Because it's bound to happen eventually
The Official Paul Mariner "Deathwatch" thread
Because it's bound to happen eventually
“Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.
I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’
And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”
-Eduardo Galeano
I like the concept of this thread.
Well played Yohan. Well played.
Wishing death on the guy is a little morbid don't you think? Understandable, but not something i can get behind.
It's suppose to be about when Mariner is getting fired ;pOriginally Posted by Gazza
“Years have gone by and I’ve finally learned to accept myself for who I am: a beggar for good football.
I go about the world, hand outstretched, and in the stadiums I plead: ‘A pretty move, for the love of God.’
And when good football happens, I give thanks for the miracle and I don’t give a damn which team or country performs it.”
-Eduardo Galeano
Lulz - not sure if you're joking, but say you did actually believe this to be a PM Deathwatch thread.
What about it is 'understandable' , yet not something you can 'get behind'.
Anyhoo..
a ha ha heh he hoo.. ha
When he inevitably does get the axe, or simply resigns, I think his best bet may be to get in a time machine and go back to the mid-80s and manage Ipswich Town.
Mariner is clearly a self-serving 'hothead' that's full of himself!! The sooner he's gone, the better. However, I think his dismissal will happen later rather than sooner for the simple reason of his contract extension. I think he'll be given every chance to keep his job but the second he steps too far out of line he'll be shown the door.
Also, a Rongen - DeKlerk coaching tandem sounds good to me.
Well that's no fun!
I disagree with this totally. It's more important that we unconditionally support Payne's ultimate decision, than it is that we get our "way". Besides:
1) It is conceivable that Mariner might be successful yet at TFC. Hard to imagine, maybe highly unlikely, but conceivable
2) Mariner worked in a dysfunctional setup. He may perform/behave completely differently in the new structure
3) Some of his unorthodox behaviour was passion. I respect passion.
4) Paul Mariner deserves respect based on his long career in football
I say all this as someone who would vote to see Mariner gone. But if Payne wants to see how it goes, then I will support Mariner.
Last edited by ensco; 11-29-2012 at 04:30 PM.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
I'm no fan of Mariner. But unless Payne finds a replacement for him in the next few weeks, I'll get behind him. I'm not going to start the new season already disagreeing with Payne's decision to go with Mariner. What Ensco wrote - whatever Payne decides I support. He's the Prez now. Let's support his decisions right out of the gate.
"Failure simply isn't an option at this stage. TFC pushed its chips to the middle of the table when it splurged on Bradley and Defoe and reinforced its bet by making savvy acquisitions elsewhere. This collection of players is capable of delivering on the promises made during the close season. There are no more excuses available for TFC. Only success will continue the process of atoning for the past and establishing a higher standard for the future." FOX Sports
Watched a few shows who have mentioned Payne...he sounds like a total "hands on" guy, who gets VERY involved in the football side of a team....So NO WAY Mariner lasts very long...Why?....#1) He's a TERRIBLE football manager...and #2...He's an EGO MANIAC who won't tolerate "interference".....I see him leaving EARLY in a "mutual decision"....
Mariner will only be around if the team has a revamped roster.If he goes with the rejects he brought in at mid season we are in trouble.If Hall thinks he can be the number 1 keeper we better drop down to the Usl league.Wiedemen might be a starting caliber player their.
Just watched the 1 on 1 with Payne on TSN. He absolutely refuses to give Mariner any kind of endorsement what so ever. When asked he says that he thinks highly of him, but he still has to evaluate everyone. He says Paul Mariner IS the coach. Very similar to how on March 31, 2011, "De Rosario is still a TFC player" or how Plata is still a TFC player, etc. saying what the current situation is, but saying absolutely nothing about the future situation. Watching it, I got the impression that Payne knows exactly how much Mariner has fucked the team up, but won't say crap about him (for obvious reasons). I wouldn't be surprised to see him canned, or get "reassigned" a la Nick Dasovic or Bob de Klerk, in a couple of weeks. He may already be planning it
These echo my sentiments.
If Payne and Mariner can make it work... then fucking great!
I want results, not a witch hunt.
If Payne stands behind the man, in his wisdom, then I do to.
So I wait and see what Mr. Payne does and says.
Just thought I'd post this to remind everyone that most things in life are not all one way or the other. I defy any Mariner hater to read this through and tell me they don't feel at least a tiny bit differently about him.
http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-e...aylor-twellman
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
It just means Mariner is a wonderful "strikers" coach in the mls
Ive won as many head coaching titles as him and I dont coach football
ok, i do feel a little differently about mariner after reading that ... he's not a complete loser, he could probably be a good assistant coach again, somewhere.
I believe there's a Holy Trinity in football. The team, the manager and the supporters. Our trinity needs a lot of work.
Would I like a truly great manager, someone that knows the modern North American game? A real tactician ?
Of course I would. Unfortunately we have Mariner.
The most important thing to me is football and the success of our team. If Payne can do that with Mariner that's great.
I will go to games and support our team. At the end of the day I still think Mariner is a cocksmoker.
Last edited by Belfast_Boy; 11-29-2012 at 06:39 PM.
Its Day 1 with a new President on the job.
New prez, but were all at it again
I'm no fan of Mariner, but will put my faith in Payne at this time.
As Alonso stated earlier "If Payne stands behind the man, in his wisdom, then I do to."
I am with you. Lets be honest, I do not trully beleive that Payne supports Mariner, he just needs to give him a chance, before brining his own dude. The chance are that Mariner will continue to be shit, and he will be replaced, if he does well, great ( I doubt it).
Why are people giving the benefit of the doubt to Mariner? Until Payne officially endorses Mariner, which he strictly avoided doing at all cost during the presser, we should assume that he does not endorse Mariner. If Payne supports Mariner (and that's a HUGE "if"), then we can all pretend to support the decision. But until then, the fact remains that the squad (bar those in his starting XI) hates him, he missuses players and benches players for months for not showing enough passion in the two minutes that he does give them, he sabotaged the team to get there, and he's leaking shit the the press. I challenge anyone to find a reason why Payne would endorse Mariner. Also, Mariner is the personification of everything that Payne clearly stated that he's against.
i don't think it is inconsistent to say we will support Payne, but at the same time expect to see mariner gone at some future point ... this thread, at least to me, is just a bit of fun ... how long will mariner last under the new prez?
those of us who demonstrated and sent messages to anselmi calling for a new president were not calling for mariner's head, neither then or now. we wanted to see a new management structure, and now it's here. mariner's fate is in payne's hands, or at least should be. next few months will be interesting.
frankly, i welcome the payne. very happy with mlse's choice for our new football boss, and i support him too, even in the unlikely case that he keeps mariner on long term. realistically, who can see mariner surviving long term though? it's not very likely mariner will be out immediately, but the mariner deathwatch is on.
No. We should assume that Payne has no opinion about Mariner. Not the same thing at all.
Payne deserves time and space to make up his own mind. Mariner deserves some consideration here too, because the right thing to do is for Payne to hear him out.
Voir, juger, agir.
Last edited by ensco; 11-29-2012 at 07:15 PM.
“What the world needs is more geniuses with humility; there are so few of us left.”
Just because we should be behind Payne doesn't necessarily mean we should be behind Mariner. As Ajax said, nothing Payne has stated so far shows an absolute endorsement of Mariner. A lot could still happen between now and the beginning of the season. I agree that Mariner will in all likelihood start out as manager next season, and Payne will see for himself how things go, but part of me feels quite confident that Mariner won't be around all season. I don't know, I just have that feeling. Of course, if Mariner DOES manage to turn things around, I think that leaves us no choice but to back him. But I don't see that happening somehow.
Over the past 6 months I've often been incredibly pissed off at Mariner. However, I agree totally with what Ensco & DOMIN8R said above.
Just like I didn't want Winter to be canned by Anselmi & the rest of the old management (I wanted those decisions made by knowledgeable footy management after the ownership change); I didn't want Mariner to be fired by Anselmi & Co, despite my growing hate for Mariner -- because I was convinced they would screw it up even worse with the next coach they pick. Now that there's a new boss in town, I'm going to relax & see what Payne thinks is the right thing to do. Even if that doesn't pan out very well in the short term.
It's interesting to note that Mariner was a long-time assistant coach & well-liked in New England. So obviously he's doesn't always play the hot-headed, arrogant, my-way-or-the-highway, clueless asshole that he's been in the past 6 months. Like others before him at TFC, Mariner was allowed into a role that was way over his head, and that side of his personality came through in all its ugliness. Maybe Payne will find a more suitable role for Mariner; or eventually let him go if it doesn't work out.
Sure I'm also worried about Payne being sabotaged by the old guys hanging around (like with deciding to keep Hassli in the last moment). However, I believe MLSE knows that Mariner has close to 0 rapport with the fan base. I highly doubt Mariner endeared himself to MLSE/TFC management in the past few months either; while Anselmi and others were playing nice with the fans, dropping prices, saying the right things (e.g., "we screwed up & have to fix it" even if that all rang hollow), Mariner was pissing off everyone around him, telling press that he's very good at his job, etc. etc.
exactly - as i said on the other Mariner thread:
when Payne was asked about his coaching staff for next season he certainly did not ringingly support them.
He said (words to the effect), "I can tell you where one bathroom is - haven't been here more than 5 hours - a little challenging to answer those questions - but i can tell you PM is the coach of TFC - I need a lot more time to spend more time with folks and understand them but we'll take that time."
this to me is a hedge until he takes a few weeks to digest. he in no way said PM is his man for 2013...if Payne decides to start 2013 with Mariner I'll support it but i really don't see Mariner as a Payne type coach, at all....
I think he has a definite opinion on Mariner. he played his cards close to this chest yesterday. he didn't endorse him, he was very reserved.
Payne said it best. he viewed Mariner as the competition in the past. if he's worth his salt he'll have done his homework on the man.
The title of this thread is way out of order and way past the line of decency, in my opinion.
How is it any different from the myriad other threads we've had on here over the years wishing for Mo's head, or Preki's, or Winter's, or...? If it's the term "deathwatch" that's the issue, I think most people realize it's referring to his tenure with TFC, and not his...well...mortality. Anyways, it's an interesting topic, because Mariner's position with this club ISN'T secure now that Payne is here, so many people will be following those developments closely, regardless of how they feel about Mariner as manager.
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