less and do more. His spell last year sure didn't engender confidence in his ability to translate good press conferences into good play.
    Last edited by MightyDM; 01-20-2015 at 01:53 PM. Reason: forgot to include the quote

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hieberrr View Post
    We're kicking off the season with 2 DPs unless we're permitted to have 4 on our roster. Giovinco isn't joining until the summer, iirc.
    Yes, true. I was thinking we'd have 3-4 DP's locked in. Still a chance we kick off the season with 3.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ensco View Post
    We can all find interviews from every last guy we've had here that left you feeling "aha this guy gets it".
    Nope. This is the first.

    Sorry dude but I just flat disagree with that. We haven't a coach who ever discussed tactics to this depth and who obviously understood what he was talking about in terms of tactical adaption to circumstance. Not even close.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Nope. This is the first.

    Sorry dude but I just flat disagree with that. We haven't a coach who ever discussed tactics to this depth and who obviously understood what he was talking about in terms of tactical adaption to circumstance. Not even close.
    Winter, maybe. But that didn't work for obvious reason. other than that I totally agree. I also think the key thing is that Vanney has armed himself with far and away the most experienced and MLS capable coaching staff we've had.

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    Quote Originally Posted by molenshtain View Post
    Winter, maybe. But that didn't work for obvious reason. other than that I totally agree. I also think the key thing is that Vanney has armed himself with far and away the most experienced and MLS capable coaching staff we've had.
    The one area where they really cross over is that Winter also favored having a baseline system of prescribed movement options, a checklist of best ways to find and open space between the opponent's lines. We were far too shit to adapt to it quickly and he and his coaching staff mostly unable to get anyone but Soolsma and Danny K to understand it.

    But that was the interesting part of Vanney's spiel; I've always rather suspected we had "player's coaches" who favored choosing a formation and then letting the players freelance based on a general knowledge of role. It explains a lot of basic inability we've had to break apart traps and full-field pressure, as well as our inability to create space in the offensive end. Certainly, it's how we looked under Mariner, Carver, Nelsen and Mo. Same basic "work hard, beat your man, cross the ball" mentality, instead of trying to unlock the other team by being ultra-prepared for tactical opportunism.

    Question is whether he can sell it, whether they buy into his personality and drive; adding Fraser and a few others certainly has the potential to help.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leedsoronto View Post
    1. Pass to our own players, not the opposition

    2. Play all 90 mins plus extra T, no sleepy time at 89

    3. When we score, no sitting back on a one goal lead

    4. If the team loses after a crap game just say it was a crap game and we was poor, in the post match, not blame everything else or moons not in alignment for us, be honest and address it !!
    Would you be ok if Vanney says "We were poor" instead of We was poor? I don't think he can pull of a Chav Track Suit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    ..

    Question is whether he can sell it, whether they buy into his personality and drive; adding Fraser and a few others certainly has the potential to help.
    I suspect the players unwilling to learn this were identified already and are being shopped around, if not released.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaz View Post
    Would you be ok if Vanney says "We were poor" instead of We was poor? I don't think he can pull of a Chav Track Suit.
    "I finx we was piss pour" would suffice

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leedsoronto View Post
    "I finx we was piss pour" would suffice
    My Doubleganger has a friend from Norfolk. First one in her village to learn to read 5 letter words in 50 years... she hasn't mastered writing yet so her UncleCousinBrother still writes all the town cheques. She is hoping to master her maths and get her A level before she retires though..


    She says Learn to speak, that isn't even Normal for Norfolk.


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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    Nope. This is the first.

    Sorry dude but I just flat disagree with that. We haven't a coach who ever discussed tactics to this depth and who obviously understood what he was talking about in terms of tactical adaption to circumstance. Not even close.
    I was talking about people getting these great vibes from the latest new manager's carefully delivered pearls of wisdom. Happens every time. I fell for it from Mo, and from Nelsen. Everyone here will have a different list of who they bought into early because he "sounded" right about something.

    To your point, I think this is maybe 25% of a manager's job and is hugely overrated.

    The formation stuff distracts people. Barcelona at its best played what looked liked a 0-10-0 with the whole thing built around triangle passing, Guardiola looked at people with blank stares when asked what formation he was playing.
    Last edited by ensco; 01-20-2015 at 04:32 PM.
    “What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”

 

 

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