The Collected Laba Rumours/News/Speculation Thread

[Pookie]

Not just any undisclosed amount of cash (that may or may not be allocation dollars). This will be cash they can use is a BIG way. Can't wait to see it.

From Larson in Feb of this year, a direct quote from TB:

"People don't know what future considerations are," Bezbatchenko told the Sun. "But Vancouver has a high hurdle to get over in order to keep him permanently. Let's just put it that way. We're comfortable that if they do, we'll be in a very good position to reinvest (what we receive) into the team to make us better in a big way."

[Richard]

I don't know if your being sarcastic or not but I don't believe in Bez.

Vancouver did a huge favour for us in taking Laba otherwise we couldn't have signed Bradley. TFC had no bargaining power in that situation where we had 4 designated players on the books, why would any team want to give us a fair deal in that situation, let alone help us sign Bradley.

[Canary10]

I don't know if your being sarcastic or not but I don't believe in Bez.

Vancouver did a huge favour for us in taking Laba otherwise we couldn't have signed Bradley. TFC had no bargaining power in that situation where we had 4 designated players on the books, why would any team want to give us a fair deal in that situation, let alone help us sign Bradley.

If I know Pookie at all that was sarcasm.

[molenshtain]

If I Pookie at all that was sarcasm.

I was gonna say...

[flamehawk]

I am really disappointed. The wording seems to indicate that it's a straight cash deal, no allocation. Seeing as we've never had an issue with cash, this doesn't help us out at all.

[Pookie]

Spoiler alert. It was sarcasm.

But I do think it important that the question is asked as to how the return will help TFC in a BIG way. This was a significant young player whom they tried hard to keep.

Facts are though that this move was necessitated as a result of offseason choices. At least one of the 3 that were brought in to be a part of the future likely won't be here.

That makes the opportunity cost of going that direction really significant. Moves likely forced on Bez of course. Showing how they can use the funds to improve the team would be important for him to do IMO

[Hieberrr]

Apparently an undisclosed amount of cash. Meh

Unless it's a lot of that sweet, sweet, garber bucks that will help with our cap.

[Globetrotter]

I can't believe it's December 2014 and we're still talking about Laba.

Three things are certain in life. Death, taxes, and Laba is gone.

[SirBobSaget]

I can't believe it's December 2014 and we're still talking about Laba.

Three things are certain in life. Death, taxes, and Laba is gone.

We're still talking about Laba because it was one of the most recent massive F-ups and screw u's delivered by management. All this BS about a massive hurdle to keep him goes out with a wimpering "some cash". Bunch of lying scum.

I'm at the end of the rope, just want a club that runs its self with some level of dignity.

[molenshtain]

We're still talking about Laba because it was one of the most recent massive F-ups and screw u's delivered by management. All this BS about a massive hurdle to keep him goes out with a wimpering "some cash". Bunch of lying scum.

I'm at the end of the rope, just want a club that runs its self with some level of dignity.

Then don't watch MLS. For the time being, these are the sorts of hurdles that every team has to face. Results haven't quite gone our way, but the nw guys upstairs have shown to have a relative idea about how to run a club and have implemented those ideas over the last 12 months. This team will win soon. Laba is a hiccup on our way to the top.

[brad]

Spoiler alert. It was sarcasm.

But I do think it important that the question is asked as to how the return will help TFC in a BIG way. This was a significant young player whom they tried hard to keep.

Facts are though that this move was necessitated as a result of offseason choices. At least one of the 3 that were brought in to be a part of the future likely won't be here.

That makes the opportunity cost of going that direction really significant. Moves likely forced on Bez of course. Showing how they can use the funds to improve the team would be important for him to do IMO

This is the wrong way to look at it. We got Bradley for Laba which unto itself, on paper at least is a fantastic deal that any team in the league would have taken. That was the move made to help TFC in a BIG way. Anything else we got on top of that is just gravy. Sure, it was up to Bez to get as much out of the deal as possible, but as many others have noted, our backs were up against the wall and we had no platform to negotiate from.

About the only thing I can fault is that Bez should have kept his mouth shut about the deal, and not advertised around how tough it was going to be for Vancouver to keep him

[Canary10]

I would take Laba over Gilberto any day.

[Ajax TFC]

About the only thing I can fault is that Bez should have kept his mouth shut about the deal, and not advertised around how tough it was going to be for Vancouver to keep him

But I think that's the point that most people are angry about. If all Vancouver had to do to keep him was pay us the cash that we paid to get him, then Bez shouldn't have been going around bigging up what we're going to get if Vancouver keeps him. It makes you look bad in the eyes of the supporters when you lie to them about what you're getting. Sure people would have been angrier at the time if we knew what we were getting/not getting, but it would have been better than pretending that we're getting some real building blocks, and then having the truth come out that we're not.

FWIW I still like Bez. I think he actually knows what he's doing in terms of building the team. But this is a bit of a fuckup by him

[starter]

As per TFC bit, the money we receive could be used to keep our current DPs.

The most promising specialist on the team was given away to please Defoe's mom.

[brad]

But I think that's the point that most people are angry about. If all Vancouver had to do to keep him was pay us the cash that we paid to get him, then Bez shouldn't have been going around bigging up what we're going to get if Vancouver keeps him. It makes you look bad in the eyes of the supporters when you lie to them about what you're getting. Sure people would have been angrier at the time if we knew what we were getting/not getting, but it would have been better than pretending that we're getting some real building blocks, and then having the truth come out that we're not.

FWIW I still like Bez. I think he actually knows what he's doing in terms of building the team. But this is a bit of a fuckup by him

Fair enough. I stopped believing anything this club tells me years ago, so I view it a bit differently.

[Pookie]

This is the wrong way to look at it. We got Bradley for Laba which unto itself, on paper at least is a fantastic deal that any team in the league would have taken. That was the move made to help TFC in a BIG way. Anything else we got on top of that is just gravy. Sure, it was up to Bez to get as much out of the deal as possible, but as many others have noted, our backs were up against the wall and we had no platform to negotiate from.

About the only thing I can fault is that Bez should have kept his mouth shut about the deal, and not advertised around how tough it was going to be for Vancouver to keep him

I disagree a little.

Yes Bradley fell into their lap. Yes technically Bradley's arrival necessitated Laba leaving.

However, 2 strikers were signed before Bradley/Laba became a decision. Based on very public quotes about the "type" of DP that they target, ticket selling ranks way up on their list of priorities.

Therefore, it has to be seen as part of the whole offseason strategy. Additions and subtractions.

I don't fault Bez about this for the most part. He didn't go to the Board for the keys to the money truck. He clearly knows the rules within the league. As a result of TL's signings he had to trade Laba from a position of weakness.

Vancouver basically gets a cornerstone piece, playoffs and it costs them some money.

We get money. I do think that based on what Bez said earlier though he should be transparent about whether the money is allocation money or simply money that will be used to offset their losses.

[brad]

I disagree a little.

Yes Bradley fell into their lap. Yes technically Bradley's arrival necessitated Laba leaving.

However, 2 strikers were signed before Bradley/Laba became a decision. Based on very public quotes about the "type" of DP that they target, ticket selling ranks way up on their list of priorities.

I don't think the 2 striker/one midfielder plan was based around ticket sales. I think that was based around Nelsen wanting to play with 2 forwards and the decision that two DP strikers were the best way win in that formation (something I never agreed with). The ticket sale angle was the oft discussed "One A level DP, one B level DP, and the midfielder. The A level DP was absolutely about ticket sales as much as footballing quality - no doubt, but the other two I don't agree. Gilberto was not a name to drive mass ticket sales, neither was Laba.

Therefore, it has to be seen as part of the whole offseason strategy. Additions and subtractions.

I don't fault Bez about this for the most part. He didn't go to the Board for the keys to the money truck. He clearly knows the rules within the league. As a result of TL's signings he had to trade Laba from a position of weakness.

Vancouver basically gets a cornerstone piece, playoffs and it costs them some money.

We get money. I do think that based on what Bez said earlier though he should be transparent about whether the money is allocation money or simply money that will be used to offset their losses.

Their off season strategy was to go into the season with Gilberto, Defoe and Laba. Bradley literally fell from the sky and they quite rightly did everything they could to sign him. There was cost to that. It certainly wasn't bad from a marketing perspective, but I do think that one was predominately a footballing decision.

On what Bez said, well, read my other post a few up from this to see my take on what Bez or anyone else at this club says....

[Initial B]

On what Bez said, well, read my other post a few up from this to see my take on what Bez or anyone else at this club says....

So what do you think about what Vanney is saying here:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/articl...her-culture-20

I'm taking a wait and see approach. We won't know what kind of team TFC will be until the end of pre-season. Again x8.

[Canary10]

So what do you think about what Vanney is saying here:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/articl...her-culture-20

I'm taking a wait and see approach. We won't know what kind of team TFC will be until the end of pre-season. Again x8.

There is probably nothing more empty coming from this club than talking about culture.

If you want my take.

[brad]

So what do you think about what Vanney is saying here:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/articl...her-culture-20

I'm taking a wait and see approach. We won't know what kind of team TFC will be until the end of pre-season. Again x8.

There is probably nothing more empty coming from this club than talking about culture.

If you want my take.

Agree with Canary.

My take - I like what he says. But the general overtone is not much different than what his predecessors have said. It's pretty much the same every year. Last year was not good enough, next year will be different, yada, yada, yada. I hope he can deliver, I really do.

And to be clear, I'm not putting any of that on Vanney. I think he has the best of intentions, I don't think he is feeding any marketing spiel here. But it's the whole culture that surrounds the club that is the problem. Most likely we will be faltering around mid-summer, this time next year Vanney will be gone and we will be listening to the same talk next year.

I really hope I am wrong, but if history is anything to go by...

[Pookie]

I don't think the 2 striker/one midfielder plan was based around ticket sales. I think that was based around Nelsen wanting to play with 2 forwards and the decision that two DP strikers were the best way win in that formation (something I never agreed with). The ticket sale angle was the oft discussed "One A level DP, one B level DP, and the midfielder. The A level DP was absolutely about ticket sales as much as footballing quality - no doubt, but the other two I don't agree. Gilberto was not a name to drive mass ticket sales, neither was Laba.

I was just going on Tim L's often quoted "they (DPs) must make waves on and off the field."

Not to mention the fact that season ticket renewals were delayed so as to be able to announce the signings. Seems to me that they are linked pretty clearly. Just opinion though. I've been wrong before… says my wife

[molenshtain]

So what do you think about what Vanney is saying here:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/articl...her-culture-20

I'm taking a wait and see approach. We won't know what kind of team TFC will be until the end of pre-season. Again x8.

I agree in the wait and see approach but I do really appreciate the fact that he's really detailing what's going to be different and how. A lot better than the vagueness of past, and I think Vanney knows that.

[JuliquE]

I agree in the wait and see approach but I do really appreciate the fact that he's really detailing what's going to be different and how. A lot better than the vagueness of past, and I think Vanney knows that.

Agreed.

We also saw, I think, six or seven new starters come into the side, this year (Gilberto/Moore, Defoe, Bradley, Morrow, Jackson, Oduro/Lovitz, and sometimes Hagglund/Creavalle), with one or two of the advertised remaining "core" of players not quite 100% ready for prime-time, on a seriously contending side (or, at least, question-marks on how they will respond to serious starting responsibilities over the likes of Henry, Oso/Bekker, and Bloom)—hardly a solid foundation on which to shift the culture.

The problem isn't necessarily the amount of new faces in the starting line-up, per se, as, presumably, that could be a good thing, if there were many bad-apples or, quite simply, a lack in quality, that needed addressing. The problem is that, if you add so many new starters, the remaining core has to not only be the absolute cream of the crop in terms of attitude (bleeding.. well.. red.. lool), but also far more reliable/influential, quality-wise.. else, there's not enough strong personalities to guide the newcomers, impressing the values of what it means to be a Red (or what we'd like it to mean, going forward).

I think that, this time around, there is far more quality to work with, and the likes of Caldwell, Bradley, Gilberto, Morrow, a more seasoned/hungry (after an injury-plagued year) Oso, and one or two others that will particularly drive the culture in a positive direction, along with a number of other starters perhaps not quite as "rah-rah," but lending to the cohesion/consistency, all the same. 2015, for me, feels like the first time we could really have a shot at putting it all together, properly, and it's refreshing to see someone like Vanney setting very specific and detailed targets.

At the minute, we need two new CB's (one stud, one not-quite, to challenge for back-up mins.), proper, stud DM (freeing Bradley to play box-to-box, a la Yaya Toure), a proper, bona fide AM (stopping the over-reliance on Bradley to create), a solid back-up at striker, and a back-up/starting, left-sided winger—that's four to five potential new starters.. so, an improvement, to be sure, with the remaining "core" FAR more worthy of the moniker.

It's not perfect, but could be something special, next season. =)

[gdg_9]

Agreed.

We also saw, I think, six or seven new starters come into the side, this year (Gilberto/Moore, Defoe, Bradley, Morrow, Jackson, Oduro/Lovitz, and sometimes Hagglund/Creavalle), with one or two of the advertised remaining "core" of players not quite 100% ready for prime-time, on a seriously contending side (or, at least, question-marks on how they will respond to serious starting responsibilities over the likes of Henry, Oso/Bekker, and Bloom)—hardly a solid foundation on which to shift the culture.

The problem isn't necessarily the amount of new faces in the starting line-up, per se, as, presumably, that could be a good thing, if there were many bad-apples or, quite simply, a lack in quality, that needed addressing. The problem is that, if you add so many new starters, the remaining core has to not only be the absolute cream of the crop in terms of attitude (bleeding.. well.. red.. lool), but also far more reliable/influential, quality-wise.. else, there's not enough strong personalities to guide the newcomers, impressing the values of what it means to be a Red (or what we'd like it to mean, going forward).

I think that, this time around, there is far more quality to work with, and the likes of Caldwell, Bradley, Gilberto, Morrow, a more seasoned/hungry (after an injury-plagued year) Oso, and one or two others that will particularly drive the culture in a positive direction, along with a number of other starters perhaps not quite as "rah-rah," but lending to the cohesion/consistency, all the same. 2015, for me, feels like the first time we could really have a shot at putting it all together, properly, and it's refreshing to see someone like Vanney setting very specific and detailed targets.

At the minute, we need two new CB's (one stud, one not-quite, to challenge for back-up mins.), proper, stud DM (freeing Bradley to play box-to-box, a la Yaya Toure), a proper, bona fide AM (stopping the over-reliance on Bradley to create), a solid back-up at striker, and a back-up/starting, left-sided winger—that's four to five potential new starters.. so, an improvement, to be sure, with the remaining "core" FAR more worthy of the moniker.

It's not perfect, but could be something special, next season. =)

This, 100%!

For me, this post hits the nail right on the head.

[TFCwestcan]

I am wondering if we can just quietly close tis thread...

[Ossington Mental Youth]

pls!!!

[brad]

I'll never understand why people complain about a thread like this. It's called "The Collected Laba Rumours/News/Speculation Thread". It's pretty easy to just not open the thread if you don't care about the topic.

[Fort York Redcoat]

I am wondering if we can just quietly close tis thread...

I'll never understand why people complain about a thread like this. It's called "The Collected Laba Rumours/News/Speculation Thread". It's pretty easy to just not open the thread if you don't care about the topic.

There is no quiet. The thread is active and respectful and for the most part on topic.

Having a look at fb lately on the subject will give one a better taste of how good this convo is in comparison.

Carry on.

Also - It's MLS. Laba's contract IIRC isn't for life. We may see him again. Stranger things have happened and will again.