Yesterday, I refrained from posting that DeVos should be punched in the dink for saying something similar.Originally Posted by ManUtd4ever
You are a supporter, though, and have no ulterior motive.. so, I wouldn't fault you for being hopeful. Please, though, no one else say this.
We should know better than that. Until we go 0-0-34 there is plenty of room to go down.
Like I said last night, we've PROVEN ONE THING in 7-years - things CAN ALWAYS GET WORSE!
"...Money wasn't tight, but it like, it wasn't right..."
Given the level of performance we were expecting yesterday, I really don't think any of this matters. We were up a man against a terribly weak squad for 70+ minutes. Chivas is about as low-rent of a squad as you can get. I wouldn't be surprised if they were pulling a New England and not even spending up to the salary cap so they can get a rebate from the league.
Current management has made some mistakes, this isn't just about Paul Mainer or waiting for signings. I'm certainly waiting to see what we bring in, but I don't think we have any indication if Ryan Nelsen can coach yet or if Kevin Payne can still hack it in MLS.
This is what I was more or less trying to get at in the "Today's News" thread. I'm certainly not about to start the "Nelsen Out!" chants at this point, but he has to be on notice after last night. I realize there are growing pains for him as well, but you'd think he'd be able to get something out of last night, even with the players at his disposal which were mostly HIS players. We had a man advantage against a crap team for 70 minutes FFS! Just sick and tired of managers learning on the job with us, like this club serves the purpose of training wheels or something. If he shows no improvement by the end of the season, even with the extra signings (which I'm assured are still coming) I think you have to reconsider whether he's the person to lead us forward.
Well all I gotta say from watching TFC as of late is on Saturday it is either the NYRB / TFC game for me or the neighbour's kid's birthday party/BBQ and I am leaning towards the neighbour's kids party.....as sad as that is. Going to be real pissed to drive all the way down to BMO to see another drab performance...against a higher powered team this time. Going to be ugly.
Maybe Leiweke should spend some cash on a good coach...what's Guus Hiddink up to?
O, Maple Leaf around the world, You speak as you rise high above,
Of courage, peace and quiet strength, Of the Canada that I love.
Remind us all, our union bound by ties we cannot sever,
Bright flag revered on every ground, The Maple Leaf forever
Mancini is looking for a job lol
I just hope this dump and chase football ends, once we get more technical players i hope he changes the way we play...4 4 2 is meh..id like to eventually see 4 2 3 1 or 4 3 1 2
I would expect us to win under such conditions, and I am playing devils advocate a bit here, but I still don't think there is enough basis to go on until we see the players brought in the window. These are "his guys", but are they the guys he intends to be the starters, or the plumbers that every team needs to have in order to fit a roster under the cap? The guys you expect to step in every now and then, cover for an injury here and there? Depth in the MLS sucks, plain and simple, and it remains to be seen if we are just seeing the depth, or if we are seeing the roots of yet another poorly assembled team.
What we played last night was really a 4-1-3-2 where the 3 in the middle were pretty much in the middle.
Actually, I'm trying to remember if Osorio ever attacked a FB?
I think Nelsen may be making the rookie mistake of assuming his players can line up in any old formation IF it counters the other team.
Last night, he initially lined them up as a 442, shifted it to a 4-1-3-2 and had Osorio and Convey change sides, so that they were cutting in on their stronger foot instead of playing outside, then in the second half shifted it back to a 442 with Osorio and Convey playing wide (and Braun up top) and gave up going inside.
There's one rather enormous problem with not finding a system and playing it for a while: the team doesn't find any cohesion.
Winter did this, so did Mo. It's the belief that "tactical adaption" is the way to win, when in fact it's the players' familiarity with each other. If they're familiar with where they'll move to, where their runs are likely to be, and what their roles are, we might actually build something cohesive.
But all this shifting players around, starting it on the floor, going to long balls later ... I don't think it's player panic; I think Nelsen is making tactical shifts on the fly. We're not good enough for that; not nearly good enough. Small changes are one thing; switching formations and player positions is quite something else.
The reason smaller clubs like Orlando and Atlanta (and any club in scotland or League 1 in England) look more cohesive than us is that they play a system. A team full of superstars will beat them; but a team of equivalent talent will have a hard time with them unless equally disciplined.
We don't lack skill right now, not completely; but our players will never have composure unless we pick a system and stick to it, let them get accustomed to singular positional roles. Hell, like I said in another thread, play the zonal 4-5-1 (4-2-3-1) for a while so that they're each responsible for a channel, fight two ways. At least we'd have a chance at winning.
I'd have to admit what we saw last night was mostly "plumbers". Out of the players who started, only Bendik, Laba, Caldwell, and Osorio, and maybe, depending on his development, Agboss, are long-term starters under Payne and Nelsen's "plan". But still, it's Nelsen's "externalizing" I don't like. Always excuses. At some point, you just have to make use of the cards you've been dealt. Yes, the 'cavalry is coming' - and we've been hearing that for the last 4 months. But at some point, you just have to dig down and get results with what you've got. Every other team in this league does it. Heck, Chivas managed to somehow do it last night.
Another game another bad miss by Brockie, like his determination, but his finishing isn't great, a bit like Barrett in that sense, plenty of hustle and bustle, but not much return in the way of goals. Although in his defence the lack of forward passing from our central mid is awful. The sooner we get a centre mid who has vision and can actually thread a through ball to our strikers, the better. Poor distribution from the wings also again. Crossing was awful esp Bekker and Morgan, with Convey not too far behind. Earnshaw looked the most dangerous but when he was replaced by Braun at half, I knew we wouldn't score
Guess the personalaty?
The boys are gutted, its harder v 10 men, if only we got them chances in the first half, we played better than them but, were down to the barebones but, the lads played well but.
New speech writer is required at this time as he is running out of excuses.
I always wanted relegation, not because we would win, but because it would stop this charade that we are competitive. We are not, we have never been (at least not for a full season), and right now if we were in Europe we would be in Serie C. OR after one year management would get serious and put a competitive team together.
Enough of the positive, at some points it is useless when the results, game in, game out, season in, season out, are the same. I supported the new coach,but I will soon have to say that he had a change and that he needs to go. We need to show more then we are. Whatever the team the manager has, there just has not been enough of a promise, in any aspect of the game.
Relegation would have destroyed this franchise a long time ago. It doesn't work in North America. The vast majority of fans in this city will not attend games against 2nd and 3rd division clubs. It's a tough enough sell as it is.
You'd think; but a poll a couple of years ago on SBI had the majority favoring it.
It may be too early, but eventually owners will realize that there can be as much (or more) profit in a salary-capped second division club as a first, and that most fans will stay for ATMOSPHERE and CLUB LOYALTY .... if it's done right. TFC was fortunate in that the community was pining for anything that resembled North America's top flight, and handed that atmosphere to them (quite literally, if you consider how much public money went into the whole thing).
Other clubs like Seattle and Portland were ideal to follow that because they had big cities with small pro sports offerings, and a lot of people waiting for something around which to create a fan community.
That's what proper pro football is for most of us. A fan community. People don't go to Oxford Utd. and Norwich games because they ever expect them to win the Premiership. But they still go. Some clubs even make money, if they're not stupid about their spending (aided over here by salary caps).
Relegation could work in North America but it would have to be done carefully, and only after the proper infrastructure (good soccer stadiums) was in place, and with a closely allied second division, where the clubs kicked off on the first day with strong supporter club support, insane game day atmosphere, local marketing out the wazoo, etc.
Even then, it would probably work best if only one team faced potential relegation, and had to lose a playoff against the second div champ. As we've seen from our own site yesterday and today, if a team is pathetic enough, their fans will accept relegation can actually be a good thing.
MLS teams individually rely too much on TV revenue to consider such an option.
Positives from last night: Osorio looked pretty good. Russell looked better playing football than when he is just out there to kill someone.
Negatives: Everything else.
Osorio (and perhaps Bendik) are the only good things to have come out of this season so far.
If he would only catch a few balls instead of punching 95% of them, then maybe ?
Osorio, Laba and the physio and kit guy, they are worth keeping.
Bendik is still very rough around the edges in some areas, and clearly needs work. Not nearly a finished article yet. But he's shown enough that he can be the #1 keeper going forward.
Just a twist here
If we had Forlan running onto them crosses instead of Brockie, would we be talking about a win?
Was there a game last night?!
Seriously though - it kinda saddens me that I didn't even blink any eye, didn't even look at the result until the morning, haven't read a report, not surprised that we lost, even less surprised we lost to the only club lower than TFC with one less player for the majority of the game.
It isn't natural for me not to care!
Well, that was fun ..
If we had Koevermans we'd be talking about a win I think. He would have easily scored on that chance Brockie missed. Could have turned the game.
They have the worst TV revenue of any pro sport in North America. A few seasons ago, DC didn't even have a TV partner for one year and people had to listen to radio. The new NBC deal doesn't really change the fact that it's not their biggest revenue issue, yet.
Damn, I ended up watching the highlights from your comment!
I thought it actually looked like a bit of a penalty - the Chivas player had Brockies back leg. Whether that meant Brockie couldn't reach the ball with his right leg isn't clear, but it was still a very clumsy challenge in the box.
On the other hand, Osorio should definitely have had a penalty at the end, 100%.
We'd probably be lower trane. TFC have been in the bottom 3 of the league (both conferences combined) every season except for 2009 and 2010.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote