Today's News,Friday,Jul.06
SSG : that reminds me - need to check my tire pressure...
a ha ha heh he hoo.. ha
That sportsnet article reads like a mash up of posts from this board. LOL
Typical Toronto sports mentality.
Danny Koevermans scores in 5 games straight and his goal is the reason we got a tie out of Dallas and we're all championing the plumber that is Terry Dunfield.
I'm all for giving Dunfield credit when it's due (which it kinda was against Dallas, albeit totally overblown) but lets not forget the countless shit performances he's put in for TFC. Please and thank you.
Koevermans is the real story at TFC in the last couple weeks. Not Mariner...not Winter....not 4-4-2 and certainly not Terry Dunfield.
Once Danny cools down (and he will, it's only natural) we'll be back to wondering what the hell is wrong with this team. LOL
MLS Player of the month: danny koevermans
I haven't been reading the pre/post game threads. Please tell me this is not true.Originally Posted by v00d00daddy
The Sportsnet piece leaves me asking logical questions. For example:
"One player who has hit fine form under the tutelage of Paul Mariner is Ashtone Morgan. The young left back has found his confidence and is careening forward with the pace and effectiveness of, well, last season."
So, he is doing well under Mariner. So well in fact, he is doing it at the same pace as he did under Winter. ??? Makes sense. Well done, Winter... uh, Mariner.
On the plus side, Tom Anselmi's plan looks to be working. The user comment:
Looking good. The team is showing character. If Mariner is responsible, then good for him. It's beginning to look as though management has finally chosen the right man for the job.
... highlights that when the main press doesn't keep asking questions about:
- the latest Plata debacle and challenging Cochrane as to his assertion that the recently signed player was being shopping for loan for "several months",
- the internal disagreement around Nesta,
- why they abandoned 4-3-3 instead of finding a different coach to implement it,
- why they didn't do a coaching search and just gave it to Mariner,
- why AW got fired but EC, BDK, PM and TR all kept their jobs,
- their future plans around ticket prices relative to the league,
- if there is a plan B after Danny K and Frings,
- the record when those guys aren't in the line up under either coach,
- and what Tom Anselmi brings to the team now and in the future
... if they don't keep (or start) asking those questions, Tom Anselmi can rely on some Toronto fans and media to form a circle jerk around the latest tie involving the last place team in the west as a sign of hope, and ensure he stays as leader of this "Championship Organization" for many years to come.
Maybe this Anselmi guy really does know the market.
Oh. My. God. Yes.
Membership Team
mornin d
wow 2016 and things are looking up --- come on you reds lets go
The personel changes are all money issues, most likely. Sure, somebody should ask so Tom has to say, "We haven't been given the budget to pay severence to these guys AND hire new people," and maybe somebody should ask what style of play the team is aiming to have in a few years so Tom can say, "No one really knows what this league will look like in a few years - how many DPs teams will be allowed, what the salary cap will be, and so on," but really, what's the point? The organization is dysfunctional and everyone knows it.
-The question regarding Cochrane's response to the Plata controversy is valid. Cochrane should have been fired along with MoJo and Preki.
-We don't know if there was internal disagreement regarding Nesta, it's all speculation at this point. Even if there was, it's not uncommon to have differing opinions on player recruitment, even within the most astute professional sports management teams.
-This issue has been discussed ad nauseum. With the pending sale of MLSE and a moratorium on long term hiring decisions in place for obvious reasons, the most qualified replacement was promoted internally to try and salvage the season. Subsequently, Paul Mariner has adapted a modified approach that he felt was more condusive to success in MLS in the short term. So far, the team has responded well to his tactical adjustments and boisterous nature.
-I can understand the concern regarding Cochrane, but to dismantle the entire front office ten games into the season is nothing short of idiotic. A semblence of stability was required for the duration of the season, not to mention that once again, permanent replacements could obviously have not been hired at this point with the pending transfer of ownership. Bell/Rogers/Tanenbaum will obviously want to make their own determination regarding the long term direction of the club if Mariner falters.
-Once again, a question that should be directed at the new ownership consortium once the sale of MLSE is official, although I agree that the ticket pricing issue is a key factor moving forward.
-The same question could be asked of any MLS club that has aging stars in their lineup. Most DPs in the league are in the twilight of their career, and logic would dictate that plan B would be to sign suitable replacements as DPs when the time comes.
-Irrelevant. Any team in the league would obviously endure hardship without their two best players in the lineup.
-Tom Anselmi has essentially acknowledged to the public that he is not qualified for his current position when he initially reached out to the league and hired Mo Johnston, and once again, when he hired a high profile consultant to determine the identity and trajectory of the franchise moving forward. It's no secret that he is a MLSE puppet that was assigned as the CEO of TFC. The issue will hopefully be resolved once the new ownership group is in place.
Last edited by ManUtd4ever; 07-06-2012 at 09:13 AM.
I see someone is already trying to paint a picture of a "stabilized situation" where they don't need to hire a new manager. Convenient, considering a new hire would draw more negative attention on their performance.
Just like the Mo Johnston extension that happened two months before the NY disaster, praise is unearned at this point. Results have been an improvement over Winter and acceptable given the circumstances, but in no way should anyone be making promises or handing out merit points so early in the game.
They aren't asking those questions because they really don't know or care enough about the problems with this club. And they aren't going to ask why they didn't get a different 4-3-3 guy because most of the sports guys in Toronto are conservatives who hated the 4-3-3 and love that TFC went back to traditional 4-4-2 hoofball. I don't expect any questions like that to be asked by the current group of soccer journalists in this city
I wasn't really pro or con Nesta but what bothers me is that we have no real idea who is actually making the final decision.
Mariner was supposedly hired for player aquistion, yet according to some journalists that was all done by Winter. By default then, if Winter as Head Coach and Director of the Office of Football Wonderfulness and Excellence (or whaterever we call it) is now replaced by Mariner as Director of Awesomeness and Excellence and Everything Related to Football, does that mean he has the final call?
If so, why is Cochrane, our apparent Director of Paperwork, Denial and Canadian Football Supremcy, speaking about contractual issues regarding Plata?
Who incidently is still with the team but set to be unvieled by LDUQ sometime today.
Differing opinions is fine. Unclear decision making structure and authority polarize ANY organization... business or sport.
Last edited by Pookie; 07-06-2012 at 10:07 AM.
I think we do know and it was already published on Monday.
http://www.canadiansoccernews.com/content.php?3414
Additional sources close to Toronto FCs front office confirmed to CSN that the club is chasing Alessandro Nesta. However, there was a suggestion that an internal conflict at the club was holding things up.
Its said that Bob de Klerk is driving interest in Nesta, but that one of either Earl Cochrane or Paul Mariner is resisting the move. The nature of their resistance was not indicated.
And the most qualified replacement was NOT promoted internally,T.Rongen and BDK are more qualified and have much better knowledge to carry on with the philosophy that club decided to go 18 months ago,and half way into it they decided to go back were they started 18 months ago.What TFC FO did is same as to try to swim across the river and half way trough turn back and swim to the shore were you started,because you panicked and thought it's to far away,and you wont make to the other side.
Mariner's contact was extended month before Winter was fired,and now to say TFC FO did not have a time to look for long term solution is very naive.
There is no excuse for ANSLEMI,so please don't even try to justify anything ANSELMI did in the past 6 years with TFC,he was incompetent in 2006/07 and he is still incompetent in 2012/12,nothing will change as long he is sitting in FO.
ANSLEMI GTFO!!
I hope we start losing every game again so that I can read about how great TFC is and that they're heading in the right direction while playing progressive football. All this "unbeaten streak" and "scoring goals" stuff is too confusing.
Does anybody know how the reserves and academy are playing right now? Have they changed to 4-4-2 also, or are they still playing/learning the 4-3-3 system? Has the whole organisation from top to bottom changed to Mariner's style?
I'm still confused as to the anger on this board right now? TFC have the best results they've had in a while, and people are not happy? Meanwhile they still want to go back to Winter, and the "long term plan", even though the club and results were getting worse and worse since Winter took over. Nobody likes Mariner running up and down the touchline, while its getting results. They would rather have Winter back, sitting mute on the touchline and setting league record low results.
I'm not sure what kool aid is being drunk, but I think I missed out on my shot of it!
Fine - so keep it internal. This sort of information should not make it outside for general consumption. The fact that it did makes the situation seem even worse.-We don't know if there was internal disagreement regarding Nesta, it's all speculation at this point. Even if there was, it's not uncommon to have differing opinions on player recruitment, even within the most astute professional sports management teams.
I think it is relevant. Coach Winter was fired over the club's record during a time when his top two players spent much of it injured. Had they not been injured perhaps results would have been improved and Winter is still here.-Irrelevant. Any team in the league would obviously endure hardship without their two best players in the lineup.
Folk are distressed because once again MLSE has packed in a long-range plan too early. Effectively killing off the prospect of an exciting future and dooming the club to mid-table mediocrity.I'm still confused as to the anger on this board right now? TFC have the best results they've had in a while, and people are not happy? Meanwhile they still want to go back to Winter, and the "long term plan", even though the club and results were getting worse and worse since Winter took over. Nobody likes Mariner running up and down the touchline, while its getting results. They would rather have Winter back, sitting mute on the touchline and setting league record low results.
I'm not sure what kool aid is being drunk, but I think I missed out on my shot of it!
Denime said it best :
What TFC FO did is same as to try to swim across the river and half way trough turn back and swim to the shore were you started,because you panicked and thought it's to far away,and you wont make to the other side.
argue the opinion,not the usersI'm still confused as to the anger on this board right now? TFC have the best results they've had in a while, and people are not happy? Meanwhile they still want to go back to Winter, and the "long term plan", even though the club and results were getting worse and worse since Winter took over. Nobody likes Mariner running up and down the touchline, while its getting results. They would rather have Winter back, sitting mute on the touchline and setting league record low results.
I'm not sure what kool aid is being drunk, but I think I missed out on my shot of it!
kool aid comment is not cool at all.
Thanks
fake tan, fake hair, fake boobs, and probably a fake personality ... sounds like my ideal woman!
No they did not,all academy teams are still on 4-3-3 because that is the best system to develop skill player,442 will develop a ballhoofers and at least there FO did not screw up,T.Rongen will leave before TFC academy goes to 442.
What now bring as back to how much they crew up if you looking long term,developing kids in 433 only to play 442 is waste of time and money,but we all know TFC FO is only looking until October when they will ask us to renew ST.
Ok. I'll keep asking the question that other's answer bring up.
Do you KNOW that 4-4-2 means "hoofball"? Is it possible to play in a 4-4-2 formation and play short passing technical football? I'm guessing you are assuming that 4-4-2 ALWAYS means hoofball? Correct?
The
The formation doesn't matter. Call it whatever formation you like.
Te fact is that our senior team is now playing a style that:
-is ugly to watch (opinion of course)
-died back when the manager was actually playing the game lol
-teaches players nothing
-is easily figured out
-will get raped repeatedly by decent teams
-is hard to win with on a game by game basis because you can't dictate the play...even when playing against inferior teams.
-is the exact opposite of what the club decided is the way to go in terms of getting results, producing good footballers and playing attractive football for the fans
But its okay because we got a few ties on the back of the hottest goal scorer in the league in the last 3 weeks.
This club has, in 3 short weeks, re-lived everything that has kept football down in this country. Mariners style of play and supporters endorsement of it is a perfect snapshot at why the sport is fucked in this country.
Agreed that it is (in quotation marks) "ugly football" if you look at it at a perfectionist type of way. Mariner is playing an "older" style of football right now. But we ALL agree, the majority of the first team are UNABLE to play a more technical style of play, so therefore its fairly pointless trying to get them to play it. It's like trying to get MacDonalds chefs to cook gourmet food - it just doesn't work!
However, my argument is that you can still get the academy and reserves to continue to learn the 4-3-3 "style" of play while the first team get short term results with longer ball football. There is no reason why the two can't co-exist at the same time. The fact that the academy is STILL learning the total football style means that the LONG TERM goal is to get them into the first team playing that way - NOT to continue playing 4-4-2 in the first team.
I don't understand why some people think that the LONG TERM has been abandoned, when the proof that the academy is still learning 4-3-3 proves that it hasn't been abandoned at all?
Well isn't this thread a ray of sunshine.
1 win since Mariner took over and averaging 1.1 points per game, even under the last shit coach the team was averaging 1.2 points a game. Neither were or are the answer. And both have been part of the problem for the past two seasons. The only thing that has changed for the good is Koevermans is back on the form he was at the end of last season.
With the resources available to this team they should better. The team basically plays like Stoke City but with the payroll of Manchester United.
Last edited by Greatest Ripoff; 07-06-2012 at 11:45 AM. Reason: poor math
Hahaha good one
Yeah, its lost me a little to be honest! I think I might have to give this forum a break for a little bit! I'm all excited that we are 5 games unbeaten, yet a lot of people seem really unhappy! I think if I don't talk to other TFC fans for a while it might be good for me! I'm happy and enthusiastic, but other fans appear to be zapping my enthusiasm! It's kinda sad!
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