Haha that's funny. They made the wolrd cup(2010), and guess what, did not loose a game to Italy, Paraguay, Slovakia. Please, come back to me when Canada scores let alone ties any of these nations. Also, I bet you Nelson is better than any the of CB's on the Canadian roster.Originally Posted by TFC07
Last edited by Richard; 05-29-2013 at 05:24 PM.
They had very easy qualification route to WC compare to Canada. Currently, Canada is ranked higher than New Zealand. So yeah, thanks for the laugh and poor attempt to defend NZ. FYI: Canada recently draw against USA and score recently against Japan (another quality team).
First off, FIFA rankings are bullshit. Its not an accurate reflection of world football, New Zealand is not going to go higher than 30 just because of teams it faces, the rankings reflect who you play and winning against American Samoa isn't going to help you. I'm not saying NZ is far ahead of Canada, but to completely disregard them and their accomplishments is a bit ridiculous. Going to the World Cup and performing is something Canada hasn't done. New Zealand's performances in the WC should be enough to say they deserved to be there. Last few meaningful games for Canada have been a disaster, you cant say that for NZ. I disregard all friendlies fyI.
You realize that New Zealand plays in Oceania right? I am not saying they are terrible but it is vastly easier to qualify out of Oceania when your toughest opposition is Tahiti. Heck, NZ got knocked out by New Caledonia in the OFC Nation's Cup and didn't score a goal against them. And our main striker right now is from Wales. A country with 4 professional football teams (canada now has 5) and hasn't made a world cup appearance since 1956! And as mentioned we have a winger starting every game who is from Bermuda!!! Also, no offense to our New Zealanders on the forum. I am not trying to put you guys down, I am just saying you are around the same level as Canada. And if NZ is viable options for footballers then so is Canada.
Does they other guy think players like Hutchinson, Simpson, Edgar, Dejong, Hainault, Nakajima-Farran, Johnson, De Rosario, Jackson, Bernier, Occean ect could not walk into our starting 11 and make a huge improvement? Ever Ledgerwood would be an improvement over Richter.
And for all of the people who support TFC and look down on Canada, you support a team in Canada that will for ever be linked to the CMNT through player quotas and our location. Get use to it.
Loosing 2-0 to New Caledonia in the AFC Nation's Cup semi finals?
I didn't say they were much better than us, just not worse. I'm not looking down on Canada if that was pointed at me.
No, that part wasn't for you but just the attitude some people on here give towards Canada. I agree NZ and Canada are around the same level. And neither country should be outright dismissed for footballers especially Canada with roster regulations.
So this thread is about scouting right? So I think it's safe to assume that every Canadian MLS team was represented by a scout and they's be watching both sides for talent.
No need to get so defensive or aggresive about it. I'm not happy about the loss, the teams present standing or their performance but it's been touched upon that comparing us to other countries in other regions is naive or at least only a bit of the story.
C'mon the Gold Cup. We'll see the bestfrom this game with the very few veterans that could rise above the taint of the last cycle.
Last edited by Fort York Redcoat; 05-29-2013 at 07:59 PM.
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
IMO this argument doesn't work since the Canadian players you mention would make a heck of a lot more than the players you're suggesting they're better than. IMO very few of those players would be better value than our current League Championship rental stopgaps.
LMAO! That says it all! Also, Canada been historically better than NZ in soccer.
Anyway, Canada recently have been playing more of their younger and inexperience players against WC quality teams with exception of one team. Result haven't been number one priority for Canada. It's all about giving experience to new generation Canadian players to prepare them for Gold Cup and beyond. So don't judge on their recent friendly results.
Last edited by TFC07; 05-29-2013 at 08:18 PM.
I think someone like Hainault (proven MLS player) and younger player (maybe someone like Edwini-Bonsu) is better example to use. Those are type of players that TFC should target and be able to sign to decent contract.
thats it right there why wasn't Osorio started earlier! Same old British patronizing coaching.....lets not go out on a limb geez we might find some talent. No courage to find a spark. youth , talent, it's called inspiration...not by the way, BS. All soccer nations with a fire will always dominate us because they live, breath the sport . Its a way of life. We're so docile , ollowing a plan that fools no one. If I see a kid with fire in his eyes thats who I want out there. We can't even recognize them yet. And if we do we call them up we ignore them so they can play our planned , controlled approach. Our FO's have no balls. until we do . We're wanna b's.
ALL HELL'S BROKEN LOOSEhttp://gfycat.com/SharpKindArrowana
For starters, most of these guys are attached to teams, and the one guy I do see who isn't attached and I wouldn't mind suiting up for TFC is Jackson - but he wouldn't be worth the DP money IMO. Yes - some of these guys on the NT are very talented, but you take them away from their talented club teams and they are...well...the CMNT. That isn't what TFC needs. TFC needs guys who can execute no matter who is around them. The Earnshaw's and Koeverman's are what we should be looking for. Players with a proven track record of delivering the goods no matter where they have played in their careers. Not Ledgerwood's or Edgar's.
As I said before - If we are looking to fill a Canadian quota, I'd rather them do it through the academy. If you can build the players you want, might as well be Canadians.
Lumping Ledgerwood with Edgar is apples and oranges... On a full-strength CMNT squad, Edgar is a mainstay, while Ledgerwood MIGHT make the bench.
I would LOVE Edgar on TFC... He'd be a definite improvement on any FB we currently have, and that has nothing to do with the fact he is a local boy from Kitchener (that's just an added bonus).
The problem is, we cannot afford a guy like Edgar. He has much better options elsewhere in the world, and would likely demand DP wages if he were to consider coming home to MLS.
He could definitely help TFC on the field, but he also definitely isn't worth DP money in a salary capped league.
Should target? Yes. Could aquire? No. If Hainault finally comes home to Canada he won't be choosing Toronto or Vancouver to play in front of his "home crowd". I wonder how Will Johnson would feel if things don't turn around for him leading Portland? I wonder if Payne and Jako get along?
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
I am just using them as examples of type of players that TFC should target and able to sign to a reasonable contract. Hainault probably go back to Houston if he can't land a job in Europe.
However, I agree with Jabbronies that academy is the way to go in the long term. Signing local young talented players for cheap is going to benefit us a lot more in the long haul.
REB has a pretty good game, he's more than just an athlete. At the right price we'd be stupid not to, pace alone will make him a factor.
His problem is that he has "Canada syndrome" around the net. Look at the main difference in that game last night, Costa Rica will punish you on half a chance with their second tier strikers, while Canada scuffs balls into the stands consistently.
I'd actually say NZ and Canada are quite similar football-wise - both in size and in comparison to their close neighbours (USA, Australia) who have bigger populations and more success. You can say that it's easier qualification for us - but in the long run, it's actually harder. It's impossible to improve as a nation when the only games you play are against Island nations and we basically never play friendlies because we can't afford to.
If Canada had to play the Islands on pitches with ten thousand pot holes, I guarantee they would struggle too.
Only Canadian players i've seen are Nakajima-Farran - who didn't exactly set the league alight - and Alen Marcina.
Last edited by valeo; 05-31-2013 at 12:01 AM.
Lol. Edgar is a beast with a lot of game and would be a cornerstone to TFC akin to Laba, although that's not happening. Earnshaw might not even be back next year and frankly his mediocre play doesn't necessitate it. Where have his goals been? A PK and the same terrible opposition mistakes in successive games which he won't see again...it was like a winning lottery ticket. He's not some star, he got pushed out of the Championship.
I agree, there are a lot of similarities and parity between the associations. TFC07 has been a bit naive.
I'm not shitting on Edgar...If you actually read my post in full you'll see that I didn't knock his abilities. READ BELOW
This is it right here.
This post sums up why we shouldn't be looking at CMNT players.
The shit players are shit and are nothing more than bench warmers and the decent players are not worth the wages.
There isn't a Canadian player on the NT that is worth DP money...We need to come to the realization that CMNT players are not DP quality players. They are not guys who can elevate a whole team to the next level. And the players who are not DP quality...well why would you waste your time bringing them in when you can build the same player though the academy at a cheaper cost.
We're still at a point where we over value home players. I'm going to enjoy the Canadians that come through the academy and get limited play with us but as soon as they develop to starters and beyond I'm afraid if they don't move on and shine elsewhere they'll be hurt by the spotlight of playing at home.
It's a culture we should adopt that is in most places in the world except for those very few places that have the best clubs and country programs.
I hope for a time that returning Canada players want to help and play for the home crowd that cheered them at the start of their career.
IT will be a challenge for any player who tries to be a DeRo that actually gets his DP status and spends his entire career here.
FORMER FULL TIME KOOL-AID DRINKER
How did you arrive at the inaccurate conclusion that CMNT players = DP? Many of them do not command DP money. It is amusing you vouch for Earnshaw though, a washed up Championship player we're considering spending substantial cap on.
The only CMNT worth grabbing are going to command DP money.
I like Earnshaw. He's a natural striker, you can see it in the way he plays. If he got better service, He'd be scoring more I have no doubt about that. But right now he gets the ball outside the 18 - not good for a guy like him.
I don't agree with spending tons of cash on Earnshaw. League max would be waaaaaaay too much. But he'd be worth like 150-200K - assuming he'll score another 5-10 goals before the end of the season.
They won’t all cost DP money, it’s unlikely that we’d be looking at anyone for that kind of spot anyway. We don’t have to like every player or every circumstance, but we’d be crazy to write the entire category off. Will Johnson came back to MLS , did well in this league, didn’t cost DP money. So did Hainault at one point, so did Attakora, so did Bernier. I see a few guys out there right now who could potentially make a difference, why eliminate that possibility?
Past experience was about how stupid our front office staff was, not the broad category of players.
To answer the OP, Pat Onstad attended the game in person.
As soon as MLS changes the rules and allows 5+ DPs and a salary cap of around $10M then we should do this. Until then, you get what you can squeeze under around $3M.Does they other guy think players like Hutchinson, Simpson, Edgar, Dejong, Hainault, Nakajima-Farran, Johnson, De Rosario, Jackson, Bernier, Occean ect could not walk into our starting 11 and make a huge improvement? Ever Ledgerwood would be an improvement over Richter.
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