Matt Stinson waived

[DangerRed]

Here's a record he'll hold for a while:

Stinson is the all time club leader in goals scored against Red Star Belgrade.

Bahahaha. Awesome.

[Mark in Ottawa]

Good luck in the future Matt and thanks for the efforts on behalf of TFC.
I am sure you will land on your feet somewhere and end up getting some regular playing time.

[Alonso]

He very frequently played out of position, added absolutely nothing/was invisible in midfield, in 25 games he recorded two assists and cost us many more goals, very much like Terry. And yes, "loser" is appropriate here: he, like Dunfield, was a core part of the very horrible year we had last year. Period full stop. Say what you will about being called up early, or not being given a chance by the regime, but the record speaks for itself.

But, nontheless, look at the comment made by MKR: people love Dunfield, and sure as shit, people will love Matt Stinson.

I love comments like, "Oh, but he had all this potential and showed a lot of promise." Did he? Show me. Because Ryan Nelsen and Kevin Payne know a shitload more about football than you, and they don't see it either.

Bottom line is that coming up through the Academy program to perform with true-to-form mediocrity should not be qualifications for celebrating someone's time with TFC. But obviously to you they are.

Dunfield has stuck around through THREE coaching changes.

You're obviously a better judgement of talent then Winter, Mariner, Payne, and Nelsen...

He has something to offer this team... is he the next coming of christ? No, but give the guy a break.

He has also scored some big goals for us.

You must be trolling with this shit.

[Alonso]

you're the only person to whom the word "loser" is applicable to in this thread.

lol +1

[DangerRed]

Dunfield has stuck around through THREE coaching changes.

You're obviously a better judgement of talent then Winter, Mariner, Payne, and Nelsen...

He has something to offer this team... is he the next coming of christ? No, but give the guy a break.

He has also scored some big goals for us.

You must be trolling with this shit.

You're right. I'm trolling. There's zero merit to what I'm saying, Terry Dunfield should consistently be starting in midfield, and unlike in every game until now, he will become brilliant sheerly through force of will and hard work.

Again, there's just no point here with you guys sometimes. The moment you disagree, you're trolling. I'm done.

[Alonso]

question has to be asked again why TFC never loaned these players out. Stinson showed great amount of improvement when he received first-team minutes. See a guy like Bright Dike stink go from a first round pick to being cut to stinking it up to being loaned out and coming back to the point where he gets a call up to the Nigerian National Team. I understand why these players are cut; I don't understand why loans couldn't have happened so these guys could get first-team minutes, get better, and then be re-evaluated based on having on-the-field learning experiences.

look at Milos Kocic; his loan deal did wonders for him.



Thierry Henry on Matt Stinson “The right back Stinson had an amazing game.”

Here is the link to the news article: http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/spor...-fc-62304.html

Matt should take this article, print it off, put it up on his wall and take it to heart.

When Thierry Henry says something like that about your game it means something...

DangerRed... not so much.

[Alonso]

You're right. I'm trolling. There's zero merit to what I'm saying, Terry Dunfield should consistently be starting in midfield, and unlike in every game until now, he will become brilliant sheerly through force of will and hard work.

Again, there's just no point here with you guys sometimes. The moment you disagree, you're trolling. I'm done.

You didn't address the fact that he has been started by THREE different coaches who have addressed his talent?

I think it's you that is blinded and unwilling to address the fact that you have an unwarranted hate on for Dunfield.

Like I said in my post, he isn't the second coming of christ, but he is a serviceable player who has happened to score some game winning goals for us and 1 awesome goal against Vancouver at home.

[Alonso]

Why do I even bother? I mean, how do I actually argue with someone like you? Ignored...

Please ignore me as well.

[OgtheDim]

You know, I was wondering why a thread about Stinson got to 3 pages in 6 hours.





Well that's 10 minutes of my life I'm not getting back.

[T-boy]

You know, I was wondering why a thread about Stinson got to 3 pages in 6 hours.





Well that's 10 minutes of my life I'm not getting back.

Man alive, I totally agree! If anybody reads this post first - don't do back and read pages 1 and 2. Stinson got cut, end of story. There's nothing else worthy to read in this thread! Seriously guys, stop the in fighting! We all support the same team here!

[Abou Sky]

Man alive, I totally agree! If anybody reads this post first - don't do back and read pages 1 and 2. Stinson got cut, end of story. There's nothing else worthy to read in this thread! Seriously guys, stop the in fighting! We all support the same team here!

IMO a bit of banter about players is alright, just don't take it to heart or be venomous to people.

I like Terry D, I think he is pretty good and if not starting he should at the very least be on the bench for most/all games.

I don't see this debate ending any time soon.

That said, the point that he has made it through that many coaches is a pretty good one. (he was also on the Can MNT)

[prizby]

Why do I even bother? I mean, how do I actually argue with someone like you? Ignored...

i agree with FYRC, might as well hit ignore for me as well...I'll take Henry's word over your word any day of the week when it comes to evaluating a player

[Jpexxx]

http://www.dcunited.com/news/2013/03...chmond-kickers

Thought this might be relevant, to bring the convo back on topic.

"D.C. United today announced that the Club will be loaning four players to the Richmond Kickers this season as part of the two clubs’ landmark affiliation agreement. Forward Casey Townsend, defender/midfielder Taylor Kemp, forward Michael Seaton, and midfielder Conor Shanosky will all join the Kickers for the 2013 season."


They call it a "landmark" relationship a few times in there... Maybe these partnerships are still pretty new for MLS clubs?


Edit:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/articl...reserve-league

Here is a link to the article they mention in that release.

[Ajax TFC]

The appeals to authority in this thread are quite mind boggling. Please come up with your own points in support of or against players, because for every authority figure that supposedly supports your point, it is just as easy to find authority figures that don't

Winter, Mariner, and Nelsen all play Dunfield therefore he's good:
And which of those coaches was successful? Winter's only wins last year came when Dunfield started on the bench, and in 2011 he rarely used him at all. Mariner's season went to shit when he started relying on him, and clearly wasn't a good evaluator of talent. Nelsen is an unknown quality right now and hasn't really had much choice other than to start him. We'll see what happens to Dunfield when Cesar comes back to full fitness.

And that's just breaking down the authority figures being used to argue a point. I can also make equally valid (aka nonvalid) counterpoints:
Dunfield's coach in Vancouver clearly didn't rate him at all because he traded him for the rights to a 17 year old who wasn't going to play in MLS any time soon.
Dunfield was playing in League 2, so clearly non of the coaches of better teams rated him enough to sign him (BTW people used a similar arguement for why Winter was clearly never qualified to coach)

Nelsen doesn't rate Stinson, so clearly he isn't good:
Winter and Mariner clearly both rated him. Winter signed him and game him some decent minutes, and Mariner didn't cut him with the rest of the HGPs. And how do we know that Nelsen is a better evaluator of talent than those two? Also the Canadian youth coaches rated him enough to consistently call him up, and Stephen Hart also called him up.

Of course you could now come up with reasons why the Canadian youth coaches aren't good talent judges, and why Hart is a poor judge of talent. Which is why posters should come up with their own evaluations of players rather than saying "so and so - who knows more than you - rates/doesn't rate such and such a player, therefore my point is proven and is infallible"

[jazzy]

I agree, but I also think this isn't something to jump into right away. I'm hoping that ground work is being done for TFC to either pursue an affliation or own USL/D3 team next year.

http://pressbox.mlssoccer.com/conten...nd-regulations

this year's rules say nothing about getting allocation money for spots 29-30

well mlse certainly for the past year did not want to be involved in any way with a'farm' team as B .DeKlerk was trying for at least a year to get mgmt to hook up with charlotte, (great idea imho), but they simply ignored him. He felt helpless.....he agrees we needed an affiliate to help develop our not ready for prime time players

[ag futbol]

http://www.dcunited.com/news/2013/03...chmond-kickers

Thought this might be relevant, to bring the convo back on topic.

"D.C. United today announced that the Club will be loaning four players to the Richmond Kickers this season as part of the two clubs’ landmark affiliation agreement. Forward Casey Townsend, defender/midfielder Taylor Kemp, forward Michael Seaton, and midfielder Conor Shanosky will all join the Kickers for the 2013 season."


They call it a "landmark" relationship a few times in there... Maybe these partnerships are still pretty new for MLS clubs?


Edit:

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/articl...reserve-league

Here is a link to the article they mention in that release.

Good find, it's something that's happening more and more these days now that MLS / USL have decided to become less adversarial and more open to loan agreements. Kevin Payne was actually among the first GM's to do this. I assume we'll eventually work up those types of partnerships ourselves once they clear out all the crap from 6 years of mismanagement.

well mlse certainly for the past year did not want to be involved in any way with a'farm' team as B .DeKlerk was trying for at least a year to get mgmt to hook up with charlotte, (great idea imho), but they simply ignored him. He felt helpless.....he agrees we needed an affiliate to help develop our not ready for prime time players

Incredibly stupid and shortsighted for them to operate that way. Also kind of ironic considering their huge marketing push talking about youth development.

Let's hope we've learned our lesson from this. Also, rumor was some MLS teams were going to create their own farm teams down the road, I hope this is what we are aiming for.

[jazzy]

loser? what did Stinson do to deserve that label?

hatred like that simply negates all the good points of past posts! I like to think what we say about someone online we'd be comfortable saying it to their face?

Then we're all losers as none of us have made it to his level. Talk is cheap! I do not hear Stinson complaining of his treatment here. Again he's from TO , whether

he's good enough or not . He's one of us! Respect!

[T-boy]

The appeals to authority in this thread are quite mind boggling. Please come up with your own points in support of or against players, because for every authority figure that supposedly supports your point, it is just as easy to find authority figures that don't

Winter, Mariner, and Nelsen all play Dunfield therefore he's good:
And which of those coaches was successful? Winter's only wins last year came when Dunfield started on the bench, and in 2011 he rarely used him at all. Mariner's season went to shit when he started relying on him, and clearly wasn't a good evaluator of talent. Nelsen is an unknown quality right now and hasn't really had much choice other than to start him. We'll see what happens to Dunfield when Cesar comes back to full fitness.

And that's just breaking down the authority figures being used to argue a point. I can also make equally valid (aka nonvalid) counterpoints:
Dunfield's coach in Vancouver clearly didn't rate him at all because he traded him for the rights to a 17 year old who wasn't going to play in MLS any time soon.
Dunfield was playing in League 2, so clearly non of the coaches of better teams rated him enough to sign him (BTW people used a similar arguement for why Winter was clearly never qualified to coach)

Nelsen doesn't rate Stinson, so clearly he isn't good:
Winter and Mariner clearly both rated him. Winter signed him and game him some decent minutes, and Mariner didn't cut him with the rest of the HGPs. And how do we know that Nelsen is a better evaluator of talent than those two? Also the Canadian youth coaches rated him enough to consistently call him up, and Stephen Hart also called him up.

Of course you could now come up with reasons why the Canadian youth coaches aren't good talent judges, and why Hart is a poor judge of talent. Which is why posters should come up with their own evaluations of players rather than saying "so and so - who knows more than you - rates/doesn't rate such and such a player, therefore my point is proven and is infallible"

In the end of the day, what do WE all know? None here are professional football coaches or managers! We all love to think we know about football, but none of really know what goes on at TFC. We can have personal opinions about players or preferences, but saying that we KNOW that player X is good or bad, is just rediculous! If we were all experts, we would all be managing football clubs. Nobody here is (as far as I'm aware!).

[Ajax TFC]

well mlse certainly for the past year did not want to be involved in any way with a'farm' team as B .DeKlerk was trying for at least a year to get mgmt to hook up with charlotte, (great idea imho), but they simply ignored him. He felt helpless.....he agrees we needed an affiliate to help develop our not ready for prime time players

That's quite shocking and sad. MLSE are such marketing penny pinchers. They love to brag about their academy, but the fact is they've never initiated anything before MLS makes it standard. A farm team is something they should have made a long time ago. Instead it is now a standard MLS thing and we still don't have one. It's also shocking that BdK wasn't even given the support to do the thing that he was brought here to do, which was to make the academy a proper setup.

[Ajax TFC]

In the end of the day, what do WE all know? None here are professional football coaches or managers! We all love to think we know about football, but none of really know what goes on at TFC. We can have personal opinions about players or preferences, but saying that we KNOW that player X is good or bad, is just rediculous! If we were all experts, we would all be managing football clubs. Nobody here is (as far as I'm aware!).

But that doesn't mean we can't form an opinion on players based on what we do know. I think most people here know enough about football and what makes a player good/good enough to have opinions about the players on the team - otherwise we wouldn't be football fans on a forum because we wouldn't know what to think about what we're seeing other than the scores.

Using the opinion of a "superior football mind" to make your own opinion infallible is not only a fallacy, but it completely ruins discussion. It completely takes away a poster's right to formulate and state an opinion if they have to back it up with the opinion of a coach/GM/"superior football mind".