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    Default The 2014 expansion/re-entry draft thread

    Last edited by Yohan; 11-19-2014 at 12:28 PM.
    “Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.

    I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’

    And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”

    -Eduardo Galeano

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    First in with the wish list


    Assuming we can only protect 11 and recent HG and GA:


    1. Bradley
    2. Bendik
    3. Morrow
    4. Hagglund
    5. Osorio
    6. Henry
    7. Gilberto
    8. Creavalle
    9. Bloom
    10. Lovitz
    11. Defoe




    Bradley - protect your best player - NYFC will take him in a heartbeat.

    Bendik - would be hard to get a keeper of his calibre

    Morrow - MVP at the back

    Hagglund - Future stud CB

    Osorio - his time is in the next 3 years

    Henry - future CB or international trade bait in 4 years

    Gilberto - the best attacking threat we have

    Crevalle - swing man - useful at his price - harder to replace easily

    Bloom - steady young defender will only get better in next 3 years

    Lovitz - protect the future a bit

    Defoe - tradeable asset, in January

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    Shoulda sent Defoe packing, that spot is valuable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OgtheDim View Post
    First in with the wish list


    Assuming we can only protect 11 and recent HG and GA:


    1. Bradley
    2. Bendik
    3. Morrow
    4. Hagglund
    5. Osorio
    6. Henry
    7. Gilberto
    8. Creavalle
    9. Bloom
    10. Lovitz
    11. Defoe




    Bradley - protect your best player - NYFC will take him in a heartbeat.

    Bendik - would be hard to get a keeper of his calibre

    Morrow - MVP at the back

    Hagglund - Future stud CB

    Osorio - his time is in the next 3 years

    Henry - future CB or international trade bait in 4 years

    Gilberto - the best attacking threat we have

    Crevalle - swing man - useful at his price - harder to replace easily

    Bloom - steady young defender will only get better in next 3 years

    Lovitz - protect the future a bit

    Defoe - tradeable asset, in January
    People generally leave DPs unprotected as n o one will pick up their salary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    People generally leave DPs unprotected as n o one will pick up their salary.
    With NYCFC coming in I wouldn't take the chance especially with Bradley.

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    Don't protect Defoe, do protect Bradley. I feel like NYCFC might have a swipe if they have an open DP slot.

    Nobody will touch Defoe with that contract and him wanting out.

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    Gotta protect defoe. Everyone knows he will be sold before next season. Leaving him unprotected means that another club gets the proceeds of selling him.

    Our hands are tied.

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    Quote Originally Posted by razor787 View Post
    Gotta protect defoe. Everyone knows he will be sold before next season. Leaving him unprotected means that another club gets the proceeds of selling him.

    Our hands are tied.
    I'm sure opinion on this will be spit, but I doubt we will be making any money on that deal. And I'm not talking about recovering the up front transfer fee either.

    Quote Originally Posted by jloome View Post
    People generally leave DPs unprotected as n o one will pick up their salary.
    Then again, what's left on the table that we want to keep?
    Last edited by ag futbol; 09-17-2014 at 10:23 PM.

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    [QUOTE=OgtheDim;1695633]First in with the wish list


    Assuming we can only protect 11 and recent HG and GA:


    1. Bradley
    2. Bendik
    3. Morrow
    4. Hagglund
    5. Osorio
    6. Henry
    7. Gilberto
    8. Creavalle
    9. Bloom
    10. Lovitz
    11. Defoe




    Bradley - protect your best player - NYFC will take him in a heartbeat.

    Bendik - would be hard to get a keeper of his calibre

    Morrow - MVP at the back

    Hagglund - Future stud CB

    Osorio - his time is in the next 3 years

    Henry - future CB or international trade bait in 4 years

    Gilberto - the best attacking threat we have

    Crevalle - swing man - useful at his price - harder to replace easily

    Bloom - steady young defender will only get better in next 3 years
    nk
    Lovitz - protect the future a bit

    Defoe - tradeable asset, in January[/QUOTE

    im good with that list...I may protect oduro instead of lovitz,i would not be shocked if we trade bloom to Orlando,i think his wife is stationed ther in the navy,remember we have 4 1st rd picks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I'm sure opinion on this will be spit, but I doubt we will be making any money on that deal. And I'm not talking about recovering the up front transfer fee either.


    Then again, what's left on the table that we want to keep?
    its a no brainer to protect him...the fee was 10-11 mil ...even if it goes down to 7 or 8 mil..the guys that we are not protecting are a dime a doz guys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by reggie View Post
    its a no brainer to protect him...the fee was 10-11 mil ...even if it goes down to 7 or 8 mil..the guys that we are not protecting are a dime a doz guys.
    Exactly.

    Even if the fee we get for selling Defoe in January doesn't cover what we paid in the original transfer at least we get back a large sum that can be reinvested in another DP.

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    Quote Originally Posted by reggie View Post
    its a no brainer to protect him...the fee was 10-11 mil ...even if it goes down to 7 or 8 mil..the guys that we are not protecting are a dime a doz guys.
    I'm not so sure it is. We had to incentivize him to come here and his wages reflect that.

    If Lambert is the relevant benchmark, we're paying Defoe roughly 1M GBP per year more than Lambert and we've got an extra year on the contract. Lambert's fee was 4M GBP. Subtract 3M GBP for the above market wage the buying club will not pay. That puts you at the 1M GBP mark. Now factor in injury history, a forced seller, competition for Defoe between clubs, Defoe's willingness to forgo wages to get a move ... where does that leave you? Could be any number of places.
    Last edited by ag futbol; 09-17-2014 at 11:09 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I'm not so sure it is. We had to incentivize him to come here and his wages reflect that.

    If Lambert is the relevant benchmark, we're paying Defoe roughly 1M GBP per year more than Lambert and we've got an extra year on the contract. Lambert's fee was 4M GBP. Subtract 3M GBP per year given the above market wage the buying club will not pay. That puts you at the 1M GBP mark. Now factor in injury history, a forced seller, competition for Defoe between clubs, Defoe's willingness to forgo wages to get a move ... where does that leave you? Could be any number of places.
    question better asked in Jan, when there is more clear idea of who the relegation battlers will be. EPL money is too lucrative, so a relegation battling club might be tempted to chance on Defoe (esp a London club, which seems to be Defoe's preference)
    “Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.

    I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’

    And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”

    -Eduardo Galeano

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    I'm not so sure it is. We had to incentivize him to come here and his wages reflect that.

    If Lambert is the relevant benchmark, we're paying Defoe roughly 1M GBP per year more than Lambert and we've got an extra year on the contract. Lambert's fee was 4M GBP. Subtract 3M GBP per year given the above market wage the buying club will not pay. That puts you at the 1M GBP mark. Now factor in injury history, a forced seller, competition for Defoe between clubs, Defoe's willingness to forgo wages to get a move ... where does that leave you? Could be any number of places.
    Lambert isn't really the benchmark though. He was sold in a fire sale to his boyhood club and didn't have a ton of bargaining power because his wages were so low to start with. Defoe will not under any circumstances significantly drop his wages to leave, he even asked for increased wages on deadline day supposedly. Defoe also has a more significant pedigree in the league over there, much more so than Lambert, and has a very well connected and influential agent.

    not really the same circumstance at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by molenshtain View Post
    Lambert isn't really the benchmark though. He was sold in a fire sale to his boyhood club and didn't have a ton of bargaining power because his wages were so low to start with. Defoe will not under any circumstances significantly drop his wages to leave, he even asked for increased wages on deadline day supposedly. Defoe also has a more significant pedigree in the league over there, much more so than Lambert, and has a very well connected and influential agent.

    not really the same circumstance at all.
    I'm not sure I follow. Sure, the Lambert-Liverpool discount is a possibility. But not being able to bargain based on existing lower wages? Don't think that's terribly relevant, neither is Defoe's mega agent (everybody over there will have a good one). I'll take your word on pedigree, I don't know that one way or another.

    I guess we will find out in January. I fail to see why anyone pays full price (edit: or more aptly, above market) for someone who they need to keep on the field immediately for the last half of the season, but is already coming off a lot of football and some injury worries. Then again, EPL clubs manage their money about as well as a gambling addict in a casino. So who am I to day otherwise?
    Last edited by ag futbol; 09-17-2014 at 11:50 PM.

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    I think the debate on whether to protect Defoe or not is probably a moot point.

    I can't imagine his agents would negotiate a deal to MLS without some sort of no-trade clause built in.
    If I remember correctly, when a player has a no-trade clause, the team is forced to use one of it's protected spots on that player.

    Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I think we will probably HAVE to use one of the spots on Defoe.

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    Just 2 cents worth;
    No need to protect Bendik ----at his level there are plenty around.
    The rest of the list is a good starting point for next year.

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    Defoe deal will be sorted before this draft im sure

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    So to me this is why you need to protect him: I'm NYCFC and I see Defoe is available - I would pick him up with zero intention of him ever playing for me, and sell him to a relegation threatened club in January for $3-4 million (or whatever discount rate I think I can get away with, without having to worry about what TFC paid to bring him in). That's a ton of allocation money for a club, which to me is worth more than some of the folks who will get picked up in this draft.


    (also - sidenote, would that be a way to get around the cap, bring in big money dp's to turn around and sell them for big allocation $?)
    TFC management changes: "like adding a new fish to your aquarium of failure." - Shakes

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    Two expansion and one dispersal draft at the same time, what a league. Maybe they should just declare a roster wildcard and let everyone redo everything. GMs would have a love explosion if they could do that.

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    If they change the rules, seeing Canadians regarded, now, as domestic, it makes things a bit trickier for us, than in years past.. but, here's my list, as things stand:


    1. Bradley

    2. Gilberto

    3. Defoe (an asset, regardless of where his future lies)

    4. Osorio (despite the thinking that teams won't too quickly "waste" an int. spot on Canadians, the value in a player that knows the league/language/etc. and feels at home should not be completely discounted)

    5. Jackson (edges Oduro, given his age, salary and general productivity; I'm sure he's also helped Gilberto settle in, as well [chemistry], and I seem to recall rumblings of him holding a greencard)

    6. Creavalle (the only cheap, USEFUL utility player we have, really, which you need, in this league; he's also originally from NY, so a risk, if left unprotected)

    7. Morrow

    8. Hagglund

    9. Henry (tempted to leave him off the list, being Canadian and maybe viewed as too raw to use a pick on [penalties conceded and so on], but it's too high risk, for me)

    10. Bendik (some years ago, there seemed an abundance in GK talent -- not so, of late, or so it would seem, and Bendik is serviceable; being from NY, as well, it's taking a chance, leaving him unprotected)

    11. Bloom (performances, since returning from injury, have dipped, but his age, price-tag [even with a raise], overall reliability and being an Orlando native, means we can all but bank on him being picked; you generally leave players you want to be rid of or those not likely to be picked up unprotected -- Bloom is neither)

    ** * **

    Luke Moore was one I was tempted to include, as he seems to make our attack tick, no matter which of Gilberto or Defoe is in. That said, he's been a bit sluggish, for me, of late, and I feel like DeRo or Osorio could play his role "in the hole," well enough, amongst a fair many others that would be worth giving a look in the position. He's also not the youngest, cheapest, nor most productive.

    Caldwell, as important as he is, is going to be 35, next year, and is on an O'Dea-level salary. Would be a shame if he's picked up, but I just don't see it.

    Lovitz might be the one lad I'm most afraid we lose, amongst those I've excluded from my list. That said, I think we hype him up a bit too much, and he's getting figured out. One for the future, to be sure, and I would hope to see our young core remain together.. but, I don't view him as so invaluable, as there's a good chance, if he's picked up, that we're left with someone else that might have played his role, anyway (i.e. Oduro, amongst one or two others).

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    TBD - MLS Dispersal Draft for Chivas USA
    December 7th, 2014 - MLS Cup Final
    December 8th, 2014 - Trade window opens
    December 10th, 2014 - MLS expansion draft
    December 12th, 2014 - MLS re-entry draft phase one
    December 19th, 2014 - MLS re-entry draft phase two
    January 2nd to 6th, 2015 - MLS SuperDraft Caribbean combine
    January 8th to 12th, 2015 - MLS SuperDraft combine
    January 15th, 2015 - MLS SuperDraft
    “Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.

    I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’

    And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”

    -Eduardo Galeano

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    MLS cup final is in December?!? I know it's a World Cup year but that is just too damn long of a season. They should be over and done with by 2nd week of November at the latest. I would even argue end of October being preferable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ag futbol View Post
    MLS cup final is in December?!? I know it's a World Cup year but that is just too damn long of a season. They should be over and done with by 2nd week of November at the latest. I would even argue end of October being preferable.
    Impossible with 34 game season plus US Open Cup/V Cup. Add in CCL for some teams. June is basically a write off due to Gold Cup/WC/Copa America. If you count June as dud, MLS has 7 months, while most European leagues have 9 months
    “Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.

    I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’

    And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”

    -Eduardo Galeano

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    http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/articl...ispersal-draft
    Chivas USA Dispersal Draft order:

    1. FC Dallas
    2. New York City FC
    3. Sporting Kansas City
    4. DC United
    5. New England Revolution
    6. Montreal Impact
    7. Orlando City SC
    8. Colorado Rapids
    9. San Jose Earthquakes
    10. Real Salt Lake
    11. Houston Dynamo
    12. Portland Timbers
    13. Chicago Fire
    14. Toronto FC
    15. Columbus Crew SC
    16. LA Galaxy
    17. Philadelphia Union
    18. New York Red Bulls
    19. Seattle Sounders FC
    20. Vancouver Whitecaps FC
    “Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.

    I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’

    And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”

    -Eduardo Galeano

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    Well so much for that then.

    Does Dallas need a keeper?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yohan View Post
    http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/articl...ispersal-draft
    Chivas USA Dispersal Draft order:

    1. FC Dallas
    2. New York City FC
    3. Sporting Kansas City
    4. DC United
    5. New England Revolution
    6. Montreal Impact
    7. Orlando City SC
    8. Colorado Rapids
    9. San Jose Earthquakes
    10. Real Salt Lake
    11. Houston Dynamo
    12. Portland Timbers
    13. Chicago Fire
    14. Toronto FC
    15. Columbus Crew SC
    16. LA Galaxy
    17. Philadelphia Union
    18. New York Red Bulls
    19. Seattle Sounders FC
    20. Vancouver Whitecaps FC
    TFC loses yet again. Nothing goes right for this club.
    MLS is a tough, physical league, that emphasizes speed, and features plastic fields, grueling travel, extreme weather, and incompetent refs. - NK Toronto

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    Weighted draft my fucking ass.

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    Drum roll please - and now TFC fans, the return of Nathan Sturgis !!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    TFC loses yet again. Nothing goes right for this club.
    There's nothing really of value past the top 7 spots in this draft so everyone beyond those spots are kind of losers as well. I'm not worried about this, so long as Karma comes around and blesses us on a draft that really matters.

 

 

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