Absolutely! I got sick of this thread, but three wins in a row at home and how people have changed their tune.Originally Posted by barticusz
Patience is a virtue. We have the right man here
Absolutely! I got sick of this thread, but three wins in a row at home and how people have changed their tune.
Patience is a virtue. We have the right man here
I have fully analyzed your post above and I feel it is intellectually sound and based for the most part on fact.
RPB Membership Team
I think it's important to note that in one of the episodes of 'All for One' , I think, the entire team was at a bespoke tailors' shop being measured for individually tailored suits. I suspect this was a team building exercise, and it would have levelled the field between those at the upper end of the wage scale, and those, like Hagglund, who are at a lower pay rate. If it was on MLSE's dime, (or anyone else's, for that matter) then good for them! The dressing room certainly seems cohesive and united, and it sounds like they'd follow Nelsen to Hell, if he asked them.
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.
RPB Membership Team
Part of it, I suspect, is that many of us can't take the constant negativity and rush to judgement in some of these threads, so we just push the mental 'ignore' button and avoid the thread for long periods of time. If I want to hear constant carping and criticism, I'll go into the other room and talk to Mrs. Bigby. Then we may notice a recent post by someone whose opinions we respect, and pop back in to see what they have to say. The negative always seem to be noisier, and more willing to express their opinion, than those who are content with the way things are progressing - in this or any other matter.
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.
This is true in life in general, I think. But let me ask you this: isn't the content of the position what's important, and not the perceived tone? Whether a post is supportive or unsupportive is only as relative to the strength of the point.
However, I can see how constant analysis, particularly wavering to the critical side, can sound one-note after a while.
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I think the latter point kind of gets at why it annoys some people. There's only so many ways to dice a tomato, and relentless discussing the same criticisms can get oppressively stifling after a while.
However, I also agree with you that ultimately it's the content of the criticism that matters. Ragging on "tone" is also a common way to try and stifle criticism, instead of addressing the validity of the argument being made (not that tone is completely irrelevant - you could have solid opinions, but if you voice them like a jerk, that matters).
One thing I do get tired of, is the constant re-hashing of being "supportive", versus being "unsupportive" to the team. As far as I'm concerned, there are only good points, and bad points. Outside of the 90 minutes in the stands, criticism should be welcomed, provided the point is well-made, and not couched in openly-hostile or passive-aggressive language.
“Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens
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Or the relevant points have been made, and after another win didn't feel like the right time to keep carping on them. Just like it's not the time to do a victory dance, as though gutting out a 1-0 home win against a weakened Columbus with a penalty kick, means all criticisms of Nelsen have been rendered moot, or rash.
I haven't personally come to an opinion on Nelsen yet, but I do see some worrying tendencies in his tactics. Maybe he's learning on the job and will get better - maybe he's not.
“Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens
So Jack Hacksworth has been fired by Philly. It'll be interesting to see who is replacement is. I've long argued that it's difficult to get a truely established manager for MLS. This league is made up of young managers learning the trade. Maybe i'll be eating crow soon.
These "I told you so" posts are flaming challenges. Leave the generalizations and sarcastic declarations out and it won't look so naive.
Wins can change opinion of the future results but it's how they perform that will change opinion on the rookie coach. Since you asked the question: You will have to defend Nelsen as long as we are not dominating teams win or lose.
I support Nelsen but can see how people may not have complete confidence in him with so little experience coaching.
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
Not to mention that our wins haven't been particularly convincing nor has our style of play. But maybe some progress is being made...but a couple of gritty wins and the Nelson fawners are ready to declare him Manager of the Year.
Wow, just read that. Honestly they don't have a team that is likely to make the playoffs, but they did invest. First casualty of the season.
Rumor is that Richie Williams of the US Men's Under 17 Squad is their front runner.
Williams would be a good guy to bring in. Was in line for RBNY head coaching position but the RB overlords brought in Hans Backe instead.
However, their HC revolving door more reflective of ownership problems, especially around Nick Sakiewicz. So unless Williams really overachieves, likely to be more of the same at PUFC.
And this is the other extreme. No need for name calling and hyperbole.
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
I don't think anybody is nominating Nelson for manager of the year, but the stability is refreshing. I trust that the 2 Tims will know when it is a dressing room, motivational, or tactical issue.
I have been critical of Nelsen's tactical approach to utilizing our offensive minded players, but if our form moving forward can resemble that of our first half against San Jose on a more consistent basis, perhaps he may prove to be the right man for the job.
I was still willing to give Winter more time when he was sacked. Nelsen has at least another year's worth of grace left in my books. I'll defer judgement until next summer's transfer window.
This is what I was thinking plus he says over and over in his interviews that the style of football will evolve. We'll see after the break and when we get everyone back. For now, it looks like he is progressing step by step and not doing the 'home run' style make over that failed for us over and over again. I like the stability and I like our growth, more defensive for now but hopefully going forward soon.
I have also read over and over about how Nelson's main goal was to run a diamond midfield but he never had the pieces to pull it off until now. That should be interesting. Bradley's showing at the WC playing AM will definitely be something to watch as he'll be doing it here when he returns most likely.
Last edited by Ultra & Proud; 06-11-2014 at 11:30 AM.
Wasn't trying to bait anyone into anything. I'm legitimately curious to see how people will react again once we start losing more. I don't think Nelson is the next Pep or anything to that effect and I dislike the style what we play, which I think I have mentioned in this and other threads. What I stated earlier was that we need to give him more time rather than calling for his head. I hope he gets a full 3 year stint to see what he can actually do.
If we make the playoffs he stays, if we don't he's sacked. That's the way i would handle it.
Then there are the ones who argued Winter should have gone who are arguing Nelsen should go. They also argued Mo should go, Preki should go, Mariner should go, probably Carver should go. Don't ever put a gun in their hands!!!
Yeah, sort of bit your head off there. Sorry about that. It was a tough day.
I think he gets at least two. This year there was still too much baggage to know what he really thinks of the hanger-on players, the leftover junk from Mariner and Payne. With two more signing windows and an offseason, there won't be any excuses left. Mind you, if we keep going four games without losing every so often, he probably won't need any.
I still prefer winning to 'winning, but it has to be pretty'. But I'd like to see some semblance of offensive cohesion at some point. When the flat four effectively played like a diamond in the first game against Seattle, with Osorio and Bradley switching off depending on which side of the field needed cover, we actually looked okay. We've had a few moments of good movement -- more than in past seasons -- but they're not really able to hold on and probe a defense for weakness yet.
For a few people, being a curmudgeon on a website is cosplay.
Nice.
In fairness, which one of those should we have kept? We generally hired lousy people. Maybe the biggest mistake was assuming we'd replace them with someone better.
But who wants to live in the world where you pay the highest ticket prices in the league and have to live with a lousy coach? ( excluding Nelsen from that statement).
Last edited by ag futbol; 06-11-2014 at 06:18 PM.
http://www.torontosun.com/2014/06/11...gs-make-s---up
apparently he's a good motivator
“Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.
I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’
And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”
-Eduardo Galeano
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Last edited by Shakes McQueen; 06-11-2014 at 08:15 PM.
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“Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens
Moderator
No way he gets three years, unless there's substantial evidence for his abilities as a coach this season. Tim L won't waste another season hoping a novice coach continues to learn on the job, while paying Bradley and Defoe (the latter of whom has a small window left).
“Heroism breaks its heart, and idealism its back, on the intransigence of the credulous and the mediocre, manipulated by the cynical and the corrupt.” ~Christopher Hitchens
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