Time for results

[trane]

I have been more patient and positive this year, because I like that we brought Payne in, and like what Nelsen is trying to do.

But I have to confess, that while I am not really worried YET, I am starting to wonder when do we say OK we have seen enough of Nelsen and he is not getting it done.

For me it will be in the next 5-10 games I think that If we do not see improvement and some results, I will have to say that Nelsen is not cutting it. I am not saying he even has a winning record during that stretch but we need to start getting points, and YES show us that you can win a game or two, otherwise, we need to start looking for a new manager for next year. AGAIN at this point I am not expecting the playoffs that is done, I kind of believe that Nelsen has what it takes for us to win, BUT we need some results to confirm that belief.


I do not think it is unreasonable.

[Yohan]

Nelsen is not getting fired this season, even if TFC doesn't win a single game. It's just not KP's style

[Initial B]

Nelsen is Payne's man. he won't be going anywhere so long as Payne is Prez. I see him leaving TFC in 5 years to take a stab a coaching in Europe.

[brad]

^^Summer transfer window. My big question is and has been whether or not they have players/moves lined up for this summer. It could be we are were we are now because they have some more of the missing pieces lined up, but they are not available until contracts in Europe expire. It could also be that they are fumbling around and unless we strike luck in the summer we will continue to suck.

It will be interesting to see what sort of moves are made in the summer, and when. Should it all be pre-planned and sorted, I'd expect we would see movement early in the window.

[TOBOR !]

Deja Vu

Every year, I find myself more at odds with what seems to be the pervailing RPB/TFC supporters culutre. This year, I cannot believe what low expectations so many of the supporters have set for this team. FOR FUCK SAKES this is year SEVEN, yes we are rebuiling again but this is the MLS, you have to demand more. This club can win this year, but they will not if there is not pressure on them.

I have like what I have see on the field ( in relative terms of course) but they need to get results. Supporters should tell them, we need to see results, and not once again, well it takes time....

[Phil]

I am still waiting till August, in the same boat as brad, just want to see what the next steps are in the plan. They have had a good long time to evaluate after getting this team rammed onto them. The recent signings are not confidence inspiring but at least they are showing their concern over some areas. We need defenders that can play a full game and more creativity in midfiled and wing. Fingers crossed.

[trane]

Deja Vu

I am actually not really in the same mind set, as I was last year. I did not agree that we should start the year, asking for nothing. But as I have said I have seen enough to think that we are moving in the right direction. I just think, as I said, that at some point we do need to see some results, to be able to stay behing the club.

Yohan says Nelsen gets the year. I would not be thrilled about that if we start noticeably sliding back, but I can live with it if we show some growth. I cannot accept that he would get five years not matter what.

I am OK with Phil and Brad's position on the issue.

[Yohan]

I am actually not really in the same mind set, as I was last year. I did not agree that we should start the year, asking for nothing. But as I have said I have seen enough to think that we are moving in the right direction. I just think, as I said, that at some point we do need to see some results, to be able to stay behing the club.

Yohan says Nelsen gets the year. I would not be thrilled about that if we start noticeably sliding back, but I can live with it if we show some growth. I cannot accept that he would get five years not matter what.

I am OK with Phil and Brad's position on the issue.

Nelsen gets a year, plus more, because if MLSE head honchos accept that this is a rebuilding year, you give managers time to sort themselves out, esp if you understand that Nelsen has a steep learning curve, and willing to accept that he's going to make a lot of mistakes.

I'm going to bet Nelsen at 2 years. 1 yr to put a squad together, the next year to see if that squad gets results.

[Fort York Redcoat]

The coach gets the year.

I can't help but think he'll keep getting players until they can perform right out of the gate.

[Couchy81]

I am pretty sure no one wants to go through yet another coaching change at this point. If I was willing to give Winter the time, I will also give Nelsen the time. 10 games from now if we are still a turd then I'll be worried, but I'll still give him the time.

[ag futbol]

Deja Vu

This is one of those quotes I have sympathy for, yet I don't.

Yes, this club needs to produce more for its fans.

No, the people in charge can't fix the problem right away. They are also not the ones who got us into this mess. Just because we've been screwed over for so long doesn't mean we can have the instant success.

My compromise is that I've cut my spend and keep track of things from a distance. I'm not jumping in with both feet at the sign of the latest plan or promise of success. But I'm not going to completely abandon the club either.

[Initial B]

I didn't mean to imply that Nelsen would still be here if the Year 5 team is as inept as this year's team. But I do see him getting then next two years to build the team and his coaching skills. I think in 2015 it will all come together and we'll get to the playoffs, at which point it will be only natural to keep Nelsen around at that point. If 2015 starts out like 2013, then yes, Nelsen should get the boot. But remember, TFC has never, EVER, given a coach more than 18 months to turn things around. I think the organization and the supporters need to resist the urge to mash the panic button for at least three years (please, someone hide it somewhere) and be patient.

[Oldtimer]

It's not time for results. Results are for next year. Relax and don't stress yourself, you'll feel a lot better.

As Jeremy said:

everyone would feel better it they accepted that this season was a write-off before it started.

It's totally unrealistic that the worst team in the world would become something good a 3 months. At least TFC is no longer worst in the world, it's not even worst in the league, although it's still a totally crappy team. Baby steps.

We'll begin to see Payne's team after the transfer window, and more next January. What's here now are temp agency players... just a fill-in until the real team comes.

[Ultra & Proud]

TFC has never, EVER, given a coach more than 18 months to turn things around. I think the organization and the supporters need to resist the urge to mash the panic button for at least three years (please, someone hide it somewhere) and be patient.

Relevant because it's been our problem for 6+ seasons : http://www.torontosun.com/2013/05/21...st-like-burkie

You'd think that some of the people around here who've watched this show in the past would get with the program now but it seems this is one of the biggest knee jerk, bandwagon sports markets in the world.

[Canary10]

The panic the fans go through causes the club to panic, leading to bad DP signings, firing coaches, getting rid of decent players, etc. For once let's just get behind the guys we have and not worry about results right now. There'll be time next year for that. As Oldtimer/Jloome said, the playoffs were never in the cards this year anyway. Let's not do the knee jerk thing.

[Abou Sky]

I have been more patient and positive this year, because I like that we brought Payne in, and like what Nelsen is trying to do.

But I have to confess, that while I am not really worried YET, I am starting to wonder when do we say OK we have seen enough of Nelsen and he is not getting it done.

For me it will be in the next 5-10 games I think that If we do not see improvement and some results, I will have to say that Nelsen is not cutting it. I am not saying he even has a winning record during that stretch but we need to start getting points, and YES show us that you can win a game or two, otherwise, we need to start looking for a new manager for next year. AGAIN at this point I am not expecting the playoffs that is done, I kind of believe that Nelsen has what it takes for us to win, BUT we need some results to confirm that belief.


I do not think it is unreasonable.

My take is after the summer transfer window.

There are only 13 games after the end of the summer transfer window (19 if you include all games after the start of the opening of the transfer window) I figure we should end the season on a very positive note for me to say 'this was a sucessful year' something like 5-3-5 or better.

[Abou Sky]

Relevant because it's been our problem for 6+ seasons : http://www.torontosun.com/2013/05/21...st-like-burkie

You'd think that some of the people around here who've watched this show in the past would get with the program now but it seems this is one of the biggest knee jerk, bandwagon sports markets in the world.

+1million!

Toronto sports fans have the attention span of gnats.

[tfcleeds]

I for one didn't have any expectations for this season, other than perhaps exceeding last years' wins/points total (which really shouldn't be that difficult). At least on the scoreboard, we've been in every game so far (Montreal in CC excepted), and were it not for some costly last minute defensive lapses, we'd be in a much better position. At least matches haven't been over by HT, like they were on many occasions last season. That surely, is some sign of progress, although our late-game meltdowns haven't ceased being a problem.

[McBrace]

My God, not another coaching change. This season is to tear down and build. As Leeds mentioned we're competing, just not the entire match... One season isn't patience, actually far from it. Management have walked into a club with little talent, and bloated salaries. No coach in the world is going to make much of a difference with that. Pulling the plug on RN would be insane.

[trane]

^ This is why I am still positive. But I do hope to see something more. After the summer transfer window is not a bad time period, again not for us to be a world beater but to see real growth and some points.

I do not accept that in this league and with these players WE cannot do anything but drop point. Sure we cannot be world class, but we could be doing better then we are. I am sure Nelsen would expect better so far. That is why I like him as a manager.

[trane]

My problem with a complete give him all season no matter what stance, is that you are pretty well giving him a season do learn but you are not evaluating his performance. Why do that? What is the logic in that? If he had gone the season without a point and will less goals for and twice the goals against, why keep him??? There has to be some evaluation during the season to evaluate if he is really the coach to built around.

This is not knee jerk bandwagon jumping, its logic. You do not keep someone around just because, he has to have shown that he is the guy. And in my eyes to do so, we need to show some result and more growth.

[v00d00daddy]

As Oldtimer/Jloome said, the playoffs were never in the cards this year anyway. Let's not do the knee jerk thing.

While I agree about being patient I think you guys need to understand that it's hard to say "wait until next year" with any sense of confidence when you have the guy at the top saying shit like this:

"We have been in every single game in MLS," Payne said. "We have managed to find a unique series of ways to shoot ourselves in the foot, but I actually don't think we've been outplayed in a game yet this year."

and when he talks about the playoffs like this how can anyone question people who, at the very least, expect a result here or there?

"I do believe by the end of the season we will be in the conversation for the playoffs," he said. "We've dug ourselves a bit of a hole, but I think that we will with a win or two we'll be able to crawl out of that hole rather quickly,"

Maybe we should focus less on telling fellow supporters to temper their expectations when the GM of the club isn't doing the same.

[QBall]

TFC as an organization is already a laughing stock with the number of coaching changes since it's inception. If they fire Nelsen at the end of the season then we should start wearing big red noses and clown wigs to the games in order to be properly be part of the circus.

[trane]

^ We are the laughing stock of the league because despite so much promise and support we have not come close to being a winning organization. The coaches are the bi-product of that futility.

And no one is calling for the firing of Nelsen.

[gate7]

whats better?.... 1 win in 10 (3 pts) with Winter or no wins in 10 (4 pts) with Nelson? If we lose next game that will be my survey question. So basically im giving it ! more game...... of-course the 'clowns' are new but the circus is the same.

[gate7]

not calling for the firing of Nelson ether......just saying

[FluSH]

If we fire any more coaches... Who on earth will want to come coach for us?

This stop is the last stop in the career bus...

[TFC07]

Problem with this team is that they're regressing not improving (meaning they're going opposite direction of rebuilding this team). This should be a worrying sign for us. I agree we can't judge Nelsen too harshly now, but after summer window, this team will be different. That is when we can start be more demanding for results because KP and co will have their players by then.

The only way Nelsen is let go is if we can get some experience (winning) manager take over this team which isn't going to happen. So we have no choice, but remain patience with Nelsen for this season. However, Nelsen needs to start picking up results some point in this season to gives us hope for next season (that's when we can determine if Nelsen is up to task or not).

[Rudy]

Does anyone know why Nelson didnt do the post-game interview last Sat?

[Prof]

The panic the fans go through causes the club to panic, leading to bad DP signings, firing coaches, getting rid of decent players, etc. For once let's just get behind the guys we have and not worry about results right now. There'll be time next year for that. As Oldtimer/Jloome said, the playoffs were never in the cards this year anyway. Let's not do the knee jerk thing.

The footy they are playing is much better than last year. Support the team and the results will come.