Player acquisitions and Mariner

[Super]

Again with this talk, though. Super I know you are amongst so many supporters that, LIKE MYSELF, think that hiring an experienced coach from abroad would've been the first step, the easiest step from the very beginning if you want the best available and don't know the sport well enough as an MLSE wouldn't. It's an easier way out to improve quickly. Another additional way that was here even before the Designated Player.

I guess what I'm asking is - would there be others out there that would start to give a chance to an experienced, winning coach from a lower level from NA if we couldn't convince a storied foreign manager to come to Toronto? Because, really, why would he?

To be honest, I don't think it matters at this point. We're dealing with a club that has to hire consultants to find its coaches. We just don't have the proper management (read: Anselmi) in place capable of finding talent, let alone someone with experience. More dark clouds ahead.

Yes, but as long as he's here, or as long as the structure of TFC is the way it is, that has to figure into everything. For this reason I think Mariner is a good choice, mostly because of his experience in dealing with, let's say, "not the best" MLS ownership.

Personel, like styles, are really situationally-dependent. So we have to find the best personel and style for our situation. Someday maybe our situation will change. Until then...

Mariner never REALLY had to deal with ownership. He was an assistant. Assistants assist. They don't make choices. They don't push for changes. Rarely, anyway. Steve Nicol was boss at NE and Mariner did what he was told. Now he's been given a shot at the big job. Let's see if he has what it takes. Right now he's not doing too well - if you average out his games over a season we miss the play-offs AGAIN. And that's with the usual bump that a new coach gets when taking over a sinking ship.

My problem with Mariner is that I actually do like him. I like a lot of what he has to say. I like his passion for the game - and how he fights for the players. Good qualities in a manager. What I don't like as much is his inability to put together a squad (he brought in many of our players) and make it work. Look at our possession. I'd LOOOOOOOOOVE for Mariner to be THE MAN and for him to succeed. He's successful and we all get to wash away the filth of 6 years of failure. I just don't think the decision to promote, or side-move him, to head coach was well thought out. Just seems more of the same from TFC FO to me, and that worries the heck out of me. I'd hate to be in June of 2013 and we write off yet another season. At that point there will be a lot of bitching and moaning, but at the end of the day it's not like we can really blame Mariner - he's learning on the job.

He certainly has had the experience of dealing with a bad front office that all the supporters hated - this was exactly the situation he had in Plymouth Argyle, where all the supporters thought the FO was too concerned with getting World Cup games if England won their bid, than the team, which was going down in flames on the pitch.

Question is, did Anselmi ask Mariner if he can deal with a bad front office when he was hired?

Mariner's one shot at head coach before us didn't end very well. Not sure how that qualifies him to run our club.

[ag futbol]

So Mariner told Greg Brady and Eric Smith on Fan 590, that TFC is "3 players away from being half decent." Interesting, I think he said that before. No wait, that was Mo Johnston...

ahahah, oh man that brings me back.

For everyone pining for Tom Anselmi to be gone: yes, but the rot in this club goes pretty deep. Very ironic that the only person who is ever worthy of dismissal is the head coach. I think it's time to hold a few more people accountable as well. It took a lot more than one person to get us to where we are today.

[Canary10]

Mariner's one shot at head coach before us didn't end very well. Not sure how that qualifies him to run our club.

It was the having to work for a bad FO that everyone hated part that qualified him for our job.....

[Beach_Red]

So Mariner told Greg Brady and Eric Smith on Fan 590, that TFC is "3 players away from being half decent." Interesting, I think he said that before. No wait, that was Mo Johnston...

That's funny. Every MLS team is 3 players away from being a top 5 team, that's the whole point of this league...

[Super]

That's funny. Every MLS team is 3 players away from being a top 5 team, that's the whole point of this league...

Or one good coach away.

[Beach_Red]

ahahah, oh man that brings me back.

For everyone pining for Tom Anselmi to be gone: yes, but the rot in this club goes pretty deep. Very ironic that the only person who is ever worthy of dismissal is the head coach. I think it's time to hold a few more people accountable as well. It took a lot more than one person to get us to where we are today.

This might be one of the ways in which Ensco means that we get what we deserve. The team never had a proper FO from the beginning but it took us six years to look beyond the inexperienced, in-over-its-head management. Every "Mo must Go" sign that was put up must have made Anselmi laugh.

[T-boy]

That's funny. Every MLS team is 3 players away from being a top 5 team, that's the whole point of this league...

It's an interesting point. I'd agree...yes we ARE 3 players away. But then again, we have always been around 2 or 3 players away from being in the play offs.

The problem is - if you are always a couple of players short, in the MLS it isn't as simple as "lets go and buy X player for $3m" like in all other soccer leagues. In the MLS, you HAVE to exchange/barter/swap something that you already have to get better players. OR, if you can find a player to join the league from outside, you need the cap space or allocation space, which usually arrives when you swap a player with another MLS team.

So it goes back to year one with TFC. TFC have NEVER had a decent centre back. TFC have NEVER had a consistent top goalscorer (other than Koev's for half a season). That's two important parts of the spine of the team that have been missing since the club began. But to GET those two players, you always need to swap something out or give something away. TFC were NEVER set up properly in the first season, and have been chasing ever since to get the squad they need.

[ag futbol]

This might be one of the ways in which Ensco means that we get what we deserve. The team never had a proper FO from the beginning but it took us six years to look beyond the inexperienced, in-over-its-head management. Every "Mo must Go" sign that was put up must have made Anselmi laugh.

Oh sure, but we as the customers can't tell them how to run their business, they have to figure that out on their own. Fan ire may center around certain people due to a lack of results, but they are the ones who have to sift through it all and make sense of it. Asking the fans as a collective to analyze a team, break down what's wrong, and point to the way forward? That will never work.

[Beach_Red]

Oh sure, but we as the customers can't tell them how to run their business, they have to figure that out on their own. Fan ire may center around certain people due to a lack of results, but they are the ones who have to sift through it all and make sense of it. Asking the fans as a collective to analyze a team, break down what's wrong, and point to the way forward? That will never work.

And yet we try. People make banners and organize protests and go to town hall meetings and buy into "culture change" and all kinds of things. And management at TFC has listened to us. After every loss this board calls out individual players so management responded with the highest player turn-over of any team. And so on (I was going to give a lot more examples but it's the same boring crap over and over ).

[T-boy]

We ALL think we can run the club better than management really! We are ALL fantastic at running TFC on Football Manager 2012 etc! I always win the MLS Cup in Football Manager! I just don't understand why the FO can't make it look as easy as I can on that game!

[Canary10]

We ALL think we can run the club better than management really! We are ALL fantastic at running TFC on Football Manager 2012 etc! I always win the MLS Cup in Football Manager! I just don't understand why the FO can't make it look as easy as I can on that game!

So Earl Cochrane, you admit your trades come from Football Manager? I KNEW it!

[ag futbol]

And yet we try. People make banners and organize protests and go to town hall meetings and buy into "culture change" and all kinds of things. And management at TFC has listened to us. After every loss this board calls out individual players so management responded with the highest player turn-over of any team. And so on (I was going to give a lot more examples but it's the same boring crap over and over ).

You’re absolutely right, people are out there giving their opinion and trying to get a point across about what they want to see. It’s sports though right? And in this day and age this kind of thing should be somewhat expected. I think the reaction of this fan base would be similar to many others if they were put in the same situation.

You always want to have an ear open to what your customers are saying, but you can’t just chase after feedback without thinking more broadly about the implications. If this was a way to run things, we’d all be drinking new coke right now while watching snakes on a plane. Crazy how those ideas which completely flopped were based off research companies gathered from their own customers.

Management should have an ear open to the fans' opinions, but they should have enough judgement to realize what is do-able and what’s not.

[Beach_Red]

You’re absolutely right, people are out there giving their opinion and trying to get a point across about what they want to see. It’s sports though right? And in this day and age this kind of thing should be somewhat expected. I think the reaction of this fan base would be similar to many others if they were put in the same situation.

You always want to have an ear open to what your customers are saying, but you can’t just chase after feedback without thinking more broadly about the implications. If this was a way to run things, we’d all be drinking new coke right now while watching snakes on a plane. Crazy how those ideas which completely flopped were based off research companies gathered from their own customers.

Management should have an ear open to the fans' opinions, but they should have enough judgement to realize what is do-able and what’s not.

The genius of MLSE is cornering the market. If we want to watch pro sports we have to get it from them. If Coke had total control of the market then, yeah, we'd all be drinking New Coke.

Sure, it would be the same in any other market. Still, I remember when TFC first started people told me soccer fans were different than Leaf fans and now, six years later, I see how TFC fans are the same as Leaf fans - calling out scapegoats, proposing ridiculous one-sided trades, and so on.

It seems like MLSE decided it was easier to have a monopoly (as Ensco pointed out, MLSE keeping another NHL team out of the sport's biggest market is 'the' story the last ten years) and then give the fans what they want than put a real organization together. You can practically hear them saying, "What are the peasants rioting about today?"

[Richard]

So Earl Cochrane, you admit your trades come from Football Manager? I KNEW it!

Haha yeh, i actaully have a hilarious picture of what managers TFC hired over the years with the AI in control. I will post a picture soon.



So,

Sacked Winter:Sep 2012
Re-Hired Preki:Oct 2012
Sacked Preki:Oct 2013
Hired Two random dutch guys for a year each
Hired Jason Kries:Oct 2015(Actually won the supporters shield)